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Marquez hit Rossi multiple times -

looks like he leaned in to rossi. does it not look that way to you?

you guys should be happy. Marc won. He (probably) cost Rossi the championship. What are you guys so pissed about?
is it that Marc might possibly get booed by 50k+ people every time they show his face on the big screen or is on the podium for the next few years? I wonder if he'll mind? He probably won't.
Marc didn't cost him the championship. Again blaming it on some external factors. If Rossi loses it, it is his own fault. He shouldn't have kicked Marc and nothing would have happened. But Rossi fanboy seem to be blind of Rossi's childish errors. In fact, it is a disgrace Rossi still has a decent option to win the championship. He should have been stripped of those 16 points.

Marquez doesn't care about the spectators. Those booing him are delusional Rossi fanboys. Marquez will just keep on winning. Rossi will be booed in Valencia like never before.
 
MM was not an innocent victim. Everyone needs to keep their facts straight, and that includes the race director. He said:

"Finally, we actually believe there is fault on both sides."

"Despite what Marquez said we think he was deliberately trying to affect the pace of Valentino. However he didn't actually break any rules. Whatever we think about the spirit of the championship, according to the rule book he didn't make contact. His passes were clean. He rode within the rules."

OK so MM was lying about riding his own race, but no contact prior to the incident? Did they not watch the same race as the rest of the world? I saw 3-4 previous hits MM made on VR.

So the rules state you can try and take someone out, but as long as you don't it's OK. If one guy falls it's your fault even if the fallen guy is the aggressor?

Lol. Rossi fanboys are just hilarious. They agree that you can break the rules to win. Unbelievable. :giggle:

In fact, I understand why Rossi fanboys are like that. A normal person would never cheer for such a crook. Rossi is the lowest person that has ever been in MotoGP. He kicks MM from the bike, claims he didn't want him to fall BUT NO APOLOGISE. If you don't apologise it means you wanted it to happen. Even worse, when he met MM just before the talk with the stewards, he called him ".......o". That's how scumbag this guy is. What can you expect from a guy whose father walks in the city with a chicken on a leash.
 
Marc didn't cost him the championship. Again blaming it on some external factors. If Rossi loses it, it is his own fault. He shouldn't have kicked Marc and nothing would have happened. But Rossi fanboy seem to be blind of Rossi's childish errors. In fact, it is a disgrace Rossi still has a decent option to win the championship. He should have been stripped of those 16 points.

Marquez doesn't care about the spectators. Those booing him are delusional Rossi fanboys. Marquez will just keep on winning. Rossi will be booed in Valencia like never before.

el... oh... el...
 
Superficial analysis. In the slow motion, side on video you can clearly see MM's handlebars turn in, in time with the motion of Rossi's leg movement. And at that time you can see that MM is moving backwards relative to Rossi. It looks very much like Rossi kicked him.

I see Marquez accelerating slightly, and leaning in, to the point where his helmet made contact with Rossi's knee. Rather than a kick, it's more likely that the handlebar end, or perhaps even Marquez's elbow, also made contact, hooking on Rossi's lower leg and pulling it away from the bike slightly as Rossi was getting back on the throttle. Rossi's knee didn't move until after it was hit by the helmet.
Why did Marquez choose to lean in and make contact when there were better options available for him? In my opinion he rides a bit like an accident waiting to happen, and especially so in this particular race.
 
I see Marquez accelerating slightly, and leaning in, to the point where his helmet made contact with Rossi's knee. Rather than a kick, it's more likely that the handlebar end, or perhaps even Marquez's elbow, also made contact, hooking on Rossi's lower leg and pulling it away from the bike slightly as Rossi was getting back on the throttle. Rossi's knee didn't move until after it was hit by the helmet.

Why did Marquez choose to lean in and make contact when there were better options available for him? In my opinion he rides a bit like an accident waiting to happen, and especially so in this particular race.


Well, I'm not disputing that MM rode into Rossi, but the alleged kick happened after MM rode into VR's leg... After that they came apart and MM was moving backwards relative to Rossi, at which point Rossi's leg had not begun to move. They were not touching when Rossi's leg started to move and look carefully at the timing of VR's leg movement and the movement of MM's handlebars.

How can an elbow, which is in the middle of an arm, attached at one end to a shoulder and to the throttle hand at the other, "hook" Rossi's leg?? For ....'s sake...

It seems like MM rode into VR's leg to piss him off and to try to get him out of the way. He's always been physically aggressive like that, but the rules are so ridiculously subjective that it's hard to control that... Although he was sanctioned a few times. And it's not clear if it's illegal or not. It was even a subjective application of the rule that they wrote VR up on. The terms in the cited rule are irresponsible and unsafe. Completely subjective.

You can put whatever context around it you like and justify it with all kinds of supposition but for me it's a very important point: was there a kick? The evidence is strongly suggestive in the affirmative. Look at the slow mo and follow my analysis and tell me you can't see it.
 
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How can an elbow, which is in the middle of an arm, attached at one end to a shoulder and to the throttle hand at the other, "hook" Rossi's leg?? For ....'s sake...
Think about where his elbow is in relation to his throttle hand and his helmet, and then consider that the helmet has just hit the side of Rossi's knee. That elbow is going to be right near the front of Rossi's ankle or shin.

You can put whatever context around it you like and justify it with all kinds of supposition but for me it's a very important point: was there a kick? The evidence is strongly suggestive in the affirmative. Look at the slow mo and follow my analysis and tell me you can't see it.
I can't see it, and I've looked at all the angles and slo-mo's that I can find. Sure, Rossi's knee and lower leg come away from the bike slightly, just after the helmet to knee contact, but I sure don't see a kicking motion, and apparently Race Direction didn't either.
 
Well, I'm not disputing that MM rode into Rossi, but the alleged kick happened after MM rode into VR's leg... After that they came apart and MM was moving backwards relative to Rossi, at which point Rossi's leg had not begun to move. They were not touching when Rossi's leg started to move and look carefully at the timing of VR's leg movement and the movement of MM's handlebars.

How can an elbow, which is in the middle of an arm, attached at one end to a shoulder and to the throttle hand at the other, "hook" Rossi's leg?? For ....'s sake...

It seems like MM rode into VR's leg to piss him off and to try to get him out of the way. He's always been physically aggressive like that, but the rules are so ridiculously subjective that it's hard to control that... Although he was sanctioned a few times. And it's not clear if it's illegal or not. It was even a subjective application of the rule that they wrote VR up on. The terms in the cited rule are irresponsible and unsafe. Completely subjective.

You can put whatever context around it you like and justify it with all kinds of supposition but for me it's a very important point: was there a kick? The evidence is strongly suggestive in the affirmative. Look at the slow mo and follow my analysis and tell me you can't see it.

Again, I'm with you on your analysis.
I don't buy any leg hooking as that'd cause MM's handlebars to turn to the left. Impact on them appears to have turned them to the right, tucking MM's front, which was already off line and onto an used, ungrippy (technical term) section of track.
Dirty move, yes.
Of course, this is all disputable, but what is more disputable is intent. If Vale aimed at his handlebars, then he is an complete cowardly prick, who needs some contact counselling. If it was a ".... off and stay away" lash which unfortunately hit MM's right 'bar, then I have a lot more sympathy.
The penalty should have some basis in intent, this is basically unprovable. So we are where we are.
 
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...Of course, this is all disputable, but what is more disputable is intent. If Vale aimed at his handlebars, then he is an complete cowardly prick, who needs some contact counselling. If it was a ".... off and stay away" lash which unfortunately hit MM's right 'bar, then I have a lot more sympathy.

The penalty should have some basis in intent, this is basically unprovable. So we are where we are.


Mate: spot on. All of the supposition about what either guy was thinking or intending is kiddy stuff... You can't nail a guy on what you think he was thinking. It's just an emotional reaction in support of existing prejudices. It's a fan boy circle jerk.

It feels like a natural reaction to lash out like Rossi did to be honest (although you could hardly call it professional), but I'm just interested in keeping it fact based: it looked a hell of a lot like a kick but, as someone else stated, he wasn't looking where he was kicking so you can't infer any intent. But, kicking is unsafe and irresponsible, regardless of intent, and those are the two principles in the (woefully blur) rule that VR was pinged on. So, on that point I guess I would offer a different view and say that the (as you rightly say) unprovable intent is actually not an issue.
 
Think about where his elbow is in relation to his throttle hand and his helmet, and then consider that the helmet has just hit the side of Rossi's knee. That elbow is going to be right near the front of Rossi's ankle or shin.

Sure, if he's riding with his elbows around his ....... ears...



I can't see it, and I've looked at all the angles and slo-mo's that I can find. Sure, Rossi's knee and lower leg come away from the bike slightly, just after the helmet to knee contact, but I sure don't see a kicking motion, and apparently Race Direction didn't either.


You not looking at the same thing as me then...
https://twitter.com/pazz046/status/658206763481739264
 
I think we're in agreement here, CBlue.
If it was a kick, then VR should sit out Valencia.
The fact that careful scrutiny can't definitively say whether it was a kick.....
Nahhh. It was a kick. Dunno if it was aimed at the handlebars.

I reckon a ride through would've been appropriate. .... all the comparisons with Spaan (I was there, btw in the pits, watching ...... monitors). The precedent should be Sic on Pedrosa. And what happened there?
 
Sure, if he's riding with his elbows around his ....... ears...
Let me break this down for you. The right ear is inside the helmet, that side of the helmet contacts Rossi's knee.
In the video, from the link you posted, note the distance and angle from Rossi's knee to the top of his foot/front of his ankle.
Then, since we can't see Marquez's right side, look at his left side and note the distance and angle from the side of his helmet to his elbow. Estimate the possible locations of Marquez's right elbow through the sequence of the video and I think you'll realize that the elbow may have pulled Rossi's leg off the footpeg. Of course it could also be the forearm, the hand or bar end, or even the shoulder.

You not looking at the same thing as me then...
https://twitter.com/pazz046/status/658206763481739264
I sure am, we're just reading the information we see a little differently is all.

See how Marquez moves forward and makes contact, see how Marquez then moves backward, in relationship to Rossi, and Rossi's leg moves with him for a short distance at exactly the same speed.
They hooked up, ever so slightly, and down went Marquez. That's my opinion, the videos we've seen aren't absolutely conclusive.
 
Looks to me like VR pushed MM head away with his knee. His foot came off afterwards. That was not meant to take him out, but if that didn't happen they both would have crashed as MM would not have been able to recover. Look at his lean angle, he's falling into VR.
 
https://www.change.org/p/director-d...utm_source=share_petition&utm_medium=copylink

------------------------

I trust in justice as well as I trust in people professionally and rigorously applying their responsibilities in the most efficient and impartial manner.

Therefore, I host the conviction that Mr. Mike Webb (MotoGP Race Director) and the FIM stewards are able to judge the incidents happened in the last Motogp race in Malaysia with this efficiency and impartiality.

To do so, I’m asking them to ask to HRC team and then review, the telemetry of Marc Marquez with special focus on throttle and brake data during the 14 overtakes with Valentino Rossi to compare it with the data from the Qualifying.

For sure, they will find conflicts (stops and/or not full throttle when Marquez was on front) that demonstrate the real intention of the pilot which really was to create a dangerous situation and to damage Valentino Rossi.

Doing that intentionally and with no real fight for the championship is repeated in Marquez over the years (other pilots suffered it before)

I ask for a penalty or, at least, a warning to make Marquez understand that this behaviors are not allow (for anybody) and that he don’t cheat to all Motogp fans during the last Malaysia GP.
 
I ask for a penalty or, at least, a warning to make Marquez understand that this behaviors are not allow (for anybody) and that he don’t cheat to all Motogp fans during the last Malaysia GP.
:giggle:

Rossi fanboys are just impossible. They really think they are Gods that make up the rules. Kicking rider out of track should not be penalized, but if the telemetry would show that Marquez did slow done on purpose he should be banned from MotoGP:

:giggle::giggle::giggle::giggle::giggle:

I never understood why people would support such a crook as Rossi. But now I understand that Rossi fanboys are cut from a very specific type of wood.
 
For those micro analyzing the incident during the contact. Answer this question : who deliberately initialed pushing the riders wide and off the racing line?


I'll answer it for you. ROSSI. (The argument ends there.)



In fact, he openly admitted it. You boys are engaging in microanalysis at the point AFTER the perpetrator had committed his act of assault. What you are doing is tantamount to trying to assign guilt to Marc after he had been cornered by an act of the perpetrator! Try using this defense for the perpetrator in a scenario a person on the street runs you off the road DELIBERATELY then...YOU are blamed for trying to balance and evade to safety while off a stable surface. All while in motion no less.

Your honor, clearly the victim is guilty, you see, when I surprised him by using my vehicle to run him off the road, he tried to get away.

WTF
 
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Every comment is very context sensitive. Some are basing their comments on Marquez tactics before Rossi took him wide. Others are referring to after Marquez ran into his knee, there are even comments going back to previous years.

From the context of the racing before the contact I saw MM racing with Rossi as if it was his last lap ever. Rossi needs every point he can get since he is actually racing for the title. Marquez shouldn't pull over, that's for sure. But damn, he was acting like this was his last race. That back tire was definitely stepping out a little more than normal. On top of that, he traded paint on multiple occasions.

From the context of MM running into VR's knee. There is no interpretation necessary. Fact one: VR ran him wide. After watching that REALLY slow motion video of the incident, it's clear that Rossi was on the brakes but in a constant fashion. His front end never dove any further from the time before MM hit to when MM bounced off of him. After MM bounces off of Rossi, Rossi's knee pops out but it's not a frickin kick.

I'm not a fanboy of any of the riders. So Marc, keep that stupidity to yourself. Speaking of Marc, how can you call others fanboys when your stinkin username is Marc Marquez.
 
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