2024 Round 16: Motul Grand Prix of Japan - Mobility Resort Motegi

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Keshav said:
Sure nuf. I was definitely thinking of that when I was typing the post. The difference tho, is Stoner was not a factory bike, and he was on whichever ...... tires Michelin had lying about, whilst competing against more experienced riders who were getting SNS.
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I am a Stoner tragic, but see some similarity although not so much until Pedro actually starts winning when he has equipment which allows him to do so. I doubt anyone else including Rossi could have won a title on that 2007 Ducati, but if you could ride it as Stoner could it was an unbeatable bike. Interesting to speculate whether peak Stoner or peak Marquez could win on a current KTM, both won races on bikes which were completely uncompetitive for others, like the 2010 Ducati and the 2021 Honda.

If he is trying to galvanise KTM it seems to be working, cf Aki Ajo running the factory team next year.
 
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AnnoyingTwit said:
I suspect that he would have ended up in third place, but via a different path.



.
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I tend to agree, Martin started behind him and beat him after all. MM himself said post race the aero doesn't allow you to overtake on this circuit unless you have a few tenths advantage though, so maybe if he had got pole and managed to get away in front as Bagnaia did it could have been different.
 
Let us not forget that the two best riders in the last two seasons, when looking at the table, are serial crashers.
People in the know explain this with the aero and intensity of the races these last few seasons.

You are something very special if you can manage to put your bike on pole, in your rookies season, and not be on the clearly best bike on the grid.

How special, only time will tell.
 
michaelm said:
I am a Stoner tragic, but see some similarity although not so much until Pedro actually starts winning when he has equipment which allows him to do so. I doubt anyone else including Rossi could have won a title on that 2007 Ducati, but if you could ride it as Stoner could it was an unbeatable bike. Interesting to speculate whether peak Stoner or peak Marquez could win on a current KTM, both won races on bikes which were completely uncompetitive for others, like the 2010 Ducati and the 2021 Honda.

If he is trying to galvanise KTM it seems to be working, cf Aki Ajo running the factory team next year.
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I believe that Acosta could have won the Sprint Race on the bike he has if he had raced smarter. If he had taken 0.2s out of Bagnaia in that near-the-end-for-him lap, instead of 0.7s, that still would have put him further ahead. While there being (probably) less chance of crashing and less taken out of his tyres. So, yes. He failed to win when he had the equipment to do so.
 
AnnoyingTwit said:
I believe that Acosta could have won the Sprint Race on the bike he has if he had raced smarter. If he had taken 0.2s out of Bagnaia in that near-the-end-for-him lap, instead of 0.7s, that still would have put him further ahead. While there being (probably) less chance of crashing and less taken out of his tyres. So, yes. He failed to win when he had the equipment to do so.
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Couldn't agree more.
Although, I think I will still give him benefit of doubt and put it down to "youthful exuberance" rather than lack of intelligence.
 
It has been said that it's easier to teach a fast rider not to crash than a slow rider who doesn't crash to ride fast

Would of thought that the electronics would prevent an engine from over revving. Different flywheel causing the over revving, that's interesting.

Yamaha's I4 doesn't have an external flywheel, I have wondered if that's a disadvantage
 
mikesbytes said:
Would of thought that the electronics would prevent an engine from over revving. Different flywheel causing the over revving, that's interesting.

Yamaha's I4 doesn't have an external flywheel, I have wondered if that's a disadvantage
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Happened to Rossi and Lorenzo in Mugello in 2015. Bike jumped off the crest, overrevved for a bit, engine went poof after some laps. Disastrously for Rossi, in the race.
 
One fall does not mean very much, and could be due to random factors. Falling significantly more frequently than other riders does mean something, particularly when there is a lot to lose. To me it looks as if Acosta is in the second group.
 
AnnoyingTwit said:
I believe that Acosta could have won the Sprint Race on the bike he has if he had raced smarter. If he had taken 0.2s out of Bagnaia in that near-the-end-for-him lap, instead of 0.7s, that still would have put him further ahead. While there being (probably) less chance of crashing and less taken out of his tyres. So, yes. He failed to win when he had the equipment to do so.
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Sure, don’t disagree. Being a traditionalist, or in other words old, I don’t value sprint race wins all that highly, but if you have to over-ride a bike it is more feasible over a sprint race distance, and he probably did have the winning of the sprint race riding just a tad more conservatively.

In his current situation a crashing year for his first year is not so bad imo, especially if it motivates KTM to improve the bike, as long as he doesn’t injure himself or more particularly, others, something the previously mentioned Casey Stoner took very much to heart after the race in his own rookie year when he lost his bike which led to a multi-bike crash and injuries to Gibernau and Capirossi iirc.

Anyhow, whether this was a learning season which was a prelude to greatness will only be apparent retrospectively rather than prospectively, as most are saying.
 
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michaelm said:
Sure, don’t disagree. Being a traditionalist, or in other words old, I don’t value sprint race wins all that highly, but if you have to over-ride a bike it is more feasible over a sprint race distance, and he probably did have the winning of the sprint race riding just a tad more conservatively.

In his current situation a crashing year for his first year is not so bad imo, especially if it motivates KTM to improve the bike, as long as he doesn’t injure himself or more particularly, others, something the previously mentioned Casey Stoner took very much to heart after the race in his own rookie year when he lost his bike which led to a multi-bike crash and injuries to Gibernau and Capirossi iirc.

Anyhow, whether this was a learning season which was a prelude to greatness will only be apparent retrospectively rather than prospectively, as most are saying.
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I keep on forgetting about the sprint races when I make my predictions. It's clear to myself that I don't value them so highly.

However, a first sprint race win is still, I think, an important milestone for a rider. I'm not sure how I would compare it to a first 3rd place podium in the feature race.

BTW: In case things got missed up above (other posts) I think that Acosta should have raced smarter in the sprint race (both races really). That doesn't mean that I think he's unintelligent. Even geniuses still do a fair chunk of stupid things.

EDIT: I see that in August Acosta was 2nd in the list of the most crashes, behind only Marc Marquez. I wonder if Acosta has overtaken MM93 yet, or not. https://www.autosport.com/motogp/ne...th-most-crashes-in-motogp-this-year/10643892/

Mir may have moved up as well.
 
synn said:
www.motorsportmagazine.com

The MotoGP rookie waging a lone war against the Ducati horde

Only one rider offers any opposition to Ducati right now and it’s rookie Pedro Acosta, the only non-Desmosedici rider to have stood on a grand prix podium since April. But what about the crashes? No worries, it’s all part of the process
www.motorsportmagazine.com www.motorsportmagazine.com
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Thanks.
A good explanation of why aero needs to go. Loss of downforce and hence traction, when behind another rider and braking.
Loss of downforce when behind and exiting the corner. Can't accelerate as early or hard, as less downforce keeping the front down.
Harder to overtake and processional racing is the result.
 

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