Nürburgring thread

[heyhuub]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Arrabbiata1 @ Sep 6 2009, 11:32 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Firstly, I'm intrigued, are you fully aware of what I am referring to?

Secondly, it was largely my opinion of his character. Although I've never seen him as an intelligent rider, more a balls out racer - and a very entertaining one, I also lost respect for him as a rider.

Was sorry to see him go down today, but with six races remaining, this ain't necessarily done.

I take it it is about the oil incident, where he rode on with a broken engine spilling oil over the track. Though i can't really remember how it went down.

 

[Arrabbiata1]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (levigarrett @ Sep 7 2009, 02:58 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>You're the first tool in the history of motorcycle forums to not blame the guy who made the inside move, couldn't hold his line and then took out another rider...........

The guy on the outside who was holding his line is to blame......?? Get real. I suppose when Fabi did it to Spies last month it was Ben's fault right? Did I get that right?? So it was Ben's fault that Fabi made an inside move, couldn't hold his line and took Ben out. HHmm, I'm pretty sure I've read some posts on here indicating otherwise........

Not by me you haven't!

Firstly, did Vale universally get the blame across motorcycle forums worldwide for his last corner inside move on Sete at Jerez? So your initial statement is wrong.

Haga left the door open, what was Rea supposed to do? There was minimal contact and Nori unluckily went down. Rough justice I concede, because as close as Haga likes to race to his competitors, he always makes clean passes and rarely misjudges it and makes contact. I recall him taking out Niel Hodgson at Assen, a collision with Xuas across the line at Brands, and the Kagayama incident at Losail..other than that Nori usually keeps it clean.

Secondly, watch your mouth, - don't shoot it off to me over the internet, although right now it's probably tied up ingesting a motherload of quarterpounders. By all means, feel free to call me a tool if you must, I have no problem folk hurling abuse my way, (even though I'm only expressing a counter opinion to your own), but before you do, you might like to lose some weight, you fat useless ......., 'cause when your very large profile stepped out from behind your internet one, looking at you on the photo's at Indy, your arteries are probably more furred up than my grandma's plumbing. Too many trips to White Castle son, too many weekends on the couch watching bike racing...(although we'd never know that, if your uninsightful posts are anything to go by

)

 

[chopperman]

At first i thought it was Rea's fault but after i watched a re play that showed the events from a little further back i changed my mind. Haga went a little deep leaving the door open, Rea jammed it up the inside. thats racing. Poor old Haga, this lad really is championship allergic.

 

[Arrabbiata1]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (chopperman @ Sep 7 2009, 11:31 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>At first i thought it was Rea's fault but after i watched a re play that showed the events from a little further back i changed my mind. Haga went a little deep leaving the door open, Rea jammed it up the inside. thats racing. Poor old Haga, this lad really is championship allergic.
EXACTLY

Remember Checa on Neukerchner last corner at Valencia '08 Levi? - that's the sort of desperate lunge up the inside that's heading nowhere other than the gravel, and that's what we all object to. Witness also Ianonne's recreation/tribute to this on Espagaro this weekend at Misano. You won't find anyone defending that inside line on here or like you say probably on any other motorcycling forum - other than the fact that they are both racers and desperately pushed for the win. Rea saw an opportunity and went for it. Haga knew he had to shut the door, but Johnny already had his foot in it, much like yours will be in your mouth when you watch the incident back again Levi, and realise how wrong you are.. (Might be more paletable and better for you than a White Castle cheeseburger though!)

 

[mylexicon]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Arrabbiata1 @ Sep 7 2009, 03:49 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>EXACTLY

Remember Checa on Neukerchner last corner at Valencia '08 Levi? - that's the sort of desperate lunge up the inside that's heading nowhere other than the gravel, and that's what we all object to. Witness also Ianonne's recreation/tribute to this on Espagaro this weekend at Misano. You won't find anyone defending that inside line on here or like you say probably on any other motorcycling forum - other than the fact that they are both racers and desperately pushed for the win. Rea saw an opportunity and went for it. Haga knew he had to shut the door, but Johnny already had his foot in it, much like yours will be in your mouth when you watch the incident back again Levi, and realise how wrong you are.. (Might be more paletable and better for you than a White Castle cheeseburger though!)

While I agree with you in regards to the Rea-Haga incident, I'm confused why you would accept Rea's move as part of racing, but classify Spies' move on Haslam as harsh.

 

[Arrabbiata1]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mylexicon @ Sep 7 2009, 03:58 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>While I agree with you in regards to the Rea-Haga incident, I'm confused why you would accept Rea's move as part of racing, but classify Spies' move on Haslam as harsh.
Leon hadn't left the door open in quite the same way, and was forced by Ben to run on. That said, I've seen Haslam pull similar moves many times in BSB, and again - it's racing. I'd say Rea's move was a tough one, but didn't warrant much objection.

 

[GatorDuc]

I'm posing this as a question, not to be rhetorical/cynical, but b/c I haven't been watching racing that long. I have watched the Rea/Haga incident over, and over, and over, and ....... over. Earlier in the race, it looks like Haga's line through that turn is always a little "wider" than the other racers. I understand if you're defending a turn you should be as close as possible to the apex to prevent a run up the inside by the guy behind you. However, in this incident, Haga was clearly ahead through the turn, his line was unchanged and Rea's inside move (and the trajectory before contact) essentially ran into Haga (on the straight/exit of the turn) from behind. Can't one argue that it was a sloppy move on Rea's part? Racing incident? Isn't it the passing riders responsibility to make a clean pass? Can't one argue that Rea's trajectory/speed ran him into Haga and he should have slowed a bit? I am not trying to play "naive-guy" here, I like Haga b/c he's a Ducati guy, I admit that, but I have tried to look at it as objectively as possible and am having a hard time determining what a "racing incident" is and what a "sloppy-overly aggressive" inside move is?
Thanks for any non-inflammatory responses.....I can see this has gotten very emotional and I'm trying to stay above that fray and am asking a serious question.

 

[Arrabbiata1]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (GatorDuc @ Sep 7 2009, 08:39 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I'm posing this as a question, not to be rhetorical/cynical, but b/c I haven't been watching racing that long. I have watched the Rea/Haga incident over, and over, and over, and ....... over. Earlier in the race, it looks like Haga's line through that turn is always a little "wider" than the other racers. I understand if you're defending a turn you should be as close as possible to the apex to prevent a run up the inside by the guy behind you. However, in this incident, Haga was clearly ahead through the turn, his line was unchanged and Rea's inside move (and the trajectory before contact) essentially ran into Haga (on the straight/exit of the turn) from behind. Can't one argue that it was a sloppy move on Rea's part? Racing incident? Isn't it the passing riders responsibility to make a clean pass? Can't one argue that Rea's trajectory/speed ran him into Haga and he should have slowed a bit? I am not trying to play "naive-guy" here, I like Haga b/c he's a Ducati guy, I admit that, but I have tried to look at it as objectively as possible and am having a hard time determining what a "racing incident" is and what a "sloppy-overly aggressive" inside move is?
Thanks for any non-inflammatory responses.....I can see this has gotten very emotional and I'm trying to stay above that fray and am asking a serious question.
Yeah, that's largely my fault. Apologies.

Good post, and points cogently made Gator. I think most riders would have gone for the opening. Rea may have misjudged/mistimed it slightly and it's a shame that Nori went down, but like I say, bike racing is a contact sport at times, and I've seen far far worse over the years.

 

[chopperman]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Arrabbiata1 @ Sep 7 2009, 10:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Yeah, that's largely my fault. Apologies.

Good post, and points cogently made Gator. I think most riders would have gone for the opening. Rea may have misjudged/mistimed it slightly and it's a shame that Nori went down, but like I say, bike racing is a contact sport at times, and I've seen far far worse over the years.
yeah, there aint always too many placers to pass these days. if you leave the door open (even a jar) someone is going to stick there boot in

 

[GatorDuc]

Okay, point understood both Arrabb and Chopper. I'll concede that it wasn't the most agressive move on Rea's part, just wish for Haga's sake it was a little cleaner pass. Oh well, "you can wish in one hand and .... in the other, see which one fills up first.." That's what my dad used to say.

 

[J708]

i hope you like my new avatar guys. im not very creative. sorry

 

[povol]

The way i saw it was Haga cooked the turn,parked his bike in the racing line to keep from losing 2-3 posistions and got tagged. Rhea might have been a little overzelous considering he was faster than Haga but just one of those racing deals. This incident is NOTHING like the Fabrizio blunder. Like Jumkie said,he had lost his bike,big difference.

 

[Jumkie]

I havnt watched race two several time, but watching race 1 i noticed Rae was very aggressive on Spies. I can appreciate agression, but Rae mite want to consider that Spies & Haga are locked in a title battle so if hes gonna execute a pass it should b clean enough so as not to be the one to decide a championship. Having said that i was suprised to c Haga go down on what looked to b very little contact.

BTW, Arab, outch man but I imagine some was tongue and cheek.(?)

Put some smiley so we know your just messing with the man.(?)

.

 

[Austin]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (chopperman @ Sep 7 2009, 05:31 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>At first i thought it was Rea's fault but after i watched a re play that showed the events from a little further back i changed my mind. Haga went a little deep leaving the door open, Rea jammed it up the inside. thats racing. Poor old Haga, this lad really is championship allergic.
Kind of my thoughts. When I initially saw it I thought Rea had overcooked it and hit Haga. Whitham was adamant the whole time that it wasn't Rea's fault and after watching it a few more times I could see his point. Then again, the British Eurosport guys are quite the homers. Rea was a little deep but Haga was deeper, giving Rea the opportunity. Or at least the illusion of an opportunity. I wouldn't say Rea is blameless, it was an ambitious maneuver but one that any other rider would have taken. It was just unlucky that they made contact.

Anyone think Hopkins might be done? He's lucky it was only a concussion but you have to wonder if he can physically do it anymore.

 

[Jumkie]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Austin @ Sep 7 2009, 09:47 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Anyone think Hopkins might be done? He's lucky it was only a concussion but you have to wonder if he can physically do it anymore.
Austin, I saw a two riders ran over by a bike. The first one, was that Hopper. I looked like somebody got ran over from foot to shoulder. Then the same bike hit a Kawasaki rider.

I haven't read much about it, but if that was Hopper, then I thin he is done. Sit it out brotha, the Lord has abandoned you. There is no way a man could have such bad lick if it wasn't God taking a giant .... on you. Poor Hopkin has been dodging a permanent injury for too long. What a waste too, such a talented guy and we will never see him flourish.

 

[povol]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (GatorDuc @ Sep 7 2009, 06:03 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Okay, point understood both Arrabb and Chopper. I'll concede that it wasn't the most agressive move on Rea's part, just wish for Haga's sake it was a little cleaner pass. Oh well, "you can wish in one hand and .... in the other, see which one fills up first.." That's what my dad used to say.
Your dad was/is a wise man!

 

[Jumkie]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (povol @ Sep 8 2009, 06:47 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Your dad was/is a wise man!

No just his dad.

Ok, got back from a BBQ and went straight to the DVR. Watched the Rae Haga thing. Wow, its a tough call. I'm really confused now. At first I thought it was Rae screwing up, then a few rewinds into it I thought Haga screwed up, then again after a few rewinds I was back on Rae.

Just a recap, it looks to me like Rae is ahead down the straight then Haga brakes latter, passes Rae but looks to be a hair too deep (that is overshoots his marker by a ..... hair). Rae reacts by diving on the inside (a very common move in racing of which I think I saw several this weekend by various riders). At this point is where the problem begins. Looking at the previous laps I noticed Haga can negotiate turns tighter than the Hondas (take a look at the bike positions in previous turns, Rae looks to want to go on the outside). So when Haga turns in he is met by Rae. Contact is made. I can't really say Rae ran wide as much as I can't say Haga turned in too much. So I'm up in the air on this one now.

 

[povol]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Sep 8 2009, 10:15 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>No just his dad.

Ok, got back from a BBQ and went straight to the DVR. Watched the Rae Haga thing. Wow, its a tough call. I'm really confused now. At first I thought it was Rae screwing up, then a few rewinds into it I thought Haga screwed up, then again after a few rewinds I was back on Rae.

Just a recap, it looks to me like Rae is ahead down the straight then Haga brakes latter, passes Rae but looks to be a hair too deep (that is overshoots his marker by a ..... hair). Rae reacts by diving on the inside (a very common move in racing of which I think I saw several this weekend by various riders). At this point is where the problem begins. Looking at the previous laps I noticed Haga can negotiate turns tighter than the Hondas (take a look at the bike positions in previous turns, Rae looks to want to go on the outside). So when Haga turns in he is met by Rae. Contact is made. I can't really say Rae ran wide as much as I can't say Haga turned in too much. So I'm up in the air on this one now.

No just his dad.

?

 

[mylexicon]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Sep 8 2009, 07:15 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>No just his dad.

Ok, got back from a BBQ and went straight to the DVR. Watched the Rae Haga thing. Wow, its a tough call. I'm really confused now. At first I thought it was Rae screwing up, then a few rewinds into it I thought Haga screwed up, then again after a few rewinds I was back on Rae.

Just a recap, it looks to me like Rae is ahead down the straight then Haga brakes latter, passes Rae but looks to be a hair too deep (that is overshoots his marker by a ..... hair). Rae reacts by diving on the inside (a very common move in racing of which I think I saw several this weekend by various riders). At this point is where the problem begins. Looking at the previous laps I noticed Haga can negotiate turns tighter than the Hondas (take a look at the bike positions in previous turns, Rae looks to want to go on the outside). So when Haga turns in he is met by Rae. Contact is made. I can't really say Rae ran wide as much as I can't say Haga turned in too much. So I'm up in the air on this one now.

You've got to give Rea the benefit of the doubt. Haga is notorious for riding right on top of people so, imo, you can't really blame Rea for the incident when Haga was love-tapped with a solid 10-15ft of track to his left.

 

[Austin]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Sep 8 2009, 01:31 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Austin, I saw a two riders ran over by a bike. The first one, was that Hopper. I looked like somebody got ran over from foot to shoulder. Then the same bike hit a Kawasaki rider.

I haven't read much about it, but if that was Hopper, then I thin he is done. Sit it out brotha, the Lord has abandoned you. There is no way a man could have such bad lick if it wasn't God taking a giant .... on you. Poor Hopkin has been dodging a permanent injury for too long. What a waste too, such a talented guy and we will never see him flourish.
It sure looked like Hopkins was the one who got run over from foot to shoulder.