michaelm
3614441379472827
Bayliss's one-off winning ride, which few would have enjoyed more than I did, imo is evidence in favour of several of your long-term contentions but not for the top WSBK riders being as good as the top motogp riders, at least in recent times, although the reverse probably also applies and not much in the way of conclusions should be drawn from Simoncelli's one-off WSBK ride either.
My point was made to contrast the event Sloth cited, that was pointing to a singular event and then making some general conclusion without a broader analysis; to rebut I did the same to show how shallow and devoid was his supposition. Beyond the top GP riders, say maybe Marquez and Lorenzo ‘at the moment’, I would still contend top Wsbk riders could hold their own among the bulk of GP riders (where we love to repeat the myth that only in GP do the 'top riders in the world" make their home. Kinda of reminds me of when I watch the Daytona race and the commentators call the event "the world center of racing" (I suppose at one time it was). My "long term contentions" assert that there is evidence to indicate GP lower categories are favored for top billeting in the premier class leading many to conclude these are then the ‘absolute best’, however, may I point to Crutchlow--a non-wsbk champ but GP multiple pole setter and podium finisher to make my point?
Sloth_27
3614451379477960
Here's a broader analysis.
Simoncelli was only a 250cc rider at the time, with no four stroke experience. He walked into WSBK and finished on the podium.
Bayliss didn't just rock up for a quick go on the Ducati, he was a long term MotoGP rider and had lots of experience on the 990 bikes, including podiums. The Ducati was also a genuine championship contender that year. He was also a multiple WSBK Champion.
Do you deny Hayden is following Dovi for a tow at every race? Cause it really looks like it on TV.
According to the point you were attempting to make, a top GP rider would mop up the Wsbk regulars. Simonchelli wasn't just some run of the mill 250 rider, he was billed as the next great thing in MotoGP, so his talent was deemed to be worthy of top accolades among the "worlds best riders". That he performed among the top Wsbk riders isn’t that much of a stretch to support my contention that ‘some’ are interchangeable on competitive machines, as Mike pointed out the Aprillia was a top machine. His Wsbk participation was impressive no doubt, keeping in mind he crashed out of race one, nonetheless a podium in the second race on a top competitive machine is worthy of mention. This is why your extrapolated point was easily rebuffed by a similar singular event occurrence when Bayliss mopped up “the world’s best” GP riders on a one-off wildcard. We can debate the weight you or I want to assign to particular details like acute experience in that year's machine, the step-up in classes, 250GP machines vs Wsbk, or Wsbk machines vs works GP990s, Wsbk tires vs 250GP tires vs MotoGP tires, etc., (side note, we can even debate the ‘step-up’ from Moto2 to MotoGP) however, either event we both point to does lend credence to my contention that top riders are top riders and that parity coupled with opportunity accounts for quite the difference.
As to your point about Hayden ‘following around’ getting a “tow” from Dovi ala Barbera, I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you were just trolling, but if in fact this is your viewpoint, then honestly I'm a bit miffed by your perceptions regarding the Ducati riders. Perhaps you should take a look at the last four rounds (I would say ‘review’, but I’m not certain you noticed the first time); at Laguna and Indy Nicky’s passes were so “aggressive” as to be reprimanded by Ducati. Both riders actually made contact in two of these races, in the last two, Silverstone and Misano, both riders exchanged positions leading eachother for a few laps, at Silverstone this resulted in a crash for Dovi. Dovi was interviewed before Misano’s race, and he stated that him and Nicky are basically putting in matching lap times, this is why, he said, “we are always together on the track”. He says it takes an extraordinary risky move to get ahead of eachother because the bike is so unstable and both riders lose time on the turns. Both riders have suffered crashes in races pushing their bikes.
