somedamnwriter
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hahaha, thanks for the pics
donnington race
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Ducati's gamble today was a sign of a desperate team. They have fallen behind Yamaha and maybe even Honda in development and are trying to make things happen.Its like an overmatched football team that resorts to different tactics and trick plays to stay in the game and hope something good happens in the end.It seemed totally unnecessary since Stoner was fastest and Nicky was 4th fastest in damp warm ups.
somedamnwriter
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<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (stnd @ Jul 27 2009, 01:35 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Registered just to note:
They let them selves get lapped.
i don't think there was much they could do at that time
They let them selves get lapped.
i don't think there was much they could do at that time
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Teomolca @ Jul 26 2009, 11:53 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>The GOAT was not so GOATy today, actually made a rookie mistake…
Big mistake…
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Teomolca @ Jul 26 2009, 11:53 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Still managed to get up and get some good points for the championship…
That’s what GOAT GOTA DO! Still manage…
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Teomolca @ Jul 26 2009, 11:53 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>rain tyres on a dry track???? that's the most ........ thing I've seen since, oh wait Ferrari did it in Malaysia with Kimi Raikkonen this season .... strategist was fired next week. That's how stupid that mistake is. Even if it had started to rain, a few laps into the race, you loose 10s per lap, so in 3 laps the leaders already have enough margin to swap bikes and still rejoin ahead AND the rain tires would be useless by then cause they would be worn out after a few laps on the dry asphalt.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (gsfan @ Jul 26 2009, 09:27 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Stoner made probably the worst tire decision I've ever seen and now I am starting to doubt his mental capacity. For Hayden it made no difference but for Stoner it lost him a chance to gain on Valentino. Screw winning the race and looking like a hero he can't let Rossi gain and fortunately for him Rossi was out of the big point positions. Damn lucky. That is what he should have been thinking but now I realize he is not even thinking about that. He is done. He based decision on probabilities of the changed of weather in England? He doesn't even appear to want to race anymore.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Jul 26 2009, 12:09 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Rossi has always had problems in the rain, especially in flag to flag racing. FACT. This race continues this fact (which undoubtedly was wisely factored into their strategy).
You seem to forget ‘pouring down’ Donington and Shangai 2005 where Rossi won, and some other good races for him too, being those two most significant examples… In what we agree is in the ‘Flag to Flag’ changing bike thing, is not Rossi’s best.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Jul 26 2009, 01:06 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>It was a wise decision considering that both Yamahas would have had DNFs...
But Ducati did NOT know if both Yamahas were going to get DNFs with slicks, what if they both had decided to play it safe going for a 3rd, a 4th, a 5th for example. I doubt this was part of Ducati’s calculation in this gambling to rely on.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (jazkat @ Jul 26 2009, 03:19 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>we are glad for 5th
i know there is a difference on both, maybe greedy was the wrong word... but both lorenzo and rossi must have known the risk's but you got lorenzo pushing to abit to hard and taking a tumble and rossi trying to pick up the pace to shake off dovi...... i just think that if rossi blocked dovi then maybe he wouldnt have slid out instead of trying to up his laptime to get away.
but at the end of the day rossi salvaged some good points.
Stupid both… Yes. Too ambitious both… Yes. Lucky one… Yes. Greedy? No way! I say go for the win always, be careful though, because to finish first, first you have to finish!
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mjpartyboy @ Jul 26 2009, 03:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I think it meant more to Rossi to be the last Donington winner than the 25 points that came with it. I'm surprised he didn't let Dovizioso past and follow him for a while before making a move.
Agreed mj.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Rossifan @ Jul 26 2009, 03:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Lorenzo - ...by the sound of his interview he is moving to honda...
A cannot read into it:
Lorenzo: “I got a good start and the first few laps went well, I was feeling quite comfortable in the lead. Unfortunately on the final corner of the ninth lap I made a small mistake, got my line wrong and touched the white line and there was nothing I could do; it was very slippery. I was okay and wanted to carry on but my bike was too badly damaged. Of course I'm sad and disappointed but this is racing and these feelings don't help, you just have to learn from a mistake like this and look forwards. Valentino was lucky that he could continue after his crash, but it wasn't our day. I am going to enjoy the break now despite this and take the chance to do plenty of training so we can come back at full strength in Brno”.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (johnny @ Jul 26 2009, 11:31 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Desperation me thinks. Rossi has messed up Caseys head
Perhaps Rossi has messed up his neurons head and marriage his hormones head… no wonder his got fatigue! (Stupid joke I Know).
Big mistake…
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Teomolca @ Jul 26 2009, 11:53 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Still managed to get up and get some good points for the championship…
That’s what GOAT GOTA DO! Still manage…
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Teomolca @ Jul 26 2009, 11:53 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>rain tyres on a dry track???? that's the most ........ thing I've seen since, oh wait Ferrari did it in Malaysia with Kimi Raikkonen this season .... strategist was fired next week. That's how stupid that mistake is. Even if it had started to rain, a few laps into the race, you loose 10s per lap, so in 3 laps the leaders already have enough margin to swap bikes and still rejoin ahead AND the rain tires would be useless by then cause they would be worn out after a few laps on the dry asphalt.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (gsfan @ Jul 26 2009, 09:27 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Stoner made probably the worst tire decision I've ever seen and now I am starting to doubt his mental capacity. For Hayden it made no difference but for Stoner it lost him a chance to gain on Valentino. Screw winning the race and looking like a hero he can't let Rossi gain and fortunately for him Rossi was out of the big point positions. Damn lucky. That is what he should have been thinking but now I realize he is not even thinking about that. He is done. He based decision on probabilities of the changed of weather in England? He doesn't even appear to want to race anymore.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Jul 26 2009, 12:09 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Rossi has always had problems in the rain, especially in flag to flag racing. FACT. This race continues this fact (which undoubtedly was wisely factored into their strategy).
You seem to forget ‘pouring down’ Donington and Shangai 2005 where Rossi won, and some other good races for him too, being those two most significant examples… In what we agree is in the ‘Flag to Flag’ changing bike thing, is not Rossi’s best.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Jul 26 2009, 01:06 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>It was a wise decision considering that both Yamahas would have had DNFs...
But Ducati did NOT know if both Yamahas were going to get DNFs with slicks, what if they both had decided to play it safe going for a 3rd, a 4th, a 5th for example. I doubt this was part of Ducati’s calculation in this gambling to rely on.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (jazkat @ Jul 26 2009, 03:19 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>we are glad for 5th
i know there is a difference on both, maybe greedy was the wrong word... but both lorenzo and rossi must have known the risk's but you got lorenzo pushing to abit to hard and taking a tumble and rossi trying to pick up the pace to shake off dovi...... i just think that if rossi blocked dovi then maybe he wouldnt have slid out instead of trying to up his laptime to get away.
but at the end of the day rossi salvaged some good points.
Stupid both… Yes. Too ambitious both… Yes. Lucky one… Yes. Greedy? No way! I say go for the win always, be careful though, because to finish first, first you have to finish!
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mjpartyboy @ Jul 26 2009, 03:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I think it meant more to Rossi to be the last Donington winner than the 25 points that came with it. I'm surprised he didn't let Dovizioso past and follow him for a while before making a move.
Agreed mj.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Rossifan @ Jul 26 2009, 03:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Lorenzo - ...by the sound of his interview he is moving to honda...
A cannot read into it:
Lorenzo: “I got a good start and the first few laps went well, I was feeling quite comfortable in the lead. Unfortunately on the final corner of the ninth lap I made a small mistake, got my line wrong and touched the white line and there was nothing I could do; it was very slippery. I was okay and wanted to carry on but my bike was too badly damaged. Of course I'm sad and disappointed but this is racing and these feelings don't help, you just have to learn from a mistake like this and look forwards. Valentino was lucky that he could continue after his crash, but it wasn't our day. I am going to enjoy the break now despite this and take the chance to do plenty of training so we can come back at full strength in Brno”.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (johnny @ Jul 26 2009, 11:31 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Desperation me thinks. Rossi has messed up Caseys head
Perhaps Rossi has messed up his neurons head and marriage his hormones head… no wonder his got fatigue! (Stupid joke I Know).
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (VHMP01 @ Jul 27 2009, 06:57 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>That’s what GOAT GOTA DO! Still manage…
That is what all racers should do and in most cases they look to try.
What makes the difference (for my way of thinking) is that VR tends to get back on the bike (when possible - which is often in his case) and get straight back to race pace quite quickly. Often in other cases it seems to dent the individual and they take far longer to get back to race pace if they achieve it. But of course the level of damage sustained to both rider and bike ultimately determines the achievable pace.
Personally, for a rider, any rider to fall, remount and finish is a great effort. To remount and overtake riders as VR does and did says much about the individual involved - has it been doubted?
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (VHMP01 @ Jul 27 2009, 06:57 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Stupid both… Yes. Too ambitious both… Yes. Lucky one… Yes. Greedy? No way! I say go for the win always, be careful though, because to finish first, first you have to finish!
Probably get a blasting for this, but to me it all depends on your interpretation.
Did VR get greedy by trying to 'bite off more than he could chew' on that corner. Well the fact he fell would indicate that he did, but that is what racers do - they try - sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.
If the conversation is more around was he greedy in trying to maximise his points haul from the race - different conversation but again, it comes to what racers are supposed to do. Yes he could have settled for a safe third or so, but the extra points could well mean a difference at years end and had he not tried for a maximum haul - it could well have haunted.
Without meaning to push the point - VR's efforts and approach at the time of trying to gain a maximum points haul are no different to Ducati's gamble in it's intent (and before people jump on teh badwagon - saying Ducati's plural). Yes the execution and results differ, but the intent is the same which is to gamble to achieve maximum points.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (VHMP01 @ Jul 27 2009, 06:57 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>A cannot read into it:
Lorenzo: “I got a good start and the first few laps went well, I was feeling quite comfortable in the lead. Unfortunately on the final corner of the ninth lap I made a small mistake, got my line wrong and touched the white line and there was nothing I could do; it was very slippery. I was okay and wanted to carry on but my bike was too badly damaged. Of course I'm sad and disappointed but this is racing and these feelings don't help, you just have to learn from a mistake like this and look forwards. Valentino was lucky that he could continue after his crash, but it wasn't our day. I am going to enjoy the break now despite this and take the chance to do plenty of training so we can come back at full strength in Brno”.
Have not seen the interview so it may be the delivery that gave the poster the impression as like you I don't read anything but disappointment and frustration - although he points to VR's luck as well (just as Jumkie who seems to be getting panned for it)
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (VHMP01 @ Jul 27 2009, 06:57 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Perhaps Rossi has messed up his neurons head and marriage his hormones head… no wonder his got fatigue! (Stupid joke I Know).
I realise it is an attempted joke but you have lost me a little in the way I read - specifically the highlighted section as it (to me) doesn't seem to flow, but the intent seems clear but just doesn't work because of the way I am reading it.
Mind you, after this race there will no doubt be a series of lines available for use and the usual wits will come up with them.
Gaz
That is what all racers should do and in most cases they look to try.
What makes the difference (for my way of thinking) is that VR tends to get back on the bike (when possible - which is often in his case) and get straight back to race pace quite quickly. Often in other cases it seems to dent the individual and they take far longer to get back to race pace if they achieve it. But of course the level of damage sustained to both rider and bike ultimately determines the achievable pace.
Personally, for a rider, any rider to fall, remount and finish is a great effort. To remount and overtake riders as VR does and did says much about the individual involved - has it been doubted?
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (VHMP01 @ Jul 27 2009, 06:57 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Stupid both… Yes. Too ambitious both… Yes. Lucky one… Yes. Greedy? No way! I say go for the win always, be careful though, because to finish first, first you have to finish!
Probably get a blasting for this, but to me it all depends on your interpretation.
Did VR get greedy by trying to 'bite off more than he could chew' on that corner. Well the fact he fell would indicate that he did, but that is what racers do - they try - sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.
If the conversation is more around was he greedy in trying to maximise his points haul from the race - different conversation but again, it comes to what racers are supposed to do. Yes he could have settled for a safe third or so, but the extra points could well mean a difference at years end and had he not tried for a maximum haul - it could well have haunted.
Without meaning to push the point - VR's efforts and approach at the time of trying to gain a maximum points haul are no different to Ducati's gamble in it's intent (and before people jump on teh badwagon - saying Ducati's plural). Yes the execution and results differ, but the intent is the same which is to gamble to achieve maximum points.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (VHMP01 @ Jul 27 2009, 06:57 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>A cannot read into it:
Lorenzo: “I got a good start and the first few laps went well, I was feeling quite comfortable in the lead. Unfortunately on the final corner of the ninth lap I made a small mistake, got my line wrong and touched the white line and there was nothing I could do; it was very slippery. I was okay and wanted to carry on but my bike was too badly damaged. Of course I'm sad and disappointed but this is racing and these feelings don't help, you just have to learn from a mistake like this and look forwards. Valentino was lucky that he could continue after his crash, but it wasn't our day. I am going to enjoy the break now despite this and take the chance to do plenty of training so we can come back at full strength in Brno”.
Have not seen the interview so it may be the delivery that gave the poster the impression as like you I don't read anything but disappointment and frustration - although he points to VR's luck as well (just as Jumkie who seems to be getting panned for it)
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (VHMP01 @ Jul 27 2009, 06:57 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Perhaps Rossi has messed up his neurons head and marriage his hormones head… no wonder his got fatigue! (Stupid joke I Know).
I realise it is an attempted joke but you have lost me a little in the way I read - specifically the highlighted section as it (to me) doesn't seem to flow, but the intent seems clear but just doesn't work because of the way I am reading it.
Mind you, after this race there will no doubt be a series of lines available for use and the usual wits will come up with them.
Gaz
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (VHMP01 @ Jul 27 2009, 06:57 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>You seem to forget ‘pouring down’ Donington and Shangai 2005 where Rossi won, and some other good races for him too, being those two most significant examples… In what we agree is in the ‘Flag to Flag’ changing bike thing, is not Rossi’s best.
Lets not forget Indianapolis '08.
Besides, Rossi has had a few successful races on both wet and slicks tires with changing conditions.
Lets not forget Indianapolis '08.
Besides, Rossi has had a few successful races on both wet and slicks tires with changing conditions.
Truth is Rossi just can't get it right can he?
If he tries for the win, he's greedy.
If he sits back and takes the cautious route, then he's just cruising around for the points (which we all know is not worthy behaviour from a champion).
After his race Valentino did say, when his race tactic and attitude were questioned, that he simply used the same attitude as always, and that's the attitude that has won him 101 races.
Says it all methinks.
He did say that with hindsight he should've let Dovi lead, and that around the time of the crash he was considering letting him pass only he crashed before he got round to it. And he did add that he bike was a very good girl to fall so well and not get hurt!!!
If he tries for the win, he's greedy.
If he sits back and takes the cautious route, then he's just cruising around for the points (which we all know is not worthy behaviour from a champion).
After his race Valentino did say, when his race tactic and attitude were questioned, that he simply used the same attitude as always, and that's the attitude that has won him 101 races.
Says it all methinks.
He did say that with hindsight he should've let Dovi lead, and that around the time of the crash he was considering letting him pass only he crashed before he got round to it. And he did add that he bike was a very good girl to fall so well and not get hurt!!!
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About mistakes:
Stoner's was not a "mistake", it was a bet. He lost it, that's all. Had he won it, we would all be applauding his intuition. Ducatis weren't fast at all with slicks, and were the fastest with rains, so in a way one can understand the wishful thinking.
Lorenzo' was a clear mistake, he braked on the white line.
Rossi's, according to Dovi who was following him, wasn't a mistake. He said Vale didn't do anything different, and seeing him go down like that with no apparent reason made him extra-careful.
Stoner's was not a "mistake", it was a bet. He lost it, that's all. Had he won it, we would all be applauding his intuition. Ducatis weren't fast at all with slicks, and were the fastest with rains, so in a way one can understand the wishful thinking.
Lorenzo' was a clear mistake, he braked on the white line.
Rossi's, according to Dovi who was following him, wasn't a mistake. He said Vale didn't do anything different, and seeing him go down like that with no apparent reason made him extra-careful.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Jul 26 2009, 05:03 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>The gamble was not that stupid. It only looks dumb at first evaluation. If you consider the two arch rivals IN FACT CRASHED ON SLICKS! I know this fact will be forgotten as I'm sure we will have people lined up on this thread ad in the following weeks. The thing is Rossi's bike is bullet proof. Had one thing went wrong with that bike, he wouldn't have finished and the gamble would have been genius.
Again, Ducati, specifically Stoner's two rivals actually and in fact CRASHED ON SLICKS. So to all those who will follow, equate this into your assessment.
I think it was a stupid gamble for both riders to take the risk....I can understand one but both riders??
Hayden having done it, i can understand given he is not in the championship hunt, but Stoner to do it while he is in the hunt, is a huge gamble which did not go his way. If it was the last race of the season and he had a shot, I could understand a gamble such as this...but they both messed it up this weekend...big time.
Rossi yes crashed, but a slow slide at that, and was able to restart. Not so for Lorenzo that crashed pretty hard and obviously could not restart.
Again, Ducati, specifically Stoner's two rivals actually and in fact CRASHED ON SLICKS. So to all those who will follow, equate this into your assessment.
I think it was a stupid gamble for both riders to take the risk....I can understand one but both riders??
Hayden having done it, i can understand given he is not in the championship hunt, but Stoner to do it while he is in the hunt, is a huge gamble which did not go his way. If it was the last race of the season and he had a shot, I could understand a gamble such as this...but they both messed it up this weekend...big time.
Rossi yes crashed, but a slow slide at that, and was able to restart. Not so for Lorenzo that crashed pretty hard and obviously could not restart.
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<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Bikergirl @ Jul 27 2009, 08:41 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Truth is Rossi just can't get it right can he?
If he tries for the win, he's greedy.
If he sits back and takes the cautious route, then he's just cruising around for the points (which we all know is not worthy behaviour from a champion).
After his race Valentino did say, when his race tactic and attitude were questioned, that he simply used the same attitude as always, and that's the attitude that has won him 101 races.
Says it all methinks.
He did say that with hindsight he should've let Dovi lead, and that around the time of the crash he was considering letting him pass only he crashed before he got round to it. And he did add that he bike was a very good girl to fall so well and not get hurt!!!
Spot on Bikergirl! The guy is hot on the trail of being the most successful racer ever, and folk are having a pop for trying to win a race! Rossi's career has been built on WINNING races for gods sakes. As for the bike being undamaged, it's well documented here that Rossi's trademark crash is the lowside which is not going to cause the same damage to the bike as say, Lorenzo's trademark vertical take off and landing. To fall off, remount and get back and finish 5th shows the level that the guy is riding at, of course luck played a part, it plays a part in any race result, and in the career of any racer. You can't grudge the guy that!
I thought it was an amazing race, edge of the seat stuff, great to see CE up there, I would have loved to see him take the win, but hey ho.
Stoner, Hayden? WTF!!!!!!!!!! Sorry Jumkie, I would not say that they took a similar gamble to Yamaha, yes Rossi fell off, but he was a lap ahead of Stoner and Hayden at the time, fell off, remounted and still finished a lap ahead of them. Not good for Ducati at all, made themselves look very amatuer sadly.
All in all though a good days racing, and of course, well done to Scott Redding!
Pete
If he tries for the win, he's greedy.
If he sits back and takes the cautious route, then he's just cruising around for the points (which we all know is not worthy behaviour from a champion).
After his race Valentino did say, when his race tactic and attitude were questioned, that he simply used the same attitude as always, and that's the attitude that has won him 101 races.
Says it all methinks.
He did say that with hindsight he should've let Dovi lead, and that around the time of the crash he was considering letting him pass only he crashed before he got round to it. And he did add that he bike was a very good girl to fall so well and not get hurt!!!
Spot on Bikergirl! The guy is hot on the trail of being the most successful racer ever, and folk are having a pop for trying to win a race! Rossi's career has been built on WINNING races for gods sakes. As for the bike being undamaged, it's well documented here that Rossi's trademark crash is the lowside which is not going to cause the same damage to the bike as say, Lorenzo's trademark vertical take off and landing. To fall off, remount and get back and finish 5th shows the level that the guy is riding at, of course luck played a part, it plays a part in any race result, and in the career of any racer. You can't grudge the guy that!
I thought it was an amazing race, edge of the seat stuff, great to see CE up there, I would have loved to see him take the win, but hey ho.
Stoner, Hayden? WTF!!!!!!!!!! Sorry Jumkie, I would not say that they took a similar gamble to Yamaha, yes Rossi fell off, but he was a lap ahead of Stoner and Hayden at the time, fell off, remounted and still finished a lap ahead of them. Not good for Ducati at all, made themselves look very amatuer sadly.
All in all though a good days racing, and of course, well done to Scott Redding!
Pete
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wow, didn't get back until late last night. ive not read all the posts yet but i gather a lot think the ducati wet tyre choice was a mistake or silly.
casey said "every lap was threatening to put enough rain down to use the wet's" and that pretty much sums it up imo.
the weather was ....... weird, the rain to start with was like hanging in the air rather than going on the track to start with. i thought the ducati gamble would pay off but the rain didnt really start to settle on track until about 11 laps to go. by then the wets were destroyed. by about 7 laps to go it was getting pretty dangrous , riders were dropping like flys, but again the track would start to dry again so not suitable for wets or slicks. imo this race proved the need for intermediate tyres. This is a saftey issue and dorna should force bridgstone to act.
some of the marshalling was questionable too. we were sat at starkeys, and a 250's a rider went down (white bike) think it may have been a wild card. he was out cold. he came round got on his bike and tried to re start the race. the marshals push him on his bike back on the track right on the racing line nearly getting him killed. how the other bikes missed his was unbelievable.
i will post storys and pics in the last donny thread later.
casey said "every lap was threatening to put enough rain down to use the wet's" and that pretty much sums it up imo.
the weather was ....... weird, the rain to start with was like hanging in the air rather than going on the track to start with. i thought the ducati gamble would pay off but the rain didnt really start to settle on track until about 11 laps to go. by then the wets were destroyed. by about 7 laps to go it was getting pretty dangrous , riders were dropping like flys, but again the track would start to dry again so not suitable for wets or slicks. imo this race proved the need for intermediate tyres. This is a saftey issue and dorna should force bridgstone to act.
some of the marshalling was questionable too. we were sat at starkeys, and a 250's a rider went down (white bike) think it may have been a wild card. he was out cold. he came round got on his bike and tried to re start the race. the marshals push him on his bike back on the track right on the racing line nearly getting him killed. how the other bikes missed his was unbelievable.
i will post storys and pics in the last donny thread later.
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I gotta ask this, what the hell is up with Edwards these days? He rode an excellent race and as my best mate from uni is his electronics Engineer I wanted him to win (but no more than Dovi or RdP :s !) but has anyone else noticed this year how if he is behind Toseland he rides like a lunatic?!
I was joking with the old man yesterday when JT was in 5th and Edwards was about 10 seconds behind him is what, 12th place and said 'Well I don't think Edwards will beat him today'...next thing is he was right behind him in a few laps and passed him like he stood still! Now before you all say 'Oh JT dropped off the pace' well he was in the pack with Melandri who was still with him when Edwards caught them?
PLEASE let JT be leading a race this year, because then as my bro said 'The devil himself riding a turbo'd Hayabusa and high on amphetamines wouldn't catch Edwards that day!!'
(Congrats to all 3 podium riders, was a cracking race)
I was joking with the old man yesterday when JT was in 5th and Edwards was about 10 seconds behind him is what, 12th place and said 'Well I don't think Edwards will beat him today'...next thing is he was right behind him in a few laps and passed him like he stood still! Now before you all say 'Oh JT dropped off the pace' well he was in the pack with Melandri who was still with him when Edwards caught them?
PLEASE let JT be leading a race this year, because then as my bro said 'The devil himself riding a turbo'd Hayabusa and high on amphetamines wouldn't catch Edwards that day!!'
(Congrats to all 3 podium riders, was a cracking race)
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (basspete @ Jul 27 2009, 09:27 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Spot on Bikergirl! The guy is hot on the trail of being the most successful racer ever, and folk are having a pop for trying to win a race! Rossi's career has been built on WINNING races for gods sakes. As for the bike being undamaged, it's well documented here that Rossi's trademark crash is the lowside which is not going to cause the same damage to the bike as say, Lorenzo's trademark vertical take off and landing. To fall off, remount and get back and finish 5th shows the level that the guy is riding at, of course luck played a part, it plays a part in any race result, and in the career of any racer. You can't grudge the guy that!
I thought it was an amazing race, edge of the seat stuff, great to see CE up there, I would have loved to see him take the win, but hey ho.
Stoner, Hayden? WTF!!!!!!!!!! Sorry Jumkie, I would not say that they took a similar gamble to Yamaha, yes Rossi fell off, but he was a lap ahead of Stoner and Hayden at the time, fell off, remounted and still finished a lap ahead of them. Not good for Ducati at all, made themselves look very amatuer sadly.
All in all though a good days racing, and of course, well done to Scott Redding!
Pete
Rossi seemed to back off a bit to try & save it, realises it's too late & keeps the power on enough to force the low side. Talk about reflexes.
I thought it was an amazing race, edge of the seat stuff, great to see CE up there, I would have loved to see him take the win, but hey ho.
Stoner, Hayden? WTF!!!!!!!!!! Sorry Jumkie, I would not say that they took a similar gamble to Yamaha, yes Rossi fell off, but he was a lap ahead of Stoner and Hayden at the time, fell off, remounted and still finished a lap ahead of them. Not good for Ducati at all, made themselves look very amatuer sadly.
All in all though a good days racing, and of course, well done to Scott Redding!
Pete
Rossi seemed to back off a bit to try & save it, realises it's too late & keeps the power on enough to force the low side. Talk about reflexes.
wow what a race! The weather made it unbarably tense, and we got shocking performances throughout. Stoner's gamble seemed ridiculous but it was so close to fully raining that i can appreciate the logic. Lorenzo was in a similar situation (needed to outscore Rossi) and it looks like both approaches failed. Rossi wasn't very impressive, considering his title rivals were getting nothing from their Sunday you would expect the calculator that is Rossi to be better than letting himself get Rossi's by Dovi. But Dovi... what a ride!! He hung it out when he needed to and played it safe when he didn't, didn't pass Rossi so he had someone to follow and got the job done. I'm impressed. Sitting on the outside of Schwantz we were treated to some extremely hairy moments for most of the riders, Elias in particular. It was great to see DePuniet and DeAngelis doing so well, both are quick and spectacular and i think proved their worth by overcoming the hardest of conditions. JT was ok, but nothing to write home about, Rossi crashed and beat him, Edwards was just better and he still can't crack the top 5 when all 4 of the top men have nightmare races.
I still maintain that Donington park is one of the best tracks on the motogp calendar for decent viewing of incredible bits of track. I can't think of many (if any) places that have or could have such awe inspiring spectating available. The British crowd was good most of the weekend showing appreciation for the top riders in all classes, but let themself down at crunch time just like i've come to expect. Cheers for Stoner's last place, cheers for Lorenzo's crash and very little appreciation of Dovi's performance followed by another pathetic track invasion makes an example of us again. It's a shame. Again i was amused by the obvious class difference between the crowd at the British motogp and the British F1gp, it couldn't be more pronounced. Whether that is a function of the location of the circuits or just the class of the sports remains to be seen. Roll on next year!
Also, it seems like yesterday was a big one for the championship. Its getting increasingly hard to believe anyone let alone Rossi's team mate can claw back 25 points. Stoner is now miles back too and Rossi seems to have made a point this summer for everyone to think about for a while. You have to be pretty damn good to have a terrible (by his standards) race and still outscore all your rivals. I think from a Lorenzo perspective at least it's important to not get hung up on losing the title, or losing the one on one battles and continue to learn and believe that experience will tilt the results in his favour sooner or later.
I still maintain that Donington park is one of the best tracks on the motogp calendar for decent viewing of incredible bits of track. I can't think of many (if any) places that have or could have such awe inspiring spectating available. The British crowd was good most of the weekend showing appreciation for the top riders in all classes, but let themself down at crunch time just like i've come to expect. Cheers for Stoner's last place, cheers for Lorenzo's crash and very little appreciation of Dovi's performance followed by another pathetic track invasion makes an example of us again. It's a shame. Again i was amused by the obvious class difference between the crowd at the British motogp and the British F1gp, it couldn't be more pronounced. Whether that is a function of the location of the circuits or just the class of the sports remains to be seen. Roll on next year!
Also, it seems like yesterday was a big one for the championship. Its getting increasingly hard to believe anyone let alone Rossi's team mate can claw back 25 points. Stoner is now miles back too and Rossi seems to have made a point this summer for everyone to think about for a while. You have to be pretty damn good to have a terrible (by his standards) race and still outscore all your rivals. I think from a Lorenzo perspective at least it's important to not get hung up on losing the title, or losing the one on one battles and continue to learn and believe that experience will tilt the results in his favour sooner or later.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (chopperman @ Jul 27 2009, 10:34 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>we were sat at starkeys, and a 250's a rider went down (white bike) think it may have been a wild card. he was out cold.
That was Ralf Waldman!!
That was Ralf Waldman!!
The problem for Ducati is that the tyre gamble only had a small window in which it could possibly work, i.e. it had to rain within the first few laps to have any chance of working. Even if it had started raining after 5 laps, the others had a substantial lead and would have been able to change bikes, probably bringing them out at least level with the Ducatis and on brand new wets whereas the Ducatis would have been on partially chewed up wets.
This gamble was a bad gamble now that we have flag-to-flag racing.
Otherwise it was a great race and seeing those bikes come down Crainer Curves is a beautiful sight indeed.
Steve
This gamble was a bad gamble now that we have flag-to-flag racing.
Otherwise it was a great race and seeing those bikes come down Crainer Curves is a beautiful sight indeed.
Steve
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tom @ Jul 27 2009, 11:35 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Rossi wasn't very impressive, considering his title rivals were getting nothing from their Sunday you would expect the calculator that is Rossi to be better than letting himself get Rossi's by Dovi.
True, lowsides from the lead are really never impressive, are they?
That said, it's got nothing to do with the situation of his championship competitors. You should know better than talking about calculator in that situation with Rossi.
He will always go for the win and only when considered impossible he settle for anything less. It's not a thought process in the moment, it's a part of his personality.
For me it's one of the main reasons to be a fan and no doubt the most important factor why he still is motivated and fighting for his 9th championship. It all comes down to his will to win.
True, lowsides from the lead are really never impressive, are they?
That said, it's got nothing to do with the situation of his championship competitors. You should know better than talking about calculator in that situation with Rossi.
He will always go for the win and only when considered impossible he settle for anything less. It's not a thought process in the moment, it's a part of his personality.
For me it's one of the main reasons to be a fan and no doubt the most important factor why he still is motivated and fighting for his 9th championship. It all comes down to his will to win.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tom @ Jul 27 2009, 10:35 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>wow what a race! The weather made it unbarably tense, and we got shocking performances throughout. Stoner's gamble seemed ridiculous but it was so close to fully raining that i can appreciate the logic.
I (fortunately from the perspective of a stoner/ducati fan) fell asleep and did not see the race. Whatever is ailing stoner, whether or not it is mainly organic and whether or not it is rossi induced, seems to have destroyed both his appetite for a fight and his confidence to engage in one.
In his most recent race win at mugello which would seem to have been in similar conditions he was slower than the yamahas in both full wet and full dry conditions but made 10 seconds on both rossi and lorenzo in a very short window when conditions were at their most treacherous around the time of the changeover, suggesting both his physical and/or mental condition was very different then.
I (fortunately from the perspective of a stoner/ducati fan) fell asleep and did not see the race. Whatever is ailing stoner, whether or not it is mainly organic and whether or not it is rossi induced, seems to have destroyed both his appetite for a fight and his confidence to engage in one.
In his most recent race win at mugello which would seem to have been in similar conditions he was slower than the yamahas in both full wet and full dry conditions but made 10 seconds on both rossi and lorenzo in a very short window when conditions were at their most treacherous around the time of the changeover, suggesting both his physical and/or mental condition was very different then.
