Launch control SCRAPPED for 2009!!!!!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mylexicon @ Feb 21 2009, 10:26 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I don't see it.

Pedrosa is hugely reliant upon launch control. Remember Qatar 2008?

I seem to remember Honda relying quite heavily on using their launch control system to shoot Pedrosa into the lead by the time he reached turn 1.


Perfect example Lex
Dani started that race from 8th on the grid and was a mile in front by the first corner.
I guess it's an advantage they wont have in 09 unless Honda figure out a way to bypass the new rules.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Frizzle @ Feb 21 2009, 01:00 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Perfect example Lex
Dani started that race from 8th on the grid and was a mile in front by the first corner.
I guess it's an advantage they wont have in 09 unless Honda figure out a way to bypass the new rules.

The trouble with launch control is that it counters "stuff ups" in a very small time. It mimics what they see as a perfect start. Yes this could includes attempts to thwart bogging down, but also too quick a start ( eg. flipping it ...... remember the PI practice start? ) You all seem to be assuming it the lack of launch control will make Pedrosa slower at the start ...... I don't see it ...... the guy is as light as a feather thats why he's always getting the holeshot ....... but also since he does start well it also suggests he doesn't currently need much launch control help ( nobody could possibly stuff up that much so many of his good starts are basically due to just plain good clutch control ....... and little need for intervention by launch control. Launch control just attempts to recover a crappy start hence at least maintain some semblance of a good place into the first corner.

Pedrosa may even excel at starts more ...... who knows?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BarryMachine @ Feb 20 2009, 06:10 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>The trouble with launch control is that it counters "stuff ups" in a very small time. It mimics what they see as a perfect start. Yes this could includes attempts to thwart bogging down, but also too quick a start ( eg. flipping it ...... remember the PI practice start? ) You all seem to be assuming it the lack of launch control will make Pedrosa slower at the start ...... I don't see it ...... the guy is as light as a feather thats why he's always getting the holeshot ....... but also since he does start well it also suggests he doesn't currently need much launch control help ( nobody could possibly stuff up that much so many of his good starts are basically due to just plain good clutch control ....... and little need for intervention by launch control. Launch control just attempts to recover a crappy start hence at least maintain some semblance of a good place into the first corner.

Pedrosa may even excel at starts more ...... who knows?

Who knows?

We got a look a Pedrosa's starting skills in 2007. He's just plain average. He can't make the bike vertical with both feet on the ground so he's always going to be slightly disadvantaged regardless of his weight.

watch rossi et al doing their practice starts in 2007. he basically whanged the throttle wide open and dumped the clutch. a perfect practice start then ensued. now that this will no longer be possible, they will have to rely on throttle/clutch modulation but how does the anti wheelie part of the TC package fit into this? will that not be some form of "launch control" albeit whilst the bike is moving?

another thing is about the 5/8 engine rule. funny how honda are rev-limiting their satellite bikes to test for engine longevity all season long so they know what to do when the deadline hits the factory boys. how did they know this was coming so soon before it was even made official?

i wonder if it is an indication of who has the clout amongst the manufacturers?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BigAl @ Feb 21 2009, 08:35 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>another thing is about the 5/8 engine rule. funny how honda are rev-limiting their satellite bikes to test for engine longevity all season long so they know what to do when the deadline hits the factory boys. how did they know this was coming so soon before it was even made official?

i wonder if it is an indication of who has the clout amongst the manufacturers?


doesn't puig have an office inside dorna's HQ ?. Only needs a memo to be left on a table and we all wondered how come this dirt bag has so much clout in HRC

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BarryMachine @ Feb 21 2009, 03:10 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>The trouble with launch control is that it counters "stuff ups" in a very small time. It mimics what they see as a perfect start. Yes this could includes attempts to thwart bogging down, but also too quick a start ( eg. flipping it ...... remember the PI practice start? ) You all seem to be assuming it the lack of launch control will make Pedrosa slower at the start ...... I don't see it ...... the guy is as light as a feather thats why he's always getting the holeshot ....... but also since he does start well it also suggests he doesn't currently need much launch control help ( nobody could possibly stuff up that much so many of his good starts are basically due to just plain good clutch control ....... and little need for intervention by launch control. Launch control just attempts to recover a crappy start hence at least maintain some semblance of a good place into the first corner.

Pedrosa may even excel at starts more ...... who knows?

I thought the launch control enabled the rider to simply pin the throttle and let the clutch go in the right moment and it took care of the rest?
That's exactly why his PI practice start went so wrong.
Without the launch control he is just as dependant as the rest to control throttle and clutch as the rest of the riders. I suspect that this control wheigh far more than pysical weight during the start.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Babelfish @ Feb 22 2009, 01:24 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I thought the launch control enabled the rider to simply pin the throttle and let the clutch go in the right moment and it took care of the rest?

No I think there was so much Pedro hate going on at that time folk didn't look at it to seriously in terms of the actual launch control. I would suggest that given that Pedro's bike has somewhat more than 200 bhp and weighs a rather minimal amount. Had the launch control failed and Pedro merely just plain "dropped the clutch the bike would have reacted somewhat more dramatically than that. In other words yes launch control may have failed however I still think there was a fair amount of input from ...., its just he expected the normal interference from LC and none was there. hence the bike didn't do much more than flip on the spot. I guess LC also incorporates wheelie control and that was also obviously malfunctioning. But the incident was certainly no 200bph unleashed at the drop of the clutch.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BarryMachine @ Feb 21 2009, 02:54 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>No I think there was so much Pedro hate going on at that time folk didn't look at it to seriously in terms of the actual launch control. I would suggest that given that Pedro's bike has somewhat more than 200 bhp and weighs a rather minimal amount. Had the launch control failed and Pedro merely just plain "dropped the clutch the bike would have reacted somewhat more dramatically than that. In other words yes launch control may have failed however I still think there was a fair amount of input from ...., its just he expected the normal interference from LC and none was there. hence the bike didn't do much more than flip on the spot. I guess LC also incorporates wheelie control and that was also obviously malfunctioning. But the incident was certainly no 200bph unleashed at the drop of the clutch.
How do you know, what are you comparing it to ?? His bike pretty much rode its rear sprocket, what more could more power have done ?

Wait wait wait.

We're forgetting about safety.

Let's take bets on how long it will be until someone loops it off the line and create a "dangerous" racing situation.

We shouldn't be debating LC's departure, we should be attempting to accurately predict it's return.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (roger-m @ Feb 22 2009, 06:23 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>How do you know, what are you comparing it to ?? His bike pretty much rode its rear sprocket, what more could more power have done ?

I'm not comparing it to anything Rog. I'm doing some assuming based on the laws of physics.

If you brought a bike to start rev's and just dropped the cluch ...... it would not just flip on the spot. Pedrosa even seemed to be attempting to bring it back down towards the vertical. Folks were too busy being ......... and laughing at him at the time to even think about what actually happened. Revisit the video and watch it with a view to see Pedrosa's reaction ...... not with a view to "laugh at the Dwarf" as seemed to be the "thing" at the time.

But one thing did occur to me ...... you might be right ...... perhaps what we did see was how Pedrosa will start in 09. However in that case I'd say since the bike virtually just got vertical then fell sideways ...... Pedrosa is one quick acting customer in which case I suspect in general he will be a great starter.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BarryMachine @ Feb 22 2009, 12:25 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I'm not comparing it to anything Rog. I'm doing some assuming based on the laws of physics.

If you brought a bike to start rev's and just dropped the cluch ...... it would not just flip on the spot. Pedrosa even seemed to be attempting to bring it back down towards the vertical. Folks were too busy being ......... and laughing at him at the time to even think about what actually happened. Revisit the video and watch it with a view to see Pedrosa's reaction ...... not with a view to "laugh at the Dwarf" as seemed to be the "thing" at the time.

But one thing did occur to me ...... you might be right ...... perhaps what we did see was how Pedrosa will start in 09. However in that case I'd say since the bike virtually just got vertical then fell sideways ...... Pedrosa is one quick acting customer in which case I suspect in general he will be a great starter.

You sure are making a lots of asumptions here, especially I find it more than a little entertaining that you are able to asume that Pedrosa will be a good starter based on his disaster test start.
Biggest pile of ......... I've heard so far this year.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Babelfish @ Feb 22 2009, 07:33 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Biggest pile of ......... I've heard so far this year.
Yeah, I was thinking that was a steamer... BM we're not buying it!!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BarryMachine @ Feb 21 2009, 03:25 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Folks were too busy being ......... and laughing at him at the time to even think about what actually happened.

After you saw he was okay, you didn't laugh? What's wrong with you?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (SackWack @ Feb 22 2009, 04:08 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>After you saw he was okay, you didn't laugh? What's wrong with you?

No ...... I'm a crusty old coot who hates to see good machinery damaged thats all I could think of .

Also I'm not into all the .... hate.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Babelfish @ Feb 22 2009, 11:33 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>You sure are making a lots of asumptions here, especially I find it more than a little entertaining that you are able to asume that Pedrosa will be a good starter based on his disaster test start.
Biggest pile of ......... I've heard so far this year.

No you ....... ..... if you bothered to read that was merely an answer to somebody who was basing their reason Pedrosa would not cope with starts, on merely that one episode.

If you bothered to read back a tad further you may have come across my post where I said this:
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BarryMachine @ Feb 21 2009, 01:10 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>.... You all seem to be assuming it the lack of launch control will make Pedrosa slower at the start ...... I don't see it ...... the guy is as light as a feather thats why he's always getting the holeshot ....... but also since he does start well it also suggests he doesn't currently need much launch control help ( nobody could possibly stuff up that much so many of his good starts are basically due to just plain good clutch control ....... and little need for intervention by launch control. Launch control just attempts to recover a crappy start hence at least maintain some semblance of a good place into the first corner.

Pedrosa may even excel at starts more ...... who knows?

which is obviously based on his past riding ...... not on a single "episode".


SO yes I agree with this bit ....
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Babelfish @ Feb 22 2009, 11:33 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Biggest pile of ......... I've heard so far this year.
only you aren't able to decipher that it was your own brain your story came from

You really need to stop using babel on my posts babelfish ...... either it stuffs them up, or you can only take in part of the story in at any one time, or ....... you fabricate so many fairy stories you don't know when to stop.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BarryMachine @ Feb 22 2009, 06:56 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>You really need to stop using babel on my posts babelfish ...... either it stuffs them up, or you can only take in part of the story in at any one time, or ....... you fabricate so many fairy stories you don't know when to stop.
Thats rich coming from you The man that can tell the power of a bike by how it flips off the line

Eliminating launch control has more to do with the future just like the reduction to 800cc did. Future problems all nipped in the bud. The clutches might suffer a bit more but nothing else important will happen IMO. Every one of the guys on the grid can get a bike started just fine and after corner one it's every man for himself just like always. It is doubtful that the GS ever had launch control.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (gsfan @ Feb 22 2009, 03:06 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Eliminating launch control has more to do with the future just like the reduction to 800cc did. Future problems all nipped in the bud. The clutches might suffer a bit more but nothing else important will happen IMO. Every one of the guys on the grid can get a bike started just fine and after corner one it's every man for himself just like always. It is doubtful that the GS ever had launch control.

it did have it, just that CV never really used it. not sure if hopper or cappers did either.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BigAl @ Feb 21 2009, 09:31 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>watch rossi et al doing their practice starts in 2007. he basically whanged the throttle wide open and dumped the clutch. a perfect practice start then ensued. now that this will no longer be possible, they will have to rely on throttle/clutch modulation but how does the anti wheelie part of the TC package fit into this? will that not be some form of "launch control" albeit whilst the bike is moving?
launch control = TC.......