Stoner Retiring!

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Zootalaws said:

You do?



I bet Rossi wishes Ducati had it so wrong. Sorry, I can't agree. Stoner has some chatter. Pedrosa doesn't seem to have a problem with chatter, so that would indicate a setup issue getting to grips with the new tyres.



I think they do have an incompatibility with the new tyres, but to say 'they have got the design completely wrong' is, IMO, wrong.

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Don't ....... question my comment and then come out with such crap.



Pedrosa doesn't have a problem with chatter? Better tell Pedrosa that. The head of HRC have said they have miscalculated with their chassis and it is made worse by the increased weight and the new tyres, Stoner has said the same and so has Pedrosa.



Do some research, muppet.

chopperman said:

The yam has had some front tyre issues though. Remember lorenzo in parc ferme checking out stoners front. Jerez i think i was?

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Tru dat. Can't say that any one bike is 100% copascetic with every tire at at every track. I suspect Lorenzo might have got a less than perfect tire at that particular race. The guy is so smooth and he knows it - so he was doubtless mystified at his tire being so chewed up.

Zootalaws said:

You do?



I bet Rossi wishes Ducati had it so wrong. Sorry, I can't agree. Stoner has some chatter. Pedrosa doesn't seem to have a problem with chatter, so that would indicate a setup issue getting to grips with the new tyres.



I think they do have an incompatibility with the new tyres, but to say 'they have got the design completely wrong' is, IMO, wrong.

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Sorry Zoot but Pedrosa and his side of the garage have been complaining aboyt chatter for as long as has Stoner's side of the garage.



Both have said that in initial tests (prior to the weight limit change) there was chatter but it was minor by comparison to the level of chatter that appeared after the weight increase and the new tyre constructions. To say Pedrosa has not complained is simply incorrect, but it is fai to have missed it easily as Pedrosa has not been getting the press as much regarding his woes, but he has mentioned it in interviews, so it is present and does exist.



The simple view is that the Honda's are suffering some extreme chatter (Spies at Qatar notwithstanding) that is the worst of the factory teams in the paddock (some of the CRT's have chatter that matches apparently

Mental Anarchist said:

Don't ....... question my comment

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Is it that time of the month, dear?

Gaz said:

Sorry Zoot but Pedrosa and his side of the garage have been complaining aboyt chatter for as long as has Stoner's side of the garage.



Both have said that in initial tests (prior to the weight limit change) there was chatter but it was minor by comparison to the level of chatter that appeared after the weight increase and the new tyre constructions. To say Pedrosa has not complained is simply incorrect, but it is fai to have missed it easily as Pedrosa has not been getting the press as much regarding his woes, but he has mentioned it in interviews, so it is present and does exist.



The simple view is that the Honda's are suffering some extreme chatter (Spies at Qatar notwithstanding) that is the worst of the factory teams in the paddock (some of the CRT's have chatter that matches apparently

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Thanks Gaz. I hadn't seen any comments from Pedrosa - drowned in the Stoner drama, no doubt.

Zootalaws said:

Mental Anarchist' timestamp='1337681752' post='316849 said:

I think it is safe to say that in general Honda have a chassis issue and that they have got the design completely wrong.

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You do?



I bet Rossi wishes Ducati had it so wrong.

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Zoo, Pedro has complained of some chatter. But lets put this in a bit of perspective shall we, as Mental says they have their design all wrong. The question is just how "wrong" is this chassis design? Well, both Casey and Pedro have been 2/3 of all podium positions, with Casey winning two races going into La Mans. So their chassis "problem" I guess its about as bad as Warren Buffet's tax "problem". Except for this weekend (Pedro not having the same wet weather credentials as Sroner) I completely expect HRC riders to be occupying podium positions the rest of the season (so that should give us all an idea of just how 'bad Honda's' chassis and tire 'woes' are creating 'havoc'. Lets just say, their problem isn't going to SINK the HRC SHIP.



13588ucati problems.png]

Ducati's problems compared to Yamaha and Honda.

Jumkie said:

Zoo, Pedro has complained of some chatter. But lets put this in a bit of perspective shall we, as Mental says they have their design all wrong. The question is just how "wrong" is this chassis design? Well, both Casey and Pedro have been 2/3 of all podium positions, with Casey winning two races going into La Mans. So their chassis "problem" I guess its about as bad as Warren Buffet's tax "problem". Except for this weekend (Pedro not having the same wet weather credentials as Sroner) I completely expect HRC riders to be occupying podium positions the rest of the season (so that should give us all an idea of just how 'bad Honda's' chassis and tire 'woes' are creating 'havoc'. Lets just say, their problem isn't going to SINK the HRC SHIP.



13588ucati problems.png]

Ducati's problems compared to Yamaha and Honda.

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Yup, agree.

Speaking of RETIRING, poor Kropo is getting a shellacking on his site. ....... poor guy caught in the middle of a Stoner vs Rossi .... storm that has been festering for several years. Man, what a rivalry this has turned into--claiming the careers and lives of champions and journalist and many spectators. This Stoner vs Rossi thing has got totally out of ....... control, it sucks. (I'm being serious).

I agree. Read that .... and feel for him. Makes me laugh when some of them say they are stating facts and then dribbling opinions based on fantasy. At least here people mostly discuss opinion and state it as such.

Jumkie said:

Speaking of RETIRING, poor Kropo is getting a shellacking on his site.

....... poor guy caught in the middle of a Stoner vs Rossi .... storm that has been festering for several years. Man, what a rivalry this has turned into--claiming the careers and lives of champions and journalist and many spectators. This Stoner vs Rossi thing has got totally out of ....... control, it sucks. (I'm being serious).

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Agreed

Mental Anarchist said:

I suspect they over shot the set up designed to get heat in the rear after morning warm up where the problem surfaced.



I think it is safe to say that in general Honda have a chassis issue and that they have got the design completely wrong. It is worrying for Yamaha that Honda are still so competitive with a chassis that is giving some major problems. I wouldn't be surprised to see Stoner and Pedrosa doing some private testing of a new chassis soon.

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LMFAO!!!

Mental Anarchist said:

Don't ....... question my comment and then come out with such crap.



Pedrosa doesn't have a problem with chatter? Better tell Pedrosa that. The head of HRC have said they have miscalculated with their chassis and it is made worse by the increased weight and the new tyres, Stoner has said the same and so has Pedrosa.



Do some research, muppet.

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You must also be a muppet, because Yam are also having chassis problems and Forcada was upset because of the cancelled testing where they were going to be doing a massive amount of testing to get the chassis on point. Yam/Jlo just don't complain and sook about things as much as Honda/Casey.

Jumkie said:

Speaking of RETIRING, poor Kropo is getting a shellacking on his site.

....... poor guy caught in the middle of a Stoner vs Rossi .... storm that has been festering for several years. Man, what a rivalry this has turned into--claiming the careers and lives of champions and journalist and many spectators. This Stoner vs Rossi thing has got totally out of ....... control, it sucks. (I'm being serious).

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.... him

That guy JohnnyKnockwurst was vehemently defending him and all he did was delete his posts

He's on his own

Jumkie said:

Speaking of RETIRING, poor Kropo is getting a shellacking on his site.

....... poor guy caught in the middle of a Stoner vs Rossi .... storm that has been festering for several years. Man, what a rivalry this has turned into--claiming the careers and lives of champions and journalist and many spectators. This Stoner vs Rossi thing has got totally out of ....... control, it sucks. (I'm being serious).

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Yes its not good over there at MM.......but its certainly what I expected as soon as Rossi started to become more competitive, and get a result like at Le Mans, Kropo has spent a lot of time trying to get his band of albeit 'more disguised' boners to settle down their sometimes outrageous and consistent negative views on Rossi, whilst claiming fact, and both sides are pulling apart Kropos articles........!!! rather a high and mighty bunch, its ok to disagree-but whats going on is over the top IMO



The backlash will be harsh, and for some time to come unfortunately if Rossi continues to find his way up front-Boners have been sprouting a lot of .... now for over 18 months and behaving in a similar way and worse than the fans they detest-textbook hypocrites......and funnily enough, just as Stoner did to his detractors-me included , Rossi once again proved them all to be foolish on the weekend, these two riders certainly share a sort of weird dimensional parallel path......I for one will not be jumping into the boner backlash........I think we've all seen and had enough of this and I certainly do not want to contribute to it anymore, there is much more to discuss at present anyway.....and Stoners boys have had a tough few days......





For whats its worth Krop........you've always been extremely generous with us here at PS and I'm sure the majority of us really appreciate and are quite honored that you share your views here (I suspect you enjoy posting over here due to the nature of this place) as well as running the most informed site on the net IMO.

Talpa said:

Yes its not good over there at MM.......but its certainly what I expected as soon as Rossi started to become more competitive, and get a result like at Le Mans, Kropo has spent a lot of time trying to get his band of albeit 'more disguised' boners to settle down their sometimes outrageous and consistent negative views on Rossi, whilst claiming fact, and both sides are pulling apart Kropos articles........!!! rather a high and mighty bunch, its ok to disagree-but whats going on is over the top IMO



The backlash will be harsh, and for some time to come unfortunately if Rossi continues to find his way up front-Boners have been sprouting a lot of .... now for over 18 months and behaving in a similar way and worse than the fans they detest-textbook hypocrites......and funnily enough, just as Stoner did to his detractors-me included

, Rossi once again proved them all to be foolish on the weekend, these two riders certainly share a sort of weird dimensional parallel path......I for one will not be jumping into the boner backlash........I think we've all seen and had enough of this and I certainly do not want to contribute to it anymore, there is much more to discuss at present anyway.....and Stoners boys have had a tough few days......

For whats its worth Krop........you've always been extremely generous with us here at PS and I'm sure the majority of us really appreciate and are quite honored that you share your views here (I suspect you enjoy posting over here due to the nature of this place) as well as running the most informed site on the net IMO.

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I said this last year at the time of the jerez incident, that david emmett was in a no win situation; I think I called him "poor decent david emmett" at the time, before he had posted much on here. I don't retract the decent part, but I am sure he can look after himself now. Basically I see his problem as that he is trying to moderate in a rational fashion, and I think the only real world solutions are either essentially not to moderate, or not to have a forum.



Passions are so high on this matter that the only way it was ever going to resolve was with the retirement of one or both which is happening. Not that I have much problem with most of your recent posts, but the problem is that when you think from your own perspective you are being entirely reasonable and pointing out the obvious truth this is not how it is perceived by the other side of the debate, and I know this applies both ways including to me. For instance in the recent debate about stoner's retirement the suggestion that he was betraying the working class by giving up further millions (if the proponents of this argument were serious) is ludicrous to most if not all people who don't dislike stoner.



Apart from some aspects of the debate about stoner's retirement the last few days have not been bad for this stoner fan. I will put myself squarely with barry on this one, stoner has already done enough to make me happy, and my concern during the le mans race was much more for him crashing rather than not winning. I don't think anyone thinks that jorge and valentino didn't deserve to beat casey having been better on the day, and like last year if his worst result when he doesn't quite get it together is a third then that is not too bad, as he himself said. I take roger's point on this, that intermediate conditions are a problem for stoner with the current tyres, and if lorenzo and rossi can out-ride him in such conditions I will just have to hope they are not frequent.

Its a little ironic that Stoner in particular appeared to go out of his way to congratulate Rossi and shake hands with the Ducati guys, meanwhile fans still cant get over it. I dont remember 500cc being this way. There were bitter rivals on track but there were no fan 'sections' all dressed up alike in groups like a football or soccer match.



Its also ironic that Krop has to moderate his site, while at the same time recognise that fans are his employer just the same as Stoner and co, which implies he also needs to embrace them just the same whether good or bad even when they boo and spit at him over the net. If the criticism and current state of affairs bothers both jounos and fans to the point of exasperation what must it have been like for the retiring whinging prick stuck in the middle of it. It might be a relief for us all when it finally comes to an end in 2013. Im actually looking forward to it.

I'll have to go check out krop's site, when the civilized get uncivilized lmao. It's funny when those guys come here and post in the style that we post, cursing, insults, and general .........gery but the second things get a little heated over there the forum police put people in check.

On a sad note the inventor of the TV remote has died today, RIP Eugene Polley a man who truly changed the world

birdman said:

Its a little ironic that Stoner in particular appeared to go out of his way to congratulate Rossi and shake hands with the Ducati guys, meanwhile fans still cant get over it. I dont remember 500cc being this way. There were bitter rivals on track but there were no fan 'sections' all dressed up alike in groups like a football or soccer match.



Its also ironic that Krop has to moderate his site, while at the same time recognise that fans are his employer just the same as Stoner and co, which implies he also needs to embrace them just the same whether good or bad even when they boo and spit at him over the net. If the criticism and current state of affairs bothers both jounos and fans to the point of exasperation what must it have been like for the retiring whinging prick stuck in the middle of it. It might be a relief for us all when it finally comes to an end in 2013. Im actually looking forward to it.

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It is the internet age. I heard exactly this discussion on an american sports program(me) yesterday concerning why le bron james the basketballer is hated by many, and they posited that it was similarly due to reinforcement by feedback from the internet, forums etc and interaction of this with journalists.

birdman said:

Its a little ironic that Stoner in particular appeared to go out of his way to congratulate Rossi and shake hands with the Ducati guys, meanwhile fans still cant get over it. I dont remember 500cc being this way. There were bitter rivals on track but there were no fan 'sections' all dressed up alike in groups like a football or soccer match.



Its also ironic that Krop has to moderate his site, while at the same time recognise that fans are his employer just the same as Stoner and co, which implies he also needs to embrace them just the same whether good or bad even when they boo and spit at him over the net. If the criticism and current state of affairs bothers both jounos and fans to the point of exasperation what must it have been like for the retiring whinging prick stuck in the middle of it. It might be a relief for us all when it finally comes to an end in 2013. Im actually looking forward to it.

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Watch footage of Mugello 2000 and 2001 - Rossi fans gathered at Poggio Seccco and the sea of red Max fans at Casanova Savelli.