Shanghai MotoGP Race

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (J4rn0 @ May 5 2008, 03:35 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Why should it be amateurish to say that a strong tailwind caused many riders' bike to overrev in the long straight?
Not amturish to say it, but amaturish to not take the wind into consideration on a track like that. Of course it might have arrived late, in witch case it's perfectly understandable. Otherwise they got no reason to complain to anyone but their team manager. It's exactly what's called bad setup.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <div class='quotemain'>By the way, this has been confirmed by many riders... While your assumption of temp and humidity hasn't.
I'm not assuming anything, just state the facts: Lower temps and higher humidity results in more power.
What is the result of more power? Right, faster acceleration and the possibly of hiting the revlimit at the end of the straight.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <div class='quotemain'>By the way, today's bikes have electronic injection and controlled intake air pressure...
And what's that suposed to mean?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (dOdGE.dIZ @ May 6 2008, 12:41 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Well, it was a fine race. Not outstanding or "great", but quite good, me thinks.

Wellcome to the forum and a good post

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Babelfish @ May 6 2008, 03:34 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Not amturish to say it, but amaturish to not take the wind into consideration on a track like that. Of course it might have arrived late, in witch case it's perfectly understandable. Otherwise they got no reason to complain to anyone but their team manager. It's exactly what's called bad setup.

I'm not assuming anything, just state the facts: Lower temps and higher humidity results in more power.
What is the result of more power? Right, faster acceleration and the possibly of hiting the revlimit at the end of the straight.

And what's that suposed to mean?

Controlled intake pressure means the engine is less sensitive - if at all - to external air temperature normal variations which affect air density. They try to control these variables as much as possible of course, that's why they now have those big airboxes rather than drawing air straight from the ambient. They create a micro-climate for the engine to breath from.

Anyway the tailwind was also visible because so many riders 'unexplicably' hit the 'wrong' brake point and went waaaay long at the end of the straight. Of course they were hitting the normal brake points, but the tailwind was tricking them. This happened also to those whose team had adjusted the 6th speed ratio... Like Rossi and Edwards...

Anybody see the average top speeds in China. WTF??? Hondas all at the very bottom with a kwaker stuck in between them. When Pedrosa gets that pneumatic engine this championship may be over. He was able to hang with Rossi for quite sometime and he was giving up quite a bit of speed.

The podium spots were decided at lap 6, the top six was decided by lap 19. Talk about an exciting race lol

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (SackWack @ May 6 2008, 04:35 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Anybody see the average top speeds in China. WTF??? Hondas all at the very bottom with a kwaker stuck in between them. When Pedrosa gets that pneumatic engine this championship may be over. He was able to hang with Rossi for quite sometime and he was giving up quite a bit of speed.

Yep. That's why I wasn't that disappointed in Nicky. He's down 10-15 clicks on the other championship contending manufacturers and he's generally down 3-5 on Pedrosa.

I'm really hoping this Ducati deal can solidify for him. He needs to try something different. Of course, as soon as he does the new Honda lump will come out.

BTW, everyone needs to quit yapping about the wind. Mamola reported it was in the riders' faces when they were lining up for the warm up. It probably died down or changed direction. I don't think anyone got it particularly wrong.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (J4rn0 @ May 6 2008, 12:46 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Controlled intake pressure means the engine is less sensitive - if at all - to external air temperature normal variations which affect air density. They try to control these variables as much as possible of course, that's why they now have those big airboxes rather than drawing air straight from the ambient. They create a micro-climate for the engine to breath from.

Sorry but I don't get this.
1. While you may call it controlled they make sure the pressure change all the time, depending on speed, that's what Ram Air is about.
2. Any temperature changes on top of that wold work totally independently. Time for the air flow through the box does not change dramatically with temperature and nither does consequently the tempearure at the intake valves have the surounding temperature as one major factor.
3. Last time I checked the engineers did not say no thanks to free extra power, rather they tried to isolate the airbox and gas tank from the hot engine so as to avoid heating.

I don't know if my airboxes are big or advnaced enough but I definatly have power in cold wether, and so do every normal breathing or ram air intake engine I've ever heard of have.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <div class='quotemain'>Anyway the tailwind was also visible because so many riders 'unexplicably' hit the 'wrong' brake point and went waaaay long at the end of the straight. Of course they were hitting the normal brake points, but the tailwind was tricking them. This happened also to those whose team had adjusted the 6th speed ratio... Like Rossi and Edwards...

Slightly different sitting there in comfort making your final plans and adsjustments before the race in the padock compared to being out there and decide what braking point to use, a unknown one or the one I used last time?

What a boring 'race'. The only thing that made it tolerable is that I caught the race on french eurosport in Rarotonga. Pedrosa was a brilliant follower, Rossi owns the midget.

WSBK next weekend, can't wait.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (SackWack @ May 7 2008, 12:46 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>The podium spots were decided at lap 6, the top six was decided by lap 19. Talk about an exciting race lol Well I wish the commentators had said then, because I sat there not knowing what was going to happen. I could have been out in the sunshine if I had known the positions had been decided.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <div class='quotemain'>(SackWack @ May 7 2008, 12:46 AM)
The podium spots were decided at lap 6, the top six was decided by lap 19. Talk about an exciting race lol dry.gif

this is motor sport, nothing is for certain, fortunes can change in one corner. what exactly will please the peeps here who call motogp boring ? no doubt if we had photo finishes every race that would also be boring eventually. dont blame the riders or the sport because the front runners break away, blame the tv producers. there are plenty of battles happening further back.

like any sport it has highs and lows. its the lows that make the highs so memorable imo.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (roger-m @ May 7 2008, 10:09 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>this is motor sport, nothing is for certain, fortunes can change in one corner. what exactly will please the peeps here who call motogp boring ? no doubt if we had photo finishes every race that would also be boring eventually. dont blame the riders or the sport because the front runners break away, blame the tv producers. there are plenty of battles happening further back.

like any sport it has highs and lows. its the lows that make the highs so memorable imo.

nicely put rog..

its called perspective..

and if we had '06 type seasons every year, they would become the accepted norm eventually and be boring too.
everthing in moderation is a good thing

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mylexicon @ May 7 2008, 04:06 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Yep. That's why I wasn't that disappointed in Nicky. He's down 10-15 clicks on the other championship contending manufacturers and he's generally down 3-5 on Pedrosa.

I'm really hoping this Ducati deal can solidify for him. He needs to try something different. Of course, as soon as he does the new Honda lump will come out.

BTW, everyone needs to quit yapping about the wind. Mamola reported it was in the riders' faces when they were lining up for the warm up. It probably died down or changed direction. I don't think anyone got it particularly wrong.

What Ducati deal for Nicky? Nicky turned down Ducati when they took stoner and chose to stay at HRC. And they've got two riders signed on till the end of next season.

As for the wind, the riders had a tailwind down the long straight. And several riders commented independently about it in their post race interviews. Capirossi, Dovi and Pedrosa to name a few. All different teams. It might be the wind picked up between morning practice and the race itself, but it was definitely a problem during the race for some.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mylexicon @ May 7 2008, 03:06 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Yep. That's why I wasn't that disappointed in Nicky. He's down 10-15 clicks on the other championship contending manufacturers and he's generally down 3-5 on Pedrosa.

Nicky had a bigger top speed than dani in china. didnt do him any good though because he didnt ride fast enough

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tom @ May 7 2008, 03:35 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Nicky had a bigger top speed than dani in china. didnt do him any good though because he didnt ride fast enough
Weren't all of the honda riders within a few tenths of each other and overrevving? I'm not sure I'd really count that as a "bigger top speed".

PS: Pedro is a "little" (pun intended), .........never even showed Rossi a tire

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (roger-m @ May 7 2008, 09:09 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>this is motor sport, nothing is for certain, fortunes can change in one corner. what exactly will please the peeps here who call motogp boring ? no doubt if we had photo finishes every race that would also be boring eventually. dont blame the riders or the sport because the front runners break away, blame the tv producers. there are plenty of battles happening further back.

like any sport it has highs and lows. its the lows that make the highs so memorable imo.
The only problem for me is if the technology doesn't allow overtaking as seems to have been the case in formula 1 for many years. I am not sure how much the current motogp formula militates against overtaking; the consensus seems to be that it is more difficult than with the 990s.

Otherwise if it is close one year and not the next due to exceptional performance by rider or manufacturer, I don't have much of a problem; at least it means the results are not contrived.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Goatboy @ May 7 2008, 12:45 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Well I wish the commentators had said then, because I sat there not knowing what was going to happen. I could have been out in the sunshine if I had known the positions had been decided.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (roger-m @ May 7 2008, 01:09 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>this is motor sport, nothing is for certain, fortunes can change in one corner. what exactly will please the peeps here who call motogp boring ? no doubt if we had photo finishes every race that would also be boring eventually. dont blame the riders or the sport because the front runners break away, blame the tv producers. there are plenty of battles happening further back.

like any sport it has highs and lows. its the lows that make the highs so memorable imo.

I was actually just making commects about the China race and now we can look back and see what happened in the race which was not much. Don't get me wrong here, I watched the whole race too. I know that anything can happen in a race. I know that I have been a skeptic of MOTOGP lately but I always base my skepticism on past events, data, and facts. Can we agree that in this race the top three didn't change from lap 6? I can see your points in the waiting and anticipation that something may happen, but looking back and seeing as nothing did happen, isn't there a little bit of a let down? Its almost like going on a hot date with a women, thinking about getting in her pants later, waitnig all night long, through all the talking and ........, then having her take off with only a slight peck on the cheek. Then you must resort to other notions This was the China race Anticipate, acnticipate, then nothing. Like I said in other posts, I would enjoy seeing the battling in the back but that really is bitter sweet. And they rarely show it on our crap ccoverage. I'm still a fan and always will be but the China race was just okay for me and I was jsut posting reason why.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (michaelm @ May 7 2008, 03:25 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>The only problem for me is if the technology doesn't allow overtaking as seems to have been the case in formula 1 for many years. I am not sure how much the current motogp formula militates against overtaking; the consensus seems to be that it is more difficult than with the 990s.

Otherwise if it is close one year and not the next due to exceptional performance by rider or manufacturer, I don't have much of a problem; at least it means the results are not contrived.

Will never get as bad as Formula one did, its very easy to slipstream a motorcycle without ill effects.

Also when a rider sticks it up the inside its harder to close the door, unlike in car racing.

Congrats to Rossi. Great race performance. He predicted a win and he delivered. Who else can make such a bold statement on the podium the previous race and make it happen? I thought he might fade at the end like the other times he wasn't able to manage his tires. But I said it before, Rossi has an outstanding learning curve.

Pedrosa I still don't like you. Wake me up when you actually challenge somebody in front of you for the win. He is fast and talented but zero heart.

Stoner, what has happened to you? You've handed Rossi the title, "man to beat". I still think Stoner will be there at the end. Im rooting for him and Rossi so that Peders will have to change his # to 3 or 4.

Lorenzo, very impressive, he wins the 'balls' award. I'm not a fan by any means, but if anybody here has ever tried to ride injured, adrenalin only gets you through a few laps, then its about mental toughness to get through the pain; you gotta admire his effort fighting through that.

Other notables:

Melandri, perhaps recharged the batteries on the 'random results' gizmo? I'm not gonna pat him on the back just yet.

Hayden, good start, fade back, resurge....I'm confused. But I will continue to root: Go Hayden (yeah, diehard all the way, what can I say).

Edwards, normal programming has resumed.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mattsteg @ May 7 2008, 02:41 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Weren't all of the honda riders within a few tenths of each other and overrevving? I'm not sure I'd really count that as a "bigger top speed".

Well it was a bigger top speed, that is a fact. You might consider the difference negligable though, which was the intention of my post in the first place. I was not trying to suggest Hayden had some kind of significant advantage, but rather the speed difference that many use to rationalize his poor results didn't appear to exist in this race and the difference was still huge between Dani and him.