Is Lorenzo a worthy champion?

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Jumkie
3405291358189860


I think hes for real. His convictions seem genuine, which is hilarious. Despite the kneejerk reaction to think hes fake becuz we/u may deem his takes over the top, consider we have a guy here like BJC who has expressed and stuck to his insane blaming of Spies for getting acutely ill and saying him mentioning his mechanicals were mere "whining excuse" making. What makes Cookoo any less sane or fake? At least Cookoo is trying to make a case based on some comparative of results, as misguided as his conclusions may be. If nothing else it has served to examine Pedro's last third of the season. What has BJCs take served? Well nothing remotely as interesting thats for sure. It has however served to remind us a 50 year old moron can access the site and not be an alter ego but actually for real. If Cookoo is an alter ego as u suggest, one possibility would be he did so to make us laugh. Reason enuf to be amused, right? However, knowing a grown man like BJC is out there (making and sticking to his stupid takes) actually exists, well, thats a much more interesting thought.
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That make me think you know more than saying sir.


So inhouse maybe?


Or maybe your words are of truth!?


It's got me!
 
Kropotkin
3405261358179957


. 1976 was the last year in which only a rider's best results were counted (6 out of 10).
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To digress: During the early 90's, when half the field was highsiding themselves into injury, didn't they institute a 'drop the worst result' or something like that?
 
Dr No
3405471358205912


 


To digress: During the early 90's, when half the field was highsiding themselves into injury, didn't they institute a 'drop the worst result' or something like that?
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1991, 13 out of 15. For some reason or other.
 
Lorenzo wasn't gifted each race win, he had to go get it.  I am not a big fan of his, especially since he tries to be Rossi, but he is the Champ until dethroned.
 
mh_kingcobra
3405311358192014

In my opinion Lorenzo is the rightfull 2012 champion. I am a "Dani Pedrosa" fan because I like his style and his developement skills. But in the other hand I 'm not closing my eyes to escape reality. Pedrosa can be very competitive when he is in the zone but he is like one of those chess playeres who knocks every chess piece of his opponent but he never knows how to check mate. there is no killing instinct in that guy.In my opinion It takes a lot of mental balance and focus to be on the top for 18 races. Lorenzo kept his eyes open and won the title fair and square. He is  like a chess player who  knows every move his going to make till the end of the game. I once said if Stoner was not injured Lorenzo had a difficult 2nd half of the season. But that has nothing to do with Lorenzo. because Lorenzo knew all his move from the Qatar race. He played 100% on his strong points and was the rider with the least errors. His smooth style and his calm strategy through the whole season won him the 2012 title.
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Unfortunately, I have to disagree with you. He is not the rightful or worthy champion of 2012.

Mr. Lorenzo has a big ego, and is not going to play the game of collecting the points. He wants to show the world he is the best by beating Pedrosa in every race.

But when Pedrosa got the setting sorted out in the last 8 races, Lorenzo failed to beat Pedrosa even once in a fair fight -

And Lorenzo got super lucky because Pedrosa was T-Boned in Misano

Even luckier when Lorenzo's poor throttle control is dropping him further and further down the field in wet Sepang 2012, then the Race Director decided to save his ... and did him a big favour of points damage limitation.


Fact - Lorenzo is not playing any chess, he is simply out there to win as many races as possible going all out, but failed due to so due to his slower speed and lack of talent compared to Pedrosa.

That is why Lorenzo is not rightful or worthy champion of 2012, because he is relying too much on luck factor, instead of relying on his talent.
 
cuckoo bird
3405701358219142


Unfortunately, I have to disagree with you. He is not the rightful or worthy champion of 2012.

Mr. Lorenzo has a big ego, and is not going to play the game of collecting the points. He wants to show the world he is the best by beating Pedrosa in every race.

But when Pedrosa got the setting sorted out in the last 8 races, Lorenzo failed to beat Pedrosa even once in a fair fight -

And Lorenzo got super lucky because Pedrosa was T-Boned in Misano

Even luckier when Lorenzo's poor throttle control is dropping him further and further down the field in wet Sepang 2012, then the Race Director decided to save his ... and did him a big favour of points damage limitation.


Fact - Lorenzo is not playing any chess, he is simply out there to win as many races as possible going all out, but failed due to so due to his slower speed and lack of talent compared to Pedrosa.

That is why Lorenzo is not rightful or worthy champion of 2012, because he is relying too much on luck factor, instead of relying on his talent.
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Post #71.


Your trolls are stale.


 


Money on the fridge!
 
Hey cuckoo, take yer head outta Pedder's .... I can smell Puig's cum on yer breath over the net... and I think his sphincter is constricting an airway or something!! :yuk:
 
If Lorenzo isnt a worthy world champion there has never been one.......idiotic post. Welcome to the forum :clap:
 
cuckoo bird
3405701358219142


Unfortunately, I have to disagree with you. He is not the rightful or worthy champion of 2012.

Mr. Lorenzo has a big ego, and is not going to play the game of collecting the points. He wants to show the world he is the best by beating Pedrosa in every race.

But when Pedrosa got the setting sorted out in the last 8 races, Lorenzo failed to beat Pedrosa even once in a fair fight -

And Lorenzo got super lucky because Pedrosa was T-Boned in Misano

Even luckier when Lorenzo's poor throttle control is dropping him further and further down the field in wet Sepang 2012, then the Race Director decided to save his ... and did him a big favour of points damage limitation.


Fact - Lorenzo is not playing any chess, he is simply out there to win as many races as possible going all out, but failed due to so due to his slower speed and lack of talent compared to Pedrosa.

That is why Lorenzo is not rightful or worthy champion of 2012, because he is relying too much on luck factor, instead of relying on his talent.
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You are trying to make a point but there is something that is missing my friend. Look, Lorenzo might sound like an ego maniac but he is not a ........ There is a difference between what he showes to people and the press and the way he acts about the title and each race. If we take a closer look to the 2nd half half of the season we might make it more clear, I'm starting to talk about the 2nd half from 2 point of views, The Circuit and The Riders.


1) Circuit:  2nd half of the season Honda sorted it's bike, yes, but look at all the circuits. We can say the charecter of the circuits in the 2nd half of the season (except Brno) favors the Honda's more power, late brake etc style, So Lorenzo knew he might have problems in the 2nd half so he tried to get more points as he can. If he can't beat the Honda guys just finish the races on the podium.


2) Riders: Stoner was out of the title game so Lorenzo had one rival out of his way, Pedrosa came to the play and started to win races but with 7 or 8 races left Pedrosa needed to win every race, But with nobody there to beat lorenzo to 3rd what he had to do was to finish every race behind Pedrosa. Yes, Pedrosa was unlucky in Misano when he was at the top of his game, but the same thing happened to Lorenzo in Assen. So each one has a "one Unlucky DNF" so the unlucky race thing is over. Lorenzo in the 2nd half of the season had a more stable and focused state of mind, while Pedrosa had to win and push to limits each and every race. So the possibility of making mistakes for a stressed on the limit mind of Pedrosa is more than Lorenzo (The phillip island race).


 


My Point: Lorenzo Was 100% on his and Yamaha's strong points (more in the 1st half) and made points out of his weaknesses in the 2nd half. This is called a perfect Mind Game. Let your rival push but you be the one to get the title!!!! If Lorenzo is Lucky ( I am saying IF), for a guy that is being constant and focused for 18 rounds Luck is what he desereves!!!!      
 
This thread still sux!


A guy wins twice beating the GOAT, Stoner, Dani and everyone else and we get 5 pages arguing if his effoerts are worthy?


Hobbies gentleman! Get some!
 
mh_kingcobra
3405821358227337

 

You are trying to make a point but there is something that is missing my friend. Look, Lorenzo might sound like an ego maniac but he is not a ........ There is a difference between what he showes to people and the press and the way he acts about the title and each race. If we take a closer look to the 2nd half half of the season we might make it more clear, I'm starting to talk about the 2nd half from 2 point of views, The Circuit and The Riders.

1) Circuit:  2nd half of the season Honda sorted it's bike, yes, but look at all the circuits. We can say the charecter of the circuits in the 2nd half of the season (except Brno) favors the Honda's more power, late brake etc style, So Lorenzo knew he might have problems in the 2nd half so he tried to get more points as he can. If he can't beat the Honda guys just finish the races on the podium.

2) Riders: Stoner was out of the title game so Lorenzo had one rival out of his way, Pedrosa came to the play and started to win races but with 7 or 8 races left Pedrosa needed to win every race, But with nobody there to beat lorenzo to 3rd what he had to do was to finish every race behind Pedrosa. Yes, Pedrosa was unlucky in Misano when he was at the top of his game, but the same thing happened to Lorenzo in Assen. So each one has a "one Unlucky DNF" so the unlucky race thing is over. Lorenzo in the 2nd half of the season had a more stable and focused state of mind, while Pedrosa had to win and push to limits each and every race. So the possibility of making mistakes for a stressed on the limit mind of Pedrosa is more than Lorenzo (The phillip island race).

 

My Point: Lorenzo Was 100% on his and Yamaha's strong points (more in the 1st half) and made points out of his weaknesses in the 2nd half. This is called a perfect Mind Game. Let your rival push but you be the one to get the title!!!! If Lorenzo is Lucky ( I am saying IF), for a guy that is being constant and focused for 18 rounds Luck is what he desereves!!!!      
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Nope, both Honda and Yamaha are equal going into final 8 races of the season. Honda may have acceleration, but Yamaha is great on the brakes and faster corner speed. So it equals out over a lap.

What Lorenzo failed to do in the final 8 races of the season is, use M1 strength to his advantage to beat Pedrosa, this is caused by his lack of talent.


Lorenzo is lucky because he only has Pedrosa to contend with, and bad luck struck Pedrosa again and again.

And Lucky Lorenzo also has help from Race Director in Sepang.

Ability to stay focused for 18 rounds is one thing, but bad luck robbing Pedrosa and Stoner round after round is a totally different matter.

If Lorenzo win it by staying focused for 18 rounds, with Pedrosa and Stoner also both equally focused for 18 rounds, then I say he fully deserves it. But that is not the case.


Lorenzo despite staying focused, also proved that he got his ... whipped in the last 8 races. That makes him an undeserving champion.
 
cuckoo bird
3405861358231336


Nope, both Honda and Yamaha are equal going into final 8 races of the season. Honda may have acceleration, but Yamaha is great on the brakes and faster corner speed. So it equals out over a lap.

What Lorenzo failed to do in the final 8 races of the season is, use M1 strength to his advantage to beat Pedrosa, this is caused by his lack of talent.


Lorenzo is lucky because he only has Pedrosa to contend with, and bad luck struck Pedrosa again and again.

And Lucky Lorenzo also has help from Race Director in Sepang.

Ability to stay focused for 18 rounds is one thing, but bad luck robbing Pedrosa and Stoner round after round is a totally different matter.

If Lorenzo win it by staying focused for 18 rounds, with Pedrosa and Stoner also both equally focused for 18 rounds, then I say he fully deserves it. But that is not the case.

Lorenzo despite staying focused, also proved that he got his ... whipped in the last 8 races. That makes him an undeserving champion.
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There are 3 parts in your post that should be cleared.


1) Your making it sound so simple with your  judgment about Honda and Yamaha without considering the circuits. With your sentence it apears that you have no consideration towards the difference between tracks, You know that circuits have sections and each section has different charecter. The riders have to adjust their style and bike while passing each section in every track. How there is no difference between circuits with more double Apexes and chicanes and a track with tight hair pins and long ... straght?? Yes, It may sound equal in  lap times but overall some of them favors one bike more than another.


 


2) Bad Luck robbing Pedrosa and Stoner over and over? Yes, They had the chatter issue in the first half, but Stoner's 8th position in Muggello was not a bad luck, Pedrosa's 4th postion in Le Mans wasn't bad luck. They both came out of not being stronger than Lorenzo, Stoner's injury was not a bad luck, He hates indianapolis, He stayed with the old chassis and got injured. Pedrosa's PhillipIsland DNF was not bad luck, He pushed it too hard to get in front of stoner from the first lap the cold tyre got his ... bitten.


 


3) Lorenzo was not in a hurry to win every battle in the 2nd half of the season... He had a different state of mind, He wanted points to get the title. A Quote from the book ART OF WAR might help you get this thing clear: " Ultimate excellence lies not in winning every battle but in defeating the enemy without ever fighting " . This is what Lorenzo did the 2nd half of the season.


 


The Picture in the following link shows Lorenzo and Pedrosa in the 2012 season.


 


http://www.powerslide.net/forum/index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_id=13917


 


Cheers
 
mh_kingcobra
3405911358233321

There are 3 parts in your post that should be cleared.

1) Your making it sound so simple with your  judgment about Honda and Yamaha without considering the circuits. With your sentence it apears that you have no consideration towards the difference between tracks, You know that circuits have sections and each section has different charecter. The riders have to adjust their style and bike while passing each section in every track. How there is no difference between circuits with more double Apexes and chicanes and a track with tight hair pins and long ... straght?? Yes, It may sound equal in  lap times but overall some of them favors one bike more than another.

 

2) Bad Luck robbing Pedrosa and Stoner over and over? Yes, They had the chatter issue in the first half, but Stoner's 8th position in Muggello was not a bad luck, Pedrosa's 4th postion in Le Mans wasn't bad luck. They both came out of not being stronger than Lorenzo, Stoner's injury was not a bad luck, He hates indianapolis, He stayed with the old chassis and got injured. Pedrosa's PhillipIsland DNF was not bad luck, He pushed it too hard to get in front of stoner from the first lap the cold tyre got his ... bitten.

 

3) Lorenzo was not in a hurry to win every battle in the 2nd half of the season... He had a different state of mind, He wanted points to get the title. A Quote from the book ART OF WAR might help you get this thing clear: " Ultimate excellence lies not in winning every battle but in defeating the enemy without ever fighting " . This is what Lorenzo did the 2nd half of the season.

 

The Picture in the following link shows Lorenzo and Pedrosa in the 2012 season.

 
http://www.powerslide.net/forum/index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_id=13917

 

Cheers
Click to expand...
If Lorenzo is fast and talented enough, he will win most of the last 8 races in 2012 without taking too much risk.


Being cautious with the title in his mind is not the reason Lorenzo failing to beat Pedrosa is last 8 races. That is not how championship are won, the saying goes -

" keep on winning and the championship will take care of itself"


You see, if we follow by your logic that Lorenzo is playing it safe in last 8 races, its not correct. Lorenzo obviously tries to take as many wins as possible. By always finishing second, at one point the gap is down from 30 over points to 18 points, that is hardly a strategy, that is just putting himself in huge pressure seeing points coming down every race.

And that shall put him vulnerable to mistakes.

Every rider would always at least want a more than 25 points lead to have the one race margin for psychological comfort.



So I don't agree on looking at the big picture while allowing the points to reduce from 30 over to 18 points. Lorenzo was just very lucky when the points is reduced to a stage within "real pressure zone", bad luck strike Pedrosa with the Misano T-bone crash.


That is why Lorenzo is lucky and does not deserve the title. If no bad luck strike Pedrosa, the points gap would have been equal, and possibly Lorenzo crash under pressure.
 
kingcobra - save your breath (or in this case keystrokes). You cannot enlighten an irrational person.
 
Mick D
3405941358234483

kingcobra - save your breath (or in this case keystrokes). You cannot enlighten an irrational person.
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Giving up on a potential constructive debate shows that you share Stoner's characteristics of hiding away from challenges.
 
Mick D
3405941358234483


kingcobra - save your breath (or in this case keystrokes). You cannot enlighten an irrational person.
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 I was just hitting my poor keystrokes to death till I saw your post and reconsidered. Thanks alot ... Silence Treatment Has Shown A Lot Of Possitive Effect On Mentally Challenged Guys, But I dont know if it will work for emotional fanboys. This is why I try for one more post and then I'm done. In Silence Treatment We Trust.


 


Dear Cuckoo Bird


 


The Only Way Pedrosa was going to win the title was by Lorenzo getting a 3rd possition. with Stoner gone by an injury he caused himself who was the one to push Lorenzo back from the title?? and from another point of view, Do you think Lorenzo would do the same thing if Stoner was still there. No, He would fight more to at least keep Stoner out of harms way or at some occasions give Pedrosa a hard time. I'm not under estimating Pedrosa's effort in the 2nd half of the season. As he said in his repsol blog he did what he had to do. Fight till the end. But it was just too late. Even Pedrosa knew that!!!


 


Hope It helps widen your point of view more.


 


Cheers
 
MH - great spreadsheet. After looking at it I realised what a good champion Jorge is, he had a window of opportunity to get into the lead after Stoner's out and he acted decisively but with grand calculation and at the right time. 


 


I love a good spreadsheet, thanks dude. 
 
Andy Roo
3405981358235878


MH - great spreadsheet. After looking at it I realised what a good champion Jorge is, he had a window of opportunity to get into the lead after Stoner's out and he acted decisively but with grand calculation and at the right time. 


 


I love a good spreadsheet, thanks dude. 
Click to expand...


 


My pleasure dear friend :D


 


Good Luck!!!!
 
mh_kingcobra
3405961358235321

 I was just hitting my poor keystrokes to death till I saw your post and reconsidered. Thanks alot ... Silence Treatment Has Shown A Lot Of Possitive Effect On Mentally Challenged Guys, But I dont know if it will work for emotional fanboys. This is why I try for one more post and then I'm done. In Silence Treatment We Trust.

 

Dear Cuckoo Bird

 

The Only Way Pedrosa was going to win the title was by Lorenzo getting a 3rd possition. with Stoner gone by an injury he caused himself who was the one to push Lorenzo back from the title?? and from another point of view, Do you think Lorenzo would do the same thing if Stoner was still there. No, He would fight more to at least keep Stoner out of harms way or at some occasions give Pedrosa a hard time. I'm not under estimating Pedrosa's effort in the 2nd half of the season. As he said in his repsol blog he did what he had to do. Fight till the end. But it was just too late. Even Pedrosa knew that!!!

 

Hope It helps widen your point of view more.

 

Cheers
Click to expand...


It would not make a difference whether Stoner is around or not, maybe worse if Stoner is around, he would have got his ... whipped by two riders instead of just one rider.

And that would make him even more undeserving champion.

What Pedrosa knew was that, if you have the luck of Lucky Lorenzo, you are guranteed a championship...Lorenzo is really that lucky. With such luck for Lorenzo, and such bad luck for his rivals, there is no way anyone else would have taken that title in 2012
 

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