Does anyone actually belive that Stoner choked under pressure???

I think Stoner lost the front because he was running a softer compound front tyre and he lost it because the new surface doesn't give warnings while he was trying really hard to gap the other guy following him
And Stoner didn't have an easy explanation when he was interviewed in the pits either...who knows ?

I'm going to try very hard to get a copy of the interview with Stoner that was conducted by the BBC in the pits, while the race was still going. It's interesting.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Goatboy @ Aug 19 2008, 10:49 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I'm going to try very hard to get a copy of the interview with Stoner that was conducted by the BBC in the pits, while the race was still going. It's interesting.
i would be very interested in hearing this

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (#46 @ Aug 20 2008, 07:49 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I think Stoner lost the front because he was running a softer compound front tyre and he lost it because the new surface doesn't give warnings while he was trying really hard to gap the other guy following him
And Stoner didn't have an easy explanation when he was interviewed in the pits either...who knows ?


Daryle Beatie on Channel 10 in Aus stated that Casey ran both the absolute hardest compounds Bridgestone had. His call was Casey set the bike up to go fastest in the last half of the race and with the fuel load and super hard tyres it was too much too soon. Casey set and then reset the lap record (the n chucked it down the road).

Valentino still didn't record a lap as fast as Casey - mind you after Casey hit the gravel he didn't have to go fast, he just set it on cruise control and slipped out the back for a cuppa.

Did he choke?

No

Did me make a mistake - my furry coat he did. I think he ran too hard to early and just put it down.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Andy Roo @ Aug 20 2008, 12:19 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Daryle Beatie on Channel 10 in Aus stated that Casey ran both the absolute hardest compounds Bridgestone had. His call was Casey set the bike up to go fastest in the last half of the race and with the fuel load and super hard tyres it was too much too soon. Casey set and then reset the lap record (the n chucked it down the road).

I've seen that "hardest tire" mentioned before but at BBC Suzy and Rossi spoke about Stoner using a softer front tire, or did I get that wrong?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Andy Roo @ Aug 19 2008, 11:19 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Daryle Beatie on Channel 10 in Aus stated that Casey ran both the absolute hardest compounds Bridgestone had. His call was Casey set the bike up to go fastest in the last half of the race and with the fuel load and super hard tyres it was too much too soon. Casey set and then reset the lap record (the n chucked it down the road).

Valentino still didn't record a lap as fast as Casey - mind you after Casey hit the gravel he didn't have to go fast, he just set it on cruise control and slipped out the back for a cuppa.

Did he choke?

No

Did me make a mistake - my furry coat he did. I think he ran too hard to early and just put it down.
this seems a contradiction to me but it is late here
if casey ran the fastest lap but rossi was reeling him in prior to casey falling he must have done these laps early which would indicate he had soft tyres like everybody except Daryle Beatie is saying

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Babelfish @ Aug 20 2008, 08:27 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I've seen that "hardest tire" mentioned before but at BBC Suzy and Rossi spoke about Stoner using a softer front tire, or did I get that wrong?

Beatie said (and the man is close to Casey and a former 500cc world No.2) that he was using the absolute hardest tyres. He said this before he fell, actually before the race started.

Too hard?

Who knows, but he was bloody fast on the track and at the post race test, he just saved his one fall for a critical time.

Vale thinks Stoner leans the bike over too much and that he can't handle pressure.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (roger-m @ Aug 20 2008, 08:30 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>this seems a contradiction to me but it is late here
if casey ran the fastest lap but rossi was reeling him in prior to casey falling he must have done these laps early which would indicate he had soft tyres like everybody except Daryle Beatie is saying


Just a question.
Why do you think it's safe to assume Vale was reeling Casey in because he did one lap quicker than Casey?
Vale was slower in all the other laps by a tenth or two and because of the early crash we have absolutely no data either way to second guess what was going to happen next. It's funny - it seems the estimated result if the race went full term, depends on which rider you follow. We did not get anywhere near enough lap times to put forward a win for either rider. What we can gather is that it was not going to be a runaway and it seemed like Casey was doing a pretty similar lap time to the previous one's when he went down. As for tyres, who knows. Vale thought his were better and they might have been for him & Yamaha. Stoner & Ducati may find something else works better for them. I do know Stoner had tyre problems at Sachsenring last year because the tyre was too hard. His team mate Capi had something softer and ended up on the podium. Perhaps it was too hard, perhaps it was too soft or perhaps it was perfect. He fell off and we will never know.

Vale
1 2'03.424 35.451 35.837 32.421 19.715
2 1'57.454 30.167 35.376 32.276 19.635 294.8
3 1'57.548 30.096 35.398 32.357 19.697 295.2
4 1'57.388 30.139 35.356 32.258 19.635 295.6
5 1'57.232 29.892 35.411 32.302 19.627 294.9
6 1'57.228 30.101 35.344 32.174 19.609 295.0

Casey
1 2'02.282 34.790 35.456 32.326 19.710
2 1'57.379 30.217 35.265 32.224 19.673 295.0
3 1'57.468 30.065 35.388 32.310 19.705 293.5
4 1'57.379 30.106 35.463 32.227 19.583 292.2
5 1'57.199 30.108 35.110 32.283 19.698 291.9
6 1'57.521 30.218 35.274 32.362 19.667 291.6
unfinished 30.076

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (crvlvr @ Aug 19 2008, 12:36 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I don't think Stoner is confident enough to push Rossi from behind.
I'm drunk and that's funny.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ROCKGOD01 @ Aug 19 2008, 04:28 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>NOW depoonya ...... chokes.
It's not choking when you're expected to fall down.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (an4rew @ Aug 19 2008, 03:41 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Vale thinks Stoner leans the bike over too much and that he can't handle pressure.

Believe me Rossi knows, he's been in the game long enough. If we can all just take a look at Stoner with no bias we can all agreed that the guy as FAST as fucc, but mentally.... he still got alot to learn, and Rossi KNOWS that, THAT is why Rossi is capatalizing on it. Clearly the Ducati is a better machine, Rossi knows this, SO the only way to win the championship is to get inside Casey's mind and mess with it. Rossi is not dumb, he knows what he is doing.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Frizzle @ Aug 20 2008, 02:27 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Vale
1 2'03.424 35.451 35.837 32.421 19.715
2 1'57.454 30.167 35.376 32.276 19.635 294.8
3 1'57.548 30.096 35.398 32.357 19.697 295.2
4 1'57.388 30.139 35.356 32.258 19.635 295.6
5 1'57.232 29.892 35.411 32.302 19.627 294.9
6 1'57.228 30.101 35.344 32.174 19.609 295.0

Casey
1 2'02.282 34.790 35.456 32.326 19.710
2 1'57.379 30.217 35.265 32.224 19.673 295.0
3 1'57.468 30.065 35.388 32.310 19.705 293.5
4 1'57.379 30.106 35.463 32.227 19.583 292.2
5 1'57.199 30.108 35.110 32.283 19.698 291.9
6 1'57.521 30.218 35.274 32.362 19.667 291.6
unfinished 30.076

Rossi shaved 0.3 off the lap before stoner binned it, i stll think he crashed by going to fast because he didn't want Laguna round II.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (SuperShinya56 @ Aug 20 2008, 01:11 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Believe me Rossi knows, he's been in the game long enough. If we can all just take a look at Stoner with no bias we can all agreed that the guy as FAST as fucc, but mentally.... he still got alot to learn, and Rossi KNOWS that, THAT is why Rossi is capatalizing on it. Clearly the Ducati is a better machine, Rossi knows this, SO the only way to win the championship is to get inside Casey's mind and mess with it. Rossi is not dumb, he knows what he is doing.


Yes yes yes, we have heard it all before.
Vale rides a Pennyfarthing and Stoner is on a Nasa designed supercomputer on wheels.
Unfortunately Marco, Toni & Sylvain lost their passwords.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (an4rew @ Aug 20 2008, 01:20 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Rossi shaved 0.3 off the lap before stoner binned it, i stll think he crashed by going to fast because he didn't want Laguna round II.


I already mentioned that one lap. What's your point?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Austin @ Aug 20 2008, 12:27 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'> I'm drunk and that's funny.

I'm sober and I laughed my arse off, not because it was funny, but because you're drunk and found it funny. You must drink for the same reasons I do.


<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (SuperShinya56 @ Aug 20 2008, 01:11 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Clearly the Ducati is a better machine

Thank God Toni Elias came second. Now when we ignore all of the exculpatory evidence as to the brilliance of the machine we can cite one rider in one race getting a podium. From two seasons and 20+ races one other rider gets one podium on the bike in the dry (Loris had a wet win but Westie could potentially get one of those)

Basing this on the amount of riders who get on the podium (dry again) and not the actually number of podium places this puts the bike level with the Suzuki.

There is an entire legion of believers in illusory correlations who have built shrines in their houses to worship Toni Elias because he made something finally come true to them. The fact that it is a recognised logical flaw (post hoc) shouldn't matter. And bigfoot (just discovered) caused global warming with one gi-.......-gantic cabbage fart the vegetarian freak.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Frizzle @ Aug 20 2008, 01:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Yes yes yes, we have heard it all before.
Vale rides a Pennyfarthing and Stoner is on a Nasa designed supercomputer on wheels.
Unfortunately Marco, Toni & Sylvain lost their passwords.

(Singing) Toni found his password, Toni found his password.

Now he can get on the podium with ease and get some cash out of the auto teller. After Brno he would be so .... happy that his computer rebooted properly he is off to score some coke and get some hookers. woohoo for Toni.

The REALLY good thing about this thread is - if Rossi ever crashes again whilst leading a race or chasing points in a race whilst behind etc etc etc plenty of people have carte blanche to call him a choker.

It seems that many people are acquainting being under pressure to produce a result but crashing to mean a choke.

Does this then mean that any rider who crashes has choked as surely each and every rider is under pressure to achieve results to either secure points, championship position, a contract or any other number of reasons.

Additionally, if crashing whilst leading equates to choking then Schwantz must have choked many a time, yet not a soul would dare suggest that he is a choker.

IMO, choking is consistently failing when under pressure, irrespective of what that pressure may well be (ie. Beckham with penalties, Greg Norman with US golf majors). Whilst CS may have crashed in the last two races there is still no consistency that yet proves he has the mental failing to qualify as a choker or as having choked (IMO).





Garry

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Gaz @ Aug 20 2008, 10:28 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>It seems that many people are acquainting being under pressure to produce a result but crashing to mean a choke.

Does this then mean that any rider who crashes has choked as surely each and every rider is under pressure to achieve results to either secure points, championship position, a contract or any other number of reasons.

Additionally, if crashing whilst leading equates to choking then Schwantz must have choked many a time, yet not a soul would dare suggest that he is a choker.

IMO, choking is consistently failing when under pressure, irrespective of what that pressure may well be (ie. Beckham with penalties, Greg Norman with US golf majors). Whilst CS may have crashed in the last two races there is still no consistency that yet proves he has the mental failing to qualify as a choker or as having choked (IMO).

I agree with you, allthough a third time within the next two-three races will be very close to what I would call choking.