Why Dani Pedrosa Is Still On The Factory Team?

ROCKGOD01 said:

The one big thing coming up is Marq Marquez, who is Spanish, already rides for Repsol and is good. Now what to do about that rookie rule eh?

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The 'Repsol' that Marquez rides for has nothing to do with HRC Repsol. Different teams, different management - the only thing they have in common is that they both run Honda engines.



Team CatalunyaCaixa Repsol is Monlau Competicion an engineering and training company specialising in motorsport. They race in Moto2, CEV Buckler and European Moto2/Moto3 competitions.



http://en.monlau-competicion.com/



http://world.honda.com/HRC/repsolhondateam/

Gaz said:

Do all that while dressed as Gilligan and I will somehow send you $50 Australian (worth more than your bloody US dollar now anyway)

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Possibly not for much longer ... seen the exchange rate today?

Obama kicked off his campaign - it's distorting the figures...



Ah... but then you've got Gillard - distorting reality...

Who you gunna replace Dani with!??



Maybe Stoner and Lorenzo ..... and they already have Stoner!

At the moment, he is probably the best Spanish rider, apart from Lorenzo. However, If Casey stays at Repsol for the next couple of years I can see him being replaced by Marquez probably after he completes his rookie year. I like Dani, and would be disappointed to see him lose his spot as I think he is a great rider.



Kingcobra raised a good point about Dani's slight build (in another thread) and whether it could hamper his performance - I've thought about that too. For example, when I watch Casey or Jorge riding, they look like they totally own their bike. They look completely comfortable - looks like the bike is not too big or too small for them. When they move the bike or their body around the bike, it looks very natural and almost like it's a part of their body. When I watch Dani, it looks more like he is trying to hang on sometimes. Because of his lighter weight, he gets an advantage off the start and on the straights, but I wonder if his lighter weight and slighter build would disadvantage him in the totality of racing. What do you guys think?

mad mick said:

At the moment, he is probably the best Spanish rider, apart from Lorenzo. However, If Casey stays at Repsol for the next couple of years I can see him being replaced by Marquez probably after he completes his rookie year. I like Dani, and would be disappointed to see him lose his spot as I think he is a great rider.



Kingcobra raised a good point about Dani's slight build (in another thread) and whether it could hamper his performance - I've thought about that too. For example, when I watch Casey or Jorge riding, they look like they totally own their bike. They look completely comfortable - looks like the bike is not too big or too small for them. When they move the bike or their body around the bike, it looks very natural and almost like it's a part of their body. When I watch Dani, it looks more like he is trying to hang on sometimes. Because of his lighter weight, he gets an advantage off the start and on the straights, but I wonder if his lighter weight and slighter build would disadvantage him in the totality of racing. What do you guys think?

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In my opinion Dani should not have any problems riding the 1000cc because of 4kg weight increase, In my opinion the hanging part that you mentioned earlier is a part of his riding style and it is not about him not having control over the bike, Well yes, his physical structure is smaller than the other guys but he is a fit guy and its not about not having the ability to lean the bike like those guys, Unlike Casey Stoner who is a magician at choosing tight lines with highest speed imaginable, Pedrosa hangs himself to the bike in order to exit the corner faster than anybody else. I was watching Indianapolis 2010 and Julian Rider (the Eurosport guy) was comparing Dani's style with Spies and Lorenzo. He said that Dani's style is little bit like Mick Doohan. (I haven't watched Mick Dohan on his bike so I don't know if its true). He said Dani's engine is a brutal engine and its difficult to use and while other Honda's use a Yamaha developed chassis Dani uses the original Honda, The HRC guys even brought technicians from Yamaha to make his throttle go smoother.

So if it is any problem with Dani not pushing the bike to its limits is because the difficulties his team has finding the guy a perfect setup. I think he proved his physical abilities in his rookie year with the 990 cc engines. Back then he was riding more aggressive than this year so far.

mt1960 said:

He is a great team rider. While we focus on riders championships, for a factory, they have at least two riders and the team and manufacturers championships are very important.



He has done a great job for HRC over the last 6 years.



The other thing to consider is the nature of Repsol's sponsorship - it is very likely they have a 'Spaniard' clause. Until Marquez is available, who else is there better than Pedrosa in Iberia

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povol said:

Dani is one of the top 4 riders in the world and deserves a factory seat. Repsol Honda stuck with him when they were not winning titles, they will probably stick with him now that they have a championship rider on the team as well. There can only be one champion when its all said and done, and his teammate will be odds on favorite to be that guy for the next few years at least. If he is popular with the Spanish fans and Repsol likes him, they will more than likely make room for him for at least another 2 year stint. He seems to have accepted his fate as being bridesmaid, so unless he is rocking the boat, keep him around

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mylexicon said:

If Dani is not on Repsol Honda, they will be competing against him.

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The above answers (all correct) are all so obvious that this thread never should have been initiated. This forum is starting to feel like Tiger Beat Magazine for 12 year old girls. Enough already with twenty new inane threads a day.

mad mick said:

Kingcobra raised a good point about Dani's slight build (in another thread) and whether it could hamper his performance - I've thought about that too. For example, when I watch Casey or Jorge riding, they look like they totally own their bike. They look completely comfortable - looks like the bike is not too big or too small for them. When they move the bike or their body around the bike, it looks very natural and almost like it's a part of their body. When I watch Dani, it looks more like he is trying to hang on sometimes. Because of his lighter weight, he gets an advantage off the start and on the straights, but I wonder if his lighter weight and slighter build would disadvantage him in the totality of racing. What do you guys think?

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He has said as much himself. It isn't so much his 'slighter' build - he has managed to put on a heap of muscle compared to a few years ago - but it is his leverage that hampers him.



An average lap of 18 or so corners sees the rider literally picking the bike up from being leaned over and haling it across and down the other side 30-odd times a lap, as well as hauling himself towards the bars under acceleration and bench pressing his own weight x2 every time he brakes.



Dani, with short legs and arms has a lot less mechanical advantage than Lorenzo, Stoner, Rossi, let alone the taller riders. What he gains in acceleration he loses out in the ability to muscle the bike around. Added to that, he just can't get much more meat on those bones... he is probably close to the limit for his frame.



He also flags towards the end of races, where Stoner, Lorenzo and co are still managing quick times, his pace is often a half or a second off. Some races last year he just about had to be helped off the bike, he looked completely shattered. I think it takes a lot more out of him than it does the other top riders.

Keshav said:

The above answers (all correct) are all so obvious that this thread never should have been initiated. This forum is starting to feel like Tiger Beat Magazine for 12 year old girls. Enough already with twenty new inane threads a day.

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Thanks for the helpful comment Keshav, Well everybody here knows that I'm new to Motogp and the forum, so if there is something wrong about the thread i posted I will be really honored to know its problems specifically and if its stupid just let me know and with the help of all of the old guys like you in the forum there will be no more stupid ........ threads. I asked everyone in my thread to inform me if I'm wrong.

I've never seen this guy do an over-take maneuver before. He just gets rocket starts to lead a race, then slowly gets passed by other racers to get 3rd place podium.

I want to see the 2011 Valencia Pedro show up to one of these races.

SuperShinya56 said:

I've never seen this guy do an over-take maneuver before. He just gets rocket starts to lead a race, then slowly gets passed by other racers to get 3rd place podium.

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He has 15 wins, 100 podiums, perhaps you haven't been watching closely enough.

he has a point though, i can't remember the last time pedrosa has been in a hard battle and succeeded.i mean really think about it, what was pedrosas last great overtaking?i'm sure it has a lot to do with him being so small and thus not being able to brake as hard as the others

cliché guevara said:

he has a point though, i can't remember the last time pedrosa has been in a hard battle and succeeded.i mean really think about it, what was pedrosas last great overtaking?i'm sure it has a lot to do with him being so small and thus not being able to brake as hard as the others

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In my opinion its all about his physical structure. Yes everybody is aware that his weak spots are hard braking and overtaking and he cant do it the way others do, But if we could switch our point of view to Pedrosa's mind we can ask ourselves: why bring the game to the situation where we are weak at it? So there is no reason for him to try to do something he knows he is weak at and instead he tries to improve his advantages in straights and corner exits. But for the part that you said he has not been successful in hard battles if you could mention his style all the races he won last year (except Motegi) was him being at his top game and I think he won both Sachsenring and Estoril fair and square. By the way I liked his ride back at Brno in 2006, for 2 or 3 laps he could give Valentino a hard time in his Rookie year even in the parts we all know he is weak.

mt1960 said:

He has said as much himself. It isn't so much his 'slighter' build - he has managed to put on a heap of muscle compared to a few years ago - but it is his leverage that hampers him.



An average lap of 18 or so corners sees the rider literally picking the bike up from being leaned over and haling it across and down the other side 30-odd times a lap, as well as hauling himself towards the bars under acceleration and bench pressing his own weight x2 every time he brakes.



Dani, with short legs and arms has a lot less mechanical advantage than Lorenzo, Stoner, Rossi, let alone the taller riders. What he gains in acceleration he loses out in the ability to muscle the bike around. Added to that, he just can't get much more meat on those bones... he is probably close to the limit for his frame.



He also flags towards the end of races, where Stoner, Lorenzo and co are still managing quick times, his pace is often a half or a second off. Some races last year he just about had to be helped off the bike, he looked completely shattered. I think it takes a lot more out of him than it does the other top riders.

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"Leverage". That's the word I was trying to find. Very good assessment.

Without stating the bleeding obvious I suspect that Dani's future is tied exceedingly closely to whatever it is that Stoner decides to do for the ensuing years.



If Stoner signs a 1 year contract as all stories seem to indicate that Dani should seek and will likely be granted a 2 year deal to tie him to HRC for seasons 2013/2014. That way, if Stoner decides to retire at year end 2013 HRC will not risk having two inexperienced factory riders (Marquez and another).



Basically it would be a poor decision of HRC now to take that risk.



The over-riding fact also remains that Lorenzo could well have a big say as well were he to sign a single year contract with Yamaha or sign with HRC for season 2013 as this would then provide a backup for 2013 should Stoner leave (although I doubt Lorenzo would be at HRC in 2013).

Jumkie said:

Not legally at least...





This thread has been inspiration for me. I figured out what im gonna do for Laguna. Im gonna get me a white captains hat and put a 26 on it, then have Dani's autograph.

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Dude ya gotta get everyone to wear one! Order 100 and do a flash mob!!

mh_kingcobra said:

I was wondering if we could look to the situation from the Nakamoto and the HRC point of view. Can we say that for factory teams besides winning titles, improving the bikes setup and technology is an objective? If so How much Dani Pedrosa's riding has helped the Repsol Honda to improve the bike? Can we say He is more than a team guy than a title guy? If non of the questions that I asked is true or reasonable than there is no reason for a factory team and a sponsor to waste money a rider that can't bring titles.

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Good question. I don't think we can say he "more than guy than a title guy". He was groomed (as Marquez is being) to be a Champion for Repsol, Honda, Spain and MGP - in that order. He was not groomed to be a nice team guy, nor to develop bikes, he was expected to win championships. The reason, "for a factory team and a sponsor to waste money a rider that can't bring titles" is because Repsol wants a Spanish champion and they don't have Jorge or Marquez (yet!).

mh_kingcobra said:

There were people (actually all of them Italian) telling that Jorge Lorenzo won the title on the bike Rossi made for the Yamaha. If it is true can we say the same can go to Pedrosa and Stoner? Stoner arrived to Honda and did something Pedrosa couldn't do with the bike Pedrosa built till that day. Is Pedrosa really a guy that brings useful data for the team?

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Casey's first year was on a bike that was built from the ground up, in 2007, FOR Dani and developed AROUND Dani for four years. What we know is Honda, and possibly Dani, can build and develop a bike fast enough for Casey to kick Dani, and the rest of the field's, butts on!! So far, on the new-for-2012 1000cc bike, developed for both, neither, who knows... Casey is still kicking Dani's arse.

mt1960 said:

Bradl: Rookie - unproven. Hardly likely to be faster than Dani in the near future. They are riding what is essentially the same bike right now and Bradl isn't close to Pedrosa's times. 8/8/9 is the sum total of his MotoGP career and you would bounce the fourth most successful rider in the paddock and replace him with Bradl? Somehow I don't think you will make it as a team manager.



Marquez - you are joking, right? Zero experience in MotoGP. Look at Pedrosa's record before he came into MotoGP and tell me how it was materially different from what Marquez has shown? And Pedrosa was competing with Stoner, Lorenzo, etc... in their respective first year in Moto2/250GP, they both have the same number of wins, but Pedrosa also walked away with a championship - and the next year.



Dovi: Now I know you were joking... on equal machinery how often did he finish ahead of Pedrosa? Less than 30% of the time is the answer. In the four years he has been in MotoGP, he has one win, sixteen podiums. In the same period, Pedrosa has eleven wins, fourty-three podiums.

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While there will never be any evidence to prove it - many people thought that Dovi was not on equal machinery. It just seemed like too big a coincidence the way he struggled when Dani was riding and then later how much more competitive he was when Dani was away sick. A lot of folks who weren't especially Dovi fans speculated that Honda was dialing down his electronics to keep him from potentially damaging Dani's championship hopes. As I said... no proof, just perception.

To be fair to Dani, there are very few riders who have actually beaten him over a season in the last ten years. Besides Rossi, Stoner and Lorenzo there is only Dovi, Loris, Nicky and Melandri. Those last 3 were in his rookie season in the top class, and he has since out performed all three of them considerably. Very few people would pick Dovi before Dani, and Rossi's troubles are well documented. With that in mind his place on a factory team is pretty well justified. Add the Repsol thing onto that and you've got a safe seat, but unfortunately for him not a world title.

Speculating, what if something happens to stoner mid season. Do you think Pedrosa could take the title ahead of Lorenzo?



I think yes.