Valencia Test

Barbedwirebikerr · Nov 22, 2018

p4p1 said:
Did Stoner even give a detailed insight to steel trellis frame vs carbon frame vs twin bar aluminium?

It'd be hard for him to do so as his experience crossed manufacturers. If he had of had Ducati experience across this evolution that would be more worthwhile. Imo.

p4p1 · Nov 22, 2018

Barbedwirebikerr said:
It'd be hard for him to do so as his experience crossed manufacturers. If he had of had Ducati experience across this evolution that would be more worthwhile. Imo.

After listen to Neil about talk about the differences in the chassis i would've loved to hear a rider give his insights as well.

Barbedwirebikerr · Nov 22, 2018

p4p1 said:
After listen to Neil about talk about the differences in the chassis i would've loved to hear a rider give his insights as well.

I agree. Maybe we will hear from Zarco in a few years as KTM evolve.

michaelm · Nov 22, 2018

p4p1 said:
Did Stoner even give a detailed insight to steel trellis frame vs carbon frame vs twin bar aluminium?

He said however bad people thought the carbon fibre bike was the trellis frame bike was worse. I think part of the problem was that it was an artisanal product, and even for him as the lead rider his second bike wasn’t the same as his number 1 bike, I guess it was adjustable which the carbon fibre bike wasn’t. He continued to maintain that the 2009 bike was fine, and his health was the problem, and his performances when healthy gave some credence to this. I guess they couldn’t do much on a given week-end to adjust the carbon fibre chassis though, and no-one else could ride his style, and the control tyre moved away from Ducati as well. They had no capacity to build an aluminium twin spar chassis back then as everyone will recall, and actually had to contract out when Valentino correctly I guess insisted on such a chassis.

It was interesting hearing Spalding reflect on how floppy a steel trellis frame chassis is.

povol · Nov 22, 2018

Marc Márquez was the third fastest of the MotoGP tests in Valencia, at 0.154s from the top. After reaching the lead on Wednesday, Marc Márquez was the third fastest of the MotoGP tests in Valencia, at 0.154s from the top. After reaching the lead on Wednesday, the Honda man did not beat Maverick Viñales (Yamaha) and Andrea Dovizioso (Ducati), but he did not try to do it because crashing was prohibited.Speaking to the AS newspaper, the world champion said on the one hand that he could not force his progress since it was forbidden to suffer a fall and, on the other, that there were many things to test: ‘At the end of the track tests It was good, but it was not the day to force it. They forbidden me from falling. They told me that if I fell I wouldn’t go to Jerez. I was threatened with a hard punishment, so I took it easy and ended up testing things I had to test, but I did not test everythingthe Honda man did not beat Maverick Viñales (Yamaha) and Andrea Dovizioso (Ducati), but he did not try to do it because crashing was prohibited.Speaking to the AS newspaper, the world champion said on the one hand that he could not force his progress since it was forbidden to suffer a fall and, on the other, that there were many things to test: ‘At the end of the track tests It was good, but it was not the day to force it. They forbidden me from falling. They told me that if I fell I wouldn’t go to Jerez. I was threatened with a hard punishment, so I took it easy and ended up testing things I had to test, but I did not test everything

evo9 · Nov 22, 2018

p4p1 said:
I’m a big Zarco fan, but listening to Neil Spalding yesterday made me realise how different a KTM would feel. From what he was saying using WP instead of Ohlins could be inhibiting them a lot as wel.

Tell you what. It was eye opening the information he put fourth. They ktm should start with the suspension switch first. And when they are trying to make the Ohlins work. They should have Kalex or the madman next door @ tech3 make them an aluminium frame.

evo9 · Nov 22, 2018

Holypuck said:
I like KTM but racing-wise I think they are rather pretentious.

CEO's past declarations such as "we'll win the title within 5 years" are .........

They prolly feel very powerful due to their humongous financial resources, but investments are only one of the many, many things you need to build up a competitive GP bike.[/COLOR]

I'd be only happy if one more bike (and of a "different" nationality) would be competitive but KTM has a long way to go before they get there and the sooner they acknowledge it, the better.

Got to agree with you there for sure. Their whole racing department I understand is made up ex HRC employees. They will need to steel some more from Ducati and HRC again to make the quantum leap.

povol · Nov 22, 2018

Holypuck said:
I like KTM but racing-wise I think they are rather pretentious.

CEO's past declarations such as "we'll win the title within 5 years" are .........

They prolly feel very powerful due to their humongous financial resources, but investments are only one of the many, many things you need to build up a competitive GP bike.

I'd be only happy if one more bike (and of a "different" nationality) would be competitive but KTM has a long way to go before they get there and the sooner they acknowledge it, the better.

Money certainly helps, but as Toyota found out in F1, you can throw a mountain of cash at a project, but if you’re decades behind the competition in know how
, you may never make it to the top. Toyota was another company that never failed in the racing world until they stuck their toe’s into the shark infested waters . MotoGp isn’t motocross, moto 2 or moto 3, just like F1 isn’t IMSA, NASCAR , trophy truck etc etc.

michaelm · Nov 22, 2018

evo9 said:
Tell you what. It was eye opening the information he put fourth. They ktm should start with the suspension switch first. And when they are trying to make the Ohlins work. They should have Kalex or the madman next door @ tech3 make them an aluminium frame.

That’s the thing. They are not going to be able to get tyres which suit their non standard frame or non-standard suspension for a start. It is a shame, but that is the way it is.

michaelm · Nov 22, 2018

povol said:
Money certainly helps, but as Toyota found out in F1, you can throw a mountain of cash at a project, but if you’re decades behind the competition in know how
, you may never make it to the top. Toyota was another company that never failed in the racing world until they stuck their toe’s into the shark infested waters . MotoGp isn’t motocross, moto 2 or moto 3, just like F1 isn’t IMSA, NASCAR , trophy truck etc etc.

Yamaha and Ducati never even raced against KTM in the other classes, and largely Honda didn’t try, and won when they decided they wanted to in the 250 class.

evo9 · Nov 22, 2018

michaelm said:
That’s the thing. They are not going to be able to get tyres which suit their non standard frame or non-standard suspension for a start. It is a shame, but that is the way it is.

Come to think of it. It would actually be wise of them, to have the Tech3 outfit on Ohlins & a twin spar aluminium frame going forward. Like starting now.

evo9 · Nov 22, 2018

From the mans mouth: Lorenzo after getting off the Honda in Cheste: "I'm very happy"

https://es.motorsport.com/motogp/news/lorenzo-prueba-honda-cheste-estoy-muy-contento/4301515/

Barbedwirebikerr · Nov 22, 2018

evo9 said:
From the mans mouth: Lorenzo after getting off the Honda in Cheste: "I'm very happy"

https://es.motorsport.com/motogp/news/lorenzo-prueba-honda-cheste-estoy-muy-contento/4301515/

There are some great photos at end of the article.

Shows him riding different variants of the RCV.

One photo clearly shows orange bodywork underneath the duck tail, with MM sticker shown. This bike is likely the 2018 version, and Marc's bike. I wonder if he also gets a ride on Dani's bike? Along with the 2019 prototype.

Holypuck · Nov 23, 2018

evo9 said:
Got to agree with you there for sure. Their whole racing department I understand is made up ex HRC employees. They will need to steel some more from Ducati and HRC again to make the quantum leap.

Stealing employes might not be the most ethical thing but it's definitely normal among companies. We all would love a much bigger salary after all

But their declarations...weirdly reminded me of BMW's declarations when they came to Superbike...and we all know how it ended there...

gui22a · Nov 23, 2018

I remember Valencia test at the end of 2016. Lorenzo ended the test with Ducati 0.7~ seconds off the leader. When he passed the reporters, he proudly told to one of them, loud and clear: "I told you! I told you I could ride this bike!".

The rest of the story we all know.

Let's remember that he was jumping from 9 years riding Yamaha directly to Ducati. Now, he's jumping from a bike to another supposedly much more similar to each other.

Holypuck · Nov 23, 2018

gui22a said:
I remember Valencia test at the end of 2016. Lorenzo ended the test with Ducati 0.7~ seconds off the leader. When he passed the reporters, he proudly told to one of them, loud and clear: "I told you! I told you I could ride this bike!".

The rest of the story we all know.

Let's remember that he was jumping from 9 years riding Yamaha directly to Ducati. Now, he's jumping from a bike to another supposedly much more similar to each other.

Supposedly indeed...Honda and Ducati are NOT similar to each other by any means. A mere look at the bikes already gives a good idea of that.

gui22a · Nov 23, 2018

Holypuck said:
Supposedly indeed...Honda and Ducati are NOT similar to each other by any means. A mere look at the bikes already gives a good idea of that.

Indeed, that's the reason I said "supposedly", because we can see how far it is from each other.

Also, Valencia is a tighty and twisty track where the problems of Honda are covered by the track character. Even Ducati's famous understeering is not highlighted here.

I can bet Lorenzo will struggle the whole year to make top 5.

Bern1 · Nov 24, 2018

I will bet that Lorenzo will take a shorter amount of time to suss out the Honda and win a race on it than he did with the Ducati.

Theo · Nov 24, 2018

Holypuck said:
For the Italian riders, 100%. Also because our moto medias are obviously very focused on our own riders, so even the interviews can be very insightful.

For the Spanish it depends. I'd say most of the Spanish riders speak Italian very fluently (some, for example Marquez, sound almost native) and due to the several similarities bewteen the two languages I think it's easier for them to describe feelings on the bike and so on.

Case in point here, my wife is Italian, her best friend is Spanish and they talk in their native tongues and understand each other.

Holypuck · Nov 26, 2018

Theo said:
Case in point here, my wife is Italian, her best friend is Spanish and they talk in their native tongues and understand each other.

I do the same with all my Spanish friends ahahaha

But as per GP riders, like I said, it's crazy how good some of them are at the language. Even Zarco speaks really good Italian

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