I suggest you watch the race again and see that Marquez while in front of Rossi was forced off track by Rossi who also ran wide and left the track.
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I suggest you watch the race again and see that Marquez while in front of Rossi was forced off track by Rossi who also ran wide and left the track.
I didn't object to either move at the time - LS08 or LS13. I was responding to Mike identifying the former but not the latter.
Rossi made a mistake at the corkscrew, and, yes, put Stoner in harm's way. I don't think it was extraordinarily risky, as Stoner had the opportunity to slow a little once he saw Rossi go off track and give himself more time to react (instead, Stoner stayed right on Rossi's shoulder).
Stoner also put Rossi in harm's way when he (intentionally) leaned his bike on Rossi (they touched...) on the run up the hill to the Corkscrew, so they both pulled some questionable moves in that sequence.
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Leaning on a rider who's been excessively aggressive with you is par for the course; has been all the years I've followed racing. Rossi's move was pure recklessness and created a state of endangerment that was way out of line with racing norms. I've walked the corkscrew at Laguna; the potential for disaster in that move was huge.
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I obviously recall that very well. The whole thing was that MM was in control, and was ruled by RD to have not ridden illegally because he had made the move to avoid Rossi, which begs the question of whether Rossi should have been allowed to maintain position by means of the original move, although I guess the rule may not have been the same then. The original Corkscrew incident involved Rossi going into the corner too hot, slewing off the track, then re-entering at right angles to Stoner who was in control on the racing line which would have resulted in a high speed torpedo had Stoner not been good enough to take rapid evasive action.
This is the whole point for those with my view of things. Not really directed at you, I value your participation in the forum as you know, but there is or has been imo and that of others a double standard. If Rossi does something then it is “that’s racing”, while others are called dangerous for lesser incidents, including by Rossi. I see some irony, and bitter irony for me as a Stoner fan given his truncated career, in the vilification of Stoner by pretty much the same people who call MM dangerous as being a wimp who wasn’t prepared to engage in hard racing.
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This is very old ground but again bumping usually requires the involvement of a minimum of 2 bikes. Why was it Stoner who was doing the bumping and why did it behove him rather than Rossi to concede?. Bottom line was that Rossii knew he would lose the race and possibly the championship if Stoner came out of the Corkscrew ahead, was rather desperate and went into the corner too hot, Stoner did not bump him off the track. As I recall, and while I am obviously not immune from bias myself I recall such things very well, Rossi moved across on Stoner and nearly squeezed Stoner off the track at the previous corner where Stoner had the better inside line, and any contact was as a result of this and Stoner refusing to concede the racing line which he was actually on.
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Memory does fail, or perhaps it is that tint in your glasses. Stoner went off track deliberately to avoid crashing into Rossi who some (not Stoner himself who conceded the right of a leading rider to negotiate a corner as he sees fit) consider brake checked Stoner.
Stoner actually said post race he could have crashed into Rossi without blame to his advantage championship-wise but that he chooses not to race that way.
Stoner said that the crash was his own fault.
The Rossi pass on the lefthander before the climb up the hill was totally legit.
Rossi was on the normal line accelerating up the hill but Stoner leaned right on him while passing, which I thought was totally unnecessary.
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I thought Rossi was very clean in his passes, other than the Corkscrew.
Of course he did, as I implied; he recognised that he should have been paying more attention and that Rossi was entitled to choose his line or slow midcorner if he so chose given he was the rider who was ahead. The off was a deliberate choice by Stoner however, he was not wildly out of control as Synn maintained. Stoner's other point post-race as I said was that if he had crashed into the back of Rossi no-one could really have blamed him, and it would actually have been to his advantage to do so.
I think his point was that he had to take drastic action to avoid collision twice, once due to his own mistake, but that Rossi's mistake was apparently also his problem rather than Valentino's. The avoidance of a high speed collision when Valentino rejoined the track at the Corkscrew was entirely dependent on Stoner.
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Perhaps you should try to find someone on here who is blaming Rossi for Stoner dumping it then. As I said and as RCV reiterated Stoner himself said it was his mistake. What you said about Stoner being wildly out of control and putting his bike in the dirt as a consequence of same was factually incorrect however as is so often the case.
Wow, Rossi/Stoner again!
I've not been posting over the last couple of months as real life has been hectic (changing jobs amongst some other things) and my interweb access has been mainly mobile phone based, but it's good to see things haven't changed.
The usual fare seems to prevail;
Rossi does alright = He's sabotaged the bike for everyone else (including the tyres)
Rossi does bad = He's ruined the best bike on the grid for everyone
Rossi doesn't feature = Wild conspiracy theories abound about how Rossi is ruining everything.
.... me, it's tedious!
Just for some perspective, for someone relatively ambiguous about VR, all the anti-Rossi ........ that gets posted is as droll/uninteresting as any fanboy contributions and it honestly does this forum a massive disservice, as somewhere, buried in the mass of detritous, are some insightful and informed discussions.
It would be a great thing indeed if these were to feature as the main course and the .... throwing/.... sucking were relegated to the aperitif
I've not been posting over the last couple of months as real life has been hectic (changing jobs amongst some other things) and my interweb access has been mainly mobile phone based, but it's good to see things haven't changed.
The usual fare seems to prevail;
Rossi does alright = He's sabotaged the bike for everyone else (including the tyres)
Rossi does bad = He's ruined the best bike on the grid for everyone
Rossi doesn't feature = Wild conspiracy theories abound about how Rossi is ruining everything.
.... me, it's tedious!
Just for some perspective, for someone relatively ambiguous about VR, all the anti-Rossi ........ that gets posted is as droll/uninteresting as any fanboy contributions and it honestly does this forum a massive disservice, as somewhere, buried in the mass of detritous, are some insightful and informed discussions.
It would be a great thing indeed if these were to feature as the main course and the .... throwing/.... sucking were relegated to the aperitif
Started by a Rossi fan complaining about MM’s dangerous riding.
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