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MotoGP: 2015 Round 17 - Shell Malaysia Motorcycle Grand Prix (SPOILERS)
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Gaz, it's not a line in the sand MM crossed, but he to will probably one day be riding for a championship, and if there is karma or a god, some rider who just doesn't want that prick to win will just hold him up and change the outcome of the series, making MM come in 2nd or worse.
No offense, every competitor is signed on to the goal of winning and finishing as best they can, to say MM has no responsibility to compete for the win, is effectively endorsing the behavior of sandbagging a race to harass another rider. I am sure the organization you "administer" or "officiate" rewards participants for the goal of harassing other riders because said rider is no longer a viable overall winner. If you as an official and do endorse that, you should not be in the racing game. You just rely on those participants to "do the right thing" is that it? you officiate chess matches, checkers? wtf?
You can think i'm a VR46 bleed yellow guy all you want, but MotoGP missed the mark here, every rider on that grid is wasting there time if the press princess MM can just ride roughshot over anyone he chooses because this classless overrated ...... doesn't like who's winning.
You don't seem to have any response to MM's laptimes, you know the fast ones in qualifying and the first few of the race? then he suddenly sees his board and suddenly the honda can't run a full lap without rubbing blue paint on it.
IMHO, no action after MM's CHOICE of going after VR, were anyone's fault but MM's. VR is the points leader after 17 races, MM is pointless in this series for the overall win. All Season he says he's just going to go for the race wins, and his laptimes show it, contantly getting better and/or staying consistent at the front. Provided he didn't crash.
This one race he hammers out some fast laps and then starts going backwards, shockingly ending up in an altercation he created himself. No offense, he tipped into VR, VR was in front, it's MM's responsibility to get around VR not VR's responsibility to let MM get around him. That turn, had NO shortage of run off, Marquez wanted to play the victim here, and you soft brained losers bit on it hook like and sinker.
Show me in the rules were your not allowed to look at another rider? Forward or back, I don't see it. It does have some info in there about hitting another rider, even if your in a block pass situation. Several of which nearly cause VR to crash earlier in the race. Riders look at the bike they are putting a block pass on all the time. Tell me how many positions on the starting grid Crutchlow lost for taking out Dovi? Because we are following the letter of the rule book right?
There was contact between MM and VR, and as it turns out you can hear and see on the telemetry that MM caused it. Yet your defending MM who drove into VR from behind.
No offense, every competitor is signed on to the goal of winning and finishing as best they can, to say MM has no responsibility to compete for the win, is effectively endorsing the behavior of sandbagging a race to harass another rider. I am sure the organization you "administer" or "officiate" rewards participants for the goal of harassing other riders because said rider is no longer a viable overall winner. If you as an official and do endorse that, you should not be in the racing game. You just rely on those participants to "do the right thing" is that it? you officiate chess matches, checkers? wtf?
You can think i'm a VR46 bleed yellow guy all you want, but MotoGP missed the mark here, every rider on that grid is wasting there time if the press princess MM can just ride roughshot over anyone he chooses because this classless overrated ...... doesn't like who's winning.
You don't seem to have any response to MM's laptimes, you know the fast ones in qualifying and the first few of the race? then he suddenly sees his board and suddenly the honda can't run a full lap without rubbing blue paint on it.
IMHO, no action after MM's CHOICE of going after VR, were anyone's fault but MM's. VR is the points leader after 17 races, MM is pointless in this series for the overall win. All Season he says he's just going to go for the race wins, and his laptimes show it, contantly getting better and/or staying consistent at the front. Provided he didn't crash.
This one race he hammers out some fast laps and then starts going backwards, shockingly ending up in an altercation he created himself. No offense, he tipped into VR, VR was in front, it's MM's responsibility to get around VR not VR's responsibility to let MM get around him. That turn, had NO shortage of run off, Marquez wanted to play the victim here, and you soft brained losers bit on it hook like and sinker.
Show me in the rules were your not allowed to look at another rider? Forward or back, I don't see it. It does have some info in there about hitting another rider, even if your in a block pass situation. Several of which nearly cause VR to crash earlier in the race. Riders look at the bike they are putting a block pass on all the time. Tell me how many positions on the starting grid Crutchlow lost for taking out Dovi? Because we are following the letter of the rule book right?
There was contact between MM and VR, and as it turns out you can hear and see on the telemetry that MM caused it. Yet your defending MM who drove into VR from behind.
Only if then a naked Kim Kardashin is the track mashall and helps Rossi back to his feet.
Gaz, I'll give you an apology for the name calling. Your right I didn't go back to read or research your old posts. I read a few ridiculous statements about dirty moves not being nice, but not dirty either. Sorry man, sincerely, for the name calling, but your splitting hairs on semantics when it's obvious to everyone else this could have all been avoided, had MM just rode for the race 1st or 2nd where is qualifying pace and first few laps put him.
Sincerely, sorry.
Sincerely, sorry.
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Nothing flusters you old chap.
Its like nobody has ever seen a Wsbk race at Silverstone.
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ok, i dont wanna start an argument,cuz i think it has been discussed enough, i do think rossi shouldve been DSQ from this race also,(race directors say :we actually believe there is fault on both sides.)
if there was fault from both sides they should get the same treatment so there should be no point for rossi,which make the decision sound very stupid.
and ive already shared my opinion about how stupid rossi's move was.(i made it very clear so i wont go into that any more)
there is something tho, how many of you watched the race more than one time?
ive taken few snapshot(which i dont know if i can ul, but tbh,18 laps to go, MM looks over his shoulder(i dont know if its visible in the snapshot) and saw lorenzo with a gap from rossi, then ran wide(very weird cuz the pace wasnt that high) , then the fight with rossi started, i honestly completely unbiased here, but for some reason if you watch the race again, you see between lap 2 and 5 every passes made by rossi was completely clean but every pass by MM even if he made stick completely (just to rub it in his face like) he tries to push rossi out of track or attack very DANGEROUSLY from outside and take rossi as a slave kinda like,(still not against the rules,iknow)
when i was watching live and saw rossi's hand gesture, i thought it was a sincere one as if buddy we can catch them, but the second and third,... time i realized he was saying what the fk are you doing. and in couple of corner he took him down.
tbh, i really think MM was trying to get on his nerve or even trying to take him down(and a couple of time we see rossi loosing the front and his left foot was off the footrest,but he managed not to crash) couple of times there was even weird contact where MM passed but he still pushed his bike under rossi's.
so when he says(MM) i was doing my own race, thats not true one bit. he was just racing very dirty against probably the worst guy, cuz rossi looked very tense on the grid also(this was the first time i saw him banging his head into his bike)
and look at the lap time, when rossi closes up to JL ,MM makes an insane move every time, and when they are back he stays back and make pass and stay in front, the gap ,which was 0.5s turned into 2.755 s.
so go figure
if there was fault from both sides they should get the same treatment so there should be no point for rossi,which make the decision sound very stupid.
and ive already shared my opinion about how stupid rossi's move was.(i made it very clear so i wont go into that any more)
there is something tho, how many of you watched the race more than one time?
ive taken few snapshot(which i dont know if i can ul, but tbh,18 laps to go, MM looks over his shoulder(i dont know if its visible in the snapshot) and saw lorenzo with a gap from rossi, then ran wide(very weird cuz the pace wasnt that high) , then the fight with rossi started, i honestly completely unbiased here, but for some reason if you watch the race again, you see between lap 2 and 5 every passes made by rossi was completely clean but every pass by MM even if he made stick completely (just to rub it in his face like) he tries to push rossi out of track or attack very DANGEROUSLY from outside and take rossi as a slave kinda like,(still not against the rules,iknow)
when i was watching live and saw rossi's hand gesture, i thought it was a sincere one as if buddy we can catch them, but the second and third,... time i realized he was saying what the fk are you doing. and in couple of corner he took him down.
tbh, i really think MM was trying to get on his nerve or even trying to take him down(and a couple of time we see rossi loosing the front and his left foot was off the footrest,but he managed not to crash) couple of times there was even weird contact where MM passed but he still pushed his bike under rossi's.
so when he says(MM) i was doing my own race, thats not true one bit. he was just racing very dirty against probably the worst guy, cuz rossi looked very tense on the grid also(this was the first time i saw him banging his head into his bike)
and look at the lap time, when rossi closes up to JL ,MM makes an insane move every time, and when they are back he stays back and make pass and stay in front, the gap ,which was 0.5s turned into 2.755 s.
so go figure
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One does like to keep ones powder dry old boy
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Just wanted to follow up from earlier so no one misunderstands me since I did talk a little bit about MM and intentions.
Based purely on the rules, Rossi should have been black flagged within 2 laps of the incident for what happened.
In spite of what he believes or believed about MM the sporting regulations state the following in section 1.21 subsection 2:
Penalties as laid out by the disciplinary code...
When you consider the options from DQ down, Rossi got off lightly.
In theory he should have been penalized under withdrawal of championship points and exclusion from the championship. There is precedent as I mentioned many pages ago where Michael Schumacher was excluded from the 1997 FIA Formula 1 World Championship for his actions in the final race at Jerez. So it has been done in a top level series for causing a collision by intentionally positioning one's self so such conflict was inevitable. Rossi did it subtly with the actual hit, but the intent remains the same.
He should not be participating in Valencia, and Jorge Lorenzo should have been declared 2015 MotoGP World Champion as a result.
Whether MM did or did not conspire to ruin VR's race doesn't matter as there is nothing explicit in the rules pertaining to such things. In order to do something about it, there needs to be proof. There is no evidence to support such claims. This is indisputable. Burden of proof in a court of law is much higher than burden of proof across internet forums. At the end of the day, Race Direction's biggest mistake was not in assessing a larger penalty to Valentino Rossi.
Based purely on the rules, Rossi should have been black flagged within 2 laps of the incident for what happened.
In spite of what he believes or believed about MM the sporting regulations state the following in section 1.21 subsection 2:
Penalties as laid out by the disciplinary code...
When you consider the options from DQ down, Rossi got off lightly.
In theory he should have been penalized under withdrawal of championship points and exclusion from the championship. There is precedent as I mentioned many pages ago where Michael Schumacher was excluded from the 1997 FIA Formula 1 World Championship for his actions in the final race at Jerez. So it has been done in a top level series for causing a collision by intentionally positioning one's self so such conflict was inevitable. Rossi did it subtly with the actual hit, but the intent remains the same.
He should not be participating in Valencia, and Jorge Lorenzo should have been declared 2015 MotoGP World Champion as a result.
Whether MM did or did not conspire to ruin VR's race doesn't matter as there is nothing explicit in the rules pertaining to such things. In order to do something about it, there needs to be proof. There is no evidence to support such claims. This is indisputable. Burden of proof in a court of law is much higher than burden of proof across internet forums. At the end of the day, Race Direction's biggest mistake was not in assessing a larger penalty to Valentino Rossi.
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I care.
I don't think he's particularly concerned about that. Winning is a cure-all.
than they should, actually, add a rule that an obviously slower rider, struggling to keep in front of a possible champion, with no chance at all to win the championship, has to be called back with a blue flag, if his own misslead ego stands in the way of good sportmanship and rational thinking, as boring as this might be. sorry, but to say marquez did nothing wrong by the way he behaved...if they really need rules to make him clear that it is not his decision who deserves to win, it will soon be boring as formula 1.
again, he did nothing wrong going strictly by the rules, but it´s also not up to him to take influence in a fight that is not his fight. and once more again:
gentlemens agreement (im 100% sure this also exists in motogp). if you have no chance to win the title, than at one point you have to get the .... out off the way of the ones who do, or at least be an obstacle for both...
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for instance whats the point of that last outside pass when you know the track and you know youre gonna run wide.!!!
ps; Consequences dictate our course of action,
it doesn't matter what's right.
It's only wrong if you get caught.
ps; Consequences dictate our course of action,
it doesn't matter what's right.
It's only wrong if you get caught.
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Thank you for your concern. Being bored to death by ........ is just an expression. If it were a real thing, I'd have died from reading your nonsense a long time ago. You beating a dead horse and repeating the meme that endless pages consisting of torrents of childish insults being traded back and forth can be construed as evidence of how or why the forum is thriving won't be the death of anyone. You'd like to take credit for the fact that this thread is going on for as long as it is - but the longevity of the the thread has only to do with the nature of the controversy being discussed. You continue to make the mistake of valuing quantity over quality. So keep up the personal attacks, keep beating that dead horse (it's god for your post count too). It keeps alive your delusion that any of your lashing out at me has any relevance to anything besides your preoccupation with pursuing a narcissistic flame war that should have died long ago. Keep feeding the drama that only you (and of course your multiple screen characters) and your two enthralled groupies who live off the crumbs of your pettiness are paying attention to. It really doesn't concern me.
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JPSLogus, which of the incidents in Feros's post would you consider to meet this rule?
It's your judgement call:
Riders must ride in a responsible manner which does not cause danger to
other competitors or participants, either on the track or in the pit-lane.
MM made far more irresponsible and was riding dangerous more than VR, he posted several stills of the passes previous to MM ramming VR and going down.
So if VR should have been black flagged, now many laps before MM crashed into VR should he have been black flagged?
It's your judgement call:
Riders must ride in a responsible manner which does not cause danger to
other competitors or participants, either on the track or in the pit-lane.
MM made far more irresponsible and was riding dangerous more than VR, he posted several stills of the passes previous to MM ramming VR and going down.
So if VR should have been black flagged, now many laps before MM crashed into VR should he have been black flagged?
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All season long I've been hearing that all Rossi needs is good qualy and a good start, then he'll show em all. The best part of the race for me was Rossi getting a good start compared to Lorenzo. This tells me all I need to know. At this point the championship is fully in Rossi's hands. Rossi should have been the one taking Marquez then sitting with Pedro for the race, well out of trouble, winning it on the last lap.
As he says, he had the pace. Really? He had the pace. Within two laps Rossi's leathers practically get blown off by Lorenzo blasting past, then checking out, just like he has all season long. Now if following the Marquez crash Rossi put in a few fastest laps I might entertain Marquez was holding him up. But Rossi just falls further behind. Rossi had no answer. No pace.
Now as for riders playing dirty tactics, first it was Pedro in Aragon, stealing points from Rossi when he is not a title contender. March Pedro to the gallows.
Next came Iannone, having the gall to pass Rossi at PI on the last lap no less, earning the wrath of Italy. March him to the gallows.
Finally Marquez, say no more. Poor cruising caretaker 10 times.
As he says, he had the pace. Really? He had the pace. Within two laps Rossi's leathers practically get blown off by Lorenzo blasting past, then checking out, just like he has all season long. Now if following the Marquez crash Rossi put in a few fastest laps I might entertain Marquez was holding him up. But Rossi just falls further behind. Rossi had no answer. No pace.
Now as for riders playing dirty tactics, first it was Pedro in Aragon, stealing points from Rossi when he is not a title contender. March Pedro to the gallows.
Next came Iannone, having the gall to pass Rossi at PI on the last lap no less, earning the wrath of Italy. March him to the gallows.
Finally Marquez, say no more. Poor cruising caretaker 10 times.
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