How does Casey go about beating Rossi now...

The handshake was used between Knights or the gentry to show the open palm and display no weapon - they were rather Machiavellian .......s and used to stab each other.

This is similar to the salute given to a military officer, "fragging" did not start in Vietnam and mutiny was once common.

This (handshake) has carried through as the sign of good intent and good will.

I give you one last piece of utterly useless trivia.

Barristers or Queens Counsel (Senior Counsel) do NOT shake hands (with each other) as they are truly considered gentlemen and it is was and always has been the code of the silk to do battle with words and not weapons, so the handshake is considered somewhat proletarian and beneath their station in life.

To this day this tradition is upheld in many countries that derived customs from the English.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (The Doc 79 @ Jul 24 2008, 02:13 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>....Stoner was pissed he lost and that's it....he should have kept his mouth shut and pitched the attitude.

Are you talking about Stoner at Laguna or Jorge Bush in Iraq?

Sure he has an attitude and he called at as he saw it. There is nothing wrong with that. I think he was a little closer to what was actually going on than you and I!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Austin @ Jul 22 2008, 11:47 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>That's a bit of a big brush to be used. Some bikes work better with more TC, the Ducati for example is better set up with more TC as exampled by Stoner's heavier use of the tool than Melandri's and their difference in the standings.
Well, Melandri's use of TC in comparison to Stoner's use of TC is hardly the only relevant variable one can consider when assessing the difference in the classification.

Yeah, but with the TC turned up high, the engine cuts the ignition constantly on corner exit and slows the rider down. If you read reviews of the 1098R and its TC, many ex-racers-turned-journalists(like Cathcart) comment that the TC can be very intrusive if set on even medium settings; the engine constantly cuts the ignition, so you don't really go anywhere.

My point is that TC, if used heavily, significantly hinders forward progress.

Alex Goebert (AMCN) rode Casey's 2007 bike and reported it had the TC on the absolute lowest setting.

He raced super bikes and couldn't get it to cut in.

You should never let the truth get in the way of a good story. Or evidence like the results of three other Ducatis. Yawn.

Casey's bike also sputters on the rev limiter. If marco is reading this he would be saying right now "hey, these things have a rev limiter".

4031:boring___.jpg]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (krusty @ Jul 24 2008, 06:41 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Are you talking about Stoner at Laguna or Jorge Bush in Iraq?
??

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (RCV600RR @ Jul 24 2008, 06:49 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>My point is that TC, if used heavily, significantly hinders forward progress.
Wrong. If properly balanced on a motorcycle that has significant wheelspin, it can substantial decrease your lap times by keeping the motorcycle from spinning the rear on corner exit.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (xx CURVE xx @ Jul 24 2008, 02:47 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I don't underestimate Stoner AT ALL...BUT in a dog fight he will lose....again.


I thought in Qatar 07 we saw the end of Stoner himself thinking this ..... otherwise the rest of 07 would never have been as it was ....... ie. one of the most successful "trouncings" in the sports history .... it was equal best season pointscore ever .......... you seem to forget what happened past the last race there Curve!!?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BarryMachine @ Jul 24 2008, 07:19 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I thought in Qatar 07 we saw the end of Stoner himself thinking this ..... otherwise the rest of 07 would never have been as it was ....... ie. one of the most successful "trouncings" in the sports history .... it was equal best season pointscore ever .......... you seem to forget what happened past the last race there Curve!!?

and YOU seem to forget whats happened the past 10 + years

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (The Doc 79 @ Jul 24 2008, 01:57 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Wrong. If properly balanced on a motorcycle that has significant wheelspin, it can substantial decrease your lap times by keeping the motorcycle from spinning the rear on corner exit.
All hairsplitting aside, this seems self-evident, or why would they bother with tc in the first place?

What I do dispute is that there is any certainty that stoner/ducati have better tc, or even use more tc , than others. They may do, but I can't see how anyone outside the factory ducati team would know precise details of the tc/electronics settings on casey's bike at present, and even marco melandri who would seem to be out of favour and to have a vested interest in attributing casey's superiority to tc is not necessarily a reliable source; I am a marco fan btw. I certainly don't think ducati would give a journalist, even if a sbk rider, casey's bike with full race set-up so gobert may not be an authority either.

I am quite willing to believe that the ducati might benefit more from tc than the other bikes given the characteristics of the bike, particularly that the ducati engine reputedly revs higher, is peaky and develops more power. What do you want ducati to do, develop a bike that isn't helped by tc just to show what good guys they are? I don't recall other manufacturers eg honda having moral qualms about superior engine power etc in the past.

As I have said on several occasions previously I think they should change the formula and don't disagree with reducing electronic aids in general.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (xx CURVE xx @ Jul 24 2008, 11:24 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>and YOU seem to forget whats happened the past 10 + years


But along comes a rider who doesn't want to be one of the sheep after 10 years and you want him to be

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BarryMachine @ Jul 24 2008, 08:51 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>But along comes a rider who doesn't want to be one of the sheep after 10 years and you want him to be

I don't want anything more than good races....you're the cheerleader with the deranged mind and wet panties

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (michaelm @ Jul 24 2008, 08:42 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>What I do dispute is that there is any certainty that stoner/ducati have better tc, or even use more tc , than others. They may do, but I can't see how anyone outside the factory ducati team would know precise details of the tc/electronics settings on casey's bike at present
DUDE!! DUCATI HAS COME OUT AND SAID THIS. Its not a secret. So how can you be unsure?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (The Doc 79 @ Jul 25 2008, 12:05 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>DUDE!! DUCATI HAS COME OUT AND SAID THIS. Its not a secret.

where?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BarryMachine @ Jul 24 2008, 09:11 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>where?

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/68468

http://www.crash.net/motorsport/motogp/new..._have_gone.html

http://www.crash.net/motorsport/motogp/new..._rides_gp9.html

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (The Doc 79 @ Jul 24 2008, 03:05 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>DUDE!! DUCATI HAS COME OUT AND SAID THIS. Its not a secret. So how can you be unsure?
Ducati themselves and stoner said after the catalunya test that the electronics had been improved not specifying whether this was the engine mapping or the tc or both. Rumours abound about major engine hardware changes up to and including reverting to the 2007 engine. The alice team recently said specifically that the tc had been improved. Whilst it is fair to draw the implication that this means the ducati tc is better than it was earlier in the year , I am unaware of any statement by ducati that they have the best tc compared to other teams; how would they know that anyway?.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (The Doc 79 @ Jul 25 2008, 12:24 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/68468

http://www.crash.net/motorsport/motogp/new..._have_gone.html

http://www.crash.net/motorsport/motogp/new..._rides_gp9.html




Well yes we all know Stoner fixed his own problems with his bike ....... but where does it say Stoner's TC is better than say Rossi's? WHich I believe was the point? and has been a point in question whenever the TC crap hits the fan again


But perhaps I am wrong? perhaps you meant Stoner was saying his TC is all "better" now? ... just as a young child might say " my taw toe got better now" ... ? ........... no in reality I'm jusy humouring you here .... what you propose is stupid on so many levels that it can only be answered in humour.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BarryMachine @ Jul 24 2008, 10:33 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Well yes we all know Stoner fixed his own problems with his bike ....... but where does it say Stoner's TC is better than say Rossi's? WHich I believe was the point? and has been a point in question whenever the TC crap hits the fan again
So now Stoner is a software engineer, I don't think so. The upgrade which helped Stoner gain an edge on the field immediately implies a drastic improvement in that area over their rivals. So the proof is in the pudding that Ducat's is better than anyone elses.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (michaelm @ Jul 24 2008, 10:31 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Ducati themselves and stoner said after the catalunya test that the electronics had been improved not specifying whether this was the engine mapping or the tc or both. Rumours abound about major engine hardware changes up to and including reverting to the 2007 engine. The alice team recently said specifically that the tc had been improved. Whilst it is fair to draw the implication that this means the ducati tc is better than it was earlier in the year , I am unaware of any statement by ducati that they have the best tc compared to other teams; how would they know that anyway?.
Try reading.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (The Doc 79 @ Jul 24 2008, 09:40 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>So now Stoner is a software engineer, I don't think so. The upgrade which helped Stoner gain an edge on the field immediately implies a drastic improvement in that area over their rivals. So the proof is in the pudding that Ducat's is better than anyone elses.

Dude you're wasting your time with Berry...he's a full blown master cheerleader...he has selective hearing and vision....