This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

2022 MotoGp Mandalika Circuit INDONESIA

I think we are seeing the old Marc. Certainly as far as the daring. As far as the ability to completely control the bike in the extreme situations I’m not so sure. It’s possible he has lost a step. Then again he hasn’t raced in quite a while, longer than the others. It’s feasible that he just needs more time to get back to his old self. However time is not on his side.

I enjoyed the era of the aliens, with just a handful of bikes and riders in the running for the win and podium.

I must admit that I am enjoying this era even more. It’s refreshing to see so many new riders and bikes that are competitive.

I think this was likely a one off situation for the Hondas with conditions necessitating the use of a previous tire. They do seem to have moved away from a bike on which he can do his thing with the front to a more conventional and generally suited bike which agrees with Pol for one.

I just don’t see how he can keep falling like this when a fall on a trail bike was sight threatening. And he could perhaps consider not pushing so hard in the warm-up session, where he is 2 for 2 in regard to falls thus far.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 person
I wonder what Honda think about all these crashes Mark is having on their bike. If he sustains a long term injurie it may reflect on the Honda brand.
 
I just don’t see how he can keep falling like this when a fall on a trail bike was sight threatening. And he could perhaps consider not pushing so hard in the warm-up session, where he is 2 for 2 in regard to falls thus far.

The problem is, he would have to get used to not going all out Marquez style and potentially losing. Which, it seems, either way he considers losing.
 
On motoGP site
Not good....

During the journey back to Spain, Marc Marquez began to experience discomfort with his vision and upon his arrival in Barcelona on Monday, he had an emergency visit to the Hospital Clinic de Barcelona with his trusted ophthalmologist, Dr. Sanchez Dalmau, who after an examination confirmed a relapse in the diplopia that the rider suffered last November.

On crash too https://www.crash.net/motogp/news/9...new-episode-diplopia-after-mandalika-highside
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: 1 person
Well said.
I really enjoyed watching Marc dominate. Watching him slide and hold the front of a 280+ hp 160 kg motorcycle was jaw dropping.
I am unsure he is going to be able to do that now and in any case pushing the bike so far over the limit lead to many crashes. The body can take only so much. His is getting older and has been absolutely thumped already.
In any case I have never seen such ability and have loved watching it displayed.
Also loved him shrugging off the Rossi mind games and fan abuse to still dominate. A great big public F you to him and his fans [emoji38]

Yeah the field is do deep and strong now, both bikes and riders. It is so close.
His ability to slide and hold speed on a bike with worn tyres prob isn't there as much and there are more with the ability to do similar.

Re: how close the racing is; I occurs to me that how exciting one finds the racing - is a matter of how one perceives the challenge of racing at the premiere level, and what one values as entertainment. Years ago I read an interview with Kenny Roberts who was talking about what makes a great racer, and he said in so many words, that what defines the top riders is not courage, or big balls or psychotic fearlessness. He said it’s all about the kind of dispassionate focus, mental acuity and discipline that makes a great chess player, which he said, was why playing golf had such a great appeal. In the current era, with increasing technical parity, the light shines even brighter on the rider when we think of what makes the team more competitive, which is IMHO, as it should be. I know a some folks find the racing less exciting because there’s less drama with less passing and less fairing bashing. As an All American boy, raised in an era where jocks ruled (although I was a four-eyed nerd who hated jocks) and going on weekends to watch the Demolition Derbies and as an unabashed Mad Max fan I have to say I prefer that over the 800 era chess game GPs. For me - I think presently MotoGp makes for a pretty good symmetry between the two dynamics. It’s a hard balance to maintain. As to MM - he’s starting to seem like a wounded badger. He has to be feeling the pressure of “advancing years.” His seeming inability to consistently ride in a more measured and pragmatic way, may end up being the quality that separates his legacy from Rossi’s. Rossi simply didn’t crash as much, and miraculously over all those years, only ever sustained one serious injury. And given how far Marquez has fallen at a relatively young age, I’m thinking retrospectively that Rossi’s continued successes into his mid-thirties look much more impressive, all the Dorna mollycoddling and turning a blind eye aside. Tho - I will say that I value Marquez’s championships over Rossi’s because the two he “won”: the one with the Gibernau pass and the one with the ........ off-track excursion at Laguna are as far as I’m concerned, illegitimate.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: 3 people
I wonder what Honda think about all these crashes Mark is having on their bike. If he sustains a long term injurie it may reflect on the Honda brand.

Always with the manufacturers, the view is: It’s the rider’s fault. Conceptually, Honda in particular, have always been all about “Here’s our latest miracle that we will allow the public to buy”.

Yamaha are the same. Their hubris is endless. How many insectile-looking MT 09s and FZ09s (essentially the same bike) sat in dealers forever collecting dust because they were so friggin’ ugly. Tho they finally got wise after - how many years? - and repackaged it in an appealing retro-ish look as the XSR900.

Ducati are equally arrogant, tho they can afford to be, as their stuff sells well because there’s the whole expensive Italian bike cache/fetish that is so appealing to their market segment.

Harley’s the same but for different reasons. As long as there are overpaid retired insurance adjusters, overweight insurance salesmen, 55-year-old no-social skills bachelor refrigerator repairmen and other kinds of Hells Angels wannabes willing to dress up in chaps and mass-produced Harley vests on the weekends, there will always be a market for slow, bulbous, overly heavy, chrome encrusted moto-anachronisms to support their bad-boy fantasy.

I want to say very clearly that I don’t absolutely dismiss all Harley owners as rednecks, social duds and posers. I have good friends who ride them, but they’re either guys who’ve done tricked-out sportsters set-up for sport riding or guys who use them for flat-track, which, if you’ve never been to a flat-track race, you are missing out on one of the most vital and essential motorcycle spectacles of American racing. Talk about yer hard-... racers….
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: 2 people
That’s bad news for Marquez. My wife was eerily prescient when she said that Marquez will never be the same. It’s looking like that may be true. I have to respect the warrior in him.
 
Watching many of the riders, in fp and qp it looked like the rear was overpowering/pushing the front tyre to much.

Matt Birt stated some of the riders said this exact thing.


As for the tires, I believe the only other time this construction was used was in Thailand/Buriram, also due to extreme heat. We may see these tires again if it's hot enough, unless Michelin comes up with something new.
 
That’s bad news for Marquez. My wife was eerily prescient when she said that Marquez will never be the same. It’s looking like that may be true. I have to respect the warrior in him.

I hope it's not true though, he could have one arm and be blindfolded and I'd still bet the house on him at the Sachsenring.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 person
Re: how close the racing is; I occurs to me that how exciting one finds the racing - is a matter of how one perceives the challenge of racing at the premiere level, and what one values as entertainment. Years ago I read an interview with Kenny Roberts who was talking about what makes a great racer, and he said in so many words, that what defines the top riders is not courage, or big balls or psychotic fearlessness. He said it’s all about the kind of dispassionate focus, mental acuity and discipline that makes a great chess player, which he said, was why playing golf had such a great appeal. In the current era, with increasing technical parity, the light shines even brighter on the rider when we think of what makes the team more competitive, which is IMHO, as it should be. I know a some folks find the racing less exciting because there’s less drama with less passing and less fairing bashing. As an All American boy, raised in an era where jocks ruled (although I was a four-eyed nerd who hated jocks) and going on weekends to watch the Demolition Derbies and as an unabashed Mad Max fan I have to say I prefer that over the 800 era chess game GPs. For me - I think presently MotoGp makes for a pretty good symmetry between the two dynamics. It’s a hard balance to maintain. As to MM - he’s starting to seem like a wounded badger. He has to be feeling the pressure of “advancing years.” His seeming inability to consistently ride in a more measured and pragmatic way, may end up being the quality that separates his legacy from Rossi’s. Rossi simply didn’t crash as much, and miraculously over all those years, only ever sustained one serious injury. And given how far Marquez has fallen at a relatively young age, I’m thinking retrospectively that Rossi’s continued successes into his mid-thirties look much more impressive, all the Dorna mollycoddling and turning a blind eye aside. Tho - I will say that I value Marquez’s championships over Rossi’s because the two he “won”: the one with the Gibernau pass and the one with the ........ off-track excursion at Laguna are as far as I’m concerned, illegitimate.

I am of the opinion both that all of Rossi’s titles were legitimate and that the Gibernau and Laguna Seca “passes” were cheating. It shouldn’t be forgotten though as you say that Rossi is right up there with the best of them (although not ahead of the very best of the other greats imo), despite him spending the last decade of his career/his declining years pursuing his personal great white whale or whatever. If he had retired after the 2009 title he would quite possibly still be perceived as being on a level of his own. Him contending at age 36 in 2015 against the likes of Lorenzo and MM was indeed remarkable, not that he should have been handed the title for services to the sport which seemed to be his own view.

It is Rossi’s character/off track manipulations and weaponisation of his fanbase in particular which I found distasteful, and MM standing up to same in such a sterling fashion was what brought me to full admiration of him.

I too am a big fan of the first two Mad Max movies, particularly the second one which I saw first. Those 2 door Falcons were a pretty good Australian version of a muscle car, and looked great with appropriately sized wheels. I nearly bought one with the 302 V8 rather than the 351 Cleveland engine, and even the 302 versions which remain go for strong money now, not that I would have kept the car for this many decades had I bought one.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: 3 people
He hardly had input in this bike. It will improve. As will Marc, hopefully.

I hear you. However, it seems he doesn’t have much input on any bike, from any of the eras. He just rides it. Not being a part of the evolution of the bike could be part of the problems he experiences with them.

I hope he recovers well too. Being able to race will be a plus.
 
Re: how close the racing is; I occurs to me that how exciting one finds the racing - is a matter of how one perceives the challenge of racing at the premiere level, and what one values as entertainment. Years ago I read an interview with Kenny Roberts who was talking about what makes a great racer, and he said in so many words, that what defines the top riders is not courage, or big balls or psychotic fearlessness. He said it’s all about the kind of dispassionate focus, mental acuity and discipline that makes a great chess player, which he said, was why playing golf had such a great appeal. In the current era, with increasing technical parity, the light shines even brighter on the rider when we think of what makes the team more competitive, which is IMHO, as it should be. I know a some folks find the racing less exciting because there’s less drama with less passing and less fairing bashing. As an All American boy, raised in an era where jocks ruled (although I was a four-eyed nerd who hated jocks) and going on weekends to watch the Demolition Derbies and as an unabashed Mad Max fan I have to say I prefer that over the 800 era chess game GPs. For me - I think presently MotoGp makes for a pretty good symmetry between the two dynamics. It’s a hard balance to maintain. As to MM - he’s starting to seem like a wounded badger. He has to be feeling the pressure of “advancing years.” His seeming inability to consistently ride in a more measured and pragmatic way, may end up being the quality that separates his legacy from Rossi’s. Rossi simply didn’t crash as much, and miraculously over all those years, only ever sustained one serious injury. And given how far Marquez has fallen at a relatively young age, I’m thinking retrospectively that Rossi’s continued successes into his mid-thirties look much more impressive, all the Dorna mollycoddling and turning a blind eye aside. Tho - I will say that I value Marquez’s championships over Rossi’s because the two he “won”: the one with the Gibernau pass and the one with the ........ off-track excursion at Laguna are as far as I’m concerned, illegitimate.

These are valid points. I had not heard these quotes from KR but they make sense. As for MM, sure I love watching him race. However the constant crashing definitely detracts from his legacy and possible length of his career, along with questionable tactics and actions from his past. I hope he recovers well and has a good life going forward, whatever having a good life means to him personally.
 
It is Rossi’s character/off track manipulations and weaponisation of his fanbase in particular which I found distasteful, and MM standing up to same in such a sterling fashion was what brought me to full admiration of him.

Well articulated.
His front end slides and saves and competitive determination to win did it for me, but I really admired him resisting that distasteful behaviour so well also.
Neither has he tried the same himself. He has relied on his riding ability.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 person
Well articulated.
His front end slides and saves and competitive determination to win did it for me, but I really admired him resisting that distasteful behaviour so well also.
Neither has he tried the same himself. He has relied on his riding ability.
Sure, I admire those things as well, although for me even as a Doohan fan Casey Stoner whom MM definitely has covered on the enduring determination to win aspect was the pinnacle as far as actually watching someone ride a bike, particularly around PI.

I too was doubtful about his tactics/actions and perhaps seeming lack of care for the safety of others early on in his career like Bern 1, and Jumkie back in the day, but I don't think there was ever malicious intent and he seems to have become more careful about others as he has progressed. As I said it was how he stood up to Rossi and that element of his fandom which others including the very good (as premier class riders) Gibernau and Biaggi, as well as Lorenzo and Stoner both of whom are probably top 10 all time imo, Lorenzo undoubtedly so, found so difficult which absolutely convinced me about MM.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 person
Marc Marquez just knew he had Rossi well covered on the bike too.
To be fair Rossi was well past his best and increasingly so the longer he stayed.
 

Recent Discussions