Gran Premio Red Bull de la República Argentina

Mick D · Apr 29, 2014

rezonator636

3720281398657740

Jorge rode a flawless race today, didn't put a wheel wrong, rode the absolute wheels off the bike and still finished third

First off this may well be the most feeble race thread in PS history. Sad.

Second, rez, you forgot to mention that Jorge's Herculean effort, in your estimation, also left him a mere 1.7 secs ahead of Vale who lost at least 5 secs in excursions while super Jorge was riding free and clear at the front... Far from impressive or anywhere near being able to challenge Marc, who was, let's face it, toying with the field, in a Rossi-esque (circa 2004-2005) fashion in Argentina.

rezonator636 · Apr 29, 2014

Mick D

3720711398796772

First off this may well be the most feeble race thread in PS history. Sad.

Second, rez, you forgot to mention that Jorge's Herculean effort, in your estimation, also left him a mere 1.7 secs ahead of Vale who lost at least 5 secs in excursions while super Jorge was riding free and clear at the front... Far from impressive or anywhere near being able to challenge Marc, who was, let's face it, toying with the field, in a Rossi-esque (circa 2004-2005) fashion in Argentina.

If you like, we can continue this debate over at SS, where there would be a lot more participation. This place really feels like it's on its last legs.

"Super Jorge" was also trying not to bin the bike at the end of the race, as it was critical to get on the podium and score some points. If he had ridden the bike on the ragged edge, which Rossi seemed to be doing at the end of the race, it might have led to an even more costly mistake. So yes, I think he rode a perfect race from that standpoint.

Jumkie makes a good point about risk. Yes, Rossi was a tenth off of Pedrosa's pace when we look at fastest laps. The question is, how close to the limit was he riding as compared to Dani? If Dani was riding at, say 95%, whereas Rossi was at 100%, that's a problem, because 100% pace isn't sustainable over the course of a race. The M1 can be almost as fast as the RCV over one lap (which is how Jorge wound up starting in 2nd). But if the RCV can punch out 39.2s at Argentina without being on the limit, and the M1 is a tenth behind while at the limit, then yes, there is a big performance disparity between the bikes.

Jumkie · Apr 29, 2014

Mick D

3720711398796772

First off this may well be the most feeble race thread in PS history. Sad.

No worries. For the JerezGP thread we will be discussing campaign finance laws, and why Republicans favor large corporations unlimited access through the "free speech" provided by extraordinary political contributions. If that's not enuf, we could throw in how Republicans depict worker unions as the Devil's work for the middle class and detrimental to living wages because collective bargaining is, as they put it, big bad "socialism". Though I think election rigging via the pocketbook should pad the thread with posts.

Mick D · Apr 29, 2014

rezonator636

3720731398797782

If you like, we can continue this debate over at SS, where there would be a lot more participation. This place really feels like it's on its last legs.

"Super Jorge" was also trying not to bin the bike at the end of the race, as it was critical to get on the podium and score some points. If he had ridden the bike on the ragged edge, which Rossi seemed to be doing at the end of the race, it might have led to an even more costly mistake. So yes, I think he rode a perfect race from that standpoint.

Jumkie makes a good point about risk. Yes, Rossi was a tenth off of Pedrosa's pace when we look at fastest laps. The question is, how close to the limit was he riding as compared to Dani? If Dani was riding at, say 95%, whereas Rossi was at 100%, that's a problem, because 100% pace isn't sustainable over the course of a race. The M1 can be almost as fast as the RCV over one lap (which is how Jorge wound up starting in 2nd). But if the RCV can punch out 39.2s at Argentina without being on the limit, and the M1 is a tenth behind while at the limit, then yes, there is a big performance disparity between the bikes.

Clearly I am not debating the performwnce disparity between manufacturers. I will however debate who is getting the most out of their M1 so far this season, and in Argentina specifically. Jorge, the younger, at-this-point-in-their-careers better, rider is not handing the old doghis .... And he should be. Period.

rezonator636 · Apr 29, 2014

Mick D

3720761398800102

Clearly I am not debating the performwnce disparity between manufacturers. I will however debate who is getting the most out of their M1 so far this season, and in Argentina specifically. Jorge, the younger, at-this-point-in-their-careers better, rider is not handing the old doghis .... And he should be. Period.

Given that Rossi didn't crash in Qatar or nail the throttle when the red lights came on in CotA, I would say you have a point. As for Argentina, Rossi may have been faster than Jorge at certain parts of the race, but JLo still finished with more points, so I would put that one in Lorenzo's corner. Jerez, along with the fancy new Bridgestones, will give us another chance to see how far apart (or not) the Rossi and Jorge are from each other.

Mick D · Apr 29, 2014

Mistakes are mistakes. Jorge's made a couple that cost him a race and the most ........ jump-start ever. Rossi's made mistakes that have cost him a few seconds. Races 1 thru 3 to Rossi. Let's see what Europe brings...

Keshav · Apr 29, 2014

povol

3720001398427417

If he didnt, he needs to. He is either a totally self absorbedl .... behind the scenes, or he is cracking. Either way, he needs to see what it looks like and do something about it.

I'm going with both options.

povol · Apr 29, 2014

rezonator636

3720781398801331

Given that Rossi didn't crash in Qatar or nail the throttle when the red lights came on in CotA, I would say you have a point. As for Argentina, Rossi may have been faster than Jorge at certain parts of the race, but JLo still finished with more points, so I would put that one in Lorenzo's corner. Jerez, along with the fancy new Bridgestones, will give us another chance to see how far apart (or not) the Rossi and Jorge are from each other.

New tires are due at LeMans i think

Keshav · Apr 29, 2014

povol

3720361398690655

Come on man, that is a knee jerk reaction.

The Yamaha is not down on power, they have plenty and fuel is not an issue. Rossi's best lap [ late in race ] was less than a 1/10 of Pedrosa's race fast lap, and speeds were virtually identical.Early mistakes cost him 2nd place.

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The numbers are close enough where rider is making the difference. Jorge's problems are between his ears. For the first time in a while, the tires dont match his preferred style, and he shows no indication of trying to change. His whining has not fallen on deaf ears though, new tires with better edge grip are to be introduced at LeMans. Lorenzo will ultimately stay at Yamaha. He can stay there and blame it on the bike.He knows If he goes to Honda, there will be nowhere to hide when he gets his ... kicked on the same machine.

I'd love to see that. While the halt in engine development has hurt Yamaha, I think Lorenzo and Marquez would have closer racing if both on Hondas - but Marquez is younger, suffered less injuries and less emotional than Lorenzo. The combination of all those facets make a difference. Marquez (while not particularly likeable) has that killer instinct and Roberts and Lawson brought to the game. The kid's a machine. It doesn't hurt that he seems to learn fast either.

povol · Apr 30, 2014

Mick D

3720801398801976

Mistakes are mistakes. Jorge's made a couple that cost him a race and the most ........ jump-start ever. Rossi's made mistakes that have cost him a few seconds. Races 1 thru 3 to Rossi. Let's see what Europe brings...

No, Jorge out qualified and outscored him in Argentina so its not Rossi 1-3 . It doesnt matter if Rossi was faster at the end, it was part of his strategy in taking the harder compound. That harder tire early in the race played into Rossi's mistakes as he tried to keep pace with faster riders, and ones who had chosen the softer option. By finishing in front of Rossi, Jorge's strategy turned out to be the right strategy

Mick D · Apr 30, 2014

Jorge should be crushing Rossi. 1.7 secs does not equal crushing. Races 1-3 to Vale.

povol · Apr 30, 2014

Mick D

3720981398862785

Jorge should be crushing Rossi. 1.7 secs does not equal crushing. Races 1-3 to Vale.

So now we have to beat someone by a set amount of time, this aint bracket racing. Whats next, judges giving style points to determine finishing order. :wacko:

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Gran Premio Red Bull de la República Argentina

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