Factory 2-MotoGP's newest category

Jumkie · Mar 18, 2014

povol

3715041395168808

So the ball is in Honda's court. Will they keep to their promise and leave since they will no longer be able to play with their own software after 2015.

What makes you think Dorna won't simply introduce another outbreak of last minute rules (which you are so willing to accept as legit) that again make "concessions" and adjustments for the "championship." Newsflash, this is what's been happening under your nose and you seem to not have noticed it Mr. Povol, dean of Experiments and Conclusions department. They changed the rookie rule last year, coincidently when they were horse trading communication with HRC to build a production racer for Dorna's pet evolution of CRT to Open class (and the now aborted in name only Factory 2). Here is what I don't get about you Dr. Pov, you were so vocal about the "farce" of introducing artificial grid filler in the form of the CRT, as a contrived championship, prompting your infamous 'boycott of GP', yet today the wholesale rolling rulebook of "Open class" has become infinitely more of a charade, and you are swallowing it whole. Why? I think I know the answer, its because they have done a Fox-like job of feeding it to you.

SuperShinya56 · Mar 18, 2014

MotoGP is nothing more then a spectacle, fellas. Money, money, money..........

All you motor racing fans are eating it up, so blame yourselves. If fans spoke up and threaten to boycott the races, maybe DORNA might listen. Regardless, motor racing is like crack for you guys, even if it's not 100% pure cocaine and mixed with rat poison...... ya'll will still smoke that .....

rezonator636 · Mar 18, 2014

Jumkie

3715031395164568

Nothing was actually sorted out except how best to present this ........ to the fans. It seems their big solution was to just retract acknowledging a 3rd category exists by not giving it the name they had proposed. Factory 2? What, where?

I think they're calling it Factory Option now, or whatever. Or are they? This thing has changed so many times in the last week, no one can keep it straight.

sewarion · Mar 19, 2014

according to Krop, Ducati can now use their own software while still enjoying 24 litres, being reduced to 22 litres if they start being successful. and all the other open teams use the 2013 software? so what about the infamous uber-complex 2014 software? will this software be made accessible to other open teams? what about 'spec'? I just don't get it anymore.. [edit:] just read that they won't have to use any spec software at all. use their own software but with 4 (or later 2) more litres of fuel, more engines and no dev freeze. wtf?! how on earth could have HRC and Yam agreed to that, while giving up on prorietary software dev even a year earlier than planned? I think there will be some rather large 'concessions' etc. coming our way in the foreseeable future.. scares me. btw we're a lot further from spec than before.. confusing? farce? dunno, but I'm irritated and annoyed by now..

MigsAngel · Mar 19, 2014

sewarion

3715151395215924

according to Krop, Ducati can now use their own software while still enjoying 24 litres, being reduced to 22 litres if they start being successful. and all the other open teams use the 2013 software? so what about the infamous uber-complex 2014 software? will this software be made accessible to other open teams? what about 'spec'? I just don't get it anymore..

reading the same piece by Krop....it seems the 2014 software will continue be developed, but it does not seem to be available for use in 2014....

I like the fact that Ducati can run under what effectively is the 'Suzuki' rule....it all makes good sense to me.....but then again i love the sport and want to see more bike fighting for wins, so any way Dorna can give the less successful teams a helping hand then all the better.....

though i am sure some will sill whinge about it, call it a farce and conspiracy

sewarion · Mar 19, 2014

just edited my post from above, after getting confirmation on the prop. vs. spec. software issue. I'm not happy, as this is not the spec route MotoGP was supposed to take. It's just helping Ducati out because they sucked, while the actual open teams are screwed. some might call that a farce..

povol · Mar 19, 2014

Im guessing Marlboro has given Ducati an ultimatum, and the powers that be created this whole scenario to keep a major sponsor and a major manufacturer in the series.

rezonator636 · Mar 19, 2014

What I don't get is why the Open teams aren't complaining about this one. Ducati just went from having to use spec software to being able to use their own software, and still have extra fuel and engines. This is somehow more fair than the original rule?

povol

3715201395230136

Im guessing Marlboro has given Ducati an ultimatum, and the powers that be created this whole scenario to keep a major sponsor and a major manufacturer in the series.

There's probably some truth to this.

J4rn0 · Mar 19, 2014

What a farce. Dorna gave in to Honda's pressure. The favors dished out to Ducati are actually secondary: in reality, Honda is again succeeding in making sure that nobody will be able to really challenge their supremacy without playing by their absurd rules -- that's the real meaning of all this.

sewarion · Mar 19, 2014

J4rn0 said:
What a farce. Dorna gave in to Honda's pressure. The favors dished out to Ducati are actually secondary: in reality, Honda is again succeeding in making sure that nobody will be able to really challenge their supremacy without playing by their absurd rules -- that's the real meaning of all this.

but didn't Ducati get even more of an advantage than bespoken earlier? that's confusing, and I don't see how Honda should be pleased with that.

rezonator636 · Mar 19, 2014

sewarion

3715261395238408

but didn't Ducati get even more of an advantage than bespoken earlier? that's confusing, and I don't see how Honda should be pleased with that.

This is exactly my point. The Open teams supposedly complain, so the rules get changed to penalize Ducati...except that Ducati benefits even more. Now they get the engines, fuel, and softer rear tire of the Open class, and the proprietary software of a factory team.

Let's just say that Ducati miraculously wins three times this year, and in so doing loses the softer rear tire and gets its engine and fuel allocation reduced. They still get four more engines than the other factory teams, as well as an extra two liters of fuel, and still keep their proprietary software. That's unfair in every sense of the word. How was this acceptable to all those claiming a violation of the "spirit of the rules"?

povol · Mar 19, 2014

J4rn0

3715241395237684

What a farce. Dorna gave in to Honda's pressure. The favors dished out to Ducati are actually secondary: in reality, Honda is again succeeding in making sure that nobody will be able to really challenge their supremacy without playing by their absurd rules -- that's the real meaning of all this.

This sounds like an anti Honda rant without reason. What exactly did Honda gain?

Jumkie · Mar 19, 2014

povol

3715201395230136

Im guessing Marlboro has given Ducati an ultimatum, and the powers that be created this whole scenario to keep a major sponsor and a major manufacturer in the series.

That’s a nice “guess” you dreamed up, surely mustering every ounce of your autistic stream of consciousness (that or you cut and paste the idea from somewhere else…uhm). It seems odd of you to admit this "whole scenario" was "created", acknowledging the contrived nature of regulations based on lobbying of particular influential principals, which make this whole thing impartial—or as you call it, perfectly legitimate since its Honda who has done most of that influencing. Even your autistic boy MurderMac struggled to make sense of the recent changes in the pre-event press conference, mistakingly thinking the 3rd category officially still existed. What does that say about the state of the sport when the reining "champ", the otherwise voice of the sport, is bewildered about the regulations in which he competes? Pedro said it best, 'its confusing when they're changing the rules every 5 minutes.'

Big Jorge · Mar 19, 2014

So Jorge wanted to try the Open M1 but Yam denied it.

SuperShinya56 · Mar 19, 2014

Jumkie

3715331395257862

That’s a nice “guess” you dreamed up, surely mustering every ounce of your autistic stream of consciousness (that or you cut and paste the idea from somewhere else…uhm). It seems odd of you to admit this "whole scenario" was "created", acknowledging the contrived nature of regulations based on lobbying of particular influential principals, which make this whole thing impartial—or as you call it, perfectly legitimate since its Honda who has done most of that influencing. Even your autistic boy MurderMac struggled to make sense of the recent changes in the pre-event press conference, mistakingly thinking the 3rd category officially still existed. What does that say about the state of the sport when the reining "champ", the otherwise voice of the sport, is bewildered about the regulations in which he competes? Pedro said it best, 'its confusing when they're changing the rules every 5 minutes.'

But but........ I thought you hated Pedrosa?

rezonator636 · Mar 19, 2014

Jumkie

3715331395257862

That’s a nice “guess” you dreamed up, surely mustering every ounce of your autistic stream of consciousness (that or you cut and paste the idea from somewhere else…uhm). It seems odd of you to admit this "whole scenario" was "created", acknowledging the contrived nature of regulations based on lobbying of particular influential principals, which make this whole thing impartial—or as you call it, perfectly legitimate since its Honda who has done most of that influencing. Even your autistic boy MurderMac struggled to make sense of the recent changes in the pre-event press conference, mistakingly thinking the 3rd category officially still existed. What does that say about the state of the sport when the reining "champ", the otherwise voice of the sport, is bewildered about the regulations in which he competes? Pedro said it best, 'its confusing when they're changing the rules every 5 minutes.'

It does still exist. It's just called Factory Option now, and Ducati is its only member. Suzuki will be eligible to re-enter the series next year under as a Factory Option team as well (at least until Dorna changes the rules again).

Jumkie · Mar 19, 2014

rezonator636

3715361395263845

It does still exist. It's just called Factory Option now, and Ducati is its only member. Suzuki will be eligible to re-enter the series next year under as a Factory Option team as well (at least until Dorna changes the rules again).

Don't tell Pov and Migs that, they won't believe you. I agree, it still does exist, but not 'officially' as a "category". Dorna's solution was to abort giving this thing a name. This way people like Pov and Migs could point to the series and say, "what 3rd category? Only 2 exist."

Dorna still kept the rules which created the 3rd category, but simply eliminated calling it anything. There are, according to Dorna, only 2 categories officially: Factory and Open options.

J4rn0 · Mar 19, 2014

sewarion

3715261395238408

but didn't Ducati get even more of an advantage than bespoken earlier? that's confusing, and I don't see how Honda should be pleased with that.

Honda is pleased because:

1) Ducati is not an immediate threat anyway, and if they happen to become a threat they'll have to start playing by a totally different set of rules (Honda's rules);

2) Yamaha, their real immediate threat, cannot switch to Open at will (this was a real danger for them).

povol · Mar 19, 2014

J4rn0

3715401395270164

Honda is pleased because:

1) Ducati is not an immediate threat anyway, and if they happen to become a threat they'll have to start playing by a totally different set of rules (Honda's rules);

2) Yamaha, their real immediate threat, cannot switch to Open at will (this was a real danger for them).

Ducati is much more of a threat than they were, and if they become a real threat, they still get concessions that the factory teams dont

If Yamaha could switch to open at will, doesnt that mean Honda could as well.

JG251 · Mar 19, 2014

sewarion

3715151395215924

according to Krop, Ducati can now use their own software while still enjoying 24 litres, being reduced to 22 litres if they start being successful. and all the other open teams use the 2013 software? so what about the infamous uber-complex 2014 software? will this software be made accessible to other open teams? what about 'spec'? I just don't get it anymore.. [edit:] just read that they won't have to use any spec software at all. use their own software but with 4 (or later 2) more litres of fuel, more engines and no dev freeze. wtf?! how on earth could have HRC and Yam agreed to that, while giving up on prorietary software dev even a year earlier than planned? I think there will be some rather large 'concessions' etc. coming our way in the foreseeable future.. scares me. btw we're a lot further from spec than before.. confusing? farce? dunno, but I'm irritated and annoyed by now..

I'm a little confused. Did Ducati set there times at the last two test with the open ECU or there own?

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Factory 2-MotoGP's newest category

Jumkie

SuperShinya56

rezonator636

sewarion

MigsAngel

sewarion

povol

rezonator636

J4rn0

sewarion

rezonator636

povol

Jumkie

Big Jorge

SuperShinya56

rezonator636

Jumkie

J4rn0

povol

JG251

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