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Pending Dorna Bailout (Rossi threatening not to race in Valencia)

What ever points Rossi gets in Valencia they represent the sham that is Race Direction. Mike, would you like to debate this with me? Because you sound like Rossi's participation in Valencia is legitimate.

Not the point I was discussing with Yamaka, whom I have always found to be eminently reasonable but who seemed to be buying into the argument about MM being at fault and not being entitled to race Valentino, which is somewhat tangential to what you are now raising.

I continue to believe that a rider is always entitled (pretty well mostly obliged actually) to race legally for position, and that moral obligation to a contender extends only to not taking him out by a rash/unfeasible move cf Pedrosa/Hayden 2006, which was amplified by them being team mates.

Ask Gaz who has been a steward whether the penalty was insufficient. Purely imo the stuff from Mike Webb about MM's contribution on this occasion is nonsense, for the reasons you have said, since the evidence apparently included data obtained by reading MM's mind as you say.
 
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Definitely Yeah, Yakama46 is the homie. I was just trying to make the point that I do not see Rossi's participation at Valencia as legitimate.

Edit: excellent points Mike. Ive started to become quite annoyed with this victim shaming that Marc is experiencing. As you well know I have been one of his greatest detractors. Probably more ballistic on him than Rossi in the last two years. However if you take the last two races the moves he has conducted have been remarkably clean. Yet he has become the bad guy in all this solely based on Rossi's ........ accusations.
 
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Ask Gaz who has been a steward whether the penalty was insufficient. Purely imo the stuff from Mike Webb about MM's contribution on this occasion is nonsense, for the reasons you have said, since the evidence apparently included data obtained by reading MM's mind as you say.


Not a steward but there or thereabouts

Short answer NO, not sufficient

Long answer, NO definitely insufficient to act as both a punishment and deterrent for future actions


With regards to the MM allegations, Race Direction would have had access to telemetry and I suspect that this may paint a picture that led to Mike Webb's comments regarding Marquez.
 
Moto VD also has access to the telemetry. He jealously guards it.


(Problem is telemetry will tell you the steering angle, bike angle, etc etc, but won't definitively show that an ubrupt change is these was caused by a kick or a knock....which is why we are where we are...)
 
I'm am completely certain if it got announced tomorrow that Honda was using their wild card on Stoner to race at Valencia, VR would meltdown in 2 seconds.

So would his entire fanbase for that matter.

Both would be positive outcomes.

I know you'd love for this to happen. He was not even asked to take Pedrosa's seat when he was away for surgery, HRC choosing Hirsoshi Ayoama instead. Keep dreaming, and close the book on HRC and Stoner.


Casey Stoner Refuses Honda's Wildcard Offer - autoevolution
 
Yes however he wanted to race when Pedrosa was out. HRC said no then.

They tried to make up for it with the wild card, but Casey likes to do things on his own terms.
 
Yes however he wanted to race when Pedrosa was out. HRC said no then.

They tried to make up for it with the wild card, but Casey likes to do things on his own terms.
Give him 6 months uninjured preparation perhaps he could challenge Valentino. On a bike he has never raced, after his injuries, with Valentino fast enough to be leading the championship at this stage in such a competitive season against current opposition? No.
 
I have never seen a top driver or rider threaten not to run a race over a warranted penalty.

It depends how you look at it, but Senna was penalised severly in 1989 at Suzuka. Warranted? I think not, but then the flipside is 1990 WAS warranted and he got off scot free.
 
And his wee brother is ....., boringly ....., not even entertainingly ...... In fact he is so ....., he is ..... at being ...... Hopper watches him and says "that guy is ....."

And thier dad is a proper knob jockey, dancing round the pits like Rudolf Nureyev on coke cause the wee fanny got owned.

Crazy Joe for the title from now til the age of Aquarious

...Just sat down at the desk and seen this. Jeez, this has finished me for today. ......' hell Pete you ......., I'm chucking a sicky.

No .... - I've read some classic .... on PS, but seriously, I'm in a meeting at nine...I'm going to have to go home.
 
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Edit: excellent points Mike. Ive started to become quite annoyed with this victim shaming that Marc is experiencing. As you well know I have been one of his greatest detractors. Probably more ballistic on him than Rossi in the last two years. However if you take the last two races the moves he has conducted have been remarkably clean. Yet he has become the bad guy in all this solely based on Rossi's ........ accusations.

Not touching on the allegations mate but this place has been relatively tame (a few obvious exceptions) compared to a number of other places and it isn't just MM but JL as well in the sights of many a 'fan' (term used loosely).

The opposite is in some of these same places, the 'fans' (again, loosely used) who have suddenly developed immense love and feelings for certain riders who have taken a specific side of the argument, despite many have been extremely critical of these same riders in the very recent past (including as recently as PI)
 
This is worse than doping, he has embarrassed the sport and openly defied it's principles and those of human decency, his points and this year's records of podiums and wins should be stricken from the books.

Just curious: What penalty should Hanika have received...and what penalty should Spaan have received?
 
Definitely Yeah, Yakama46 is the homie. I was just trying to make the point that I do not see Rossi's participation at Valencia as legitimate.

Edit: excellent points Mike. Ive started to become quite annoyed with this victim shaming that Marc is experiencing. As you well know I have been one of his greatest detractors. Probably more ballistic on him than Rossi in the last two years. However if you take the last two races the moves he has conducted have been remarkably clean. Yet he has become the bad guy in all this solely based on Rossi's ........ accusations.

So you consider Mike Webb's statement ("“Despite what Marquez said we think he was deliberately trying to affect the pace of Valentino") as ........ as well? Or not relevant to forming a balanced opinion on this (ugly) episode? Not that balanced views are your forte, we kknow that. :p
 
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J4, have you seen the Agostini comments?

MotoGp, Agostini: «Rossi ha perso la testa» - Tuttosport

Asking as I have seen to supposed translations which have been interspersed with the individual posters 'feelings' so not sure what is genuine and what is not.

General gist seems to be that Ago is more along the Mamola lines but again, I have NFI as I dont trust the translators and (from memory) you read and understand Italian far better than I so thought I would ask. Feel free to PM privately if you wish so as not to reignite anything if preferred
 
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So you consider Mike Webb's statement ("“Despite what Marquez said we think he was deliberately trying to affect the pace of Valentino") as ........ as well? Or not relevant to forming a balanced opinion on this (ugly) episode? Not that balanced views are your forte, we kknow that. :p

But there is a difference between trying to affect someones pace and forcing them off track.
 
So you consider Mike Webb's statement ("“Despite what Marquez said we think he was deliberately trying to affect the pace of Valentino") as ........ as well? Or not relevant to forming a balanced opinion on this (ugly) episode? Not that balanced views are your forte, we kknow that. :p

With all due respect J4rn0, exactly how are MM's motives relevant? Either MM was racing for position legally, which they have said he was, and looked to be the case to me in this particular race, or he wasn't.
 
I guess everybody who finished Between Oliveira in 1st & Kent in 7th in the Moto3 race can be accused of interfering in the championship? .......s did the same at PI the race before too. ;)
 
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I guess everybody who finished Between Oliveira in 1st & Kent in 7th in the Moto3 race can be accused of interfering in the championship? .......s did the same at PI the race before too. ;)

That should be classified as normal racing.
What would not be in the spirit of racing is slow down to benefit or affect someone.

Funny, last year on the same race there was that claim done by Honda and Alex Marquez stating Danny Kent slow down to help Miller! :)
In a lot of ways comparable with this year's claim. (of course without any stupid attitude like we saw this year)
 

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