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Rossi the next Melandri??

Mental Anarchist' date='24 November 2010 - 09:52 PM' timestamp='1290664371' post='261222 said:
Yeah the other Ducati riders were told to finish 12th, 13th, 14th and 15th!!!



They got carried away with the "do not finish in front" thing...

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Fantastic!
 
Thanx for the benefit of the doubt Tek. To answer ur question, yes, 2006 was certainly scripted. But the dumb redneck didnt follow the script. Honda did everything to wreck Nicks title run, but the dumb ....... wouldnt give up. He wasnt suppose to win, the season went off script. Now u tell me, if this was an honest competition, would Honda hav designed their 07 bike around the non champ? 06, Rossi was suppose to win, just like every year. The drama the producers make for us is Rossi vs the world. Rossi beats the world, 90% of viewers happy. 07 had unintended consequences, formula change coupled with tire war & another dumb ....... named Casey rode with fierce determination. What was the one uncontrollable factor? The tire war. So Dorna eliminated it. Enter 08, normal script resume. 2010, the lose cannon was Yamaha. They did what Bridgestone was not able to avoid, they did not cave to Rossi pressure. Same bike same tires resulted in a snafu in script.



Tek, most dont agree with me because most believe that GP is honest. But all u need to do is review the series of events that got Rossi on bstones and how Dorna did his bidding, this will give u a clue about the integrity of this sport. WWF looks real, but is not.



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Just say when Rossi wins it, it's scripted.

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Honda were racing against Hayden, it was only that Hayden didn't give up. yeah, we saw many times, his bikes dnf ed, and once even Honda asked their other rider (a rookie who was also in fight for the championship), to ride into Hayden and let Rossi get away with it, but Nobody knows why in the next round that rookie was not allowed to do the same or that he had to defend and finish behind Hayden.
 
I've been asked this many times. Yours is not the first. First of all, I'm more curious why you think what happens in GP should be viewed at face value?



To answer your question, I watch because I like motorcycle racing. But I don't watch like an ignorant person and make conclusions as if this were a street fight. Every now and then, the best plans of mice and men go off script. This is when GP is at its best. Its rare, but it happens. I'm not so naive to think that powerful men who's interest it is of making money, through viewership at the expense of an authentic competition, are not going to skew whatever they can to prop up the golden goose. If you watch with that perspective, then I'd like for you to send me money, I have a great scam, and you might just be the sucker I need.
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Exactly, that's why they have kept Hayden in motogp, only to keep the American money in motogp.
 
Jumkie, WWF looks real but isn't? The only way WWF looks real is if you poke a stick in both eyes and then squint with what ever eye sight you have left!!!



Michael, A conspiracy theory requires an attempt to keep the act secret. It is my opinion that there was no attempt to keep the act of assisting Rossi to get BS's a secret. I think Dorna is happy to be upfront with Rossi's fans that they will do what ever is necessary to ensure he wins. After all they want to keep on side with the 80% of people who watch.



I have said it before but the politics of MotoGP is enthralling if you are into that sort of thing. In the corporate world it is far less likely to get blow by blow media insights into the secret deals happening behind closed doors. Where as in MotoGP it gets played out in the media on a weekly basis. The best way to follow the politics is to not follow a specific rider as it clouds your perception. We see this from Rossi fans who deny politics happens even when it happens in black and white in front of them. I don't blame them as when I watch my rugby team play I only see and swear at the bad calls the ref makes against my team!



So, why and how Could Pedrosa change tires in the middle of 2008 season?

Dorna trys to take care of their business, and they will do the same for every rider that is running in front.



Rossi thought he the tires were the reason for his problems, and he showed they were by beating Casey and Ducati on the tires which they knew and their bikes were made arround it.
 
So, why and how Could Pedrosa change tires in the middle of 2008 season?

Dorna trys to take care of their business, and they will do the same for every rider that is running in front.



Rossi thought he the tires were the reason for his problems, and he showed they were by beating Casey and Ducati on the tires which they knew and their bikes were made arround it.



Pedrosa has Puig in his corner, that's how he got the switch done. By that time Bridgestone was already announced as the sole tyre supplier for 09.

They got the switch done so they could get a head start on all the other Michelin riders who had to make the switch the following year. Smart of them? Yes absolutely. Fair? No, definitely not.

These 2 riders got to switch tyre manufacturers without their teams doing so. No other rider whether at the front or not, would have got that pushed through for them. So the part I bolded in your statement to me is completely & utterly wrong.

I think if you can't see there are more than one set of rules for different riders then you have blinders on to the world my friend.







The tyres were only 1 part of the problem for Rossi in 07.

Besides Stoner's Ducati, he still easily beat every other Bridgestone rider in the championship easily.

Yes there were problem circuits for Michelin where a podium was not possible like Laguna Seca & Turkey, but they also had a qualifying advantage with their soft tyre.

Yamaha getting their lack of top speed issues sorted was more than anything the reason Vale was able to win the title back in 08. I think the bike was already the best turning bike even in 07, but if you get blown away down the straight it makes it very tough.

Having said that, every other Ducati rider still had the same advantage Casey did, and were unable to get the results he achieved.
 
Exactly, that's why they have kept Hayden in motogp, only to keep the American money in motogp.





Yes, and dually noted that the debate as to how Nicky got the official factory ride on the best bike in the world next to Rossi in the first place doesn't seem to come up much, especially with the conspiracy champions that exist here, probably the biggest back room deal ever............
 
You are wrong here Frizz!!



Firstly Rossi changed tyres at the end of the season when he just got his arse handed to him with no increrase in performance likely so no way to win, there is nothing wrong with that!

So you would stay on equipment that you had no chance of winning on would you, either a fool or a liar me thinks.



I agree that just like Pedrosa he used his influence to get what he wanted but he is a competitor just like them all, they all want to win & to do so they need the equipement to enable them to win.



Stoner certainly had a tyre advantage so before you cry foul you should think about that too. Stoner wasnt the only one on Bridgies but they were designed primarily for Ducati since the 990 days & his were a lot harder than the others, funnily enough thats exactly how Rossi liked his.
 
I think you will find Nicky earnt his place on the GP grid as much as anybody has, if you dont like it tough. He came from a similar background to Spies beatign down on guys in the national championchips to get noticed by the top dogs.
 
He also happens to be a very good developemtn & test rider, just like Edwards, thats why Rossi likes him & Edwards as team mates not someone whoi comes in does nothing but demands everything.



Both Colin & Nicky may not have set the world alight but they are top quality world class riders who have won many titles between them AND DESERVED THEM - you couldnt do it so i suggest you remember that before running them or any of these guys down!!



Rant Over !!
 
Yes, and dually noted that the debate as to how Nicky got the official factory ride on the best bike in the world next to Rossi in the first place doesn't seem to come up much, especially with the conspiracy champions that exist here, probably the biggest back room deal ever............

I don't quite follow your line of argument; I don't see how the existence of a conspiracy to favour nicky hayden would make a conspiracy/conspiracies to favour valentino rossi less likely, not that I am arguing the latter on this thread at least.



As johnny has already posted hayden didn't exactly come from nowhere, he was the reigning ama championship, and signing ama champions has resulted in some success historically, including nicky's recruitment actually since as I recall nicky won a world championship for honda, their only one in the last 7 years. Perhaps honda should ask dorna to foist more riders on them. I think nicky also had strong backing from american honda, with the usa being an important market.



There is no need to invoke back room deals where dorna is concerned in this context anyway, since they very openly try to influence the national variety on the grid ; they partially funded stoner's entry into motogp with lcr in 2006.
 
You are wrong here Frizz!!



Firstly Rossi changed tyres at the end of the season when he just got his arse handed to him with no increrase in performance likely so no way to win, there is nothing wrong with that!

So you would stay on equipment that you had no chance of winning on would you, either a fool or a liar me thinks.



I agree that just like Pedrosa he used his influence to get what he wanted but he is a competitor just like them all, they all want to win & to do so they need the equipement to enable them to win.



Stoner certainly had a tyre advantage so before you cry foul you should think about that too. Stoner wasnt the only one on Bridgies but they were designed primarily for Ducati since the 990 days & his were a lot harder than the others, funnily enough thats exactly how Rossi liked his.



I bet most of the grid would have loved Michelin overnight specials too but did they get them? Can't have it both ways.



Debate & agreeing to disagree is fine. The fool or liar business just wasn't necessary.

Of course Stoner had a tyre advantage in 07. Bridgestone was the better tyre in 2007. No argument. However there was more than a tyre issue with the Fiat Yamaha team in 07. Please read my post carefully before passing judgement.

I never said Vale changed mid season. I did say Pedrosa did by using Puig's influence.

What I did say is that both Vale & Pedrosa switched tyre manufacturers without their factory team doing so.



What I then ask you is, if say Stoner or even Hayden or Spies would be able to have the influence to swap tyre suppliers without their team doing so? I think not.

Is that not an advantage in itself that some riders have & some do not? I think the answer is obvious.

This of course irrelevant in 2010 because of the one tyre supplier.
 
I bet most of the grid would have loved Michelin overnight specials too but did they get them? Can't have it both ways.



Debate & agreeing to disagree is fine. The fool or liar business just wasn't necessary.

Of course Stoner had a tyre advantage in 07. Bridgestone was the better tyre in 2007. No argument. However there was more than a tyre issue with the Fiat Yamaha team in 07. Please read my post carefully before passing judgement.

I never said Vale changed mid season. I did say Pedrosa did by using Puig's influence.

What I did say is that both Vale & Pedrosa switched tyre manufacturers without their factory team doing so.



What I then ask you is, if say Stoner or even Hayden or Spies would be able to have the influence to swap tyre suppliers without their team doing so? I think not.

Is that not an advantage in itself that some riders have & some do not?
I think the answer is obvious.

This of course irrelevant in 2010 because of the one tyre supplier.



Don't you think Frizzle that Vale has earned this advantage through years of hardwork and excellent sucess rate? He wasn't born with that kind advantage did he!!!
 
Don't you think Frizzle that Vale has earned this advantage through years of hardwork and excellent sucess rate? He wasn't born with that kind advantage did he!!!



No Inam - I think the rules should be the same for everybody.

Yes he is the goat & yes he generates massive interest in the sport, god knows the sport is much better off because of him.

But the rules must apply to everyone equally or at least they should.
 
No Inam - I think the rules should be the same for everybody.

Yes he is the goat & yes he generates massive interest in the sport, god knows the sport is much better off because of him.

But the rules must apply to everyone equally or at least they should.





But Frizzle he didn't break any rules did he? his tyre contract was up with Michelin so infact he was free agent to choose best tyre for himself whether it was Michelin or Bridgestone and there is nothing in rule books where you can't change tyre company without your whole team making that change as well.
 
Stoner certainly had a tyre advantage so before you cry foul you should think about that too. Stoner wasnt the only one on Bridgies but they were designed primarily for Ducati since the 990 days & his were a lot harder than the others, funnily enough thats exactly how Rossi liked his.

There were still several tracks where michelin were superior in 2007, and their qualifiers were always superior.



I wouldn't argue against the bridgestone hard tyres when on casey's bike giving him an advantage on many tracks, but only for him as the other bridgestone riders didn't or couldn't use them to advantage; it was theorized that only he could get them up to operating temperature. I can't see that there was any unfairness involved though.



I personally have never said the michelin tyre situation was unfair either; it was just part of the way of things, and certainly not instigated by rossi or on his behalf. However a tyre company charging some teams and not others for tyres (particularly since the teams charged were usually the less well resourced teams), and providing sns tyres to some of their riders/teams and not others is arguably closer to being unfair than a then second tier team and a then second tier tyre company getting together and working very hard over several years to develop a superior tyre.
 
But Frizzle he didn't break any rules did he? his tyre contract was up with Michelin so infact he was free agent to choose best tyre for himself whether it was Michelin or Bridgestone and there is nothing in rule books where you can't change tyre company without your whole team making that change as well.



Of course he didn't break any rules & neither did Pedrosa. Tyre contracts were a team decision not each individual rider.

But what I'm saying is the governing body would not have used their influence for any of the other riders in 2007

Ezpeleta spoke to Bridgestone themselves after Bridgestone did not wish to supply anyone else. Would he have done that for Randy De puniet? I'm sure he would have loved Bridgestones as well? Not a chance.
 
Of course he didn't break any rules & neither did Pedrosa. Tyre contracts were a team decision not each individual rider.

But what I'm saying is the governing body would not have used their influence for any of the other riders in 2007

Ezpeleta spoke to Bridgestone themselves after Bridgestone did not wish to supply anyone else. Would he have done that for Randy De puniet? I'm sure he would have loved Bridgestones as well? Not a chance.

Your pissing in the wind my friend, they will NEVER NEVER see the inequities when it comes to Rossi. Their only defense is, he earned it.
 
But Frizzle he didn't break any rules did he? his tyre contract was up with Michelin so infact he was free agent to choose best tyre for himself whether it was Michelin or Bridgestone and there is nothing in rule books where you can't change tyre company without your whole team making that change as well.



I thought he terminated the original contract early? Where are yiu getting this "contract was up" stuff?
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