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Round 7: 2017 Gran Premi Monster Energy de Catalunya

Gaz said:
Would be the first back to back Ducati wins for 8 or so seasons (irrespective of riders) so good effort Dovi and quite unexpected in that Catalunya is not the best track.

As for the comparison, well I did say it would bite me :D

But in fairness, I will never begrudge Dovi some limelight as riders like him do not get the limelight as they do not fit the 'out there, laugh at all times', or 'say something controversial' mould.

IMO though, big credit Lorenzo who could have easily ridden around but knuckled down as I suspect the tyres came to him which gave him confidence enough to allow him to ride the Ducati closer to how he needs to ride it.

I do again suspect that there will be meeting at Yamaha as twice this season the official factory team have been beaten by the Tech3 team so they do need to look at chassis or similar to try to determine the issues
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Lorenzo really was impressive. Ducati's main strength is the HP; but it's secondary strength would seem to be it capacity to keep the shiny side up - if - ridden fearlessly when it's getting all out of shape. Doesn't look as smooth as the Yamaha, but if the rider really trusts it (when his gut says not to) it does the job, tho doesn't look as pretty doing it.
 
MdubSTYLIE said:
It's to early to call him a contender? Have you looked at the points?
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The points don't mean a thing Dub.

You should know as well as anyone that Ducati hasn't fielded an actual title contender since 2007/2008 and I'm loathe to even consider 2008 since they ...... up with the power increase that cost them a real chance at back-to-back titles. At any rate, if Dovi is still in P2, or even P1 come September 1st, I'll consider him a legitimate contender at that point.

Being close in points doesn't mean a thing if it's non sustainable over the course of 18 races. One or two race wins do not make someone a legitimate title contender. Look at 2006 if you need any further proof of such a thing. Melandri and Capirossi took more wins than Hayden, but what did it mean in the end? Nothing.
 
p4p1 said:
If I can just point a few things out.
Rossi is only 8 points ahead of Zarco - I expect him to finish well in front though.

The other things is that Lorenzo goes to Ducati, he along with Stoner have huge input t development and Ducati get back to back wins for the first time since Stoner in 2010. I expect them to win at least once more this year given that the red bull ring is their dream track.
Meanwhile where Lorenzo just left at Yamaha they have two weeks in unfavourable conditions and have an almost unprecedented stuggle in those weekends for their factory riders. During those they were beaten by at least one of the Lorenzo developed 2016 Yamahas.
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What development input from Lorenzo?

The GP17 was developed long before he got there and he had no real input into that bike other than whatever Dall'Igna thought would work for his style and as we've seen, the bike was not suited for Lorenzo out of the gate. They also lost a lot of time with the Hammerhead fairing that never was run, though Gigi says there is another fairing design being worked on that may show up for the second half of the season.
 
JPSLotus said:
The points don't mean a thing Dub.

You should know as well as anyone that Ducati hasn't fielded an actual title contender since 2007/2008 and I'm loathe to even consider 2008 since they ...... up with the power increase that cost them a real chance at back-to-back titles. At any rate, if Dovi is still in P2, or even P1 come September 1st, I'll consider him a legitimate contender at that point.

Being close in points doesn't mean a thing if it's non sustainable over the course of 18 races. One or two race wins do not make someone a legitimate title contender. Look at 2006 if you need any further proof of such a thing. Melandri and Capirossi took more wins than Hayden, but what did it mean in the end? Nothing.
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But its not the points that matter as much a Dovi and his consistency. Something no one else has shown this year. There are some proper ducati tracks yet. Points aside I still say he is a contender.
 
Keshav said:
It is pretty weird to see Yamaha struggle so much. I'm very curious to hear hw they're going to present this to the press. They're running the tire Rossi wanted. WTF is keeping them back?
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The new employee hasn't realised that he is delivering the Saturday night specials to the wrong Italian.
 
I strongly suspect the missing consistency is not in Dovi, but rather in the capacity of the Ducati itself to adjust to varying weather and track conditions.
 
JPSLotus said:
The points don't mean a thing Dub.

You should know as well as anyone that Ducati hasn't fielded an actual title contender since 2007/2008 and I'm loathe to even consider 2008 since they ...... up with the power increase that cost them a real chance at back-to-back titles. At any rate, if Dovi is still in P2, or even P1 come September 1st, I'll consider him a legitimate contender at that point.

Being close in points doesn't mean a thing if it's non sustainable over the course of 18 races. One or two race wins do not make someone a legitimate title contender. Look at 2006 if you need any further proof of such a thing. Melandri and Capirossi took more wins than Hayden, but what did it mean in the end? Nothing.
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Dovi is being consistent as well, and 7 races is more than a third of a season. As has been said, his only bad result was due to the mistake of another rider. Vinales looked like he would do it easily before the tyre change, but 'his' tyre is gone now. I would still favour MM if he keeps riding smart as he did today, but as as has also been said this won't be Ducati last win, there are circuits to come which favour them, particularly Austria.
 
Keshav said:
It is pretty weird to see Yamaha struggle so much. I'm very curious to hear hw they're going to present this to the press. They're running the tire Rossi wanted. WTF is keeping them back?
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I think in an effort to cure last season's cooler weather woes, they swung the pendulum too far in the other direction so it's going to come at the expense of hot weather races. Last season's M1 was fantastic in the hot, low grip conditions of Jerez and Catalunya as Rossi took wins at both circuits.

I've actually got a theory that climate change is impacting this championship significantly and fueled the direction Yamaha went with the design of the M1. Long range forecasts say the northern part of the mainland (Germany) will see cooler temperatures and rain. Northern Europe looks to be cooler. Looking ahead to Assen, temperatures look to be in the low 70s at highest with possible rain. Spain/Italy are going to be in for a heatwave this summer, and that may play a decisive roll on the championship depending on how things unfold at Assen and the Sachsenring.
 
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MdubSTYLIE said:
But its not the points that matter as much a Dovi and his consistency. Something no one else has shown this year. There are some proper ducati tracks yet. Points aside I still say he is a contender.
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Sure, but it's about being consistent through the whole season. Fortunes rise and fall quickly in the era of Michelin. Consistency will win a title, but only if it isn't offset by calamitous performances linked into tires.
 
michaelm said:
Dovi is being consistent as well, and 7 races is more than a third of a season. As has been said, his only bad result was due to the mistake of another rider. Vinales looked like he would do it easily before the tyre change, but 'his' tyre is gone now. I would still favour MM if he keeps riding smart as he did today, but as as has also been said this won't be Ducati last win, there are circuits to come which favour them, particularly Austria.
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Yes, but given everyone thought a Vinales title was assured after two races and his points lead has looked increasingly shakier as the race weekends go by, nothing is certain in this title chase. What happens if Vinales suddenly runs off 3 or 4 wins in a row? What if for that matter Marquez does that? Dovi may very well win the title this year, but Ducati now has to deal with Yamaha and Honda circuits coming up. Yes the Red Bull Ring should favor the Ducati, but other circuits will favor the M1 and RCV.
 
MdubSTYLIE said:
But its not the points that matter as much a Dovi and his consistency. Something no one else has shown this year. There are some proper ducati tracks yet. Points aside I still say he is a contender.
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I hate to say it ........ but I share mdubs optimism re Dovi.

7 points from Vinales

Marquez 16 behind


its looking pretty good!
 
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Interesting point made by Dovi, that I'd not considered. He said his capacity to save the front was made possible by way of his not having to engage heavy late braking because of his top speed advantage on the straights. Funny, because watching him in those last few laps trailing behind Dani, I kept wondering why the hell he didn't do one of his signature late-braking moves to pass. Doh!
 
Keshav said:
Interesting point made by Dovi, that I'd not considered. He said his capacity to save the front was made possible by way of his not having to engage heavy late braking because of his top speed advantage on the straights. Funny, because watching him in those last few laps trailing behind Dani, I kept wondering why the hell he didn't do one of his signature late-braking moves to pass. Doh!
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During the race, the did a speed comparison between Pedro and Dovi before Dovi made the overtake, and he was down 4MPH I think it was to Pedro at that point. I still think he was purposely forcing Pedro to use up his front and rear tire by just hanging around on his rear knowing he had superior pace. He never bothered to stand on the brakes during the race.
 
iNfRaSoNiC said:
Actually you are right, he isn't, but anyway the sport will loss when he retires that's not my opinion all media said so :)
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Gee you give in too easy ! ....... you didnt say "greatest of all time" ( clearly that's Stoner )

You said ........ "Goat"

Which could refer to say .... rossi ....." the geriatricest of all time"
 
BarryMachine said:
Gee you give in too easy ! ....... you didnt say "greatest of all time" ( clearly that's Stoner )

You said ........ "Goat"

Which could refer to say .... rossi ....." the geriatricest of all time"
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You mean it's not Glowering Old ... Toad?
 

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