Nothing wrong with the pass imo, Vale did fantastic yesterday. He was up for the battle with Stoner and he had a move put on him. Did anyone see the replay of the pass and then it showed the reaction in the duc garage ...........Stoners guys were whooping it up but Mrs Stoner just sat there looking well pissed off.
Sachsenring GP Race Discussion
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I'm almost starting to like Pedrosa. Last time out was with out doubt his best recovery ever as he sliced through the field as if he were Rossi, and now this. Hard and aggressive battle with Lorenzo
Rossi had a fantastic race considering and it was good to see him more or less on pace with the rest of the aliens.
Stoner were... strange. Almost waiting for Rossi loosing .7 a lap and then hanging in there. I bet it's not all praise at Ducati for that performance. No doubt they will question his motivation from here on.
But as EVERYONE of the forum agreed on, the final move was hard but fair. All the more strange that the two CLOWNS on the forum has not only lost their ability for logic reasoning but they clearly lost their ability to read.
I agree about pedrosa.
I also more or less agree about casey, who has not to my mind been riding with the edge he has previously displayed on the ducati. I think it is partly because he lost the confidence he had in previous iterations of the ducati after putting the bike down in the first 2 races, which I am sure he was being honest in saying was for reasons he didn't understand, and hence has not been pushing the limits as much as has previously been his wont. But as rossi truly observed he is emotional, and may very well be pissed with ducati approaching first lorenzo and then rossi to replace him after he has given them their only world championship, and also with them developing the gp10 at least initially in a direction which was not his preference; if this is another reason for not pushing to the limit it is less admirable if perhaps understandable. Loose cannon or not though, he has not made any criticism of ducati whilst contracted to them as has also been his policy with previous employers. I still think that what he did with the gp07 has been underestimated, as extracting the capability which the bike had did not involve much in the way of pussyfooting.
I don't think he could have touched dani in this race however motivated he was; dani did multiple laps at stoner's last lap pace or better including much earlier in the race with a heavier fuel load, and the red flag probably didn't help either as casey seems to have been careful about warming up his tyres this season since his earlier vicissitudes.
You guys should be happy that valentino is engaging in mind games/ a little by play after the race as is his usual wont; he must be feeling that he is already close to being back on top of his game.
Can't say I remember that. Sure you don't mean '06 or '07 and Turkey?
Surly not '09 where he passed Lorenzo on the last corner?
In '08 he had a similar fight with stoner while Pedrosa walked away, wasn't it.
In fact, I have a hard time to remember Elias fighting Rossi any time after '06.
I'd say any moves that result in contact is obviously a hard/aggressive move. YMMV
But I also expect any GP racer to do nothing less on the last turn on the last lap.
Poor casey, His antics really are the joke of the paddock.
That isn't true. I've never heard anything to suggest Casey gets anything other than respect in the motogp paddock.
Anyway, good race! It was a shame about the red flag and of course RDP's injury, such a bad weekend for him. But up at the front things were great. Pedrosa did very well and won the race convincingly, and i think he needed to, while Lorenzo did enough to secure 2nd but didn't take risks he didn't need to at the front.
Battle for 3rd was very entertaining, i think Casey did well to raise his pace so much and fight for a position he wasn't really quick enough to be in, that is admirable. But obviously Rossi deserves admiration for the speed of his recovery!! He's been lapping all weekend and didn't appear to get too tired, he can walk okay and all in all doesn't look too hurt at all. I agree with Casey and think that Rossi's ride was less heroic than we've seen from the other 3 aliens and one or two others on the grid, but to get to a decent level of fitness so quickly is impressive so Rossi and his doctors deserve some credit. Mind you he still looked a little rusty but i'm sure that'll be gone after the summer.
Joined Oct 2007
4K Posts | 744+
Tuscany, Italy
True. But Rossi never brought up his physical condition when commenting Stoner's last-corner pass, on the contrary he stated that Stoner had won the duel, period. So Stoner's comment playing Rossi's physical difficulties down sounds a bit like an uncalled for excuse. Of course there are many who think that a Rossi in good shape and 100% fit would have found that extra bit of speed to win that one. But you do not silence those doubts by offering an amateurish diagnosis of Rossi's medical situation -- you can silence them only by beating Rossi again next Sunday at Laguna.
Joined Mar 2007
2K Posts | 0+
Alpha Setti 5
What a great run fron Rossi, I didn't really think he'd run better then mid pack, let alone mix it up with another rider!
Joined Aug 2007
11K Posts | 3K+
Pomona NY
I'm almost starting to like Pedrosa. Last time out was with out doubt his best recovery ever as he sliced through the field as if he were Rossi, and now this. Hard and aggressive battle with Lorenzo
Rossi had a fantastic race considering and it was good to see him more or less on pace with the rest of the aliens.
Stoner were... strange. Almost waiting for Rossi loosing .7 a lap and then hanging in there. I bet it's not all praise at Ducati for that performance. No doubt they will question his motivation from here on.
But as EVERYONE of the forum agreed on, the final move was hard but fair. All the more strange that the two CLOWNS on the forum has not only lost their ability for logic reasoning but they clearly lost their ability to read.
I dunno. Mayhaps I'm simple-minded but seems to me - Stoner's strategy was likely about being conservative,
not wanting to throw it away at the tail end of the race, desperate to get a podium, waiting for Rossi to be at
his most exhausted state - in order that he could pass him as late as possible with as little chance of Rossi
re-passing with one of his patented last second improvisations. Surely - it would have been a hard pill to swallow
if Rossi operating at 90% capacity, had beaten him after coming from a fair ways back. I think it was
a good strategy for him in as much as the Yamahas have thus far seemed to have more top end and better handling
out of the corners this year.
BTW... only two clowns?
Stoners analysis of Rossi's medical situation is far more qualified than anyone on here because a) He's seen Rossi in action up close and
Joined Aug 2007
11K Posts | 3K+
Pomona NY
I'm surprised no-one has commented on Rossi's reply of "No comment" to the interviewer when asked what he thought
of Lorenzo wearing a #46 t-shirt on the podium following the crash. My first thought was, how ungracious. But then,
I reckon, it's just a mind-game way of pissing off Lorenzo to make him feel like a chump after making what seemed
like a genuinely heart felt gesture. Then again, maybe he's just so filled with resentment at Lorenzo's ascendance
that he's incapable of being magnanimous.
True. But Rossi never brought up his physical condition when commenting Stoner's last-corner pass, on the contrary he stated that Stoner had won the duel, period. So Stoner's comment playing Rossi's physical difficulties down sounds a bit like an uncalled for excuse. Of course there are many who think that a Rossi in good shape and 100% fit would have found that extra bit of speed to win that one. But you do not silence those doubts by offering an amateurish diagnosis of Rossi's medical situation -- you can silence them only by beating Rossi again next Sunday at Laguna.
Cmon j4rno, i don't often disagree with you, valentino made a jibe about casey, saying he would have cried if he (valentino) had made a similar move, stoner replied in kind, less gracefully probably mainly because he is possessed of less grace. If that makes me a clown, so be it.
Valentino deliberately made the comment to provoke such a response, so basically he wins the mind-game again, but it was hardly an inoccent comment and as I said previously shows he is already close to being back to normal. As for the accuracy of his medical diagnosis, from this distance it appears fairly accurate, somewhat miraculously and to the credit of both rossi and the people who treated him, but accurate nonetheless.
Joined Aug 2007
11K Posts | 3K+
Pomona NY
True. But Rossi never brought up his physical condition when commenting Stoner's last-corner pass, on the contrary he stated that Stoner had won the duel, period. So Stoner's comment playing Rossi's physical difficulties down sounds a bit like an uncalled for excuse. Of course there are many who think that a Rossi in good shape and 100% fit would have found that extra bit of speed to win that one. But you do not silence those doubts by offering an amateurish diagnosis of Rossi's medical situation -- you can silence them only by beating Rossi again next Sunday at Laguna.
Agree ++. I'm a Stoner supporter, and even I think that comment was pretty punk.
Below are the four fastest laps in the race. Rossi having the 2nd fastest lap is impressive and bodes well for Laguna Seca. That could be a very good race!
Dani PEDROSA 1'21.882
Valentino ROSSI 1'22.035
Jorge LORENZO 1'22.099
Casey STONER 1'22.135
Dani PEDROSA 1'21.882
Valentino ROSSI 1'22.035
Jorge LORENZO 1'22.099
Casey STONER 1'22.135
Joined Oct 2007
4K Posts | 744+
Tuscany, Italy
The fact remains, that Rossi did not mention his own physical condition as a handicap. So there was no reason to bring that up, only to dismiss it. Rossi now could easily say -- very well, since it's a piece of cake now you break your leg in the same way, exposed and all, and in six weeks we race a nice duel again...!
The fact remains, that Rossi did not mention his own physical condition as a handicap. So there was no reason to bring that up, only to dismiss it. Rossi now could easily say -- very well, since it's a piece of cake now you break your leg in the same way, exposed and all, and in six weeks we race a nice duel again...!Stoner's problem is that he's so good on the track, but much less outside it.
I am not contending it was a smart or gracious thing for him to say. He is a hot-head and easily provoked. He did say something similar about lorenzo in similar circumstances also.
Valentino deserves nothing but praise for his performance, and as I think he implied if he had felt confident from the start he could have finished further forward. I still believe he made the jibe regarding stoner due to not wanting stoner to get any satisfaction or psychological boost at all from his pass, little though that may have been given rossi's circumstances, which proves to me as I said that valentino is back in town and intending to stay there for a while, and just quietly that he still sees some threat from stoner in future and wants to keep him subjugated. Stoner in the motogp.com post race interview prior to all this seemed a little concerned that he had touched valentino in the pass. I also agree with a comment someone made elsewhere that stoner tried so hard on the last lap at least partly from sheer embarassment at the thought of being beaten by a man with a broken leg.
Well, motivation and confidence seems to be extremely important when riding a Ducati so I wouldn't rule out another result with better motivation and confidence.
Indeed we are
Not even the trolls can keep us from that.
Joined Jun 2007
10K Posts | 1K+
Norah Head
WOW Rossi gets passed again and the sooking is still going. Sure it was a pass calculated to get Stoner the momentum he needed to hit the straight first, as the big bang Duc. is never going to beat the Yam in a straight line drag, I think the pure class of the move and how Rossi was "duped" into it is whats pissed Rossi and the Boppers. Twas a beautiful well orchestrated move that began a few corners back by allowing a gap to build then catching up with momentum so that when Rossi turned his head to look where Stoner was it was toolate he was comigand even the Yam could not catch him.
But basically ............ he got passed Boppers ........ get over it
Its only riders like Stoner that come back after a long illness and podium, obviously Rossi came close but not close enough.
Roll on next round
But basically ............ he got passed Boppers ........ get over it
Its only riders like Stoner that come back after a long illness and podium, obviously Rossi came close but not close enough.
Roll on next round
But as EVERYONE of the forum agreed on, the final move was hard but fair. All the more strange that the two CLOWNS on the forum has not only lost their ability for logic reasoning but they clearly lost their ability to read.
This is also a mystery to me. Ive read this entire thread and cant see anybody moaning about the last corner pass. Everybody seems to share the opinion it was a hard but fair pass. Holding someone out wide is a move Rossi has used in the past (gibbers jerez 05) so he is not moaning either. In fact i took is gesture over the line as mocking gibbers as it was a carbon copy move, but then the press say it was a piss take to stoner. Who knows ? thing is no one in this thread has accused stoner of dirty racing, only that if the same mover were used on him he would have whined like he did at Guna 08
I think one thing that has become obvious in this thread is who cannot be bothered to read the whole thread and just assume what was said by reading comment's made by member's who were just trying to get a rise out of others. Note the ones who accuse have not quoted anybody !!
Has anyone actually objected to Stoner's move? I see no argument against it being a good move, and i think Stoner can be glad to have clearly raised his pace to enter and then win a battle. It should silence many critics of his, but Rossi was pretty clever with his post race comments because now we are all guessing how it would be if positions were reversed rather than talking about the fact that Rossi got beat in a straight up battle to a slower rider.
Joined Jun 2007
10K Posts | 1K+
Norah Head
This is also a mystery to me. Ive read this entire thread and cant see anybody moaning about the last corner pass. Everybody seems to share the opinion it was a hard but fair pass. Holding someone out wide is a move Rossi has used in the past (gibbers jerez 05) so he is not moaning either. In fact i took is gesture over the line as mocking gibbers as it was a carbon copy move, but then the press say it was a piss take to stoner. Who knows ? thing is no one in this thread has accused stoner of dirty racing, only that if the same mover were used on him he would have whined like he did at Guna 08
I think one thing that has become obvious in this thread is who cannot be bothered to read the whole thread and just assume what was said by reading comment's made by member's who were just trying to get a rise out of others. Note the ones who accuse have not quoted anybody !!
Then why are you all sooking at Stoner again, especially since Lorenzo is making both Stoner and Rossi look a bit "so so".
Stoners analysis of Rossi's medical situation is far more qualified than anyone on here because a) He's seen Rossi in action up close andHe understands well what its like to ride with injuries. So he is in a better position than most to judge how much the leg is affecting Vale's performance (which wasn't at all far from his usual place at the end of the day).
Well, we know you haven't raced with broken bones but I have and I'm sure others here have. Although my 4 fractures in the foot was nothing compared to Rossi's fracture I was out on track after 3 weeks so believe it or not but there are a few here that do understand what's it like to race with injuries.
Besides, looking at Rossi is something we probably do a lot better in the arm chair rather on the bike behind. I'll promise you the view behind there is very limited, especially when you have your own race-bike to worry about.
It's not always the smart thing to transfer your own (lack of) experience onto others as it may not be relevant.
Besides, most racers would agree that the injurie it self is often not the most difficult part to overcome. The psychological part are maybe more important after a serious injure like this.
And stoner are dead wrong when says it not at all remarkable.
This was a first time for Rossi. That will always make for an interesting come back.
He did better than most. Not only racing good but on pace with the aliens. That's where he belong but at the same time I hope nobody here think it's just their normal race pace. As we see from Stoner now with motivation and confidence stumbling it does take a certain dedication even when 100% to keep up that kind of speed.
All that said, as michaelm said this is pay back for Rossi's joke about him whining if the roles were turned, and has nothing to do with "medical analysis" what so ever. Just the clumsy as usual.
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