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Where will Stoner end up this year

A very happy young Aussie having just claimed his second title thats where!



Your probably right there Johnnyvvc!
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As much as i would love to see Rossi do it again, i just cant see it.



I think Lorenzo will push Stoner all year though, that M1 isnt as slow as people think.
 
What most amazes me about this forum, is just how educated about the sport people are but still hold on to this myth that its a level playing field. Sure Rossi has beat Stoner 4/5 times, and in that time Stoner has been on a Ducati. I sure hope Rossi would stick around for 4-5 more years on Ducati while Stoner sticks around on HRC. But I know Rossi will not stick around on a machine he can't beat everybody on. That is the difference, he will walk away, while people like Stoner, knowing they are on a flawed machine, will push.



Every time Rossi has not won, what has happened? Its always been big drama. Threats of leaving the sport or demands of getting exclusive treatment. You can go claiming he's the best, bla bla bla, but right now, all of you should begin to understand one thing, GP is about the mouse trap. Its about the machine you ride. Take a better than average rider like Rossi, put him on the best machine, you will get titles. Can you say Rossi is better than Stoner? Is that you're conclusion from the titles he's won? I have no doubt Stoner, had he been Rossi's teammate, where the manufacture would have had the balls that Yamaha had to give their riders equal treatment, Stoner (after his rookie season) would have beat him or at least pushed him every single year!!!



I haven't said Rossi is the best, I"ve merely said he is ahead at the end of round 5. Stoner has the opportunity to change that.
 
Bulshitmachine please stop! This is getting rather annoying. Stoner can never be the goat. He can never match Rossi in anything besides wins. He will never have the career Rossi did. He will never win the 125 or 250 titles or streak that many titles in a row. From the start of his career, he can never match what Rossi has done. So quit trying to math Caseys legacy against the goat, it will never match up to what Vale has accomplished. Your argument is laughable as always. Go back to your cave under a bridge. He will go down in history as a great rider for sure.





Gee you ....... ...... Its already a done deal ......Stoner is the real GOAT.



Its not jut numbers you know ........... surely the Rossi to Ducati has shown you that on "skill set" alone the guy is out in front of anybody else out there.



Rossi has a way to go to get there .... if he ever does.





Numbers
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Thats like saying whoever turns out the most paintings is the worlds greatest artist
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I think Lorenzo will push Stoner all year though, that M1 isnt as slow as people think.





He is good isn't he, Lorenzo has me scared as a Stoner fan.



I can't figure Lorenzo out to, he's so smooth I can't see the effort ....



I'm still thinking Jerez is his.
 
Agreed, JL at Jerez will be something to watch. I don't know where he gets it either, 'Steady Eddie' like.



Read a story about JL going to SR's ranch and SR said JL was mentally the strongest rider that's ever been to the ranch.



That is one HELL of a statement!
 
Gee you ....... ...... Its already a done deal ......Stoner is the real GOAT.



Its not jut numbers you know ........... surely the Rossi to Ducati has shown you that on "skill set" alone the guy is out in front of anybody else out there.



Rossi has a way to go to get there .... if he ever does.





Numbers
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Thats like saying whoever turns out the most paintings is the worlds greatest artist
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Did you read a word I wrote? That was my point. Being the greatest of all time is a hell of a lot more than about numbers. Its about legacy, and Caseys is nothing. Scratch that its about his 1 championship. Other than that he is just a really talented fast mother f-er. He has no legacy. Vale has nothing to prove. He has already turned one .... bike into a winner at yamaha. He has nothing to prove at Ducati. He is in the twilight of his career. We could easily argue that he has held on for to long already So quit comparing what cs is doing now against Vale, and saying that means he is better than Vale and by default is the goat. it will never hold up. Nor will it ever. Casey is not one of the greats yet, and whether he ever will be is yet to be determined. So quit counting your chickens before they hatch.
 
SR said JL was mentally the strongest rider that's ever been to the ranch.



That is one HELL of a statement!





Not sure thats actually a part of Lorenzo I like though, cos it just appears as he is up himself
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I try and avoid watching Lorenzo's antics and just watch his riding, he doesn't "urk" me so much then
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He maintains a bit of dignity to me then too
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SR said JL was mentally the strongest rider that's ever been to the ranch.



That is one HELL of a statement!





Not sure thats actually a part of Lorenzo I like though, cos it just appears as he is up himself
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I try and avoid watching Lorenzo's antics and just watch his riding, he doesn't "urk" me so much then
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He maintains a bit of dignity to me then too
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What most amazes me about this forum, is just how educated about the sport people are but still hold on to this myth that its a level playing field. Sure Rossi has beat Stoner 4/5 times, and in that time Stoner has been on a Ducati. I sure hope Rossi would stick around for 4-5 more years on Ducati while Stoner sticks around on HRC. But I know Rossi will not stick around on a machine he can't beat everybody on. That is the difference, he will walk away, while people like Stoner, knowing they are on a flawed machine, will push.



Every time Rossi has not won, what has happened? Its always been big drama. Threats of leaving the sport or demands of getting exclusive treatment. You can go claiming he's the best, bla bla bla, but right now, all of you should begin to understand one thing, GP is about the mouse trap. Its about the machine you ride. Take a better than average rider like Rossi, put him on the best machine, you will get titles. Can you say Rossi is better than Stoner? Is that you're conclusion from the titles he's won? I have no doubt Stoner, had he been Rossi's teammate, where the manufacture would have had the balls that Yamaha had to give their riders equal treatment, Stoner (after his rookie season) would have beat him or at least pushed him every single year!!!



was rossi's m1 the best in 04? was it the best in 08? legit questions here....in 09 he had jlo on equal machinery

is hayden "above average"?
 
Casey is not one of the greats yet, and whether he ever will be is yet to be determined. So quit counting your chickens before they hatch.



Exactly. Casey has it in front of him to achieve if he is good enough. There are a lot of variables which could mean he never gets there. Where would Mick Doohan be rated if he didn't have that crash and kept racing for a couple more years in the process knocking out Rossi's first couple of championships?



My point is, the GOAT is not a one championship winner. It's too easily disputed and too hard to defend. Stoner has to back it up. At the moment he has 2007 and then 3 years in the wilderness.
 
Exactly. Casey has it in front of him to achieve if he is good enough. There are a lot of variables which could mean he never gets there. Where would Mick Doohan be rated if he didn't have that crash and kept racing for a couple more years in the process knocking out Rossi's first couple of championships?



My point is, the GOAT is not a one championship winner. It's too easily disputed and too hard to defend. Stoner has to back it up. At the moment he has 2007 and then 3 years in the wilderness.

You are not arguing with many people on this point. He needs more championship wins to be an all-time great.
 
You are not arguing with many people on this point. He needs more championship wins to be an all-time great.



I disagree. As its turning out ( from the Rossi to Ducati experience ), Stoner has done what is close to winning a GP on a Postie bike ...... this through skills nobody else has ever exhibited. And he has actually won a WC whilst doing that
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Who else in the long past list of riders could take a Ducati motorcycle ...... and win a WC? Pretty hard ask isn't it when you look at it like that.
 
I disagree. As its turning out ( from the Rossi to Ducati experience ), Stoner has done what is close to winning a GP on a Postie bike ...... this through skills nobody else has ever exhibited. And he has actually won a WC whilst doing that
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Who else in the long past list of riders could take a Ducati motorcycle ...... and win a WC? Pretty hard ask isn't it when you look at it like that.



Like the first year Rossi rode the Yama. That bike was ..... And the Goat was able to turn that into the bike it is today. Casey rode the duc while it was a mess and left it a mess. Not very g.o.a.t. of him.
 
I disagree. As its turning out ( from the Rossi to Ducati experience ), Stoner has done what is close to winning a GP on a Postie bike ...... this through skills nobody else has ever exhibited. And he has actually won a WC whilst doing that
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Who else in the long past list of riders could take a Ducati motorcycle ...... and win a WC? Pretty hard ask isn't it when you look at it like that.

He is not on a postie bike this year so I am prepared to wait and see how he goes before making any big calls.
 
was rossi's m1 the best in 04? was it the best in 08? legit questions here....in 09 he had jlo on equal machinery

is hayden "above average"?



The 04 M1 was about as good as Stoner's 07 Ducati, not the best machine but with winning potential. 08 Yamaha had the advantage worked out by the time they had adapted to the Bridgestones, fortunately for them Ducati has some early season trouble too. In 09 JLo didn't have equal machinary and status until Brno
 
iono dude, considering the duc in 07 blitzed the entire field

i thought 08 the duc was great...then yamaha took over, then was pretty even towards the end

and 09...a part here, a part there...didn't colin edwards say something to the effect that it was cuz rossi liked testing all the new parts or something along those lines.



how about in 03? when the hondas were pretty much the same? biaggi and co was complaining that rossi had the best bike but then honda handed them the bikes and lost anyway in 04
 

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