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Aragon GP 2011: RACE

Yes...very strange:

Stoner 2011 race time 42,17 minutes

Stoner 2010 race time 42,16 minutes



Rossi Ducati 2011 - 328,8 km/h

Stoner Ducati 2010 - 319,8 km.h



After Stoners win last year at Motegi, Haydens qualifying P2 (0.1 off pole) in Malaysia, and Stoners usual dominance at Phillip Is, Ducati should go back to exactly the same spec GP10 used last year, and with exactly Stoner's settings as a base setup for the next 3 races, and see where that leads them.

I realise there will be other variations effecting speed, but that is probably better than their current lack of direction.
 
The whole Rossi based development has been an absolute success. They are getting exactly what they are aiming to get ........... a "tamer Ducati"



They need to be developing a Ducati that will win ....... ala Stoner's Ducati mods. pre Aragon 2010.



Big Bang sucks.



Riding it smoothly sucks.



Ducati need a rider who will push the bike and develop it as a fast bike, not a "tame" machine that "everyone can ride"
 
The whole Rossi based development has been an absolute success. They are getting exactly what they are aiming to get ........... a "tamer Ducati"



They need to be developing a Ducati that will win ....... ala Stoner's Ducati mods. pre Aragon 2010.



Big Bang sucks.



Riding it smoothly sucks.



Ducati need a rider who will push the bike and develop it as a fast bike, not a "tame" machine that "everyone can ride"



surely having 4 or 5 bikes on the gird is pointless if only 1 person can ride it though? Freaks like Stoner dont come about often, what are Ducati supposed to do, develop freaks to ride their bikes?
 
surely having 4 or 5 bikes on the gird is pointless if only 1 person can ride it though? Freaks like Stoner dont come about often, what are Ducati supposed to do, develop freaks to ride their bikes?



But "freaks" have got Ducati their only major credits. eg. Bayliss and Stoner.



One could argue that the reason behind that is an idiosyncratic riding style required by Ducati ( but beneficial on other brands as 2011 has shown ). I would possibly argue that the "idiosyncratic style" comes directly from Aust. short circuit racing, however I'm not dead sure Bayliss' upbringing involved much of that.
 
Out of curiosity, i looked to see how close Casey was to breaking Lorenzo's record point total from last year. Even after the season Casey has had, he will have to win all 4 remaining races to beat Lorenzo's total. Makes you realize how special a year Lorenzo had in 2010.

What lorenzo did last year was exceptional, and what he has done this year is nearly as exceptional, he seems to have developed the ability to get the absolute maximum out of his bike.



However what he did last year which stoner has not managed even thus far this year was to have zero dnfs; without the jerez dnf which in my biased opinion was entirely unrelated to any error in riding or judgement by stoner or even any deficiency in the honda it would seem likely he would need only 4 second places in the remaining races to match jorge's 2010 total.



That said I think lorenzo could have scored more points last year had he not ridden conservatively in a few races when the championship was almost in the bag; stoner has at least not thrown the bike down in his non winning races apart from jerez this year, but I don't think he could have scored much higher by trying harder anyway.
 
What lorenzo did last year was exceptional, and what he has done this year is nearly as exceptional, he seems to have developed the ability to get the absolute maximum out of his bike.



However what he did last year which stoner has not managed even thus far this year was to have zero dnfs; without the jerez dnf which in my biased opinion was entirely unrelated to any error in riding or judgement by stoner or even any deficiency in the honda it would seem likely he would need only 4 second places in the remaining races to match jorge's 2010 total.



That said I think lorenzo could have scored more points last year had he not ridden conservatively in a few races when the championship was almost in the bag; stoner has at least not thrown the bike down in his non winning races apart from jerez this year, but I don't think he could have scored much higher by trying harder anyway.

No need to throw the word biased in your statement. Surely their isnt anyone on the planet who didnt see it for what it was, Is there?. DNF's are killers, look at poor Dovi,comfortable and cruising towards 3rd place in the championship, and now, almost certainly will concede that position to his teammate.I also believe Lorenzo left some points on the table last year while sewing up the title, and the same might happen to Stoner this year.. He is going to be in a quandary come Phillip Island. Everyone keeps talking about him wrapping the title up at home, but he could also lose the title at home if he rides to please the home fans. He is dominant at PI, but except for 07, has not had anything to lose by going balls out at home. Might have to be a little more careful this time around. But then again, on a bike with some predictability built in, he can go 9/10ths and get the home win. I know a lot of "bored"fans are clinging to title race that goes to Valencia, but i am pulling hard for him to wrap the title at home. That would be "entertaining" to me. Sharing your accomplishments and your emotions with your fellow countryman would have to be one of the best feelings in the world.
 
But "freaks" have got Ducati their only major credits. eg. Bayliss and Stoner.



One could argue that the reason behind that is an idiosyncratic riding style required by Ducati ( but beneficial on other brands as 2011 has shown ). I would possibly argue that the "idiosyncratic style" comes directly from Aust. short circuit racing, however I'm not dead sure Bayliss' upbringing involved much of that.





Sorry, Stoner is freaking genius, but Bayliss? He won one race on the Ducati an did eff all in the rest of his gp career. Thats as many wins as Scud Elias has in his career, and 2 less than Capirossi won on the Duke that season. He was a good superbike rider, but, as Toseland and Edwards proved in championships, far from unbeatable. And lets be honest, nobody is shouting about what great GP riders they are.......
 
But "freaks" have got Ducati their only major credits. eg. Bayliss and Stoner.



Bayliss was no freak and neither was Loris, he won more races on that bike too



but i am pulling hard for him to wrap the title at home. That would be "entertaining" to me. Sharing your accomplishments and your emotions with your fellow countryman would have to be one of the best feelings in the world.



So am I. I think i read somewhere raceday will be his birthday too
 
if Stoner is such a phenomena..why wasnt he durring 2008, 2009, 2010?



J-Lo has disappointed me big time, makes 2010 look like a fluke cause i expected a better fight from him for the #1
 
I cannot help but be skeptical about using this information to draw conclusions. Firstly as you say you have no verification, and secondly you are taking the opinion of someone who is not only involved in the competition, but who is losing. Perhaps more so than us sat on our armchairs people in this position will be desperate to explain the difference between their efforts and winning one, desperate to allocate the performance difference to something outside of their own team's performance. That is fundamental in such a competitive environment. All I am saying is, it is extremely unlikely a principal in the moto2 paddock can be considered a reliable or nuetral source



Because Dorna are the keepers of honesty and integrity and hav all the best intentions. Ur logic above applies to the series organizers. Do u realize that?
 
I can only take so much whining before i snap. I just cannot wrap my head around anyone who does nothing but ..... and complain and constantly telling me how bored they are. If you ....... bored, find something that doesnt bore you. I will just go ahead and make predictions for the next 4 races. Stoner fans will be happy, Rossi fans will not, Curve will be bored, and Lex will continue to push for spec racing, then say he didnt..



Ok, but u still didnt answer the question.
 
This perhaps in an offbeat kind of way explains why I am an atheist.



Someone claims a miraculous event



And I still don't see it.



Help me here please - explain the miracle - how history was made



Now winning back to back titles and races with two different manufacturers was cool and I can see the juju



It may be the drugs I'm on but this needs some work (sorry if I seems dense at the moment)



A cogent explanation that cuts through oxycontin



Sorry, was taking the piss out of scotty
 
Sorry, was taking the piss out of scotty



It's sweet that penguin guy has united all the different powerslide factions to stand together and say.........what a fanny.



For penguin, ponky and super soaker, we are truly thankful. Yeah I ken I spelt penkies name wrong, but he cannae read so wont notice. Bless
 
Ok, but u still didnt answer the question.

Hell, what question?. That was 3 pages ago



Is this the question

How would u prefer to describe the lack of close racing?

If that is the question, i have answered about a million times in the last 5 years.



ITS PROTOTYPE RACING, a form of racing that inherently produces runaway victories and championships. There is always someone who comes up with a better design, a more tractable engine, better aero etc: Once that is achieved, the best pilots are standing in line. You mix the 2 together and you have F1, Gp, or the old IMSA series. It is what it is, a contest of engineering capabilities. If it doesnt produce the results you like, your just not a fan of prototype racing, which you have already stated. I happen to be a fan of prototype racing, but i can differentiate it from spec racing and not expect the same results. In fact, i abhor the thought of them being the same. Would i make changes in GP, you betcha, but it would not be in the name of close racing. If close racing was a byproduct of such changes, so be it. If they created even more of a performance gap, so be it. Can i make myself any clearer, i dont give a .... if there is 1 bike or 4 bikes at the finish line of a GP race, it is not why i follow the sport.
 
Pov, why cant u answer the simply question? U just explained why u think there isnt close racing. Great. My question is how would u like the people describing the lack of close racing. They use the word "boring". Obviously u hav a revolting reaction to the word. I dont think the people describing it as such are casual fans of the sport. Most peeps here are actually avid folliwers of the sport. So again, how would u like peeps describe the lack of close racing? Keep in mind, some years hav been closer and it was still prototype racing. So one does not mean the other must not exist.
 
ITS PROTOTYPE RACING...

http://moto-racing.speedtv.com/article/motogp-new-moto2-600s-could-debut-in-spain-2009/P4

And, in fact, where does this idea that GP racing being reserved for prototypes come from anyway? In earlier times, manufactures raced with modified versions of their production engines. If you look for historic precedents that make it clear that the FIM did not originally intend to differentiate between prototypes and production-derived machines, there are many examples… Jack Findlay became the first ever 500 winner on a two-stroke when he won the Ulster in 1971 on a modified version of the Suzuki TR500 twin.



Slotting Suzuki and Kawasaki engines into Seeley frames was a smart way to go 500 racing in the early seventies. And when Findlay and Danielli Fontana (of brake fame) got together to build their Suzuki TR500-powwered “JADA” there was no reason for the FIM to question whether this was a “prototype.” Had GP racing engines been four strokes instead of turning exclusively to two-stroke power (with the exception of the oval-piston Honda NR500 from 1979 through 1981), we would certainly have seen direct crossovers from production to racing or from racing to production.



But when Dorna petitioned the FIM to change from the traditional 500cc two stroke class (which was never a 'two stroke class' at all, but merely a class where two strokes had proven the more successful engine type under a strict capacity limit of 500cc) to admit large capacity four strokes, the rights-holders of the World Superbike Championship feared that big road engines from bikes homologated for World Superbike would be slotted into prototype frames and that manufacturers might choose to concentrate on the GP series as a way of promoting their roadbikes.



As a result of this concern new contracts were written or old contracts were amended to protect SBK from encroachments and the Flammini brothers, Maurizio and Paolo Alberto, began to say that their agreements with the FIM assured them that production-based engines could not be used to power GP machines on any kind.



Ironically, being a purist about "prototype" racing advances the agenda of the Flamminis. But now that Bridgepoint owns both Dorna and Infront, the differences will be downplayed. Who knows, there may be a control ECU in MotoGP's future.
 
Bingo. If there is one pure unadulterated truth in the world, its that no matter where you go in the racing world, there is some guy in the paddock saying, Im as good as him, if i had his equipment i would be winning too. Jum, you can tell us what you heard, without telling us who said it.Spit it out, inquiring minds want to know.



U and Tom already made up ur mind its ..... So u two can keep believing the series organizers who in ur naive minds must hav more integrity than Mother Teresa.
 

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