Now that Ducati has burned up all their tests

According to Harold Camping (loony religious doomsday guy) the world is going to end tomorrow anyway.



It was also going to end on some other occasions but kept going like Harold was just a mentally ill loud mouth bible bashing window licking freak.



Just in case it ends, I hope Ducati experience that terrible irony of having produced a Stoneresque lap time and before they can even leak it to 2nd rate media the giant meteor come and ..... everything up.



The people who are occupying wall street are killed in exactly the same way as Oomfufu and all of her lizard eating African tribal people who have no currency, but were running low on lizards and had began experimenting with beetle recipes.







Shame, 2012 would have been a good series.

BarryMachine said:

Cut off the bottom riders in the 990 tables and test you theory ........ not so sure its just more numbers. ( Note: I am even being fair by saying cut off the bottom rider ....... cos looking at the records ........ they were shockers!!

)



2. Yes they do ....... but were's all these stats showing that 800's were worse for it?

Click to expand...

In the media center, there's a list of crashes at each circuit and statistics for the year. I have asked Dorna multiple times to publish the data, but they won't. I have had this discussion with Dennis Noyes a couple of times, and he told me that Motociclismo, the Spanish magazine he works for, looked at the numbers once and came to the conclusion that there were more crashes.

Andy Roo said:

According to Harold Camping (loony religious doomsday guy) the world is going to end tomorrow anyway.



It was also going to end on some other occasions but kept going like Harold was just a mentally ill loud mouth bible bashing window licking freak.



Just in case it ends, I hope Ducati experience that terrible irony of having produced a Stoneresque lap time and before they can even leak it to 2nd rate media the giant meteor come and ..... everything up.



The people who are occupying wall street are killed in exactly the same way as Oomfufu and all of her lizard eating African tribal people who have no currency, but were running low on lizards and had began experimenting with beetle recipes.







Shame, 2012 would have been a good series.

Click to expand...

Thats guy has nothing on all the doom and gloom paranoia going on here

birdman said:

Seriously I see a potential problem coming in the near future when production bikes actually become faster than purpose built but dumbed downed entertainment based race bikes.

Click to expand...

One more thing: who says WSBK bikes will stay the same? 17 inch wheels returning for 2012, and FIM and Infront heading down the road of much more stock bikes. That will slow them down a lot.

Kropotkin said:

In the media center, there's a list of crashes at each circuit and statistics for the year. I have asked Dorna multiple times to publish the data, but they won't. I have had this discussion with Dennis Noyes a couple of times, and he told me that Motociclismo, the Spanish magazine he works for, looked at the numbers once and came to the conclusion that there were more crashes.

Click to expand...

Oh well that has me convinced ..........................................



Comeon mate you have to do better than that. Can you get the guys mother to write me a note ?





God I'm a terminal skeptic .............. thanks to too many years working in a govermink test lab

BarryMachine said:

Oh well that has me convinced ..........................................

Comeon mate you have to do better than that. Can you get the guys mother to write me a note ?

God I'm a terminal skeptic .............. thanks to too many years working in a govermink test lab

Click to expand...

I realize I'm not going to convince. Fair enough.

Kropotkin said:

Yet Supersport riders would give their left testicle to be racing in Moto2. That's the point.

Click to expand...

Or the right to get to SBK. Then in SBK they (Laverty?) notice they are faster than Biaggi, who is going to be faster than Stoner on a CRT. So SBK challenges Motogp's right to the claim of the best rider in the world. Its not a problem now because its never happened before. 500cc riders like Doohan always made it clear riding SBK was much easier because they were slower, which is a conception maintained to this day.

BarryMachine said:

Oh well that has me convinced ..........................................

Comeon mate you have to do better than that. Can you get the guys mother to write me a note ?

God I'm a terminal skeptic .............. thanks to too many years working in a govermink test lab

Click to expand...

You're in too deep Barry, even the bold Casy Stoner cant convince you otherwise!

Kropotkin said:

One more thing: who says WSBK bikes will stay the same? 17 inch wheels returning for 2012, and FIM and Infront heading down the road of much more stock bikes. That will slow them down a lot.

Click to expand...

Thats a good thing. The pressure is still coming from production though. They cant freeze development there. Superstock will be too fast one day at this rate. But none of this actually bothers me at all. If moto2 spec bikes satisfies the masses, so be it. I'm only trying to point out potential conflict, not doomsday or anything like that. I'm a deliriously happy Stoner fan on a planet with mega fast bikes all over the place. One's in my garage. What more could I ask for?

Kropotkin said:

I realize I'm not going to convince. Fair enough.

Click to expand...

Barry has not been convinced by an opinion or argument different than his own in the history of the forum to my knowledge.

Kropotkin said:

I realize I'm not going to convince. Fair enough.

Click to expand...

I just think folk should perhaps say the opposite outcome to themselves:



ie. "the 1000's are being brought back to make racing safer" .......... does that sound realistic?



Then sit back and see what happens, and cross our fingers nobody is killed again.

Kropotkin said:

I realize I'm not going to convince. Fair enough.

Click to expand...

I just think folk should perhaps say the opposite outcome to themselves:



ie. "the 1000's are being brought back to make racing safer" .......... does that sound realistic?



Then sit back and see what happens, and cross our fingers nobody is killed again.

I guess race fans in the US are just totally different animals. Not just bike racing fans. Like Andy said, we have had these conversations before. You gut performance in a racing series, it almost always suffers. And like Krop said, we are more enthusiasts, instead of masses looking for manufactured entertainment. You may be right about the fan in Europe Krop, but the pinnacle of motorsport in the US is who is going faster. We are not that easily fooled, well, not all of us anyway.F1 is not just perceived to be the number 1 road racing series in the world, it is because nothing else comes close. Let another series surpass them in performance, and that perception will change quickly, at least over here it will.

povol said:

And like Krop said, we are more enthusiasts, instead of masses looking for manufactured entertainment. You may be right about the fan in Europe Krop, but the pinnacle of motorsport in the US is who is going faster. We are not that easily fooled, well, not all of us anyway.

Click to expand...

NASCAR. Quod erat demonstrandum.

BarryMachine said:

I just think folk should perhaps say the opposite outcome to themselves:



ie. "the 1000's are being brought back to make racing safer" .......... does that sound realistic?



Then sit back and see what happens, and cross our fingers nobody is killed again.

Click to expand...

That is what is known in the art of rhetoric as a false dichotomy. The 1000s are not being brought back to make racing safer. That does not mean that the 800s weren't more dangerous than the 990s. People crashed more on the 800s because corner speed was higher. What happens with the 1000s is as yet unknown.

michaelm said:

Barry has not been convinced by an opinion or argument different than his own in the history of the forum to my knowledge.

Click to expand...

But then again those arguments were:



I argued against the feasibility of using a gyro to map position on a track .............. I'd still be amazed to see a valid working system Sorry Mick I'm not such a fence sitter that I will sit by and agree with something I have to date learned was flawed for such use, and in any case far superseded by GPS devices. God knows why whomsoever suggested it could be done in the first place anyway, and why they thought it was useful. Nonetheless it is, and was, a nonsense and I felt compelled to say so rather than go along with the masses for the sake of being "social". In the end that was all just a witch hunt, I thnk had I taken the opposite view, I would have been opposed for the sake of it



and



Backing in is initiated with the back brake and downshifting ........ I beg to differ, these are not the critical initiators. is all I will say ......... and I believe Stoners "cracking the throttle before the corner" is because he is of the school where such things are the norm as well. I also believe now it is an alien concept to many outside Aussie flat track riding. Ditto on the fence sit here ....... And suffice to to say that given Stoners demonstration of the technique I feel somewhat big headed in the knowledge, and long ago learned use of that technique. ( though possibly at a somewhat lessened level of prowess to Stoner ) So for now I will say "go ahead skid away guys , but I feel good in doing it, and knowing of, another way"

Kropotkin said:

That is what is known in the art of rhetoric as a false dichotomy. The 1000s are not being brought back to make racing safer. That does not mean that the 800s weren't more dangerous than the 990s. People crashed more on the 800s because corner speed was higher. What happens with the 1000s is as yet unknown.

Click to expand...

I fear you are sitting on the fence ........ go ahead and say it and believe it



It is most definitely not a false dichotomy.other wise 800's are not more dangerous than 990's/1000's .... by your own reasoning ....... and you have already taken a stance opposed to that.





I take your backing away from outright acceptance, and committal to, of the thought that "1000's are being brought back to make racing safer"

BarryMachine said:

I fear you are sitting on the fence ........ go ahead and say it and believe it

It is most definitely not a false dichotomy.other wise 800's are not more dangerous than 990's/1000's .... by your own reasoning ....... and you have already taken a stance opposed to that.





I take your backing away from outright acceptance, and committal to, of the thought that "1000's are being brought back to make racing safer"

Click to expand...

No.



The 1000s are being brought back because the 800cc formula was too expensive and provided terrible racing.



The 800s did not improve safety one bit, there were more crashes due to the higher corner speeds.

Kropotkin said:

The 800s did not improve safety one bit, there were more crashes due to the higher corner speeds.

Click to expand...

That fence is getting taller ...... this discussion started because of how the 1000's were going to make it safer ( according to some ) remember, ...... at least I have you back on the fence ATM ...... Sometimes folk forget to say the logical opposite to test their logic, and when they do it puts new perspective on the issue/problem/design/whatever. Sorry "blackbox" engineering ideology ........ works wonders. If you aren't sure of the logic ( or if its questionable ), throw the opposite logic at it and see how it runs/operates/fares. At least you should find out what it won't do.

You dont half talk a lot of mince Barry...trying to debate something, anything with you is like