Can Rossi beat Lorenzo at least once in a Race or Qualifying this season?

Dr No · Jun 3, 2013

spottswoode

3529491370321668

Fighting with Marquez at Qatar?

Sooo. One race out of 5 against a rookie in his first race = "Rossi is still extremely good at battling. He seems to be able to pass any other rider at will" ??

I get what elite's intending to say. But it's been a looooong time since VR was able to just stuff it where he wanted to (ooo errr!)

muzzy57 · Jun 4, 2013

spottswoode

3529491370321668

Fighting with Marquez at Qatar?

Seriously? Fighting against a rookie in his first ever MotoGP race is the best evidence available?

cliche guevara · Jun 4, 2013

Why isn't this poll public?

So who's got lorenzo to hand rossi his ... throughout the entire season?

Come on now , be men.

BJ.C · Jun 4, 2013

Garbin · Jun 4, 2013

Nine il Clowno fans? Who can they be? :scratch: Chances are Rossi could do it but only if Lorenzo gets torpedoed

Ngads · Jun 4, 2013

i would have said yes, at mugello, but we all know how that turned out.

Its a long season tho im sure somewhere he will be able to.

As for cal vs rossi in the final standings, i think rossi will be on top at the end of the year.

BJ.C · Jun 4, 2013

Garbin

3529901370362618

Nine il Clowno fans? Who can they be? :scratch: Chances are Rossi could do it but only if Lorenzo gets torpedoed

There's a difference between beating and finishing ahead. If Lorenzo suffers a mishap and Rossi doesn't, he didn't get beaten.

lil red rocket pilot · Jun 4, 2013

cliché guevara

3529801370358923

Why isn't this poll public?

So who's got lorenzo to hand rossi his ... throughout the entire season?

Come on now , be men.

As I have said before PI may be Rossi's only chance unless lollo goes for a flyer at another track.

I just cannot see Rossi getting back to his best.

Garbin · Jun 4, 2013

BJ.C

3530001370366678

There's a difference between beating and finishing ahead. If Lorenzo suffers a mishap and Rossi doesn't, he didn't get beaten.

Trust me, for a bopper finishing ahead will count for a win... they are really that desperate. WTF now it's 10 - 10 !!!

spottswoode · Jun 4, 2013

muzzy57

3529631370340502

Seriously? Fighting against a rookie in his first ever MotoGP race is the best evidence available?

In all fairness, a rookie that finished that race ahead of Dani Pedrosa... a rookie that was leading the championship after three rounds...

Rossi also fought his way past Crutchlow, Pedrosa, and a few others after his braking mistake on lap one.

Not really a Rossi apologist, but I definitely thought he was back after Qatar. I doubt I'm the only one...

muzzy57 · Jun 5, 2013

spottswoode

3530551370401579

In all fairness, a rookie that finished that race ahead of Dani Pedrosa... a rookie that was leading the championship after three rounds...

Rossi also fought his way past Crutchlow, Pedrosa, and a few others after his braking mistake on lap one.

Not really a Rossi apologist, but I definitely thought he was back after Qatar. I doubt I'm the only one...

I might be inclined to agree, but the "evidence" singled out the battle with Marquez as proof...

There's no doubt that Rossi was a past master at the "cut & thrust" style of racing that gradually faded in the 800 era ( with a few notable exceptions of course ) but the contemporary pilots have tended to emulate the methods of one Casey Stoner, ie win by sheer speed. Better to gap your rivals & win by 5 seconds than to give them the chance to duff you up in the last corner!

It's the worst kept secret that in the 990 era Rossi was so dominant speed wise, that he could afford to keep his rivals in the hunt & let them "battle" with him, thus keeping the spectacle for the masses... Before blasting off into the sunset & the cheering adulation of his fan base!

Now that he doesn't have that excess speed in reserve, the battles are few & far between... Not just for Rossi I guess but for all the top guys.

Maybe if Marquez ends up that much faster than everyone else in time to come, we might end up seeing the "battles" come back into MotoGP?

Talpa · Jun 5, 2013

muzzy57

3530661370420795

I might be inclined to agree, but the "evidence" singled out the battle with Marquez as proof...

There's no doubt that Rossi was a past master at the "cut & thrust" style of racing that gradually faded in the 800 era ( with a few notable exceptions of course ) but the contemporary pilots have tended to emulate the methods of one Casey Stoner, ie win by sheer speed. Better to gap your rivals & win by 5 seconds than to give them the chance to duff you up in the last corner!

It's the worst kept secret that in the 990 era Rossi was so dominant speed wise, that he could afford to keep his rivals in the hunt & let them "battle" with him, thus keeping the spectacle for the masses... Before blasting off into the sunset & the cheering adulation of his fan base!

Now that he doesn't have that excess speed in reserve, the battles are few & far between... Not just for Rossi I guess but for all the top guys.

Maybe if Marquez ends up that much faster than everyone else in time to come, we might end up seeing the "battles" come back into MotoGP?

Do you have any evidence of the 'worst kept secret?' Other than the usual and lame PI 2003....?

And 18 years at the top level in the world, the majority of them as no 1, being in his mid thirties against those mostly 10+ years his junior doesn't have something to do with his wane in form?

How about the ridiculous regulations and electronics driven fuel limits, hopelessly ineffective and insufficient tyre supply, the difference between this series in 2006 to now (let alone between the 500s & 990's) is gigantic, for a rider to consistently adapt to what have been several of the most significant technical regulation changes to the sport since its inception is remarkable. To add to this, theyve now turned qualifying on its head to try to avoid 'towing' advantages, only to encourage it, and increase towing like never before......... they simply changed a compound supply and it completely farked Stoner last year......Rossi has been through a few more upheavals than this

In actually amazed that Rossi and his team can still pull out races like Qatar 2013 and what might have been at Mugello or Le Mans.

And Qatar was a great example of his ability to still cut through the field, unless you consider Dani, Cal, Marquez, Dovi and Bradl to be part of the Worst kept secret in Motogp as well?

Also, did Jorge finish in front of Rossi at Mugello and Le Mans, or beat him?

Dr No · Jun 5, 2013

All that desperate typing....just look at the points.

Just as bad as using his current form to detract from his record, is to that record to justify his (by his standards) poor showing this year.

Big Jorge · Jun 5, 2013

Rossi was certainly on course to beat JLo in Le Mans but fell off, so we could have had a scorecard of 5-0 and 4-1 and this thread would never have been created.

I hope Rossi gets the better of JLo at points during the season as it will no doubt entail some amazing racing.

Lyria · Jun 5, 2013

Okay my short answer to the given question is no

and my long answer is nooooooooooooooooooooooo! I can't see it happening unless something happens to Lorenzo, certainly not as things are right now.

muzzy57 · Jun 5, 2013

Talpa

3530731370433371

Do you have any evidence of the 'worst kept secret?' Other than the usual and lame PI 2003....?

And 18 years at the top level in the world, the majority of them as no 1, being in his mid thirties against those mostly 10+ years his junior doesn't have something to do with his wane in form?

How about the ridiculous regulations and electronics driven fuel limits, hopelessly ineffective and insufficient tyre supply, the difference between this series in 2006 to now (let alone between the 500s & 990's) is gigantic, for a rider to consistently adapt to what have been several of the most significant technical regulation changes to the sport since its inception is remarkable. To add to this, theyve now turned qualifying on its head to try to avoid 'towing' advantages, only to encourage it, and increase towing like never before......... they simply changed a compound supply and it completely farked Stoner last year......Rossi has been through a few more upheavals than this

In actually amazed that Rossi and his team can still pull out races like Qatar 2013 and what might have been at Mugello or Le Mans.

And Qatar was a great example of his ability to still cut through the field, unless you consider Dani, Cal, Marquez, Dovi and Bradl to be part of the Worst kept secret in Motogp as well?

Also, did Jorge finish in front of Rossi at Mugello and Le Mans, or beat him?

A lot of the points you brought up here are valid but as Rossi is the only rider that has had his career span so many rule changes & eras, only he could comment on the relative merits or disadvantages that the various changes have brought.

One could argue that this knowledge & experience gives him an advantage that none of the other riders presently have?

As for your requested evidence as to Rossi's tactics... Are you serious? I'm assuming from your posts that I've read during the last 6 years on this forum, that you're truly a fan of the sport. This said, you don't need either myself or anyone else to go trolling back through all the historical footage to give the examples that you've asked for. Simply put, I'm sure that if you're anything like myself, you've pretty much watched every race run during the last couple of decades & despite your natural compulsion to "defend" VR from any derision, even you should have seen what was really going on.

As I said in the post above, the only reason he could toy with the competition in such a way is because he was so head & shoulders better at the time... This is a complement. That he tried to make a better spectacle of it is also not a bad thing & it certainly added to his legion of fans! But it does not change the situation that in most of the close "battles" that he fought during those years, he was rarely truly challenged...

Jumkie · Jun 5, 2013

Lyria

3530771370435372

Okay my short answer to the given question is no

and my long answer is nooooooooooooooooooooooo! I can't see it happening unless something happens to Lorenzo, certainly not as things are right now.

:lol: Well, thats the long and short of it.

Talpa · Jun 5, 2013

Dr No

3530751370434119

All that desperate typing....just look at the points.

Just as bad as using his current form to detract from his record, is to that record to justify his (by his standards) poor showing this year.

Lame

As usual

Mental Anarchist · Jun 5, 2013

Talpa

3531141370465556

Lame

As usual

Wow, you have come along way being able to inwardly reflect like that Talpa.

Talpa · Jun 5, 2013

muzzy57

3530801370436646

A lot of the points you brought up here are valid but as Rossi is the only rider that has had his career span so many rule changes & eras, only he could comment on the relative merits or disadvantages that the various changes have brought.

One could argue that this knowledge & experience gives him an advantage that none of the other riders presently have?

As for your requested evidence as to Rossi's tactics... Are you serious? I'm assuming from your posts that I've read during the last 6 years on this forum, that you're truly a fan of the sport. This said, you don't need either myself or anyone else to go trolling back through all the historical footage to give the examples that you've asked for. Simply put, I'm sure that if you're anything like myself, you've pretty much watched every race run during the last couple of decades & despite your natural compulsion to "defend" VR from any derision, even you should have seen what was really going on.

As I said in the post above, the only reason he could toy with the competition in such a way is because he was so head & shoulders better at the time... This is a complement. That he tried to make a better spectacle of it is also not a bad thing & it certainly added to his legion of fans! But it does not change the situation that in most of the close "battles" that he fought during those years, he was rarely truly challenged...

Not realty serious, I only pop in here now to stir the pot and have a laugh

You do have some good points also, I have stated many times before that the demeaning of the competition Rossi faced in the 990 era is usually an all to convient way to try to cheapen His achievements, not saying you are doing this, but it has been commonplace in debate here. I however feel as though riders like Max, Barros, Crivelle, Roberts Jnr, Sete, Nicky, Melandri, Loris and co were all brillant in their day.

My personal view is that the type of machine and regs, fuel, tyre supply etc back then allowed for Rossis style and race tactics rather than his competition was sub par, now the game has changed dramatically and he's old.

I never ridden one so I can't say, but from what I've read, simply riding a 990 at speed was a serious challenge. Rossi was the best of that era, and that era was full of superb riders-the best in the world at the time in fact.....

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Can Rossi beat Lorenzo at least once in a Race or Qualifying this season?