Vilifications continue: Max, Sete, Casey & Jorge

Jumkie said:

Anyway, yes, ive got clearance for Silverstone, now i just need to save cans for the flight to NYC. Thanx to Levi, seeing a race in Europe ( if the UK can b considered Europe) this dream may b a reality. But honestly, i rather not talk about it so as not to jinx it.



Bunny, im not that intelligent, after all, i argue with Talps. What does that say about me?

Go Rossi!

Click to expand...

I really knew underneath you were a rossi fan!!



Its a pity you couldn't get to a Spanish round like Jerez because the atmosphere there is just electric, street parties Friday/Saturday night in Jerez...brilliant

Silverstone good track but not the best for spectating.

bigt46 said:

I really knew underneath you were a rossi fan!!

Its a pity you couldn't get to a Spanish round like Jerez because the atmosphere there is just electric, street parties Friday/Saturday night in Jerez...brilliant

Silverstone good track but not the best for spectating.

Click to expand...

Big are you going to Jerez?

And yeah got to agree about silverstone, although if using just a general admision ticket best place to stand & view has to be in front of beckets grandstand. There you get the riders coming through maggots into beckets through chapel curve & all the way down hanger straight.

It took first two days last year to find this out so anyone going thats the place to be. Enjoy

Burky said:

Ok Rob, it took a while but I think I have it!!!!!



Is it the same as those, who love those, who hate those who hate those who love those that love their own genitalia, because they know that they know that they are the only ones........ like SS!!!!!!

Click to expand...

ROFL exactly!!!

ganz said:

Enough of this ...., you fucken whining moralfags. Rossi doesn't encourage anyone to hate other riders. ....... ......s.

Click to expand...

At times I enjoy the eloquence of a a good argument and a well reasoned premise - inference - conclusion. Classic Socratic reasoning.



But at other times a good soul wrenching but barely expressed highly emotive emotive vitriolic "don't pick on my hero" expression is just as good.



Really, it is.



Timing is the qualitative measure however.



After fat KRJ won the title in 2001 Rossi entered his golden era, invincible, confident. well supported, widely and deeply felt. He was the man after Doohan and there is no doubt about it.



Then a no hoper (iroy) on a Honda beat hm to the title (Hayden). He won with hard workand consistency in 2006. A totally worthy champion.



The cracks were appearing.



Stoner came along in 2007 and won 10 races on a bike no other prick could ride in 2007 (and thereafter). A totally worthy champion.



Yamaha got there .... together and he won again in 2008 and 2009. But Yamaha hired a young firebrand called Lorenzo and the unthinkable occurred.



After the tyre wars, the attempt to limits RPM, and everything else Rossi was beaten by his team mate.



Despite by Australasianism and pro Stoner boner attitude I rated this as the most important championship of all for Rossi.



He was stuck with a quandary. Face his team mate on "equal machinery" or change, but Rossi's ego burned bridges with Honda and and then Yamaha so he jumped on Stoner's seemingly invincible Ducati.



Once upon an early 2000's he could lay .... on whomever he pleased, Max copped it, Sete was cursed and Rossi got away with it. But after the three championship losses and most importantly the one to his team mate the hype never matched what was happening on the track. The magic was gone.



It was like Muhhamed Ali's last fights, guys who may not have once beat him had him against the ropes pounding him mercilessly.



No matter how much you like to repeat previous victories, your opposition aren't content to repeat their previous defeats, and this is okay if you have their measure. But after 2006 he didn't.



So when the vilifications continued he looked more like a tired and stressed has been, fans and rider alike, he branded Lorenzo a copy cat, Stoner a mad man and said they would not win races anymore just prior to this season.



But now it is meaningless. He languished at the back of the field and Stoner and Lorenzo sprinted away at the front of the first race. This is not going to be a coincidence.



Lorenzo has already proved himself on the Yamaha, Stoner proved himself over and over on the Poocati (that no one else could get a consistent handle on).



Stoner adapted to the Honda very quickly and Lorenzo continued his good form (2nd is not bad, right?) on the Yamaha and that is far more likely to continue than Rossi is likely to tame the Ducati and take them on.



I believe the words of doom have become little more than a "mouthtrap" for Vale and he would be better off acknowledging his opposition and trying to beat them on the track, after all, you don't get extra points for being a spoiled braggart who lives in the past.

SuperShinya56 said:

Look at Rossi. All he simply have to do is sign his freakin' name on a stupid piece of paper and put it up for auction to help out charities yet he hardly does anything worth mentioning other then putting a stupid sticker on his rally car. Japan could really use some help right about now, don't you guys think? A man with his stature should be doing more to help those less fortunate, instead the guy goes around avoiding taxes. Seriously, who does he think he is? There are people scraping by working ...... jobs at minimum wage yet they pay their taxes.... and this ..... makes millions upon millions and refuse to do his part.

Click to expand...

As much as I hate doing this, I have to agree with you there.

Jumkie said:

Big, is this a break thru? Beer on me if u we make it to Slitherstone for getting a rise out of u.

Click to expand...

Screw that, come to Donny where i'll be racing

Andy Roo said:

Stoner proved himself over and over on the Poocati (that no one else could get a consistent handle on).

Click to expand...

First of all lets not be selective.....stoner was totally superb on the 2007/2008 duc when it was clearly the fastest bike on the track(not saying thats all there was to it, but still it helped a lot), comparatively in 2009 and esp 2010 he really didnt do much on it at all.



If we are going to compare rossi on the duc NOW, then you must compare to something which is actually comparable...i.e 2010 or even 2009. I mean i have said this twice already and people just dont seen to even consider this fact, but ask yourself if rossi had an extra 20bhp on his current duc where would he position? anything but top 3 would be a lie to yourself.



If you consider these points and look at it in a non nuthugger light....then maybe you should consider the situation is not all doom and gloom. The duc needs work but really it has for a while.



Doesnt look so black and white now does it?



And in spite of these considerations we are only 1 race in this season. What i would say is dont count your chickens......



Second of all, one of the most annoying things someone can do on a forum is dig up this kind of shitball thread(which for all intents and purposes was dead and buried), and write a mini novel of a response.

Rob said:

First of all lets not be selective.....stoner was totally superb on the 2007/2008 duc when it was clearly the fastest bike on the track(not saying thats all there was to it, but still it helped a lot), comparatively in 2009 and esp 2010 he really didnt do much on it at all.



If we are going to compare rossi on the duc NOW, then you must compare to something which is actually comparable...i.e 2010 or even 2009. I mean i have said this twice already and people just dont seen to even consider this fact, but ask yourself if rossi had an extra 20bhp on his current duc where would he position? anything but top 3 would be a lie to yourself.



If you consider these points and look at it in a non nuthugger light....then maybe you should consider the situation is not all doom and gloom. The duc needs work but really it has for a while.



Doesnt look so black and white now does it?



And in spite of these considerations we are only 1 race in this season. What i would say is dont count your chickens......



Firstly - 20 bhp extra on a bike that won't turn - don't mean squat.



Secondly - the figure you mention is just one you've pulled out of your .... Nobody in the industry

(never mind some guy on PS) can say with any authority what the BHP differences were between

the Yam and the Duc.

Click to expand...

Firstly - 20 bhp extra on a bike that won't turn - don't mean squat.



Secondly - the figure you mention is just one you've pulled out of your .... Nobody in the industry

(never mind some guy on PS) can say with any authority what the BHP differences were between

the Yam and the Duc.



Lastly - engine-wise, the Duc and the Yam engines have not changed appreciably between the end of

last season and the beginning of this season; yet Rossi could not come close to Lorenzo either in

practice or in the race.

Keshav said:

Firstly - 20 bhp extra on a bike that won't turn - don't mean squat.



Secondly - the figure you mention is just one you've pulled out of your .... Nobody in the industry

(never mind some guy on PS) can say with any authority what the BHP differences were between

the Yam and the Duc.



Lastly - engine-wise, the Duc and the Yam engines have not changed appreciably between the end of

last season and the beginning of this season; yet Rossi could not come close to Lorenzo either in

practice or in the race.

Click to expand...

1, Clearly it did turn....well enough to win 10 races in that year. The ONLY thing that we can say is similar about the ducati then and now is that it isnt an easy ride. Like it or lump it if either rossi or hayden could choose to have the advantages of 20bhp/better tyres then they would, and it would most definitely benefit both riders.......A crap handling bike is still more likely to win with more power and grip, than without afterall.



2, Oh no because nobody ever tested for bhp on machinery before....its impossible!!!



The figure i mention is quoted for all to see on a popular site:



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ducati_Desmosedici#GP7



Although even without documented reports, only an absolute stoner nuthugging extraordinaire would deny

the duc being absolutely the quikest bike that year.



3, Thats good....finally a fair 2010 comparison, no they havent changed really, but this is another debate. My point is really not wether rossi is quicker/slower than stoner on the duc in 2010....but rather that when we do compare the two, then it should be using that season as a main point of comparison, instead of a totally unfair and unrealistic 2007 comparison. The bike didnt have the speed or tyre factors of 2007 last year......so these kind of things are fair points. To actually aswer you last point, yes stoner was quick in parts last year but utterly average in others, and as we are only one race in so far this year who knows how it will pan out over the whole season.

^^^ and over and over it goes with you Boppers



This has al been discussed adnauseum in 07 08 ......... result ......... its Stoner not the bike





Stick to your sooking meltdown PM's, at least they aren't replication

BarryMachine said:

^^^ and over and over it goes with you Boppers

This has al been discussed adnauseum in 07 08 ......... result ......... its Stoner not the bike

Stick to your sooking meltdown PM's, at least they aren't replication

Click to expand...

So you deny that stoner had more horsepower over his rivals in 2007 than rossi does over the current grid?



If you agree the duc had more power advantage in 2007 then my point is absolutely valid.



Only nuthuggers like you come along and turn it into a "it was stoner not the bike in 2007" topic.



I dont even attempt to take anything from stoner in 2007......but if the horsepower advatage existed then, a.nd not now, then we shouldnt be making blanket statements about the all conquering duc/stoner combo of 2007 as it was a different bike, grid, and advantage set.



Stick to 2010.

Rob said:

Although even without documented reports, only an absolute stoner nuthugging extraordinaire would deny

the duc being absolutely the quikest bike that year.

Click to expand...

You don't need to watch much racing to know that a fast vehicle does not necessarily equate to fast laptimes, and even more so to racing success. The Ducati GP7 is one of many examples of this.

For Boppob ^^^ and over and over it goes with you Boppers



This has al been discussed adnauseum in 07 08 ......... result ......... its Stoner not the bike





Stick to your sooking meltdown PM's, at least they aren't replication

Rob said:

So you deny that stoner had more horsepower over his rivals in 2007 than rossi does over the current grid?



If you agree the duc had more power advantage in 2007 then my point is absolutely valid.



Only nuthuggers like you come along and turn it into a "it was stoner not the bike in 2007" topic.



I dont even attempt to take anything from stoner in 2007......but if the horsepower advatage existed then, a.nd not now, then we shouldnt be making blanket statements about the all conquering duc/stoner combo of 2007 as it was a different bike, grid, and advantage set.



Stick to 2010.

Click to expand...

So how did Capirossi go ? Melandri ?







........

Tom said:

You don't need to watch much racing to know that a fast vehicle does not necessarily equate to fast laptimes, and even more so to racing success. The Ducati GP7 is one of many examples of this.

Click to expand...

Again missing the point.



Rossi on duc = no BHP advantage and .... ride = average.



Stoner in 2007 on duc(like people keep comparing the current duc to) = 20BHP advantage/bridgestones = competitive>dominant.



The (oh so simple)point is we cannot compare the 2007 season to the 2011 ducati season, because all the paranoid excuse making aside it had very real advantages that the current bike doesnt have.



Such a simple thing.



Critisize rossi all you want if the comparison is fair, nutthug stoner all you want....i could care less, but for goodness sake look at it for what it is and not for "oh god i cannot have someone potentially knocking stoner in 2007".

Rob said:

Again missing the point.



Rossi on duc = no BHP advantage and .... ride = average.



Stoner in 2007 on duc(like people keep comparing the current duc to) = 20BHP advantage/bridgestones = competitive>dominant.



The (oh so simple)point is we cannot compare the 2007 season to the 2011 ducati season, because all the paranoid excuse making aside it had very real advantages that the current bike doesnt have.



Such a simple thing.



Critisize rossi all you want if the comparison is fair, nutthug stoner all you want....i could care less, but for goodness sake look at it for what it is and not for "oh god i cannot have someone potentially knocking stoner in 2007".

Click to expand...

Sorry i have tagged myself in because i disagreed with a specific point you were trying to make. In the greater scheme of things i would never compare the 07 bike to today's Ducati 800. In a few races time i think it'll be a stretch to compare it to the bike Stoner last raced.

Rob said:

Only nuthuggers like you come along and turn it into a "it was stoner not the bike in 2007" topic.

Click to expand...

There was a fair amount of "it was the bike not stoner" from people of your ilk, nuthuggers or not, prior to much if any "it was stoner not the bike". This is entirely different of course, since the first is your opinion and hence apparently by definition correct.

BarryMachine said:

So how did Capirossi go ? Melandri ?







........

Click to expand...

Crap.....i dont remember melandri running as well as 7th at qatar, and capi didnt even finish in 2007.



But whats that got to do with the simple fact that the bike still had more power, and looking at rossi's current lap times is it not fair to wonder how more horses and a better tyre package would help his 1 - 1.5 second difference? forgetting the shoulder.



Another exapmple of you missing the point entirely.



This question only arises because the unfair 07 comparison is spammed around by idiots like you barry.



Its all moot and not worth arguing about really, but its suddenly becomes relevant whe people start boasting that stoner on the duc in 2007 was so much better than what rossi is acheiving on the 2011 model.

Rob said:

stoner on the duc in 2007 was so much better than what rossi is acheiving on the 2011 model.

Click to expand...

Correct.





And for the record, all that sooking and whining in your PM about everybody hating Italians ........... Stoners crew are mostly Italian ..... and I think they are great.





Not that your "state" was ever much above a gooey slush, but I'd have to say you are having a complete meltdown fella!



By the way where is your bro ...... Talpa?