A good development rider should be fast, not only at developing the bike but in his racing too! Why do you think Jacque got the flick? Coz he was too slow come race day.. The only way I would approve Capirossi taking the ride is if he's a full time tester, like Jacque is now.. Your right, the difference between a good development rider and a quick racer is large, but maybe all Loris is good for from this point on is being a development rider..
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (antfan @ Jul 8 2007, 12:27 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>A good development rider should be fast, not only at developing the bike but in his racing too! [/b
Why do you think Jacque got the flick? Coz he was too slow come race day..
The only way I would approve Capirossi taking the ride is if he's a full time tester, like Jacque is now..
Your right, the difference between a good development rider and a quick racer is large,
but maybe all Loris is good for from this point on is being a development rider..
why ? it's a team sport, loris develops and casey races !
errm, cos he got injured.
im sure kawasaki will take note.
this is a bit of a contradiction from your first comment.
Why do you think Jacque got the flick? Coz he was too slow come race day..
The only way I would approve Capirossi taking the ride is if he's a full time tester, like Jacque is now..
Your right, the difference between a good development rider and a quick racer is large,
but maybe all Loris is good for from this point on is being a development rider..
why ? it's a team sport, loris develops and casey races !
errm, cos he got injured.
im sure kawasaki will take note.
this is a bit of a contradiction from your first comment.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (antfan @ Jul 8 2007, 09:27 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>A good development rider should be fast, not only at developing the bike but in his racing too! Why do you think Jacque got the flick? Coz he was too slow come race day.. The only way I would approve Capirossi taking the ride is if he's a full time tester, like Jacque is now.. Your right, the difference between a good development rider and a quick racer is large, but maybe all Loris is good for from this point on is being a development rider..
A good idea in theory but I don't think Loris will swallow being a test rider exclusively for a few years yet.
A good idea in theory but I don't think Loris will swallow being a test rider exclusively for a few years yet.
Jacque didn't "get the flick".... he's still Kawasaki test rider. Loris is still better than half the grid in my opinion, and he could still show Westy the way round a track, as much as I like Westy. There is no replacement for experience, and Loris has got a lot of experience.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (IsraeliRacer @ Jul 8 2007, 12:41 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Jacque didn't "get the flick".... he's still Kawasaki test rider. Loris is still better than half the grid in my opinion, and he could still show Westy the way round a track, as much as I like Westy. There is no replacement for experience, and Loris has got a lot of experience.
I wouldn't be signing a rider with experience if his experience is getting progressively less relevant. If he can't adapt to ride an 800, he is useless to develop one. If he can get to grips with riding one i don't doubt that he would be valuable to Kawasaki, i just don't see it happening though.
I wouldn't be signing a rider with experience if his experience is getting progressively less relevant. If he can't adapt to ride an 800, he is useless to develop one. If he can get to grips with riding one i don't doubt that he would be valuable to Kawasaki, i just don't see it happening though.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (antfan @ Jul 8 2007, 12:17 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>This years Ducati has been developed my Guareschi and the other test rider, the Japanese bloke .. You could even say Sete Gibernau had a hand in its development.. Im sorry, but Capirossi's form this year is SO dissapointing, he doesnt deserve the chance to waste another seat in 08... If Stoner can be so dominant on the bike, why cant Loris? He's lost it, period..
check out post #16.
http://www.motogpforum.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=5000
check out post #16.
http://www.motogpforum.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=5000
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (roger-m @ Jul 8 2007, 05:58 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>check out post #16.
http://www.motogpforum.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=5000
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <div class='quotemain'>Although the bike was developed mainly by Capirossi, the Italian reckons too many changes were made since then.
What that basically says is that Capirossi has lost development control and doesn't like it. But since Casey's direction has got the bike leading the championship you can see that it was a good decision.
http://www.motogpforum.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=5000
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <div class='quotemain'>Although the bike was developed mainly by Capirossi, the Italian reckons too many changes were made since then.
What that basically says is that Capirossi has lost development control and doesn't like it. But since Casey's direction has got the bike leading the championship you can see that it was a good decision.
1. Ducati was also a contender last year for the title - pity for the crash at catalunya - Wasn't that Loris? .... Wasn't he one of the older ones on the grid?
2. Loris developed the 990cc bike and also the 800cc bike .... he was with dukes from the beggining so there's no question about the experience and abillity of developing a bike.
3. He was pretty fast in different raaces, so he's still fast i have no doubt there ... he'll be bcak on top my prediction is from brno ...
4. Hm He need to change his style also and i think after so much time in racing that stuff is harder to do then for casey or the younger ones.
Dont you worry for him ... he won;t retire until he'll shut all the doubters, so until he'll be back for the winning way, is that clear?
2. Loris developed the 990cc bike and also the 800cc bike .... he was with dukes from the beggining so there's no question about the experience and abillity of developing a bike.
3. He was pretty fast in different raaces, so he's still fast i have no doubt there ... he'll be bcak on top my prediction is from brno ...
4. Hm He need to change his style also and i think after so much time in racing that stuff is harder to do then for casey or the younger ones.
Dont you worry for him ... he won;t retire until he'll shut all the doubters, so until he'll be back for the winning way, is that clear?
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tom @ Jul 8 2007, 04:57 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I wouldn't be signing a rider with experience if his experience is getting progressively less relevant. If he can't adapt to ride an 800, he is useless to develop one. If he can get to grips with riding one i don't doubt that he would be valuable to Kawasaki, i just don't see it happening though.
I guess most of what you say here could be said about stoner last year.
I guess most of what you say here could be said about stoner last year.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Babelfish @ Jul 9 2007, 03:38 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I guess most of what you say here could be said about stoner last year.
I have no idea how you can apply this to Stoner???
I have no idea how you can apply this to Stoner???
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Son of Doohan @ Jul 8 2007, 07:26 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I have no idea how you can apply this to Stoner???
The similarities are that it would have seemed in 2006 that Stoner struggled to get to rips with the motogp bike, and that oyu wouldn't trust him with development duties. The difference is that Stoner was a rookie, he is young, learns fast, is clearly on the up slope of his career and will be around for a wile yet. For those reasons it is a reasonable gamble to trust him with development and invest time/money into his desires and requests, ducati clearly agreed with the theory and it is working. What more evidence do you need.
The similarities are that it would have seemed in 2006 that Stoner struggled to get to rips with the motogp bike, and that oyu wouldn't trust him with development duties. The difference is that Stoner was a rookie, he is young, learns fast, is clearly on the up slope of his career and will be around for a wile yet. For those reasons it is a reasonable gamble to trust him with development and invest time/money into his desires and requests, ducati clearly agreed with the theory and it is working. What more evidence do you need.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <div class='quotemain'>For those reasons it is a reasonable gamble to trust him with development and invest time/money into his desires and requests
You don't gamble on something like developing a bike because then when it doesn't work you get an 800CC Honda thats playing catch up until now, not when you have a tried and tested rider who entrusting him with development isn't a gamble. Its a pointless gamble.
You don't gamble on something like developing a bike because then when it doesn't work you get an 800CC Honda thats playing catch up until now, not when you have a tried and tested rider who entrusting him with development isn't a gamble. Its a pointless gamble.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (vale4607 @ Jul 8 2007, 10:18 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>There are a number of younger guys with a lot of experience on 4 strokes. Melandri and Hopkins were mentioned. Capirossi is a good rider but on the way out and someone I wouldn't consider a championship threat in the future. I say invest in a threat, if Pedrosa stays at Honda and Lorenzo is with Yamaha it tough to choose from whats left on the grid.
i dont know why people are saying that Cappa is on his way out and he is over the hill
just remember back 12 months
the guy finished 3rd in the champoinship only 23 points behind the new world champion and without his team mate hitting him mid season and having to race a couple of races in extreme pain then who knows.
please people give the guy a break
i hope he stays at Ducati but there are offers out there around the 3mil mark for a two year deal at kwacka but i hope he doesnt sign
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tom @ Jul 8 2007, 10:53 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Well look at how capirossi isn't getting on wit the 800, ask him to develop one he is comfortable with and it wont be any use in 2 years time when he retires and they want to bring a 250 rider onto it. So put the young guy on it now, build it around him as he gains experience, and in a few years time he will be ready to challange.
just like ducati are doing now maybe ???
i dont know why people are saying that Cappa is on his way out and he is over the hill
just remember back 12 months
the guy finished 3rd in the champoinship only 23 points behind the new world champion and without his team mate hitting him mid season and having to race a couple of races in extreme pain then who knows.
please people give the guy a break
i hope he stays at Ducati but there are offers out there around the 3mil mark for a two year deal at kwacka but i hope he doesnt sign
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tom @ Jul 8 2007, 10:53 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Well look at how capirossi isn't getting on wit the 800, ask him to develop one he is comfortable with and it wont be any use in 2 years time when he retires and they want to bring a 250 rider onto it. So put the young guy on it now, build it around him as he gains experience, and in a few years time he will be ready to challange.
just like ducati are doing now maybe ???
I think there is still life left in Loris. Last year I honestly believe he could have won the title if it wasn't for the crash at Catalunya. Who knows? Maybe he's not performing to the best of his ability because of family distractions at the moment or something. I still think we haven't seen the last of the legend yet.
As for going to Kawasaki, I'm not sure. I guess its probably the most likely team he'll be at for next season and I reckon that it would be interesting to see him on a Kawasaki and just weird seeing him off a Ducati, that team wouldn't seem right without him.
As for going to Kawasaki, I'm not sure. I guess its probably the most likely team he'll be at for next season and I reckon that it would be interesting to see him on a Kawasaki and just weird seeing him off a Ducati, that team wouldn't seem right without him.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Capirex @ Jul 9 2007, 03:26 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>1. Ducati was also a contender last year for the title - pity for the crash at catalunya - Wasn't that Loris? .... Wasn't he one of the older ones on the grid?
2. Loris developed the 990cc bike and also the 800cc bike .... he was with dukes from the beggining so there's no question about the experience and abillity of developing a bike.
3. He was pretty fast in different raaces, so he's still fast i have no doubt there ... he'll be bcak on top my prediction is from brno ...
4. Hm He need to change his style also and i think after so much time in racing that stuff is harder to do then for casey or the younger ones.
Dont you worry for him ... he won;t retire until he'll shut all the doubters, so until he'll be back for the winning way, is that clear?
I agree with you , at 34 he is not too old , he's having a bad patch at the moment but it's more down to bad luck , Loris is still young enough to win races and i believe he'll do just that in the not too distant future.
2. Loris developed the 990cc bike and also the 800cc bike .... he was with dukes from the beggining so there's no question about the experience and abillity of developing a bike.
3. He was pretty fast in different raaces, so he's still fast i have no doubt there ... he'll be bcak on top my prediction is from brno ...
4. Hm He need to change his style also and i think after so much time in racing that stuff is harder to do then for casey or the younger ones.
Dont you worry for him ... he won;t retire until he'll shut all the doubters, so until he'll be back for the winning way, is that clear?
I agree with you , at 34 he is not too old , he's having a bad patch at the moment but it's more down to bad luck , Loris is still young enough to win races and i believe he'll do just that in the not too distant future.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (chanchan @ Jul 9 2007, 05:57 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>i dont know why people are saying that Cappa is on his way out and he is over the hill
just remember back 12 months
the guy finished 3rd in the champoinship only 23 points behind the new world champion and without his team mate hitting him mid season and having to race a couple of races in extreme pain then who knows.
please people give the guy a break
It's simple, he is at the tail end of his career, he's on his way out. It may not happen for a few years, but to put it bluntly he will have to make way for younger riders, it is the nature of the sport. I think its reasonable to expect Dovisioso, Lorenzo, Toseland, DeAngelis, Bautista, Rea, Kiyonari in MotoGP within 3 years. Barros, Checa, KRJR, Edwards, Tamada will be gone and good riddance. Unfortunately Capirossi may be on this list.
I like Capirossi, I've said he is a good rider, he rode very well last year on a very well developed motorcycle. This year for him the bike doesn't work, but Stoner has proven in the right hands it is a race winner, championship leading machine. The Ducati has only been off the podium once. So why should Capirossi be given a break for performing poorly?
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (pepik128 @ Jul 9 2007, 08:56 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I agree with you , at 34 he is not too old , he's having a bad patch at the moment but it's more down to bad luck , Loris is still young enough to win races and i believe he'll do just that in the not too distant future.
What bad luck? He's definitely not too old to win races and I hope he does and as long as Stoner is in 2nd place its all good
just remember back 12 months
the guy finished 3rd in the champoinship only 23 points behind the new world champion and without his team mate hitting him mid season and having to race a couple of races in extreme pain then who knows.
please people give the guy a break
It's simple, he is at the tail end of his career, he's on his way out. It may not happen for a few years, but to put it bluntly he will have to make way for younger riders, it is the nature of the sport. I think its reasonable to expect Dovisioso, Lorenzo, Toseland, DeAngelis, Bautista, Rea, Kiyonari in MotoGP within 3 years. Barros, Checa, KRJR, Edwards, Tamada will be gone and good riddance. Unfortunately Capirossi may be on this list.
I like Capirossi, I've said he is a good rider, he rode very well last year on a very well developed motorcycle. This year for him the bike doesn't work, but Stoner has proven in the right hands it is a race winner, championship leading machine. The Ducati has only been off the podium once. So why should Capirossi be given a break for performing poorly?
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (pepik128 @ Jul 9 2007, 08:56 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I agree with you , at 34 he is not too old , he's having a bad patch at the moment but it's more down to bad luck , Loris is still young enough to win races and i believe he'll do just that in the not too distant future.
What bad luck? He's definitely not too old to win races and I hope he does and as long as Stoner is in 2nd place its all good
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (pepik128 @ Jul 8 2007, 11:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>he's having a bad patch at the moment but it's more down to bad luck , Loris is still young enough to win races and i believe he'll do just that in the not too distant future.
Bad luck my arse, hes under performing. It is possible he may return to form and that he is not too old to win races and maybe a change of team is the shake up he needs, but i am still skeptical about hiring him to develop the Kawasaki for the future when he can't ride well established machinery.
Bad luck my arse, hes under performing. It is possible he may return to form and that he is not too old to win races and maybe a change of team is the shake up he needs, but i am still skeptical about hiring him to develop the Kawasaki for the future when he can't ride well established machinery.
talking about making way for younger riders to go through into the premier class hase made me think.
Wouldnt it be nice if we could run the Motogp class like a Football league.
If you finish in the bottom 3 you are relegated down into 250cc class and then the top 3 riders in the 250cc class come up into Moto gp
That would sure make some riders even more competetive to keep their seats.
I know there is a logistical nightmare never mind the contracts but it would shake things up a bit and at the same time make way for younger riders to come through
i know it will never happen but just think, it could be cool
Wouldnt it be nice if we could run the Motogp class like a Football league.
If you finish in the bottom 3 you are relegated down into 250cc class and then the top 3 riders in the 250cc class come up into Moto gp
That would sure make some riders even more competetive to keep their seats.
I know there is a logistical nightmare never mind the contracts but it would shake things up a bit and at the same time make way for younger riders to come through
i know it will never happen but just think, it could be cool
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (chanchan @ Jul 9 2007, 05:43 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>talking about making way for younger riders to go through into the premier class hase made me think.
Wouldnt it be nice if we could run the Motogp class like a Football league.
If you finish in the bottom 3 you are relegated down into 250cc class and then the top 3 riders in the 250cc class come up into Moto gp
That would sure make some riders even more competetive to keep their seats.
I know there is a logistical nightmare never mind the contracts but it would shake things up a bit and at the same time make way for younger riders to come through
i know it will never happen but just think, it could be cool
While we are at it lets put them all on the same machinery with same tyres and same support!
Maybe then we will find out who the best riders are?
Wouldnt it be nice if we could run the Motogp class like a Football league.
If you finish in the bottom 3 you are relegated down into 250cc class and then the top 3 riders in the 250cc class come up into Moto gp
That would sure make some riders even more competetive to keep their seats.
I know there is a logistical nightmare never mind the contracts but it would shake things up a bit and at the same time make way for younger riders to come through
i know it will never happen but just think, it could be cool
While we are at it lets put them all on the same machinery with same tyres and same support!
Maybe then we will find out who the best riders are?
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (chanchan @ Jul 9 2007, 08:43 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>talking about making way for younger riders to go through into the premier class hase made me think.
Wouldnt it be nice if we could run the Motogp class like a Football league.
If you finish in the bottom 3 you are relegated down into 250cc class and then the top 3 riders in the 250cc class come up into Moto gp
That would sure make some riders even more competetive to keep their seats.
I know there is a logistical nightmare never mind the contracts but it would shake things up a bit and at the same time make way for younger riders to come through
i know it will never happen but just think, it could be cool
For that to work the machinery would have to be completely equal, and thats a rubbish idea.
Wouldnt it be nice if we could run the Motogp class like a Football league.
If you finish in the bottom 3 you are relegated down into 250cc class and then the top 3 riders in the 250cc class come up into Moto gp
That would sure make some riders even more competetive to keep their seats.
I know there is a logistical nightmare never mind the contracts but it would shake things up a bit and at the same time make way for younger riders to come through
i know it will never happen but just think, it could be cool
For that to work the machinery would have to be completely equal, and thats a rubbish idea.
