Joined Oct 2011
307 Posts | 47+
Up ..... Creek
Joined May 2009
6K Posts | 4K+
Shovel's Club
It would have been nice to see what Colins lap times would have looked like if he wasnt injured.
Yes, most of the bikes on track this week are in the very early stages, with very little or no track time. So they aren't used to working with the tyres and setups, when you add that to riders who have very little experience of world level riding it's hardly a surprise they are turning the laptimes they are. With a decent rider i think they'll be quicker than a wsbk within half a season if not sooner
Joined Feb 2007
11K Posts | 2K+
Tennessee
Final Test Times
1. Dani Pedrosa ESP Repsol Honda 1m 31.807s (45 laps)
2. Casey Stoner AUS Repsol Honda 1m 31.968s (33)
3. Ben Spies USA Yamaha Factory 1m 32.338s (75)
4. Cal Crutchlow GBR Monster Yamaha Tech 3 1m 32.550s (67)
5. Andrea Dovizioso ITA Monster Yamaha Tech 3 1m 33.256s (69)
6. Valentino Rossi ITA Ducati Marlboro 1m 33.332s (62)
7. Karel Abraham CZE Cardion AB Motoracing 1m 33.433s (72)
8. Hector Barbera ESP Pramac Racing 1m 33.648s (41)
9. Alvaro Bautista ESP San Carlo Honda Gresini (800cc) 1m 33.814s (55)
10. Stefan Bradl GER LCR Honda (800cc) 1m 34.142s (61)
11. Kousuke Akiyoshi JPN Repsol Honda 1m 34.546s (32)
12. Franco Battaini ITA Ducati Marlboro 1m 34.840s (74)
13. Carmelo Morales ESP Team Laglisse Suter-BMW (CRT) 1m 35.911s (67)
14. Ivan Silva ESP BQR Inmotec (CRT) 1m 36.695s (52)
15. Yonny Hernandez COL BQR FTR Kawasaki (CRT) 1m 37.279s (30)
16. Federico Sandi ITA Grillini Team Gapam (CRT) 1m 38.680s (26)
With Spies being within a 1/2 second, its assumable that Lorenzo would be right in the mix with the Honda's at the top of the sheet. Hopefully now, everyone can be a little more objective instead of moaning about Honda being on another planet, next year is going to be boring, Honda is evil etc etc . If Honda is dominant next year, it will be for the same reason they were dominant this year, the rider. I see 2012 coming down to the 2 best riders in the sport CS and JL, and if you believe what Spies says, it will not be decided for lack of power.
1. Dani Pedrosa ESP Repsol Honda 1m 31.807s (45 laps)
2. Casey Stoner AUS Repsol Honda 1m 31.968s (33)
3. Ben Spies USA Yamaha Factory 1m 32.338s (75)
4. Cal Crutchlow GBR Monster Yamaha Tech 3 1m 32.550s (67)
5. Andrea Dovizioso ITA Monster Yamaha Tech 3 1m 33.256s (69)
6. Valentino Rossi ITA Ducati Marlboro 1m 33.332s (62)
7. Karel Abraham CZE Cardion AB Motoracing 1m 33.433s (72)
8. Hector Barbera ESP Pramac Racing 1m 33.648s (41)
9. Alvaro Bautista ESP San Carlo Honda Gresini (800cc) 1m 33.814s (55)
10. Stefan Bradl GER LCR Honda (800cc) 1m 34.142s (61)
11. Kousuke Akiyoshi JPN Repsol Honda 1m 34.546s (32)
12. Franco Battaini ITA Ducati Marlboro 1m 34.840s (74)
13. Carmelo Morales ESP Team Laglisse Suter-BMW (CRT) 1m 35.911s (67)
14. Ivan Silva ESP BQR Inmotec (CRT) 1m 36.695s (52)
15. Yonny Hernandez COL BQR FTR Kawasaki (CRT) 1m 37.279s (30)
16. Federico Sandi ITA Grillini Team Gapam (CRT) 1m 38.680s (26)
With Spies being within a 1/2 second, its assumable that Lorenzo would be right in the mix with the Honda's at the top of the sheet. Hopefully now, everyone can be a little more objective instead of moaning about Honda being on another planet, next year is going to be boring, Honda is evil etc etc . If Honda is dominant next year, it will be for the same reason they were dominant this year, the rider. I see 2012 coming down to the 2 best riders in the sport CS and JL, and if you believe what Spies says, it will not be decided for lack of power.
Joined Oct 2006
25K Posts | 4K+
Your Mom's House
Take a look again buddy, all of them listed above in my post are on an 800. Apple to Apples.
Carmelo Morales on the Suter BMW improving by 3 seconds over the two days... Still slow as .... but it's a decent learning curve by anyone's standards!
Four seconds. Not to shabby all things considered. No offense to Morales, but a top rider might be able to shave another second off of his time.
If the CRT bikes are competitive by the start of 2012, I will be over the moon. The MSMA will be forced to put more fuel in the tank, and MotoGP will be saved.
I think the Valencia test has answered a nagging question:
1. Was Yamaha's lower rev ceiling a result of the reliability rules or the fuel rules? Looks like reliability may have been a problem. Reliability is not much of a limitation in testing, and Spies has taken a big chunk out the qualifying gap from Saturday.
We will still have to wait for the answer to other nagging questions:
1. Does Yamaha have the fuel efficiency to hang with Honda?
2. Will eliminating the 19,000rpm rev limit help Honda? or is 240hp the most you can get from 21L over race distance?
Probably won't find out until Qatar.
1. Was Yamaha's lower rev ceiling a result of the reliability rules or the fuel rules? Looks like reliability may have been a problem. Reliability is not much of a limitation in testing, and Spies has taken a big chunk out the qualifying gap from Saturday.
We will still have to wait for the answer to other nagging questions:
1. Does Yamaha have the fuel efficiency to hang with Honda?
2. Will eliminating the 19,000rpm rev limit help Honda? or is 240hp the most you can get from 21L over race distance?
Probably won't find out until Qatar.
In our Valencia coverage Toby Moody said that Casey was only on engine number 5 at the final round!
Joined Apr 2011
1K Posts | 87+
Pangea
I think some of that is down to Stoners ability to get up to warp speed in 2 or 3 laps, determine if the bike requires setup changes then come in and tweak while the other riders continue circulating and adding kilometers. He also didnt damage any of his engines through crashes unlike J-Lo and some of the others.
Having said that Honda do seem to have the best engine power / reliability / fuel economy performance ratio of all the bikes on the grid.
So they should if we are to believe they have a budget of $400 million a year to spend on their effort... a figure quoted as gospel by Talpa so it must be true
Joined Feb 2007
11K Posts | 2K+
Tennessee
I think some of that is down to Stoners ability to get up to warp speed in 2 or 3 laps, determine if the bike requires setup changes then come in and tweak while the other riders continue circulating and adding kilometers. He also didnt damage any of his engines through crashes unlike J-Lo and some of the others.
Having said that Honda do seem to have the best engine power / reliability / fuel economy performance ratio of all the bikes on the grid.
So they should if we are to believe they have a budget of $400 million a year to spend on their effort... a figure quoted as gospel by Talpa so it must be true
A feat of engineering, what prototype racing is supposed to be.
I don't think so. Tom Jojic said that when he was Aoyama's crew chief at Interwetten, Honda supplied them with six engines for the entire season. Six engines were expected to complete all race mileage and all pre/post season testing without any trouble. Word on the street is that the Honda 800s can go across a continent at race speed without a rebuild.
Joined Apr 2011
1K Posts | 87+
Pangea
Which continent? Sorry couldnt help myself hehe
No doubt they are the best engineered motor in the paddock - no arguement there. My point was that Stoner seems to do less laps (I dont have evidence to back this up...just a gut feeling) so therefore reliablity wont be such an issue if you arent running as many laps...
Joined Apr 2011
1K Posts | 87+
Pangea
Casey was quoted as saying he will lose interest and possibly leave the series if they dumb down the formula any more than they have already and make it "like touring cars"....
Spies is also in agreeance with this principle...unfortunately I think it is inevitable that the formula will continue to move down the path of a glorified moto1 spec series....but I hope I am wrong.
However, I do agree that costs need to come down in this financial climate and we need a way to balance the exotic prototype / financial constraints competing interests. Glad I dont have to write the rules - its a tough job, but If I did I would reintroduce 500 strokers and the tire wars
Fuel economy is an integral part of prototype sprint racing? If I didn't know any better, I'd think you were part of Green Peace or ELF or something.
Casey was quoted as saying he will lose interest and possibly leave the series if they dumb down the formula any more than they have already and make it "like touring cars"....
Spies is also in agreeance with this principle...unfortunately I think it is inevitable that the formula will continue to move down the path of a glorified moto1 spec series....but I hope I am wrong.
However, I do agree that costs need to come down in this financial climate and we need a way to balance the exotic prototype / financial constraints competing interests. Glad I dont have to write the rules - its a tough job, but If I did I would reintroduce 500 strokers and the tire warsCouldnt be any worse than the 800cc formula.
Well, I suppose Casey's 3-laps-the-pit strategy must have some impact, but a regular practice/qualifying routine would probably generate similar results.
Going by the info given. (Stoner only on his 5th engine) Must be the fuel limit causing the 240hp limit.
And doesnt Yamaha use a more sophisticated engine braking system where by some fuel is used to control entry into the corner ? I wouldnt quote me on that but that's you hear from Eurosports Neil Spalding.
They're all doing it now, it's to prevent engine braking. When you down shift the revs go up and cause the rear wheel to slow down(engine braking),the ecu is tracking wheel speeds and adds in a little throttle to help keep the rear wheel spinning at the same rate as the front wheel while not giving it so much throttle that it wants to accelerate. Honda is no doubt doing the same as Yamaha as they poached a few Yamaha electronics technicians last year when they made the switch to the magneti electronics.
This same technology has found it's way onto the 1199 Ducati.
