Joined Mar 2015
2K Posts | 337+
Chertsey, Surrey, UK
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If you live in a glass house don't throw rocks.
The dress suits him better than race leathers.
Gran Premio Motul de la República Argentina
- Thread starter MdubSTYLIE
- Start date
The dress suits him better than race leathers.
Joined Apr 2015
6K Posts | 5K+
NJ
Ah but by your standards contact is a no-no.
What happened with Rossi was a racing incident.
But because it was Rossi, he got the 30 second penalty.
Joined Jun 2007
10K Posts | 1K+
Norah Head
Joined Apr 2015
6K Posts | 5K+
NJ
Joined Oct 2006
25K Posts | 4K+
Your Mom's House
Rossi's entire reaction is about his narcissistic ego. He felt/feels indignation that a "kid" wouldn't treat him like royalty. That's what this whole thing is about. And all his subjects must follow suit, because by their peculiar association, they feel the same indignation! The genuinely feel an affront to their honor. Thing is Marc wasn't actually disrespecting him, and offered his apology for the incident, but Rossi will have none of it. Marc must pay for the embarrassment Rossi feels.
It's not about safety, it's not about motogp, racing etiquette, it's not about anything other that Rossi's sense of grandiose honor. It's why he refused to grant Marc an audience, and why he sent out his private-at-arms. It's all about Rossi's ego, honor, and sense of grandiose exceptionalism, his fans (which includes not just spectators) are simply mirroring it because they themselves feel disrespected, it's their honor that Marc has trampled, as they see it. It's a psychosis we are witnessing, it's a fascinating dynamic being played out.
No amount of logic, or details about the facts can overcome the temperamental need to be worshipped, nor those that psychologically feel associated with the cult's figure, it is not a technical matter of racing that can be argued by concrete facets of the incident. That's why it is futile, those looking from the outside in cannot by logic or debate overcome what is an emotional issue.
If you live in a glass house don't throw rocks.
It's not about safety, it's not about motogp, racing etiquette, it's not about anything other that Rossi's sense of grandiose honor. It's why he refused to grant Marc an audience, and why he sent out his private-at-arms. It's all about Rossi's ego, honor, and sense of grandiose exceptionalism, his fans (which includes not just spectators) are simply mirroring it because they themselves feel disrespected, it's their honor that Marc has trampled, as they see it. It's a psychosis we are witnessing, it's a fascinating dynamic being played out.
No amount of logic, or details about the facts can overcome the temperamental need to be worshipped, nor those that psychologically feel associated with the cult's figure, it is not a technical matter of racing that can be argued by concrete facets of the incident. That's why it is futile, those looking from the outside in cannot by logic or debate overcome what is an emotional issue.
If you live in a glass house don't throw rocks.
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Joined Nov 2015
242 Posts | 144+
Australia
My apologies if I missed this question being discussed and answered many pages ago but
If Marquez had created such a clear an obvious infringement of the rules by bump starting his bike on the grid, why did they start the race with him on the grid?
If Marquez had created such a clear an obvious infringement of the rules by bump starting his bike on the grid, why did they start the race with him on the grid?
As crazy as this theory is, I think it hits the nail on the head.
I'm so anti this hero worship of people it must also explain why I get such a laugh to see Marquez kick his ... ruthlessly. I just love it!
I haven't seen it answered to my satisfaction.
I think the reason is, they were basically incompetant (much like my spelling) and they had been told "Get this ....... race going!!!".
He's 25, heart going like a triphammer stressed to the max and he stalls the bike. His brain melted.
He starts playing dumb, like "I'm not getting off this track until they tell me to" and it effed with their simp heads.
He gets his bike back in position and they are GO GO GO.
To my way of thinking if they started the race after what he did they shouldn't be able to punish him.
Starting the race is them saying, "Everything is in order"
Joined Oct 2006
25K Posts | 4K+
Your Mom's House
I was reflecting on this debacle, and it dawned on me that logic is not at play here.
It's amazing really, because if you read the arguments being made to hang Marc and commiserate Rossi (few here, but in other places, plenty) particularly by so called journalists, and reactions on social media, it made me realize what is being debated, and the responses I've been reading are similar to the arguments I've read when debating religious people (my other hobby). I don’t know what is your world view Max, but I watch religious debates for fun, particularly Christopher Hitchens and Sam Harris. Anyway, I recognize some of the same reactions being presented, devoid of logic because faith, belief and love for a savior is not something that is debatable. I could never talk you out of the emotional experiences you have if you believed some figure was righteous, nor could I convince you that a figure you love and associate you experiences of wellbeing is a con-job. I'm reminded of a quote, "There’s simply no polite way to tell people they’ve dedicated their lives to an illusion." Daniel Dennett. Think about that, how can I sound polite to a Rossi fan that his hero is a hypocrite, conman? Despite it being true, its,not going to be accepted, and I come out looking like the villain. Is it any coincidence that every single person that ever complained about Rossi’s tactics was vilified? Is it any coincidence that every rider that ever beat Rossi, rivaled, or otherwise dared to challenge him was vilified and disparaged? Not only vilified, but a campaign launched to explain away why Rossi didn’t come out on top in exchanges he lost. Biaggi, Sete, Nicky, Stoner, Lorenzo, Marc, all at one time disparaged. What about the machines? Even inanimate objects are not immune to hostility. The GP07, road itself, whilst the GP11 & GP12 were the scourge of the paddock, Ducati didn’t listen to him and failed, right? Even now, the M1 is a "piece of ...." (worse that Suzuki I've read) holding Rossi back, nevermind the fact he developed the 2016 that Zarco used to kick his ... on his 2017 model, or the 2017 model Zarco has/was kicking his ... on the 2018 model at Argentina before Marc interrupted the embarrassment.
What kind of dynamic is at play here with Rossi. That people would sign a petition to suspend the rules of the competition, signed by over three-quarters of a million people! I wondered what if those petitioners got their way (and let's be honest, it was over a million that thought this way, no all got around to signing it). They honestly would have accepted Rossi as the legitimate champion despite what they were asking for was expressly illegitimate, think about that. This can only be achieved by a religious mindset. That's why we are seeing what's being played out now. Marc doesn't stand a chance. The man tried to apologize twice, once on track then in person. Consider that the character assassination is bunk under scrutiny, Marc complied and obeyed sanctions lodged, he didn’t stay out there in defiance like we've seen others do when shown a penalty. This arrogant non-compliant out of control ....... they're painting doesn’t jive with the facts. If Schwantz for example can blame Marc for crashing himself out at Sepang, than can the argument be reasonably made that Rossi bares some blame for crashing out at Argentina? Blasphemy! Cut your tongue out heathen!
If you live in a glass house don't throw rocks.
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I want to start a petition to have Jumkie running the motogp series,i also want him as my lawyer for an upcoming appointment i have with the beak,it wasn't my fault,i'm blaming Yamaha for making r1's..
Joined Feb 2007
11K Posts | 2K+
Tennessee
While everything you say is spot on, I don’t worry about Marc. He will take this as an afront and zero n on one thing and one thing only, dominating the championship. He is simply not worried what Rossi or his goofy fans think or say.
Yes, you can't chop away someone's foundation without receiving hostility.
It's an interesting concept. I was listening to a speaker talk about how Christianity built a culture that valued truth and then the people woke up one day and turned that against Christianity. "Prove your truth", they demanded, using a value system it had taught them. And when they weren't satisfied with the answers they tore out the foundation of their culture and found themselves floating in an uncertain chaos.
Little wonder a culture like the middle east looks at us with revulsion, them being some 800 years behind still accepting their roots and yet to take such a "progressive" step as to pull down the foundations of their belief system.
But perhaps I stray ...
You brought it to mind with your comments, I suppose. People can be hostile to the suggestion or hint that their foundation might be on shaky ground because everything they've built rests on it.
Who knew the study of Rossi fans would take us to the very basis of our being?
Edited to add, of course Stoner saw what you speak of and decided to walk away. How long before Marc decides what his response will be.
It's an interesting concept. I was listening to a speaker talk about how Christianity built a culture that valued truth and then the people woke up one day and turned that against Christianity. "Prove your truth", they demanded, using a value system it had taught them. And when they weren't satisfied with the answers they tore out the foundation of their culture and found themselves floating in an uncertain chaos.
Little wonder a culture like the middle east looks at us with revulsion, them being some 800 years behind still accepting their roots and yet to take such a "progressive" step as to pull down the foundations of their belief system.
But perhaps I stray ...
You brought it to mind with your comments, I suppose. People can be hostile to the suggestion or hint that their foundation might be on shaky ground because everything they've built rests on it.
Who knew the study of Rossi fans would take us to the very basis of our being?
Edited to add, of course Stoner saw what you speak of and decided to walk away. How long before Marc decides what his response will be.
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You don't really need to study Rossi fans to understand the kind of people they are,they are just fans of personality,the same kind of people who flock to see Ed Sheeran because he's popular,just sheep,if Rossi became an f1 driver tomorrow they'd all go and follow that instead,i sum them up in 2 words...sad .......s.
I am a Rossi fan, but I am not "sad basterd".
As far as I can see in this thread, you guys, Rossi haters are far more aggressive and vulgar. It's a good thing that nobody cares about you [emoji442]
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Joined Oct 2006
25K Posts | 4K+
Your Mom's House
When Rossi and his fans were busy vilifying Casey, even mocking his, as they put it "mystery illness" (implying that he was weak minded) the same media that is piling on Marc relentlessly now later with crocodile tears lamented Stoner leaving this, how should I put it, "ruined" sport.
Mat Oxley just blamed us, in a carefully worded indictment, careful to move the blame from the man who was most associated and celebrated for his machismo style racing (code for aggressive tactics). His omission, as Povol point out, was deafening. Oxley blamed to us, for what now? Oh yeah, we created a monster, so who is that monster? I want to revisit this point, because the implication is we've created a monster, and that monster's name is Marc Marquez!
Subtle isn't it? Why would Mat Oxley, known Rossi apologists, write an article on the heels of this hyperbolic debacle that has been roundly blamed on ONE man, Marc Marquez, and ask the "question", completely rhetorical of course, who created this scourge, this reckless, arrogant, out of control monster, that thumbs his nose at authority?
You did!
Which of course begs a response doesn’t it. The answer almost hangs there waiting for the next point. If I'm the reason this monster exists, them I'm the solution to put this monster down.
So our duty, your duty reader, is to break him [Marc] down a notch, I suppose via social media, but shouting at his ... in public will do, he'll get the message, oh how did Schwantz put it in his last interview, ah, I got it, "calm the .... down!" (That's from an interview I read in Spanish, I'm sure ya'll can find it in English, since I'm sure it was translated.)
So readers of Mat Oxley's articles, you've been called to action, every problem has a solution. And since Oxley declared, YOU created this monster, well you know what to do.
I wish i could agree with Povol, that this doesn’t faze Marc, but I highly doubt it. He's a human being, young still, not as ruthless or Machiavellian as Rossi, or the ........ of the sport. He is and will be the target of the onslaught that Rossi can raise via his cult and influence. It's not just going to be booes, his actual safety will be a real distraction, if that plays out, you heard it hear first, the gutless media will say, oh we didn’t mean for someone to assault Marc. They have no problem whipping up a frenzy with their irresponsible blame on Marc though, the Evil Doer of Argentina! Especially in Italy, but in many other places. I'll be embarrassed if he's booed here in Austin, but I can now guarantee it, if he wins or is on the podium. If he crashes, he'll be cheered. I can tell you this from personal experience sitting in the grandstands, hearing the cheers of Rossi fans when Viñalez crashed (for his crime of wining the first two races). It's sick, isn't it?
If you live in a glass house don't throw rocks.
Joined Oct 2006
25K Posts | 4K+
Your Mom's House
You could very well be the exception to the rule. But you'll have to explain away a few things. Stoner, Lorenzo, and Marquez have all been disrespected publicly on the podium for the crimes of wining. Perhaps it was Dovizioso fans expressing their contempt? Stoner was jeered at a charity event no less. Nicky Hayden was disparaged from his accomplishment that it prompted him to place on his leathers, "Numbers don't lie". This in response to certain fans expressing their dissatisfaction of his "fluke" championship. Oh people notice, which rider's fans do you think were responsible?
There was an incident where fan club members of a certain rider came to Marc's garage to assault him with verbal abuse, perhaps they were Karl Abraham fan club?
When these riders have crashed, audible cheers of approval have been heard, Stoner, Lorenzo, Marc, and Viñalez (this I heard personally). Guess who's fans were seeing doing this? Perhaps Redding fans?
There is one group of fans that repeatedly exhibit contempt for riders, not just at the track, but relentlessly on social media, comments sections of articles written, you tube video reactions, etc. Have you seen the video of Rossi firing a rifle juxtaposed with Marc getting shot? Guess who's fans came up with that gem?
You say use 4-5 guys on this thread are "more aggressive and vulgar" than any Rossi fans you've seen? How do I respond to that except to say you've advanced my point, Rossi fans are delusional then, and you are NOT the exception to the rule.
If you live in a glass house don't throw rocks.
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Joined Jun 2007
10K Posts | 1K+
Norah Head
You may not be a “sad basterd”, or even a sad ......., but you are typical of the breed, indignant about even a small corner of the Internet with an opinion counter to yours, and hypocritical in the extreme to take issue with “Rossi haters” given what has been levelled at pretty much every rival Rossi has ever had, even one as temporary as Tony Elias, by your fellow travellers over his career.
As applies to most of your fellow travellers, you could perhaps also assay a counter argument to what has been said by those you dispute, other than either argument ad hominem or a blind declaration of faith in Valentino, which mostly seem to be all those of your ilk can muster.
Jumkie, I did not say that. I just said that you blame every Rossi fan and give all of them the finger but there are some decent people out there and it's not right.
I can agree with you that more then 50 percent of VR fans are blind and does not have any respect.
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I can agree with you that more then 50 percent of VR fans are blind and does not have any respect.
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That's '.......' not ' basterd'..go on admit it,you love Ed Sheeran as well don't you.