Assen Race Talk

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (frosty58 @ Jul 2 2007, 05:09 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'> somethin tells me rossi is a bottom dweller anyway...
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (roger-m @ Jul 2 2007, 05:12 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>shut it frosty, he aint no bum bandit , uccio may be tho, rossi's to bloody scruffy to be a poofta.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (frosty58 @ Jul 2 2007, 05:26 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>did u see the bum on elisabetta...... he's a bottom dweller for sure!

You two guys kill me!!!!!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tom @ Jul 3 2007, 01:37 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>That other guy rode faster than him, remember?
Not just yet, but he looks good for it so far!!

yews but it was slightly just at the...i wish they would take it on the average of a race and not the winner...lol

It was a great Rossi win!!!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (roger-m @ Jul 2 2007, 11:16 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>careful r46, repeating your self is a sign of senility , the men in white coats will come and take you away.

1 more sig. and I'am bound for a rubber room... but they ain't signing. yet.

Uh oh, that word outridden has surfaced again. Will this thread eventually become as huge as the one about Stoner, and spawn a TE-like entity?

I think that l13eaw simply meant that Rossi rode a better race than Stoner, just as when Tom made the comment about Stoner over Rossi in Qatar--not that the guy who finished second got his ... handed to him on a plate...

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Rising Sun @ Jul 2 2007, 11:01 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Uh oh, that word outridden has surfaced again. Will this thread eventually become as huge as the one about Stoner, and spawn a TE-like entity?

I think that l13eaw simply meant that Rossi rode a better race than Stoner, just as when Tom made the comment about Stoner over Rossi in Qatar--not that the guy who finished second got his ... handed to him on a plate...
sun seems to me that worshippers can't accept that terminology. it seems to strike them as some kind of insult so they must leap to their mans defense.... i just don't get it?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (phleg @ Jul 2 2007, 07:01 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>WTF.

How fickle are your loyalties? First you give up one minute and start praying at the Rossi altar, then you renounce your ways and become a Ducatisti again.

= Well, maybe not THAT much of a Ducatisti, they keep their loyalty.

I lost my mind a litte bit. It's ok now.

cheering a lot for Ducati was the reason I got stunned when they miss a very important race. To win in Assen would be crucial for title chances and actually i am not believing yet my team lost that race.

Did you never get stunned when something you hopes a lot doesn't work?
I did.

But now things are normal. I'm back in hope again. And here we go...

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (gui22a @ Jul 2 2007, 05:48 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I lost my mind a litte bit. It's ok now.

cheering a lot for Ducati was the reason I got stunned when they miss a very important race. To win in Assen would be crucial for title chances and actually i am not believing yet my team lost that race.

Did you never get stunned when something you hopes a lot doesn't work?
I did.

But now things are normal. I'm back in hope again. And here we go...
i take it by that ,that you have only started to follow motogp this season, otherwise you would be used to ducati and stoner getting nowhere.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (l13eaw @ Jul 2 2007, 12:10 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>We were all no doubt wondering when Rossi's tyres would give up the ghost, he wasn't sparing them under braking, he was just absolutely unstoppable and I have run out of praise words at the moment, but he sure did look happy crossing the line.

Why would we wonder about that?
Michelin obviously brought the right tires this time. Michelin riders and Rossi in particular, were at or close to the top all weekend and regular wear has never been the real issue with the michelins, rather various construction problems. With the stronger construction and the resent progress they seem to have sorted those out.
Besides, to ride fast doesn't have to mean higher wear and Rossi's style is not particulary hard on any special part of the tire, except for the construction. His high corner speed and early power wear on a part of the tire that never recive maximum strain, but it does add to the overall stress on the construction and adds heat.
I bet Stoner and the other ducati's are harder on tires as they rely on maximum power on a narrower range of the tire.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <div class='quotemain'>.... track..........

WHAT?


<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (gui22a @ Jul 2 2007, 06:48 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I lost my mind a litte bit. It's ok now.

cheering a lot for Ducati was the reason I got stunned when they miss a very important race. To win in Assen would be crucial for title chances and actually i am not believing yet my team lost that race.

Did you never get stunned when something you hopes a lot doesn't work?
I did.

But now things are normal. I'm back in hope again. And here we go...

That's ok but you should know by now that Assen is one of the most curvy tracks that suite the Yamaha's low power, Rossi's high corner speed particulary well. Btw, expect to be patient for the next races as the next four tracks have short straights. Only when the arrive Estoril there seems to be somthing that might suite the Ducati in favor of the others.

Musings...

The race just proves to me that Rossi still has the most talent out there. Any fool can go fast on the straights. But being able to fly through those curves so much faster than everybody else is amazing..

Well, the Michelins held up. I hope they continue to do so to keep this season interesting.

I wish the straights were a little bit longer so that Stoner could have closed the gap with the ducati top speed.

Have to hand it to Stoner for not crumbling under pressure. Does anyone else this it is evil of Rossi to put pressure from the back to make his competitors crash before he passes them?

Stoner says he could see that Rossi was catching up ON THE MOITORS, "I was able to watch a bit of the race on the big screens around the track and I could see that Valentino was coming through the field quickly...." How THE F$$# does anyone manage watch TV while riding a MotoGP race? Amazing.. And, he made no excuses and gave Rossi due credit. Swell guy.

Hayden beat Pedrosa! That, to me, was more amazing than Rossi winning from 11th place. Most of us have high expectations of Rossi, don't we?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (crvlvr @ Jul 2 2007, 09:38 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Have to hand it to Stoner for not crumbling under pressure.

Does anyone else this it is evil of Rossi to put pressure from the back to make his competitors crash before he passes them?
1. yes i admire stoner for not cracking under pressure, he keeps his head down and ignores rossi's pressure.

2. no i dont think it's evil, i think its intelligent racing,some crack some dont, thats the other riders problem.

....... this was a long thread! Well this time I’ve read through all the posts before commenting myself (unlike I usually do, not read, so I don’t become biased by the tilt of the thread). But I’ve come to realize this fact, no matter what happens, the threads are predictable, depending on who wins.

Here is my brief take of the race.

Rossi rode brilliant. (as expected)
Casey rode brilliant. (as expected)
Hayden rode brilliant. (as expected—by me, see my predictions)

Ok, now on to a "brief" response regarding this thread.

It is amazing to me how people can’t realize when they are hypocritical and use a double standard. That’s one reason why I like a forum, cuz you can go back and read through people’s opinions and statements and see when they are contradictory. But ......., I’m astonished how it’s so blatant and foolhardy. Nothing changes. Last year it was all about; Hayden doesn’t deserve .... cuz of luck. This year it’s all about the machine/package remote-controlling Stoner/Rossi to victories. Different people, same old bias ......... When Stoner wins, you can count on a few Rossi fans pointing at Ducati, Rossi wins, and now you can count on the same ....--them pointing at Yamaha. ...., these bikes are equal enough! So what is the microscopic difference?—the rider!!! Period. Yes, some bikes do suck in comparison to others. I think most will agree that if placed side by side with an “imaginary equal rider” then the likes of Suzuki, Honda, and Kawasaki don’t stack up (though much improved). So I concede that bike/tire packages do play into results, but it really takes an articulate and eloquent knowledgeable person to make a case for these nuances when explaining how a rider was affected by an “advatage/distadvantage”. Lets not forget, that Stoner and Rossi have teammates, who in my opinion are not sloths (Capi/Edwards), Yet, the dynamic duo of Stoner/Rossi have been consistently kicking their ......

It was quite commonplace for me to read some Rossi fans pointing to the Ducati, cuz quite frankly; many of these were the same who couldn’t accept the results of last year. But to see a few Stoner fans coming out with the same exact, I mean “exact” .... is ....... amazing! Really guys, you sound like idiots and totally crap on your credibility when formulating an opinion.

Here are a few responses or additional comments. Saying one or another rider has wrapped up the title is stupid, which makes you either ignorant or stupid. If it’s a tremendous amount of confidence and hope in your favorite rider—rooting/cheering, well that's cool, but it’s an unspoken rule in racing, you don't claim the winner before he wins. I thought we would have learned more from the last two races and how they effected the championship last year. Stoner himself, when asked about his title hopes, admits its way to soon to even think about that. I'm sure Rossi would say the same thing. They understand that claiming a title before it’s in their hands is one sure way to jinx themselves.

I noticed a poster mention that she ate her words. Wow, a true conversion, that’s nice to read. It shows you can adjust your perceptions.

It’s nice to read so many people coming out and congratulating Hayden for a podium. I hope things continue to turn around for his effort. He has a lot to go, but now I’m more realistically hopeful that he may get a good result (even a win) at Laguna. I love the guy and always believe he is capable of winning. I know he can ride with the best. And he has proven it. So what’s the problem? Well it’s for us to speculate. We can probably have this conversation, because he’s not winning—at the moment.


Hopkins needs to get on the podium consistently. Yeah, easier said than done. But its not exactly an essay thing to do when you got guys who are gonna take two of those three spots and 10 other guys putting it all on the line for that third spot.

West, I’m not a fan. But he’s changing my mind. I like grit and determination, and this guy is showing that against the odds, he’s proving the naysayer wrong.

Capirossi/Melandri—two of my favorite riders in the world. What is wrong? Melandri, I can accept his explanation, but Capirossi? WTF?

Team Roberts. Help them Jesus.





Oh, note to mods. I see you have been active on this thread. Though some of the stuff is mild, thanks for making attempts to keep it civil. Even though to me it may be even borderline over-moderation (censorship is a slipper slop), it’s the attempt that is nice to see and noted. I appreciate your efforts.

^^you make some good point jumkie, but im not going to tell you which ones cos i cant be arsed
i was going to say i agree but then thought you may mean me when you say "some rossi fans"
i was pleased for your boy tho mate, i was rooting for him to get second

damn jumkie thats a short 1 from u.... i feel a little cheated!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (roger-m @ Jul 2 2007, 03:05 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>im not going to tell you which ones cos i cant be arsed
Haha, Hi Rog. Yeah, well I've noticed some changes in you buddy. But yes, you were one of the guys that use to give Hayden hell. But it’s nice to see our guys up there (my guy for at least this race). It reminds me of a song I know that says--"there is plenty of room at the table." Rossi turned in a brilliant win. He was a mad man. The guy is amazing. When he was about fifth, that's when I though he might win the race. He had some trouble passing Stoner, and I thought it would go down like their other dual. This time Rossi got the better of him. It’s no wonder why he has so many fervent (some varmint) fans. Oh, BTW, I thought his bulls eye celebration was over the top. Rossi is still the man to beat, and I've been saying that all season. Stoner, it seems, is the only one that looks like he will be the only one doing it. So props to both of those talented riders.

I've been wondering though. I've notice this word "owned" used by some posters. Is this a European thing? Cuz the way it’s used, it doesn't seem to fit. People have used to describe when one rider beats another to say the winner "owns" the 2nd place guy (usually referring to Stoner/Rossi ). Well for me, to say somebody "own" somebody else, they have to be beating them "all" the time. Anyway, I just thought I would mention that.

Congrats on your boy winning. I'm feeling better about Hayden. He said he was happy to see the nightmare coming to an end. Well I hope he is right and he continues to show a better title defense. We got Laguna coming up, but really, I see Stoner/Rossi Hopkins/Pedrosa and Edwards doing well. Maybe even Melandri (podium last year). So it will be tough for Hayden. It just goes to show you, championships are truly earned cuz the grid has a plethora of talent (as it did last year).

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Racejumkie @ Jul 2 2007, 11:54 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>This year it’s all about the machine/package remote-controlling Stoner/Rossi to victories. Different people, same old bias ......... When Stoner wins, you can count on a few Rossi fans pointing at Ducati, Rossi wins, and now you can count on the same ....--them pointing at Yamaha. ...., these bikes are equal enough! So what is the microscopic difference?—the rider!!! Period. Yes, some bikes do suck in comparison to others. I think most will agree that if placed side by side with an “imaginary equal rider” then the likes of Suzuki, Honda, and Kawasaki don’t stack up (though much improved).

What I don't understand is why you want this to be a rider thing. The bikes are very different, more different than they've been for years. Thats quite natural as they are new. Is it lack of interest in technical issues that make you say that? Because the performance of Ducati vs Yamaha is quite predictable, even if there are unknown factors as Rain.

The difference today is more about the bike than in a long time. Stoner and Rossi are both world class riders, and allthough we have no idea how they would have done on each others bikes we can and should assume they exploit the bikes possibilities pretty well, alltohough all my ducatisti friends would bet Rossi would gain the most on any such deals. To me that leavs the bikes as big enough differentiators to be major contributors to who is winning. If thats not worth discussing, what is?

What I do understand is your dobble standards when you first say it's the riders, then to go on to suggest Honda is under par.
If it is riders that make the difference at least be man enough to admit that the current world champion doesn't do his job.
What did MotogpNews say: "The worst American title defender since.., well, the previous American title defender" Or something like that.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (frosty58 @ Jun 30 2007, 09:49 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'> we can only hope!

And hope is the last to die!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (roger-m @ Jun 30 2007, 12:54 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>yes they did, they had bayliss in 2003 but the bike was a dog. altho he finished 6th in the championship i think

Rightly so, Bayliss was 6th in ’03.

Plus they had Gibernau last year, after he was second to best in ‘03 & ’04 (he went down the hill after the ginks) but we cannot deny he was a good rider at some stage.

I have followed the premier class racing for over 20 years and can only acknowledge Rossi as an all-time great. Assen was a genius ride by a genius rider and he would obviously have won more easily if qualifying had been dry.

However as a Casey fan and patriotic Australian I am not giving up on Casey and I don't think Rossi is suddenly a second a lap faster, although he may well achieve this later in the season.

Rossi's and Stoner's pace was similar in the dry in practice but Rossi replicated it in the race whilst Stoner did not, which has not usually been the case this year. I suspect that the crash in the warm-up affected the set-up of the race bike or if a replacement bike was used it was not as well set-up, or alternatively the tyre choice was wrong or conservative because Rossi was well back on the grid and hence thought likely to shred his tyres.

In any of these cases it is entirely Stoner's/Ducati's error, but I would not assume that Rossi will be so much faster in the next race.

think i'll watch the race again.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (CSCVAW @ Jul 2 2007, 04:24 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>how was he outridden?
Because Rossi not only beat him but came from 11th on the grid to do so.