This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

Motogp: 2016 Round 3 Red Bull Grand Prix of The Americas

You essentially said it was "too bad" that Dovi's leg didn't get broken so that Stoner could take his spot. You're probably the only one here that would have been ecstatic if that happened.

That doesn't mean I wished it. I simply made the observation it wouldn't have been the worst thing.

Some of you guys really need to get over yourselves.

I'm only saying what most don't have the balls to admit. Remember when Pedrosa was injured last year? Everyone was praying for Stoner to fill in for him...and no one cared about Pedrosa's arm pump misfortune because the thought of Stoner possibly riding mattered more.

Trust me, most of this forum would have been ecstatic after offering their ........ platitudes about how sad it was for Dovizioso. But as soon as the red lights went out and if Stoner were in the lead, why many would be thrilled to have the good fortune of seeing Casey back on track no matter what the circumstances are. Anyone who even denies that outside of the legit Stoner haters are full of .... and probably have a bridge to sell you.
 
"and no one cared about Pedrosa's arm pump misfortune because the thought of Stoner possibly riding mattered more. "

(i think you meant)
and I didn't care about Pedrosa's arm pump misfortune because the thought of Stoner possibly riding mattered more.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 person
"and no one cared about Pedrosa's arm pump misfortune because the thought of Stoner possibly riding mattered more. "

(i think you meant)
and I didn't care about Pedrosa's arm pump misfortune because the thought of Stoner possibly riding mattered more.

Quite a few people out there got excited once they heard Stoner was possibly going to ride.

In fact, when he announced he was going back to Ducati, there were a lot of GP fans out there who were livid when they found out he wanted to ride in place of Pedrosa last April because they felt like they got robbed. All anyone cared about was not getting to see him ride, not that it would have come at the expense of Pedrosa's health.
 
Quite a few people out there got excited once they heard Stoner was possibly going to ride.

In fact, when he announced he was going back to Ducati, there were a lot of GP fans out there who were livid when they found out he wanted to ride in place of Pedrosa last April because they felt like they got robbed. All anyone cared about was not getting to see him ride, not that it would have come at the expense of Pedrosa's health.

I too would like to see stoner race again. the sport would be better with him in it for sur. but definitely not at the expense of any other rider. He retired. it's on him.

pro tip- if you are famous and decide to retire. don't say it's to spend more time with your family. because when you come out of retirement 2 years later people might think you've decided your family sucks
 
  • Like
Reactions: 2 people
I've never really watched the parade lap before. What a surreal and silly thing. How weird to be put on display like a homecoming queen. It looks all so somber out there. I love the fact that Espargaro and Smith are being chauffeured by a fat lady in a pink housecoat and a sun bonnet.


And what's the deal with MM wearing a bandanna over his face? Is it that cold there at this hour???


BTW - love it when Jorge pouts. It's his best feature.

I've only ever seen it done in America,
See there you lot go again messing where messing isn't necessary.
It was so fcuking lame, Cal was a picture, didn't wave to anyone till half way round, He looked well pissed
 
I've only ever seen it done in America,
See there you lot go again messing where messing isn't necessary.
It was so fcuking lame, Cal was a picture, didn't wave to anyone till half way round, He looked well pissed

I don't get you there. Please explain Bro. You talking about the "pout" remark???
 
Watched race late last night. Haven't read thread. Initial thoughts:

To say Marc Marquez's performance was amazing is an understatement! But since there were no close passes, the master class performance often gets overlooked (Valencia anyone?). That is two times Marc has annihilated the field in tricky conditions, at Argentina the dirty wet-patchy track combined with the Mishitlins combined with 'almost impossible old habits' (more on this below); COTA wasn't much different, the track itself seemed to offer its own precarious complexity combined with a tire that is NOT predictable (indicated by the number of crashers in the last two rounds...old habits, which for mere mortal die hard). Sometimes the performance of the winner is overshadowed by the auxiliary story lines, given that Rossi went down and all the other crashes, Marc's performance (like Lorenzo's at Valencia) will be overshadowed. Possibly "boring". I appreciate the desire for dicing, but sometimes the individual performance is as awe inspiring. Marquez not only won the race wilst others crashed trying to achieve the same goal, but he was managing to set faster laps compared to those who 'pushed beyond the limit'. Pause for a moment to think about this, the guy who didn't crash was faster than the crashers. It's counter intuitive, but I remember Casey Stoner once explaining his crash on tricky tires, he explained the problem was he didn't push hard enough. Counterintuitive. Easier said than done, because surely it's not as simple as 'pushing harder' because those who crashed will tell you they 'pushed too much'. What Marquez is doing is going faster than that supposed 'limit'! What limit? The limit that caused a slower Lorenzo at Argentina and a slower Rossi in America to crash. Mind-boggling stuff. (For the record, I migs in the pre-season that Marquez might be out of contention this season, I was wrong.)

Jorge Lorenzo was exceptionally fast and consistent after his firs lap dash wilst being cautions, riding to the point he believed was his limit, which again puts Marc's performance into perspective. During the post-race press conference, Jorge reflected about his crash in Argentina and his ability to ride for a podium in America, it sounded like he alluded to 'old habits' in regards to his approach with the Michelins. He actually paused mid sentence, as if editing himself on the fly from uttering the name "Bridgestone" but if you listen to him talk, one could fill in the blank. It sounded like he meant to say, in Argentina I crashed because I made the mistake of pushing the Michelin tires like I used to do with the Bridgestones. 'Old habits die hard' (and I believe it was part of the problem for Iannone's crash, but more on that later). Lorenzo has a steep learning curve, and it seems he has made the adjustment. For the record, I don't believe Yamaha will support him in the later stages of the season, I believe this title is a write off, I believe Rossi's influence and the 'new' Yamaha culture will see to it. Racing in the European portion of the season in theory should shift the balance toward Lorenzo. Notwithstanding the effect of the Michelins.

Andrea Iannone has earned a bit of bad wrap, both from his own blunders and from a confluence of conditions, misjudgments and jumping to conclusions on our part and tires that have made racing for a podium a knife's edge proposition (I'm still fixing to write up why we are wrong to blame him solely for Argentina, if I could find the time). We had many fallers at COTA, indication that the tires are lacking predictability and quality, though I feel the track conditions during the race seemed to present another layer of complexity.

---

The podium ambience was fantastic. All the riders moving around in that space free from a looming shadow of animosity or rancor. Frankly, they looked like kids having fun. No bitterness on display, no animus or discord. I'm not sure I detected much booing, but I'm told from a friend who was there that he detected some coming from a Yellow tinged crowd when they announced Lorenzo, though he was happy to report, it wasn't overwhelming. And, he added, if there were any booes for Marquez, he didn't hear them, as they might have been overpowered by cheers. I'd like to see the selfie the riders took on the podium. I'd like to caption it: 'The Absence of Venom'.

I'm not convinced Mavrick Vinalez is the next big thing but rather the next big name. It was fun to watch his on track exchange with Alex Espargaro, who by the way, doesn't get enough credit. But if Alex is to be so easily dismissed, well... Mavrick struggled to get by him. Yes, I'm aware they were on different tires, there is a message here isn't there? My migs is that Vinalez will become Rossi's teammate, by design (there is a message there too). Which leads me to another point, and that is this notion that Jorge Lorenzo is picking his teammate. First of all, Jorge has not employed this vetoing power to my knowledge in the past, as Marquez said recently he has never either, why are they suddenly going to change their principles? I don't see Ducati operating with the same principles as Yamaha on this point either. Contrasted, Rossi has vetoed a teammate, and there is no reason to believe he will change his "principles' either.

I'm not going to spend to much on Valentino Rossi's crash. It looked like a typical front end wash out in a high speed zone. In the feed he mentioned it had something to do with his clutch. However, his crash did have an impact on the proceedings; if any of you have the race recorded, if you watch it again, you will notice that the feed uncharacteristically provided significant screen coverage for the 'lesser' riders. It's as if all the time they dedicated obsessing over Rossi coverage ad nausium was used up in providing us with some screen time of those other riders that have dedicated their lives, risking life and limb, and often loot, to the sport we all love. Dumb .......s. It was refreshing. I see a parallel to the podium ambience. (Btw, for the record, I migsed that Rossi would not have any DNFs this season, I was wrong.)


---



How many mirrors did Andrea Doviziosobreak? When I first saw it, I held my breath and an audible "oh ...." rang out. I thought for sure Dovi's leg was broken from the initial looks of it. Thank god he didn't get hurt, that would have been truly tragic. Just goes to show you how close these guys come to career ending injury or worse every time they take the track, which makes deliberately trying to harm another rider infinitely more egregious (so the logic goes in a normal universe). Dovi looked good for his third possible podium. We will never know if he could have battled for 2nd with Lorenzo or what might have happened with him and Pedrosa, but surely we missed out on something, what that was we will never know but I believe it would have been special. I said this after Argentina, if Ducati were in contention for a title (which I don't believe the machine is) this rash of bad luck has destroyed that prospect. I think Ducati will win a race this years, my migs is they will win at Mugello.

Which brings me to Dani Pedrosa. I was reminiscing with Arrabi the other day about the inaugural GP of Indy. I remember taking a picture with this girl wearing a "Pedrosa Sucks" t-shirt. Which at the time, I wholeheartedly believe (right or wrong) was both a funny and deserved jibe. Allow me to provide some context, as I'm sure there are perhaps some noobies that could use the history lesson. Dani Pedrosa torpedoed Nicky Hayden at the penultimate round of the 2006 season, not only his teammate, but his teammate that was on the cusp of a historic championship (at the Portuguese GP in Estoril, a topic that was touched on recently). But I want to take this opportunity to provide some context to contrast this infamous torpedo and the one that occurred at COTA. In addition, that infamous torpedo of Estoril should not be compared with Iannone taking Dovi out at the Argentine GP (more on this later someday). This is not only completely different, but the man who caused the crash in 2006 is not the same man of 2016. Ten years ago, I submit that Dani Pedrosa was under the influence and guidance of an awful man who was hell bent on ruthlessly smashing all obstacles, real or perceived; a dominating figure who highjacked his considerable influence and real connections within MotoGP's organization, including using the leverage of important marketing sponsorship dollars, employing this power to achieve his evil machinates, where the ends justified the means, and it mattered not how dastardly or mean spirited his 'climb to the top' was, even if climbing over people meant attempts at ruining the good name of rivals by accusations, including thwarting, foiling and obstructing a teammate in the garage. No, I'm not talking about Valentino Rossi, I'm talking about Alberto Puig, once manager and mentor, more akin to a dominatrix to Dani Pedrosa. The Torpedo of Estoril was one born from blind arrogance and self-entitlement, even the reaction after the incident can be contrasted to the one from Circuit of the Americas, where Pedrosa in 06 gesticulated in astounding conceit as if he was the victim, walking away from the incident transmitting an air of ....... contempt. It is no wonder why he was scorned, hated, and ridiculed. Forward ten years later, Pedrosa has been free from the wicked clutches of the evil influence of the vial Alberto Puig; the metamorphosis from a disgusting worm into a butterfly is a fitting metaphor for the new version of Dani Pedrosa. A more mature man aware of mortality and the importance of humility. That was on display at COTA when after the incident his immediate human reaction was to check on Dovizioso, once he saw the his fellow competitor was ok, he then picked up his bike after causing a horrifying crash and soldiered on in the race. Fitting that this type of human spirit we admire as a staple of competition and determination was on full display at Argentina by the same man he had just take out in America. Dani Pedrosa circulated on a damaged Honda, probably in some physical discomfort, until he determined the risk offset any knowledge gained from being on a hot track. When he returned to his garage, he expressed his commiseration to his own team, then took off his helmet and walked over to the Ducati garage with an expression of solace, humility, and consolation. The cameras tried to follow him into the garage, it is after all their job to capture all the significant events of the weekend, but the Ducati personnel, echoed in unison their team's principal principles, Gigi Dall'Igna made it clear the public intrusion was not to make a media circus in what should be a private moment (more on this later Lin Jarvis). I'm thankful we were still privy to a glimpse, we got to discern the moment. And what we could see of it was a genuine human exchange, an apology by a regretful man who made no attempt at making it into a narrative about himself. This was dully reciprocated by the man who had reason to be upset, Dovizioso expressed no ill will, no reservation for pride on display. Dani Pedrosa may be the smallest rider in the paddock, but he walked out of the Ducati garage 10 feet tall, by far the largest man of the day. My respects to the big fella, he has earned it!
 
  • Like
Reactions: 11 people
I too would like to see stoner race again. the sport would be better with him in it for sur. but definitely not at the expense of any other rider. He retired. it's on him.

pro tip- if you are famous and decide to retire. don't say it's to spend more time with your family. because when you come out of retirement 2 years later people might think you've decided your family sucks

Congratulations. You have found a non-Rossi fan who is to an extent wishing another rider ill.

Stoner has not at this stage made any sort of commitment that will significantly curtail time spent with his family; he is test riding 3 or 4 times a year. People's family situations do change; I imagine his child is at school now rather than being an infant. Riders other than him have been known to have a change of mind as well; I recall a certain rider deciding fairly quickly that riding for Ducati was not for him. I for one hope Stoner does change his mind and makes a genuine comeback, but only if he really wants to do so, and not at the expense of an injury to another rider. The door is open for him to ride a couple of wild cards if he wishes anyway.

In any case Stoner was not well known for internal consistency and if a return (still very unlikely imo) involved some hypocrisy then so be it. This is again not unprecedented in the paddock; I recall a certain rider saying 'that's racing' after a tense multi-lap duel involving him blocking on many occasions a bike and rider who were actually rather than theoretically faster (with which I had no problem per se btw) but seemed to consider it not to be racing when the circumstances were reversed some years later. I also seem to recall that rider considering it a matter of course that he should race rather fiercely a title contender when not in contention himself, even though that rider was his team-mate, with which again I had no problem, but having a rather different attitude some years later when he was the rider still in contention.

Family reasons were also not the only reasons Stoner gave for retiring. Apart from the direction the sport was taking in terms of electronic riding aids, he also didn't like attitudes of those running the sport and a significant proportion of those following a sport in which riders risk their lives. Specifically he said that only a matter of weeks after a rider not only risked but lost his life those followers were back to their usual back biting concerning, and vilification of, riders other than the one they particularly followed; he has definitely been proven wrong about that, hasn't he?
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 person
Ahhhh this forum always brings a smile, I mainly read it because it's the most active place I can read on motogp aside from Reddit.

All in all the weekend was really interesting, the race kind of fell flat I find a lonely 1-2-3 makes for a pretty uneventful race. Thanks Vinales and Esparago for the little show behind though!

It's funny because Rossi proved this forum wrong once again (2nd weekend in a row this happens) he took his fall like a man, admited to his mistakes and was pretty rational in his thinking. Too bad he did not throw you guys the bone you were wishing for ;)

On a side note, I'm happy to see the Ducati being constantly competitive since the season start. The suzuki seems to have some potential aswell! The hondas I get a mixed feeling, I guess Marquez is just the alien of the aliens because he makes that bike so damn fast it's insane!

Let's see how europe turns out :)

I agree he has comported himself fairly well the last 2 races. If he continues to refrain, now the season is under way, from his practice throughout the off season and in the lead up to the Qatar race of advancing his conspiracy theory about last year's title at most opportunities I will likely return to being indifferent to him.
 
I disagree with all the accolades being heaped upon Pedrosa. When you crash and take someone out it is basic human decency to check on their condition and apologize. This reminds me of when a woman says a man is a good husband because he doesnt cheat. That's not being a good husband, that's being a husband. Your not supposed to cheat. Thats not a value a spouse should be judged by.
Its Pedrosas humanly duty to check on Dovi. He doesnt get credit for it. If anything it was a facetious attempt to take the heat off of his own actions. It looked more to me like a dog and pony show since he knew the cameras would follow him.
Judging by the comments it worked brillantly. The narrative has swayed from attempted murder to half pint hero
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 person
I disagree with all the accolades being heaped upon Pedrosa. When you crash and take someone out it is basic human decency to check on their condition and apologize. This reminds me of when a woman says a man is a good husband because he doesnt cheat. That's not being a good husband, that's being a husband. Your not supposed to cheat. Thats not a value a spouse should be judged by.
Its Pedrosas humanly duty to check on Dovi. He doesnt get credit for it. If anything it was a facetious attempt to take the heat off of his own actions. It looked more to me like a dog and pony show since he knew the cameras would follow him.
Judging by the comments it worked brillantly. The narrative has swayed from attempted murder to half pint hero

And this outlook on life must be why you are so good at making friends.

When Dani's bike crashed into Andrea, Dani's thoughts were not on cameras and how he would be perceived by the masses. I would think he was more in a state of shock as to the fact that he lost control of his bike crestin the hill and saw it crashing into a fellow rider that he values, respects, and considers a friend.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 person
Dovi should be second in the championship now, with at least 56 points. Speak of bad luck...!

In view of Marquez' performance, Lorenzo's move to Ducati looks like a no brainer: grab your top dollar now while you can get it, -- the title is going to be a tough proposition anyway, even on the M1, as long as #93 is given a reasonably sorted Honda... And Pedro's improved performance means the Honda is being sorted out.

The others could only race for second and hope MM93 had problems with his soft front tire, while trying to stay themselves out of trouble. Which is what Lorenzo did.

Rossi didn't manage the "stay out of trouble" part this time and had his first DNF in a long time (24 races they say). He had the pace to race for the podium, but his clutch had overheated during the long red flag time before the start, so in the first laps he was visibly slow out of corners and his top speed was affected as well. He dropped to 6th but would have probably regained positions as the thing cooled down. Unfortunately he compounded the problem with a mistake of his own, and the Michelin front didn't grant him preferential treatment. The unexplainable episode is under investigation by race direction... :)

Iannone was on the podium courtesy the Pedro-Dovi mess.
Maverick and Suzuki are maturing -- they are not yet up there, but on the way imo.

Now the circus comes back to Europe -- Lorenzo is hopeful circumstances will suit him better, but I have a feeling it could be 2014 again.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 3 people
I disagree with all the accolades being heaped upon Pedrosa. When you crash and take someone out it is basic human decency to check on their condition and apologize. This reminds me of when a woman says a man is a good husband because he doesnt cheat. That's not being a good husband, that's being a husband. Your not supposed to cheat. Thats not a value a spouse should be judged by.
Its Pedrosas humanly duty to check on Dovi. He doesnt get credit for it. If anything it was a facetious attempt to take the heat off of his own actions. It looked more to me like a dog and pony show since he knew the cameras would follow him.
Judging by the comments it worked brillantly. The narrative has swayed from attempted murder to half pint hero



I agree with you. However, this is the world of professional athletes. I do not hold them above normal human decency, that behavior is quite often missing. So yes, I feel such behavior should be commended, because as we all know, it could have and has been handled differently.
 
Look who I ran into at the airport...what's better is what I told Dovi. I told him where Dani was should he decide he wants to slap him. :D
 

Attachments

  • image2.jpg
    image2.jpg
    82.3 KB
  • image1 (1).jpg
    image1 (1).jpg
    88.8 KB
  • Like
Reactions: 6 people
I agree with you. However, this is the world of professional athletes. I do not hold them above normal human decency, that behavior is quite often missing. So yes, I feel such behavior should be commended, because as we all know, it could have and has been handled differently.

So the lesson is, their normally ..... so applaud them when their human.
Haha. Your probabaly right Iowa. I cant argue with that. If this was Rossi instead of Pedro Im sure Battshit wouldnt have trouble making friends with me.
Lets not forget Pedro was mentored by the most cunning and duplicitious snake in recent paddock history. Just because Dani is quiet and keeps his head down is no reason to believe he's above it all. It's the quiet ones you worry about the most
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 person
So the lesson is, their normally ..... so applaud them when their human.
Haha. Your probabaly right Iowa. I cant argue with that. If this was Rossi instead of Pedro Im sure Battshit wouldnt have trouble making friends with me.
Lets not forget Pedro was mentored by the most cunning and duplicitious snake in recent paddock history. Just because Dani is quiet and keeps his head down is no reason to believe he's above it all. It's the quiet ones you worry about the most

Heh...this is always what is amusing when it comes to athletes whether they play other sports or ride MotoGP machines.

So many people are desperate to believe they are nice people. It's why Rossi has the fanbase he does; simpletons believe he is a nice likeable guy therefore he could be their best friend because he acts the way they'd want the best friend they never had to act.

One should never forget that these guys would stab their own mother in the .... if it meant a world championship. You don't get to that level by being nice...creating the illusion that they are nice is all part of the game because it helps them get much-needed support from fans, and sponsors in turn will flock to that.

Just because they say hello to you or smile when they talk to you in the paddock should never be taken as proof that they are nice. I would never vouch for someone I don't know personally....GP riders are no different.
 
.
Lets not forget Pedro was mentored by the most cunning and duplicitious snake in recent paddock history.

No he wasn't ............... that title has been usurped and resides within the #93 team




But as for Puig, love or loathe the fact remains that he has developed, mentored or assisted a lot of successful riders including world champions and it is just as shame that we recall his sheer arrogance with all things early years Dani
 
So the lesson is, their normally ..... so applaud them when their human.
Haha. Your probabaly right Iowa. I cant argue with that. If this was Rossi instead of Pedro Im sure Battshit wouldnt have trouble making friends with me.
Lets not forget Pedro was mentored by the most cunning and duplicitious snake in recent paddock history. Just because Dani is quiet and keeps his head down is no reason to believe he's above it all. It's the quiet ones you worry about the most

Your real good at making assumptions.
If Rossi would make an attempt to mend what he has broken I would applaud him as well, as long as it seemed sincere. We should all be better, but especially people of such notoriety, Rossi, Pedrosa. And it makes it more unfortunate when they don't. Such as in Rossi's case. I'm not sayin Dani deserves a medal. But I am sayin he was sincere.

Being in the US, JK, you don't know Dani like someone in Spain or that follows Spanish Motorsport media would. He's much changed in the last 10 years. He's been a star in Spain since a teen. Pretty normal to be a tetulant ... at that age. I wouldn't say he was mentored by Puig, more so taken advantage of. The best thing he has done was to get rid of him.
 

Recent Discussions