2024 Round 13: Gran Premio Red Bull di San Marino e della Riviera di Rimini San Marino - Misano World Circuit Marco Simoncelli

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Do you know what Tom Brady, Michael Jordan, and Marc Marquez have in common? They all took pay cuts to be with a winning team. Brady was never the highest paid quarterback because he knew it would hurt the team. He wanted that money spent on talent to support him. Michael Jordan took pay cuts to re-sign Scotty Pippen. Champions don't chase the dollar they do what it takes to win.
Exactly. That is to me, what makes Marc stand out above the like of Fabio Quartararo and while I like the latter, I have no time for his moaning anymore. He made his bed and now he can sleep in it. Marc wanted to win, nothing else. And he dumped a considerable load of money to do so. It also means that if he wins the title again, his redemption arc will be even more special.
The difference between Marc and Michael Schumacher is that Marc never rode for a team that cheated to win a championship. He definitely did not do anything like Adelaide 1994 when Michael purposely wrecked Damon Hill to secure his first title. Nor did Marc ever get kicked out of a world championship the way Schumacher did in 1997 for purposely driving into Jacques Villeneuve in a desperate attempt to save his World Championship bid at Jerez. Then there was the attempts to run Mika Hakkinen off the Kemmel Straight at Spa in 2000 again in another desperate attempt to hold position in a championship battle that he did ultimate prevail in. There was the parking effort at Monaco in 2006 where he parked his car at Rascasse to try and keep provisional pole position. Not to mention trying to run Rubens Barichello into the pitwall at 190MPH at the Hungaroring during the GP. Schumacher was one of the dirtiest drivers I ever had the displeasure of watching. Not that everyone behaves perfectly on track, and I am certainly willing to make allowances for this and heat of the moment incidents...but Schumacher was far more calculating on track to simply chalk it up to heat of the moment. Yes he was liked by the teams he drove for. But he was in his day as divisive as Valentino was in his day.
It's difficult, because I cannot stand Schumacher for all the reasons you stated. But, as a human being, I also don't wish what happened to him on almost anybody. That said, he was a completely dirty driver who would outright cheat to win. The problem is now, because of his fate (much like Senna), people will never speak ill of him, but like you said, I will not disregard what he did because of his current state.
People say Senna pushed the level of aggressiveness, and he did, but he never outright cheated. Schumacher (and Ferrari) were allowed to get away with far too much imo.
I'd also say that based on everything I know, Ayrton Senna died trying to outrun an illegal car in Schumacher's Benetton B-194 at Imola...the one that the FIA found traction control software hidden on the ECU, as well as launch control. But oh hey we can't prove it was used so there's nothing we can do. As if any team run by noted scumbag Flavio Briatore could be trusted from top to bottom. Plus Schumacher ignored black flags at the British GP that year which got him a multi-race ban after the appeal failed.
I will go so far as saying that too. Given how Schumacher and some of his team at Ferrari later blantantly cheated, it is not beyond the realms of imagination at all to conclude they were cheating in 1994. As you know, the FIA found software on the Benetton B194 but could not prove it had been activated. Senna was famed for his finesse when it came to engines, once famously in 1993 stating his engine in practice was not right. When the technicians looked at the data, they found no issues. Ron Dennis said "We either change the engine, or tell him we changed it". Knowing Senna, Dennis opted to change the engine and when Cosworth got it back, they found a cam lobe slightly wiped (like a couple of degrees). THAT is the level of feel that he had on engines. When he says the Benetton was running TC, it was running TC.

And like you said, who was boss at that time? Flavio Briatore. The same guy who ordered one of his drivers to crash deliberately in Singapore 2008 to allow his start driver to win thanks to a well timed safety car.



MM himself says he needs to make less mistakes, such as the one he made in qualifying which would normally have ruined his weekend., to be in the title fight.

I consider him less likely to make mistakes than Pecco or Martin, and particularly not the type of own goal just scored by Martin, but I am now more inclined to believe Bagnaia and Martin about some of their crashes, that these aero devices just ain’t natural and perhaps do just let go for no apparent reason on occasion. This is something even MM probably won’t be able to avoid, although he does appear recently to be able to skate on the limit more than other Ducati riders, as he has done in general on other bikes over his whole career.
It's an interesting point, and I think I started a thread on it recently. I do think the aero era is making it harder to be consistent.
I don't know jack about aerodynamics, but could aero stall be a factor mid corner? Particularly amongst other bikes.
Aero stalls are scary AF...I dread to think how bad they are on a bike.
 
Something clearly not right at Noale. The Piaggio group can't be happy about slipping down the pecking order, and now have to start fighting with a Japanese bike by the looks of it.

Martin and Bezzecchi... Fernandez and Ogura... Wouldn't fill me with confidence if I were Rivola.
Piaggio is the smallest company involved in the premier class if I'm not mistaken.
It's an arms race and they're being outspent. This was bound to happen, unfortunately.
He doesn't sound like a good bloke at all.
Knew he did a bit of dodgy stuff but not that much.
Never been into F1 as it is boring as fk to watch imo. All that aero .... makes it very hard to pass. Hope it never happens to motoGP.
Oh wait.....🙄
Heck, F1 did everything right with the ground effect cars (except they're ....... huge) This year is the first time since like 2012 that F1 has all in all been more exciting than MotoGP.
Senna was famed for his finesse when it came to engines, once famously in 1993 stating his engine in practice was not right. When the technicians looked at the data, they found no issues. Ron Dennis said "We either change the engine, or tell him we changed it". Knowing Senna, Dennis opted to change the engine and when Cosworth got it back, they found a cam lobe slightly wiped (like a couple of degrees). THAT is the level of feel that he had on engines. When he says the Benetton was running TC, it was running TC.
During his rookie season Senna crashed out at the 100+ degree Dallas GP. The Toleman team laughed at him when he said the wall had moved.
Until it turned out it had moved a few millimeters indeed.
Ayrton's precision was otherworldly.
 
It's an interesting point, and I think I started a thread on it recently. I do think the aero era is making it harder to be consistent.
Apologies if I didn’t acknowledge previous ideas of yours.

It is interesting, and what is one source of interest for me is that MM is by and large calling his crashes mistakes, so perhaps he considers he can actually learn to avoid them. Other than the sprint race when he crashed out of the lead which he attributed probably correctly to water under the track he has not been saying that the bike just let go as Martin and Pecco have been known to do. This probably hasn’t harmed his relationship with Gigi and Ducati either.

Not that I would know, but the aero stall thing sounds like it could be contributing. Some of the crashes, particularly Martin’s, have been when out on their own in front rather than in corners though.
 
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I think I said it....or something close to it a while back but.....Piqueras is a star in the making. Kid has got "it." Martin getting ever more creative in coming up with new ways to throw away a championship. And just when I've had enough of Jake Dixon, he starts pulling me back in. I had some hope for Joe Roberts but he got mugged and never recovered. Ai Ogura deserves that MotoGP ride. Congrats to him. Pecco seemed to play both sides in Parc Ferme. He admitted Marc rode the wheels off the GP23 but then brought up not being fit. I don't know. Fuqqin' Mdub has got me thinking he's a bit of a prima donna.
 
I think I said it....or something close to it a while back but.....Piqueras is a star in the making. Kid has got "it." Martin getting ever more creative in coming up with new ways to throw away a championship. And just when I've had enough of Jake Dixon, he starts pulling me back in. I had some hope for Joe Roberts but he got mugged and never recovered. Ai Ogura deserves that MotoGP ride. Congrats to him. Pecco seemed to play both sides in Parc Ferme. He admitted Marc rode the wheels off the GP23 but then brought up not being fit. I don't know. Fuqqin' Mdub has got me thinking he's a bit of a prima donna.
Yes he did 15 laps in the race, and he couldn't handle the pan in the last 5 laps. Well his Mrs must have given him a great massage Sunday night, as he was able to do 51 laps in the testing, no sign of pain.
Fucken amazing.
 
Ago switching to Yamaha

But in more recent times we had Marc Marquez voluntarily go from a factory team to a satellite team. Can you think of anyone else who voluntarily went from a factory team to a satellite team?
 
Ago switching to Yamaha

But in more recent times we had Marc Marquez voluntarily go from a factory team to a satellite team. Can you think of anyone else who voluntarily went from a factory team to a satellite team?
Wrong thread, but haven't we already seen riders go from the worst factory bike, to a very good satellite? Zarco for instance going from KTM to Avintia.
 
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