Pedrosa Doesn't Deserve 2nd Place

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(phleg @ Nov 10 2007, 10:10 PM) [snapback]100194[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
And the other Honda's?


Well Nicky was like Capirossi he had trouble with bike setup so he wasn't really on it, the other Honda's i dunno but they are not factory bikes and didn't get any upgrades for ages.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(roger-m @ Nov 10 2007, 07:20 PM) [snapback]100163[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
i posted this thread back in april to debate this very thing. iwould be interest to hear your ideas on a fair point system.

http://www.motogpforum.com/forum/index.php...fit+for+purpose


Yes, - the only thing I do not agree with is the points for the pole position - at least until they forbid the use of qualifying tyres.
I think it would be a good idea to increase the difference between 1st and 2nd but maybe 6 or 7 points difference would be enough.
I remain of the opinion that if the final score difference is lower than the difference between 1st and 2nd, then the number of victories should prevail.
Anyway...

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(J4rn0 @ Nov 10 2007, 11:42 PM) [snapback]100203[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
Yes, - the only thing I do not agree with is the points for the pole position - at least until they forbid the use of qualifying tyres.
I think it would be a good idea to increase the difference between 1st and 2nd but maybe 6 or 7 points difference would be enough.
I remain of the opinion that if the final score difference is lower than the difference between 1st and 2nd, then the number of victories should prevail.
Anyway...

i think a point for pole is a good idea, i think we should keep the qual tyres tho,mabe some of the poorer teams can manage 1 fast lap on a quali to pick up a point where as they cant compete over a race distance. but i will admit i had not considered quali tyres when i suggested points for poles,im open minded tho so could be swayed to agree about banning quali's if a good case were put forward to do so.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(roger-m @ Nov 10 2007, 11:53 PM) [snapback]100205[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
i think a point for pole is a good idea, i think we should keep the qual tyres tho,mabe some of the poorer teams can manage 1 fast lap on a quali to pick up a point where as they cant compete over a race distance. but i will admit i had not considered quali tyres when i suggested points for poles,im open minded tho so could be swayed to agree about banning quali's if a good case were put forward to do so.


theres your cost cutting.... quali tyres must be a big cost to develop and the money saved would go towards race tyre development...

win win IMHO

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(roger-m @ Nov 11 2007, 12:53 AM) [snapback]100205[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
i think a point for pole is a good idea, i think we should keep the qual tyres tho,mabe some of the poorer teams can manage 1 fast lap on a quali to pick up a point where as they cant compete over a race distance. but i will admit i had not considered quali tyres when i suggested points for poles,im open minded tho so could be swayed to agree about banning quali's if a good case were put forward to do so.


The case against Qual tyres is simply that they generate a grid that often has little to do with the actual race pace. Cost would be the last worry but one can throw that in also, for good measure

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(J4rn0 @ Nov 11 2007, 11:10 AM) [snapback]100256[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
The case against Qual tyres is simply that they generate a grid that often has little to do with the actual race pace. Cost would be the last worry but one can throw that in also, for good measure

i think this is good tho for 2 reasons.
1. as i said, the poorer teams can put in a super fast quali lap to get some exposure ,score a point and get a bit lime light where as they cant afford to keep up with the rich teams over a race distance, ie tech 3 this season.

2. it shows lap time possibility's for the near future, so helps tyre manufactures teams and riders develop for a faster pace.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(roger-m @ Nov 11 2007, 03:35 PM) [snapback]100293[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
2. it shows lap time possibility's for the near future, so helps tyre manufactures teams and riders develop for a faster pace.


Perhaps I am naive, but I would have thought it also says something about the ultimate capability of the bike.

Everyone has assumed that the michelin qualifiers were superior to the bridgestone qualifiers this year, but what if they really had similar perormance or the bridgestones were superior but just not by the same amount as the race tyres? Valentino might win next year even with an engine down on power as he and stoner's qualifying performance was pretty close most of this year.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(michaelm @ Nov 11 2007, 04:05 PM) [snapback]100294[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
Perhaps I am naive, but I would have thought it also says something about the ultimate capability of the bike.

Everyone has assumed that the michelin qualifiers were superior to the bridgestone qualifiers this year, but what if they really had similar perormance or the bridgestones were superior but just not by the same amount as the race tyres? Valentino might win next year even with an engine down on power as he and stoner's qualifying performance was pretty close most of this year.

interesting points, the only time i think quali tyres should be banned is if they go for a single make control tyre. i think quali tyres are important for tyre development.

damn, we seemed to have strayed off topic here but ended up have some good debates

Yes, I haven’t been around lately, so I’ve been reading some “old” threads. I came across this one and started laughing uncontrollably. Its not so much that Johnny’s post was so hilariously funny, witty, and clever, but the real laughter came from reading the knee-jerk Neanderthals that just didn’t get the satire (bar the new people that perhaps may not have known the inside joke history behind the sarcasm), but those who were here back when Hayden was summarily crucified for winning the championship, those that were here before, have no excuse for not getting the joke. Jesus H Christ, I’ve been only gone for a few months but it seems more of the same. And I haven’t even got to the Rossi- Bridgestone threads. My God, if this is what I’m in for, only the Lord can help me now!

Johnny’s post was so witty it deserves a second look.


<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(JohnnyKnockdown @ Nov 6 2007, 07:08 PM) [snapback]99379[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
Congratulations Dani for being lucky. You certainly don't deserve that 2nd place trophy. You never earned it. You only won two races.
You are the worst 2nd place finisher of all time. I will never acknowledge
that you are the 2007 runner up. History will put an asterisk next to your name and this season. You only got second place because those that finished behind you scored fewer points than you. Those races when they crashed, broke or finished badly were merely them giving you points. You wern't good enough to beat them. You had to rely on their poor judgement and bad luck in order to score more points. That's not how a true motogp runner up should race.
You are a lucky fraud who will never be a runner up again!

Haha, this was an excellent post. Is this how we weed out the adolescent members and IQs-less-than-your-shoe-size members of the forum? By using witty posts beyond the capabilities of a blindfolded monkey? Great.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(rgvneil @ Nov 7 2007, 07:22 AM) [snapback]99486[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
If this thread shows us 'oldies' one thing it's that there are many 'newbies' here who didn't see all the grief Nicky Hayden got last year.


Yeah, so how do you explain some of the 'oldies' getting their panties in a tizzy? Johnny's post had WIT & SATIRE written all over it, yet, plenty of the 'oldies' got all flustered. Haha, especially the 15 and younger crowd.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(povol @ Nov 7 2007, 05:28 AM) [snapback]99445[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
Satire is something that must be practiced only in the US and UK.For those of us that see it all the time,its obvious even on a computer screen.Its like the post where someone was coming unglued about an Mamola article.It was so obvious,yet some saw it as a serious article bashing Rossi.I guess some people are just edgy emotionally and take everything as a personal affront.

I don't think it limited to the US/UK, I think its practiced the world wide. Wittiness is a universal human activity that enriches life. However, satire/wit requires a bit of a sense of humor and a bit of IQ (not allot of it and not in any particular order).

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Traverser @ Nov 7 2007, 11:14 AM) [snapback]99548[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
I took the joke as more of making fun of Rossi and his fans than Pedrosa.

That's because, unlike a few, you actually got the joke.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(IsraeliRacer @ Nov 7 2007, 01:16 PM) [snapback]99577[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
.....So little recognition of sarcasm and irony in some peoples posts, even after it was pointed out where's Jumkie when you need him?

I told you I would splash in, but perhaps this was not the grand reappearance you were hoping for? Perhaps a kinder, gentler, return? Hahaha. This was a great thread to return and begin posting on. Wow, it really is breathtaking to see the sarcasm/wittiness ooze out of a post and it not reach the tickle bone of the reader. Ah, the irony.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(baldylocks @ Nov 8 2007, 04:06 AM) [snapback]99700[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
HMMM - what would jumkie say i wonder ?

OH - yeah - "Grow some skin........"

Where is the little fat donut eater anyway ? does anyone hear from him ?

Here is a secret. As you wrote this post, perhaps you didn't know that this exact day was my birthday. (Yes, its the 8th of November). Now how is that for irony? Amazing, and you were talking about me some half a world away not knowing that I was getting drunk, cursing my computer for crashing, and not having my Internet connection up to keep in touch with my online family.

As far as this thread and your post, well wonder no more my friend, I think what I would have said is not, 'grow some skin' but rather to those who didn't get the sarcasm in Johnny's post to start this thread, I would have said: 'grow some brain!'.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(BarryMachine @ Nov 7 2007, 06:26 PM) [snapback]99603[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>

Satire requires the notions being put forward to be so prolific as to be ludicrous ...... or a spoof of a previous situation maybe ....


Worth quoting you here.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(JohnnyKnockdown @ Nov 7 2007, 07:18 PM) [snapback]99605[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>

I think it's funny that some are so jaded to absurd posts that they
couldn't see it as sarcasm.

Not just "jaded" but 'silly' too. Oh crap, just when the mods thought it was safe, here I come out with that repugnant "S" word. (Only the old-school members may get this inside joke, but to let you in on it, when I first joined this site, I called a member's post "silly", then I was crucified).

Disclaimer: Don't worry mods, I love you remember.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(somedamnwriter @ Nov 8 2007, 04:16 AM) [snapback]99701[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
jumkie likes extremes.... when he goes, no one has an idea...when he's around, he makes sure everybody knows it

SDamnW, you are so psychoanalytical. Hell, just wait until I get a chance to respond to the "Its ok VR gets Bstones since he deserves preferential treatment on account he is God." Oh, then you will know I'm around.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(vtinoimik @ Nov 8 2007, 04:19 AM) [snapback]99703[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
so i wasn't the only one wondering where jumkie is... hahaha

Wonder no more. I'm here to balance out the universe. When I first joined this site it might as well been called: Rossiloversforum.com but now it seems the Stoner fans have found a playground to sing their praises, its important that Hayden fans maintain the balance of reality around here.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(roger-m @ Nov 8 2007, 04:21 AM) [snapback]99704[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
yeah, i keep in touch with <strike>charlie sheene</strike>, i mean jumkie think he is working hard in between putting out fires. hopping to hook up with him next year for lugna seca. looking for cheep flights to LA, any ideas anyone ??

I bet you didn't know when you wrote this post it was my bday. Isn't that amazing. There must certainly be parallel universes. Dude, you gotta get a plane ticket and get your fat ... down here. Or as Damn suggests, start swimming.

Hey, Roger, don't ignore the red little lines under most of the words in your posts, they are there to help us.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Bikergirl @ Nov 7 2007, 12:45 AM) [snapback]99406[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>


Hi BG, It appears you got Johnnys joke here. But I've been reading some of your mindless defense of VR and the Bstone threads, I hope you were joking, cuz I'm coming after those next.

good to have ya back RJ!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(roger-m @ Nov 11 2007, 12:53 AM) [snapback]100205[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
i think a point for pole is a good idea, i think we should keep the qual tyres tho,mabe some of the poorer teams can manage 1 fast lap on a quali to pick up a point where as they cant compete over a race distance. but i will admit i had not considered quali tyres when i suggested points for poles,im open minded tho so could be swayed to agree about banning quali's if a good case were put forward to do so.


AMA rules for MotoGP?

Can we not just have an easy system race tyres only, and best times at end of Saturday (or Friday) make up the grid....we don't need to devalue the series by adding rules which allow poor teams and riders to gain points for simply belting it around for 1 lap...

Why go the AMA hog and give points for leading the most laps as well?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(L8Braker @ Dec 11 2007, 04:29 AM) [snapback]104001[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
good to have ya back RJ!

Thanks L8, it seems there is much work to be done here, eh. Great to be reading some of the threads. I'm finding lots of good material. It was nice of Roger to change the topic on this one, because some where really showing their assess here. haha.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(JohnnyKnockdown @ Nov 6 2007, 07:08 PM) [snapback]99379[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
Congratulations Dani for being lucky. You certainly don't deserve that 2nd place trophy. You never earned it. You only won two races.
You are the worst 2nd place finisher of all time. I will never acknowledge
that you are the 2007 runner up. History will put an asterisk next to your name and this season. You only got second place because those that finished behind you scored fewer points than you. Those races when they crashed, broke or finished badly were merely them giving you points. You wern't good enough to beat them. You had to rely on their poor judgement and bad luck in order to score more points. That's not how a true motogp runner up should race.
You are a lucky fraud who will never be a runner up again!


Rossi is being the best forever and ever. No riders can be beat Rossi any year!!! Rossi = God

^^Supposed to be Italianish^^

Pedro never would have come second if Rossi didn't fall off and injure his hand. Furthermore, if Yamaha hadn't built a bad bike and if Michelin hadn't built bad tires Rossi would be 7 time Motogp champion right now. That's as good as Ago and as good as Doohan would have been if Doohan hadn't crashed in 1992. But Doohan did crash and if Rainey hadn't gotten paralyzed then Rainey would be 4 time world champion and Schwantz would be below Rainey on the all time wins list and would have no titles because Suzuki makes slow bikes. Then America would have two 4 time world champions which is how it was supposed to happen.

Reality is not in line with my expectations so I'm going to create my own reality and live in it. It's the place where Nicky is 5 time world champ because they never changed to 4 strokes and Rossi got his ... handed to him by an American (or Australian) dirt tracker, which is what always happens to European riders in modern 500GP anyway. Blast and block will always be faster on bikes built for men. Kiddie bikes and bikes built by robots for robots can have their corner speed style. You have to like it up the ... to ride that style anyway.

The end.

Wait I'm confused. Did Stoner win this year, or did Rossi lose? Or did Ducati win and Rossi lost? God, this is impossible!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(mylexicon @ Dec 11 2007, 07:34 AM) [snapback]104008[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>


Wait I'm confused. Did Stoner win this year, or did Rossi lose? Or did Ducati win and Rossi lost? God, this is impossible!

Its a good one isn't it.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(mylexicon @ Dec 12 2007, 02:34 AM) [snapback]104008[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
Wait I'm confused. Did Stoner win this year, or did Rossi lose? Or did Ducati win and Rossi lost? God, this is impossible!


Hard to say really ..... if we go on votes .... well they all know that Rossi was "gyp'd" ....... thankfully we don't go by votes and instead those that would have voted are now crying in their beers about it, instead



PS. Voting for a world Champion ....... oh dear what did I say/accidentally suggest ....... that'll be the next "thing"


Rog. .... will have Rossi prancing around in a bikini before we know it

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(BarryMachine @ Dec 11 2007, 06:59 PM) [snapback]104075[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>

Rog. .... will have Rossi prancing around in a bikini before we know it







(For increased post count purposes)

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Racejumkie @ Dec 11 2007, 04:29 PM) [snapback]104019[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
Its a good one isn't it.



The only answer is.....Hayboy, with his No1 plate lost it.

Pete

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(JohnnyKnockdown @ Nov 7 2007, 03:08 AM) [snapback]99379[/snapback]<div class='quotemain'>
Congratulations Dani for being lucky. You certainly don't deserve that 2nd place trophy. You never earned it. You only won two races.
You are the worst 2nd place finisher of all time. I will never acknowledge
that you are the 2007 runner up. History will put an asterisk next to your name and this season. You only got second place because those that finished behind you scored fewer points than you. Those races when they crashed, broke or finished badly were merely them giving you points. You wern't good enough to beat them. You had to rely on their poor judgement and bad luck in order to score more points. That's not how a true motogp runner up should race.
You are a lucky fraud who will never be a runner up again!


JohnnyKnockdown “You only got second place because those that finished behind you scored fewer points than you” that is the best statement I’ve ever read EVER!!! good one Johnny!!! especially Johnny and please remember!? that is why he came second!!!...hahahaha... that is the statement of the century about anything in motor racing ever!!! good one mate!!!