Rossi vs. Stoner (not a troll thread, promise...)

[J4rn0]

A little something i dug up from 2007

With his world championship goal edging closer, Casey Stoner is urging MotoGP officials to resist the latest attempt by superstar rival Valentino Rossi to change the tyre regulations.
With six wins out of 11 races, Stoner believes the new 2007 tyre rules have created a level playing field and that Rossi is now searching for excuses.
In the wake of his crushing defeat at the hands of Stoner and Ducati at the US Grand Prix, Rossi has complained the tyre rules are spoiling the championship show.
Rossi was a distant fourth in California and slipped 44 points behind Stoner with seven races remaining.
Using French Michelin tyres, Rossi's Yamaha has won three races this season while Stoner, with Bridgestone tyres from Japan, has won six times.
"At the beginning of the season Valentino and the others were all for the new tyre rules," said Stoner who earlier finished fifth in Germany because of tyre problems.
"And as soon as they don't win the rule is crap, but when they win the rule is nothing.
"I've had my bad races this year, especially in Germany, and I'm not complaining about the tyre rule and that it is unfair.
"They can moan and whinge about it as much as they want but it shows they have had such an advantage in the past and this season they cannot bring a tyre in just for the race.
"It's a matter of relying on the company that supports you to do a good job."
Rossi said after his defeat in America he would consider proposing changes to the tyre regulations.
Under 2007 restrictions, Michelin are unable to bring in hand-made tyres overnight from their factory and all riders are restricted to 17 nominated rear tyres for each race weekend.
"This rule is not good and we need more tyres," Rossi said.
"The problem is for the show because at the end it is the tyre that decides the race."
Until this year Michelin had dominated MotoGP competition with Rossi winning five world championships and 61 races.
However Rossi's famed crew chief, the Adelaide-based engineer Jerry Burgess with 12 world championships to his credit, agrees with Stoner.
"The tyre rule has not been the main reason for Valentino not winning races this season, Burgess said.
"I like the rule, it's equal for everyone and think it should stay."

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Moto GP banned SNS after 2006. After the Elias incident, more and more riders were screaming for equality after they saw what difference it made. Rossi went along with banning them because he didnt want the entire field on them, remember back then, satellite bikes were winning races. Roll forward to 2007, Stoner is kicking Rossi's ... on Bridgestones and he isnt liking it one bit , because, you know, it was ....... up the show. The show was Rossi winning and Dorna agreed, forcing Bridgestone to supply Rossi in 2008 against their will. Hows that for painting a picture J4rno, sounds less and less conspiratorial all the time huh

Facts give the lie to Bridgegstone. As I remember I wrote here in this very forum at that time, Bridgestone initially cried that they didn't have the means to supply any more teams simply because they didn't want to lose face, openly breaking their standing written and unwritten agreements with Ducati; but they were looking forward to expanding their base.

After supplying Rossi (Yamaha) and then Pedrosa (Honda), they happily supplied the entire field next season. Not bad for a factory that only a few months earlier claimed they didn't have the production capability to supply one more rider.

Those who suffered in all this PR and marketing exercise were Ducati. I know and remember very well what they were saying in the Ducati circles at that time.

Those who really suffered in all that have been Ducati. The switch to Bridgestone single supplier rule in 2008 was not to favor Rossi nor any rider, as some simple minds like to think; it was to neutralize the threat of a Stoner-Ducati-Bridgestone package that looked too strong and was embarassing Honda and Yamaha.

 

[povol]

Did the Melandri's and Gibernau's of the world get SNS's . They were not on the factory team and the reports through the years were for factory riders only.

 

[michaelm]

Facts give the lie to Bridgegstone. As I remember I wrote here in this very forum at that time, Bridgestone initially cried that they didn't have the means to supply any more teams simply because they didn't want to lose face, openly breaking their standing written and unwritten agreements with Ducati; but they were looking forward to expanding their base.

After supplying Rossi (Yamaha) and then Pedrosa (Honda), they happily supplied the entire field next season. Not bad for a factory that only a few months earlier claimed they didn't have the production capability to supply one more rider.

Those who suffered in all this PR and marketing exercise were Ducati. I know and remember very well what they were saying in the Ducati circles at that time.

Those who really suffered in all that have been Ducati. The switch to Bridgestone single supplier rule in 2008 was not to favor Rossi nor any rider, as some simple minds like to think; it was to neutralize the threat of a Stoner-Ducati-Bridgestone package that looked too strong and was embarassing Honda and Yamaha.

Yes, I don't think Dorna were all that keen on another surprise like 2007.
Do you think if Capirossi had won in 2006, which he/Ducati possibly had the capacity to do, it would have caused disquiet as well?

 

[povol]

Facts give the lie to Bridgegstone. As I remember I wrote here in this very forum at that time, Bridgestone initially cried that they didn't have the means to supply any more teams simply because they didn't want to lose face, openly breaking their standing written and unwritten agreements with Ducati; but they were looking forward to expanding their base.

After supplying Rossi (Yamaha) and then Pedrosa (Honda), they happily supplied the entire field next season. Not bad for a factory that only a few months earlier claimed they didn't have the production capability to supply one more rider.

Those who suffered in all this PR and marketing exercise were Ducati. I know and remember very well what they were saying in the Ducati circles at that time.

Those who really suffered in all that have been Ducati. The switch to Bridgestone single supplier rule in 2008 was not to favor Rossi nor any rider, as some simple minds like to think; it was to neutralize the threat of a Stoner-Ducati-Bridgestone package that looked too strong and was embarassing Honda and Yamaha.

You are partially right, the Stoner Ducati package looked to strong and that meant hundreds of millions of dollars in loses if Rossi wasnt winning. If you dont believe Dorna is a self serving entity that would manipulate the sport for their own financial well being, i dont know what to tell you. Those 3 words " I am calm" in 2012 were so powerful and telling as to how Dorna has operated over the years. The opposite of that is we are losing our ..., we must get Vale back in the spot light. Thats not simple minded, thats simply reading between the lines. Is Carmelo going to have to publically admit to you what is/was happening before you can connect the dots. One more thing, the single supplier rule did not happen in 2008, that was the year Rossi got the Bridgestones while every other Michelin rider was told to go .... themselves. The rider uproar throughout 2008 was what caused the single tire rule

 

[Keshav]

A little something i dug up from 2007

With his world championship goal edging closer, Casey Stoner is urging MotoGP officials to resist the latest attempt by superstar rival Valentino Rossi to change the tyre regulations.
With six wins out of 11 races, Stoner believes the new 2007 tyre rules have created a level playing field and that Rossi is now searching for excuses.
In the wake of his crushing defeat at the hands of Stoner and Ducati at the US Grand Prix, Rossi has complained the tyre rules are spoiling the championship show.
Rossi was a distant fourth in California and slipped 44 points behind Stoner with seven races remaining.
Using French Michelin tyres, Rossi's Yamaha has won three races this season while Stoner, with Bridgestone tyres from Japan, has won six times.
"At the beginning of the season Valentino and the others were all for the new tyre rules," said Stoner who earlier finished fifth in Germany because of tyre problems.
"And as soon as they don't win the rule is crap, but when they win the rule is nothing.
"I've had my bad races this year, especially in Germany, and I'm not complaining about the tyre rule and that it is unfair.
"They can moan and whinge about it as much as they want but it shows they have had such an advantage in the past and this season they cannot bring a tyre in just for the race.
"It's a matter of relying on the company that supports you to do a good job."
Rossi said after his defeat in America he would consider proposing changes to the tyre regulations.
Under 2007 restrictions, Michelin are unable to bring in hand-made tyres overnight from their factory and all riders are restricted to 17 nominated rear tyres for each race weekend.
"This rule is not good and we need more tyres," Rossi said.
"The problem is for the show because at the end it is the tyre that decides the race."
Until this year Michelin had dominated MotoGP competition with Rossi winning five world championships and 61 races.
However Rossi's famed crew chief, the Adelaide-based engineer Jerry Burgess with 12 world championships to his credit, agrees with Stoner.
"The tyre rule has not been the main reason for Valentino not winning races this season, Burgess said.
"I like the rule, it's equal for everyone and think it should stay."

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Moto GP banned SNS after 2006. After the Elias incident, more and more riders were screaming for equality after they saw what difference it made. Rossi went along with banning them because he didnt want the entire field on them, remember back then, satellite bikes were winning races. Roll forward to 2007, Stoner is kicking Rossi's ... on Bridgestones and he isnt liking it one bit , because, you know, it was ....... up the show. The show was Rossi winning and Dorna agreed, forcing Bridgestone to supply Rossi in 2008 against their will. Hows that for painting a picture J4rno, sounds less and less conspiratorial all the time huh

No-one has ever considered that just maybe - the Michelins were not that bad. Perhaps Rossi and Pedrosa were just panicking at being beaten so badly by Stoner and were grasping at straws; looking for an excuse for having been beaten by some skinny nobody from Australia on a freakin' Ducati.

 

[Keshav]

Not one person has said that Rossi has exclusive use of the SNS

What is being said is that the SNS were developed around one man and then made available to others. It just so happened that one of those riders, Tony Elias could make exceptional use of the tyres with his only race on them, and subsequently that race likely was the pivotal moment in the 2006 championship

There is a significant difference between who they may have been developed around (or based on data supplied) and to whom they were made available

That said, in my world I suspect that there may have been 2 tiers and 2 riders who drove development of the SNS, each based on their own needs

Beat me to it.

 

[povol]

Yes, I don't think Dorna were all that keen on another surprise like 2007.
Do you think if Capirossi had won in 2006, which he/Ducati possibly had the capacity to do, it would have caused disquiet as well?

I dont, Capirossi was part of the in crowd and his title would have been looked at like Haydens, an anomaly. The racing world had years of Capirossi getting beat by Rossi, Stoner was a virtual unknown except for the paddock and fans who really follow the sport. When he burst onto the scene, it was obvious even to the fringe fan that this dude was special, and that worried not only Rossi, but Dorna as well.

 

[J4rn0]

Yes, I don't think Dorna were all that keen on another surprise like 2007.
Do you think if Capirossi had won in 2006, which he/Ducati possibly had the capacity to do, it would have caused disquiet as well?

Short answer is yes, of course.
Verbose answer below.

Bridgestone, a Japanese company, was forced to work with Ducati because the Japanese bike manufacturers, initially, did not take them seriously and didn't want to take risks with them. When Bridgestone became dominant with Ducati, suddenly that situation became an anomaly: Jap vs Jap?! It took only one year to correct it.

Ducati was f*cked by the single supplier rule because they needed a certain kind of tire to make their unique bike design work. That's why they were ready to switch back to Michelin, fully understanding that a dominant Bridgestone would work with Honda and Yamaha. They needed a tire supplier that worked on their requirements.

The 2008-onwards Bridgestone was still a Bridgestone, but it was different from the 2007 version that Ducati required and Stoner preferred. It was made more and more for Honda and Yamaha, each year. Stoner could still make a difference, but only to a point. Him and Ducati were still competitive, but could not win titles any more. That's exactly how Honda and Yamaha wanted them.

Remember that to cure Ducati's front-end problems and understeer, the complete redesign that eventually generated the GP15 was not the only possible way. Technically, there was a much faster, simple and economical way, that unfortunately became impossible after 2008: design an ad-hoc tire.

Where does Rossi stand in all this? Not where some people put him for sure. He certainly wasn't pulling the strings, because had he really had the power to have tires magically designed to his needs, well, how does one explain that he didn't use that power to make Bridgestone design the best tire for the Ducati in 2011-12? Maybe his all-encompassing power had been suspended? Evidently...

 

[Jumkie]

A little something i dug up from 2007

With his world championship goal edging closer, Casey Stoner is urging MotoGP officials to resist the latest attempt by superstar rival Valentino Rossi to change the tyre regulations.
With six wins out of 11 races, Stoner believes the new 2007 tyre rules have created a level playing field and that Rossi is now searching for excuses.
In the wake of his crushing defeat at the hands of Stoner and Ducati at the US Grand Prix, Rossi has complained the tyre rules are spoiling the championship show.
Rossi was a distant fourth in California and slipped 44 points behind Stoner with seven races remaining.
Using French Michelin tyres, Rossi's Yamaha has won three races this season while Stoner, with Bridgestone tyres from Japan, has won six times.
"At the beginning of the season Valentino and the others were all for the new tyre rules," said Stoner who earlier finished fifth in Germany because of tyre problems.
"And as soon as they don't win the rule is crap, but when they win the rule is nothing.
"I've had my bad races this year, especially in Germany, and I'm not complaining about the tyre rule and that it is unfair.
"They can moan and whinge about it as much as they want but it shows they have had such an advantage in the past and this season they cannot bring a tyre in just for the race.
"It's a matter of relying on the company that supports you to do a good job."
Rossi said after his defeat in America he would consider proposing changes to the tyre regulations.
Under 2007 restrictions, Michelin are unable to bring in hand-made tyres overnight from their factory and all riders are restricted to 17 nominated rear tyres for each race weekend.
"This rule is not good and we need more tyres," Rossi said.
"The problem is for the show because at the end it is the tyre that decides the race."
Until this year Michelin had dominated MotoGP competition with Rossi winning five world championships and 61 races.
However Rossi's famed crew chief, the Adelaide-based engineer Jerry Burgess with 12 world championships to his credit, agrees with Stoner.
"The tyre rule has not been the main reason for Valentino not winning races this season, Burgess said.
"I like the rule, it's equal for everyone and think it should stay."

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Moto GP banned SNS after 2006. After the Elias incident, more and more riders were screaming for equality after they saw what difference it made. Rossi went along with banning them because he didnt want the entire field on them, remember back then, satellite bikes were winning races. Roll forward to 2007, Stoner is kicking Rossi's ... on Bridgestones and he isnt liking it one bit , because, you know, it was ....... up the show. The show was Rossi winning and Dorna agreed, forcing Bridgestone to supply Rossi in 2008 against their will. Hows that for painting a picture J4rno, sounds less and less conspiratorial all the time huh

Povol, I'm going to move this post to the SNS thread for posterity. It's as much the smoking gun as we are going to get.

Great find!

 

[JPSLotus]

Short answer is yes, of course.
Verbose answer below.

Bridgestone, a Japanese company, was forced to work with Ducati because the Japanese bike manufacturers, initially, did not take them seriously and didn't want to take risks with them. When Bridgestone became dominant with Ducati, suddenly that situation became an anomaly: Jap vs Jap?! It took only one year to correct it.

Ducati was f*cked by the single supplier rule because they needed a certain kind of tire to make their unique bike design work. That's why they were ready to switch back to Michelin, fully understanding that a dominant Bridgestone would work with Honda and Yamaha. They needed a tire supplier that worked on their requirements.

The 2008-onwards Bridgestone was still a Bridgestone, but it was different from the 2007 version that Ducati required and Stoner preferred. It was made more and more for Honda and Yamaha, each year. Stoner could still make a difference, but only to a point. Him and Ducati were still competitive, but could not win titles any more. That's exactly how Honda and Yamaha wanted them.

Remember that to cure Ducati's front-end problems and understeer, the complete redesign that eventually generated the GP15 was not the only possible way. Technically, there was a much faster, simple and economical way, that unfortunately became impossible after 2008: design an ad-hoc tire.

Where does Rossi stand in all this? Not where some people put him for sure. He certainly wasn't pulling the strings, because had he really had the power to have tires magically designed to his needs, well, how does one explain that he didn't use that power to make Bridgestone design the best tire for the Ducati in 2011-12? Maybe his all-encompassing power had been suspended? Evidently...

Nice gotcha post there J4rn0.

But wasn't there a tire change aimed at trying to make the Ducati more competitive while trying to hurt one particular rider?

Oh that's right, there was since the tire was designed to try and provide better front end feel.

The official tyre supplier to MotoGP™ will provide a new specification front compound, which will further enhance rider feel and warm-up performance.

Bridgestone will introduce a new specification front tyre for the MotoGP™ World Championship, giving the 21 riders taking part in this year’s competition access to the very latest in tyre technology.

This new front tyre is the latest evolution of the 2012 specification MotoGP™ front tyre, and features a revised construction that further enhances rider feel and warm-up performance and was developed following analysis of performance data and rider feedback acquired in pre-season testing.

Due to the overwhelmingly positive appraisal this new front tyre received when tested by riders, Bridgestone, after consultation with Dorna, the FIM and IRTA, has agreed to replace the current front tyre with the new 2012 specification front tyre from the Silverstone round while also making a limited number of the new front tyre available for the Jerez, Estoril, Le Mans and Catalunya rounds.

Starting from Jerez, riders will be allocated two of the new specification front tyres to increase their total allocation for the race weekend to 11 front tyres. The new specification tyre will only be made available in the harder compound option, as the greater durability this option provides makes it better suited for race use. At Silverstone, when the new specification front tyre becomes the standard, the front tyre allocation will return to nine tyres.

Furthermore, following a request from the Safety Commission, Bridgestone has proposed a revision to the wet tyre allocation for each race. Riders are currently allocated four rear and four front wet tyres in a single compound option, or in the case of all practice sessions being wet, five front and rear wet tyres.

Currently, riders have access to only one compound option of wet tyre per race. Under the new proposal, after the first wet practice session, Bridgestone, in consultation with the Safety Commission and organisers may agree to provide wet tyres with an alternative compound option to ensure rider safety in wet conditions. In this case, each rider may choose to replace a maximum of two of their front and/or rear wet tyres with the alternative compound.

To facilitate the revisions to the front tyre and wet tyre allocation, the FIM will propose changes to the tyre allocation regulations to members of the Grand Prix Commission. Should the proposals presented be accepted by the commission members, they will be implemented with immediate effect.

The introduction of a new specification front tyre, and the revision to the wet tyre allocation are the latest in a series of initiatives implemented by Bridgestone to improve rider safety. At Mugello last year, Bridgestone proposed bringing softer rear slick tyre options to six of the remaining races in the 2011 season and a revision to the rear tyre allocation to provide riders with greater flexibility in choosing their final rear tyre allocation. Additionally, Bridgestone increased the number of front tyre compounds available to three from the Brno round, ensuring the availability of a softer front compound at each race.

Hiroshi Yamada - Manager, Bridgestone Motorsport Department:
"Last year we set out with a clear set of technical objectives for our 2012 specification tyres and since they were first tested, we received very good feedback on our path of development. Though rider comments on our original 2012 specification front tyre were positive, we haven’t rested on our laurels and brought new specification front tyres to the pre-season tests as part of our ongoing tyre development programme. One of these new front tyres was met with such an encouraging appraisal from the riders that we proposed to make it available as soon as possible. Due to logistical constraints, we are unable to supply a full allocation of this new specification front tyre until Silverstone, but we have changed our production schedule and made every effort to provide a limited allocation of the new front tyre to riders from the next race.

"I would like to thank all the riders and teams for their commitment to evaluating during pre-season testing and also Safety Advisor to Dorna Loris Capirossi for his ongoing efforts in collating feedback from the riders. I look forward to Jerez with great interest as not only will riders be using our latest specification front tyre in a race setting for the first time, they will also be showcasing the very latest in Bridgestone tyre technology to the world."

Carmelo Ezpeleta – CEO, Dorna Sports:
"Dorna is pleased that Bridgestone will make their new specification front tyre available to riders from the second round of the season at Jerez. During the regular meetings during pre-season testing between Bridgestone and Safety Advisor to Dorna Loris Capirossi, it became apparent that this new specification tyre provided even greater levels of front-end feel to the riders and so we welcome the decision to make the tyre available as soon as possible.

Bridgestone to introduce new specification front tyre

"Gotcha".

 

[Jumkie]

Not just that, but suddenly the weights "needed to change" well after Stoner's Honda was designed with the previous regs in mind. We couldn't have a repeat of the previous year, where TV audience were leaving in yellow droves. Meanwhile Rossi was cursing around on Ducati looking like wet tissue paper.

Surely Rossi's motorhome saw it's fair share of Carmelo visits. Or as J4rn0 puts it, just friendly invitations to chat about the weather.

.

 

[michaelm]

I don't think it is either/or J4rn0. It is possible for both Honda and VR to have undue influence and for the degree of influence to vary.

Certainly Honda didn't seem to be controlling the sport in 2012 when there was a late weight change 1 year into the development of their bike, and the tyres with which the bike was developed and were preferred by their lead rider were withdrawn mid season, as has been said.

I substantially agree with your Ducati narrative, and their preparedness to start again with Michelin was telling. I think how severe the tyre problem was became more obvious in retrospect though, and possibly the worst thing in the whole saga was the scapegoating of a genius called Presiozi, for which VR bears some of the responsibility imo.

Much of the impetus for the tyre changes in 2008 and 2009 came from Rossi imo, whom I believe assigned to a significant degree being beaten by Stoner to a superior bike and/or tyre, rather underestimating Stoner's role. At the time from what Honda were saying they weren't disposed to write off Michelin so immediately, and as Birdman said with his usual perceptiveness if Melandri rather than Stoner had ridden the 2007 Ducati Michelin is still the superior tyre ridden by the the riders who finished 1st and 2nd in the championship.

 

[#22]

Nice gotcha post there J4rn0.

But wasn't there a tire change aimed at trying to make the Ducati more competitive while trying to hurt one particular rider?

Oh that's right, there was since the tire was designed to try and provide better front end feel.



Bridgestone to introduce new specification front tyre

"Gotcha".

I'll add this too, the same tyre becoming mandatory for the front (which is where Ducati's problems were) from the British GP onwards:

Casey Stoner bemused by front tyre switch | MCN

And in true J4rn0 fashion:

 

[J4rn0]

Nice gotcha post there J4rn0.

But wasn't there a tire change aimed at trying to make the Ducati more competitive while trying to hurt one particular rider?

Oh that's right, there was since the tire was designed to try and provide better front end feel.



Bridgestone to introduce new specification front tyre

"Gotcha".

Gotcha?
Are you kidding yourself...
That certainly didn't work for Ducati, in spite of the weasel wording.

 

[J4rn0]

I don't think it is either/or J4rn0. It is possible for both Honda and VR to have undue influence and for the degree of influence to vary.

Certainly Honda didn't seem to be controlling the sport in 2012 when there was a late weight change 1 year into the development of their bike, and the tyres with which the bike was developed and were preferred by their lead rider were withdrawn mid season, as has been said.

I substantially agree with your Ducati narrative, and their preparedness to start again with Michelin was telling. I think how severe the tyre problem was became more obvious in retrospect though, and possibly the worst thing in the whole saga was the scapegoating of a genius called Presiozi, for which VR bears some of the responsibility imo.

Much of the impetus for the tyre changes in 2008 and 2009 came from Rossi imo, whom I believe assigned to a significant degree being beaten by Stoner to a superior bike and/or tyre, rather underestimating Stoner's role. At the time from what Honda were saying they weren't disposed to write off Michelin so immediately, and as Birdman said with his usual perceptiveness if Melandri rather than Stoner had ridden the 2007 Ducati Michelin is still the superior tyre ridden by the the riders who finished 1st and 2nd in the championship.

Everybody underestimated Stoner's contribution at that time. Anyway they succeeded in disrupting the redoutable Stoner-Ducati-Bridgestone package.
Look at what Honda did in succession from 2008 to 2010:

1. Taking Bridgestone away from Ducati
2. Hiring key members of the Ducati team (Suppo and two engineers)
3. Hiring Stoner himself with the entire crew.

One could say they gradually focused their aim better and better... but the aim was clear from the beginning.

 

[BarryMachine]

Everybody underestimated Stoner's contribution at that time.

"I didnt" ............ ( in a "Life of Brian" from the back of the crowd voice.)

 

[michaelm]

Everybody underestimated Stoner's contribution at that time. Anyway they succeeded in disrupting the redoutable Stoner-Ducati-Bridgestone package.
Look at what Honda did in succession from 2008 to 2010:

1. Taking Bridgestone away from Ducati
2. Hiring key members of the Ducati team (Suppo and two engineers)
3. Hiring Stoner himself with the entire crew.

One could say they gradually focused their aim better and better... but the aim was clear from the beginning.

The Marlboro man rather than Honda did most of that, and his reward appears to have been to be put in charge of the Ferrari F1 Team.

 

[Jumkie]

I'll add this too, the same tyre becoming mandatory for the front (which is where Ducati's problems were) from the British GP onwards:

Casey Stoner bemused by front tyre switch | MCN

And in true J4rn0 fashion:
:

It's fascinating how so much underbelly is exposed on the subject of Rossi's centric driven tires bias throughout the years, the reaction from those refusing to see the trend is to stick their heads in the sand, scream "conspiracy" (as if that magically makes it all go away).

22, despite so many being unaware of the effect of SNS-doping, some members that know about have found some way to rationalize it didn't represent some advatages. Despite a quote from Rossi saying in effect, 'tires decide the race'. These same people will point to 08/09 and declared, no SNS existed then, but like your post above, they seem oblivious to Dorna's influence over the tire supplier. Let me add a bit of forgotten 'truth' (I say "truth" because like J4rn0, Daniboy declared he only believes in "truth" despite the truth being in his face he still doesn't seem to get it). In 2008, at the Brno race, there was a special safety meeting before the race, ALL the Michelin riders demanded of Dorna to declare a "single tire supplier". Some Bridgestone riders didn't want this. Keep in mind, the only rider that was allowed to switch to Bridgestone in 08 was Rossi. And like your article above, Casey Stoner was aware that the tires had become restricted and changed detrimental to him, hence why he requested to use the 07 spec Bridgestone during the 08 season. These are all facts, or as Daniboy might say "untruth". Dorna was so unsympathetic to their plight (and why would Dorna care, Rossi was already happy on 'his' Bridgestones) for the Michelin riders that they attempted to do something similar to the F1 2005 protest of drivers at Indy. Do you remember that? (Daniboy is BJCing as he reads this.) Before the Brno race Dani Pedrosa tried to convince all the Michelin riders to pull in after the warm up lap! That is right, refuse to race as an open protest to the TIRE situation!

Well, unfortunately the Michelin riders didn’t unite (despite ALL of them expressing themselves with the same sentiment in the 'private' safety meeting). It's difficult to put your neck on the line in an environment where you're aware of the repercussions that surely would come from Dorna. Why did Dani Pedrosa feel so strongly that he could challenge Dorna's refusal to allow him and others to switch to Bridgestone? Simple. Because Alberto Puig, a powerful figure and advocate for Pedrosa was on his side, and in fact (or "untruth") was actively trying to instigate the Michelin shod riders to pull into the pits and refuse to race! This is sensation stuff.

In the words of Rossi: '...because tires decide races.' Which is convenient for him given he has had much influence over his tires where not even the second most power rider in 2008 could get a switch. Though power politics did allow Pedrosa to switch mid season in 2008 (Edit correction). I'm sure Alberto Puig was busy after Brno 08 having his own 'motorhome meetings'. Though consider to what length Albert Puig was willing to go, given his knowledge of the sport, surely Carmelo didn't want a unhappy Puig. I should note, that while Pedrosa was allowed to switch to Bridgestone 'mid season' Nicky Hayden did not. Indication of power politics? Of course. Or as J4rn0 and Daniboy might say, "untruths".

Combine that incident, with Stoner's above, with Pedrosa's recent comments after Jerez...

Dani Pedrosa also had some scathing comments about the Michelin tires change in performance after Jerez 16. Interestingly, Michelin seem quite satisfied at the moment with their tire. Sound familiar? The truth is not so subtle, but that's never stopped anyone from seeing it.

'It's the tires stupid.'

 

[J4rn0]

The Marlboro man rather than Honda did most of that, and his reward appears to have been to be put in charge of the Ferrari F1 Team.

Mr. Arrivabene probably gave additional reasons to Stoner (and others) to leave Ducati, but had no power on who Honda hired. His Ferrari appointment was decided by Marchionne, who arrived at the top of Ferrari only recently through Fiat. Looks more like internal Marlboro career and sponsor politics to me...

 

[#22]

I recall that, though had to BJC the details. It is interesting that both Pedrosa AND Honda were scathing of Michelin after that race:

MotoGP News - Pedrosa, Honda blast Michelin.

And this statement I found interesting:

The Spaniard, third in the championship and a double 2008 race winner, finished ahead of only Randy de Puniet, who fell, and set just the 15th fastest lap time out of the 17 riders. Brno marked the second event in succession at which Michelin has failed to supply competitive tyres.

By contrast, the same specification factory Honda, in the hands of Gresini's Shinya Nakano for the first time this weekend, set the third fastest lap of the race - 2.2secs quicker than Pedrosa - and progressed from twelfth on lap one to fourth at the finish.

It was mid 2008 that Pedrosa strongarmed his way to Bridgestones iirc correctly Jums. Rossi's infamous "I want Bridgestones or I quit" rant in 2007 is strong in my memory still.

While looking for that, I found this:

MotoGP: Bridgestone blame Valentino Rossi for one-make tyre proposal | MCN

And he believes Valentino Rossi has used his considerable influence to get Dorna to propose such a radical rule change.

“I think the power of Rossi is very strong with Mr Ezpeleta. I believe he is the main reason for this,” said Yamada,

He is upset that at the first hint of problems for their rivals, most notably Michelin duo Valentino Rossi and Dani Pedrosa, Dorna is proposing a radical rule change.