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2019 Sepang - Malaysia

evo9 said:
Malaysia seems to be the only parts of the east that gives him such a large fan base. In Thailand the Marquez grandstand was bigger with more 93 fans. Lets hope Indonesia does the same as Thailand. A minimum of 4, of the current top riders would have to not go racing next year for rossi have any chance at the podium much less another title. Dorna is the puppet master and yamaha is the puppet.
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His fan base is huge everywhere. Nothing intrinsically wrong with that. He's won 9 championships and enjoyed a longevity that is impressive. Other than Rossi's ability to put ..... in seats, his relevance to MotoGp is kind of moot. That he's able to finish in the top ten at age 40 is interesting from a statistical point, but to deserve a ride on a top factory bike, you need to do more. Rossi (for the most part) schlepping around in 12th place struggling to compete with rookies on downmarket bikes from KTM is like watching a 60 year old Barbara Streisand, doing a love scene where she's pretending to be 21 because Hollywood schmucks know that zillions of gray-haired widows will pack the theaters to for the sake of nostalgia.
 
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ratdeal said:
The size of the stands for respective riders, while relevant to the sales of tickets for seats, has no bearing on the volume of machines sold.

The fact is that until a south east Asian prospect turns up and starts winning, Rossi will leave a void from a marketing perspective in that region. And Yamaha with its dwindling sales figures globally has leaned heavily on the region as have the other manufacturers.

Racing is primarily a marketing exercise. All other considerations are secondary.
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I go with the theory that Yamaha are keeping Rossi around because Dorna subsidized them in order to support their bottom line, which comes from all the ..... in seats, and advertising revenues the value of which is founded on how many ..... there are in seats (and of course how many viewers on TV etc.) and all the money they make from merchandise vendors at shows along with dozens and dozens of other business to whom they license their name and merchandise. Just a guess, but I bet very few of the hundred thousand people in the stands in Malaysia pay a penny to stream the races. I lived in India for a while and there the races were broadcast free with no commercials. Probably true for most of Asia.
 
Keshav said:
I go with the theory that Yamaha are keeping Rossi around because Dorna subsidized them in order to support their bottom line, which comes from all the ..... in seats, and advertising revenues the value of which is founded on how many ..... there are in seats (and of course how many viewers on TV etc.) and all the money they make from merchandise vendors at shows along with dozens and dozens of other business to whom they license their name and merchandise. Just a guess, but I bet very few of the hundred thousand people in the stands in Malaysia pay a penny to stream the races. I lived in India for a while and there the races were broadcast free with no commercials. Probably true for most of Asia.
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I am sure Dorna/uncle Carmelo had a role both when Valentino first joined Yamaha and when he returned there, but even in the second case he was the best rider available imo, unless someone wishes to posit that Ben Spies was deliberately sabotaged which I think is highly unlikely.

I suspect Valentino subsidises Yamaha more than Dorna does however, they had no naming rights sponsor when the factory riders were Lorenzo and Spies, while sponsorship appears plentiful now, including for the satellite team which can presumably easily afford the full factory bikes both riders reportedly now have with Petronas money, which Tech Trois reputedly couldn’t do. Yamaha are a much smaller company than Honda, who seem to regard racing as part of their DNA going back to their founder Soichiro Honda himself, and appear prepared to both expend significant funds of their own and brook the disapproval consequent on a fallout with the likes of Valentino Rossi.

I have thought like many that the plan was for Rossi to be a Yamaha icon in retirement and to perhaps carry on to be the factory team manager a la Agostini and Roberts, but in view of the critics on this thread will restrict myself to saying I can see signs that this could come unstuck.

I like you don’t see the point of finishing 4th at age 40 being now a good day for such a great rider, let alone him battling for a finish at the lower end of the top 10 on more than a few weekends this year.
 
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Keshav said:
No idea what you're on about. When did I ever say that Dorna didn't pressure Yamaha etc. Are you sure you didn't reply to the wrong post dude???
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Sorry mate post wasn’t aimed at you. By the time I replied you had already posted.
 
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darkkakashi said:
And you are thai shemales' ......

How would you know about the thai counting of fans ? You were there, to .... little boys at worst case scenario, shemales medium case scenario, cheap hookers best case scenario.
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Hahaha... how to make yourself sound infinitely stupider than the poster you were quoting AND prove you have never left your sofa.

I have lived in Thailand for over 13 yrs, been to MotoGPs all over Asia (with my western wife, so please save your uniformed ...-tourist comments) and evo9 is absolutely correct.

Go ask mom to change your diaper, and try to get out of her basement now and then.
 
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imunderandoverit said:
Rossi showed again that he still has it when his bike works. Chocking the yama is so slow on the straights. Lorenzo.......... Zarco should get that ride.
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How did he show he still has it? He was smashed by his teammate who won the race and he only finished fourth. Not a stellar performance I'm afraid. Even worse considering there is nothing wrong at all with that beautiful factory Yamaha.
 
Mick D said:
Hahaha... how to make yourself sound infinitely stupider than the poster you were quoting AND prove you have never left your sofa.

I have lived in Thailand for over 13 yrs, been to MotoGPs all over Asia (with my western wife, so please save your uniformed ...-tourist comments) and evo9 is absolutely correct.

Go ask mom to change your diaper, and try to get out of her basement now and then.
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I can vouch for that. Met Mick and the wife when me and mine were in Thailand. Mick's wife is hot. Asian street meat not required.
 
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Aw Mang said:
I hope Yamaha sign Rossi for another two years and the Petronas team outperforms the factory team just to see Yamaha and that rat face Jarvis fail.
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And MM can win his 10th crown while the king is watching..... I mean he wont be seeing much during the race because he is so far back defending is 11th position but he gets to see it at home if luccio records it for him.
 
Segfault said:
Here is how MM crash unfolds. As we know now Keshav is the standard of human capabilities. What he cannot do nobody can. So we have to assume there is a Guardian Angel in action every time MM crashes.
The first picture shows how this Guardian Angel lets Marc to get upright and step on his bike.
Second shows how his GA lets him land on his foot.
Third picture illustrates how GA managed to override Marc's natural reflexes and to avoid breaking his wrists pulls his hands towards his body, so the impact goes to the heavily padded elbows instead.
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Photos are like religious tenets in that they can be interpreted in myriad ways.

Photo #1 I The Great Super Marc will now descend from the heavens and pin the motorcycle to the ground to keep it from hitting a passing rider.

Photo #2 "Hey, wait for me, I want donuts too. I'm running as fast as I can."

Photo #3 "The front of my helmet is too darned shiny. Watch me grind off all that excess paint at 120 clicks."

Barring your interpretation and mine, and employing Occam's razor, the most plausible explanation is that he is still a mortal being subject to the laws of gravity, physics and thermodynamics like everyone else.
 
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Barring your interpretation and mine, and employing Occam's razor, the most plausible explanation is that he is still a mortal being subject to the laws of gravity, physics and thermodynamics like everyone else.
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Didn't say he could rip off wings from his bike and using those to fly into pits.
My point is he is not using Keshav-recommended "wet rag" style when he crashes. Look at any of his crashes in slow motion, he always manages to do something to avoid the worst. It is quite unusual in MotoGP, I agree, but in some other sports falling technique is part of routine training.
 
Segfault said:
Didn't say he could rip off wings from his bike and using those to fly into pits.
My point is he is not using Keshav-recommended "wet rag" style when he crashes. Look at any of his crashes in slow motion, he always manages to do something to avoid the worst. It is quite unusual in MotoGP, I agree, but in some other sports falling technique is part of routine training.
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As yet you have offered zero in the way of evidence to support your unfounded speculation. Regardless of your insulting tone and your dogmatic insistence, I will continue to reject your faith-based beliefs.
 
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Keshav said:
As yet you have offered zero in the way of evidence to support your unfounded speculation. Regardless of your insulting tone and your dogmatic insistence, I will continue to reject your faith-based beliefs.
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I don’t believe MM will be riding at 30 let alone 40 if he continues riding as he does, and he is going to found out eventually if he continues to highside as he did in the most recent round.

No-one is saying he can highside with impunity because of his “falling” ability however afaik, and I don’t think it is entirely irrational to suggest that the man with possibly the closest to the proverbial cat-like reflexes of any rider in MotoGP history as evidenced by his now almost routine impossible saves can mitigate a crash better than some.
 
michaelm said:
I don’t believe MM will be riding at 30 let alone 40 if he continues riding as he does, and he is going to found out eventually if he continues to highside as he did in the most recent round.

No-one is saying he can highside with impunity because of his “falling” ability however afaik, and I don’t think it is entirely irrational to suggest that the man with possibly the closest to the proverbial cat-like reflexes of any rider in MotoGP history as evidenced by his now almost routine impossible saves can mitigate a crash better than some.
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MM routinely makes front end saves throughout the race to the point where there is a predictability factor. For the most part when he does crash, it's a low-side. In a low-side there is much more unpredictability than one can discern from one's television set. Much like the way it's so hard to get a real sense of how fast the bikes are when watching from a TV monitor.

That unpredictability factor is increased five hundred fold (yes- just a number I made up) in a high-side. You can be sure that MM does is not factoring in the mathematic likelihood of a high-side at any time in the race. He's totally sold on the idea that he will not crash. Ask anyone who's been violently thrown in the air at speed and they will (and have done) tell you, there's no way to manipulate the landing - simply because when you're in the air, there is NOTHING to push against. There is no resisting that kind of violent force. Watch video of astronauts floating around in a space station. Once they push away from a wall (moving at 2 mph) there's some room to change attitude, but alternately, when a rider is launched violently in a normal gravity environment at over 100 mph there's no time for acrobatics. It's just bag of meat being shot out of a cannon.
 
Keshav said:
MM routinely makes front end saves throughout the race to the point where there is a predictability factor. For the most part when he does crash, it's a low-side. In a low-side there is much more unpredictability than one can discern from one's television set. Much like the way it's so hard to get a real sense of how fast the bikes are when watching from a TV monitor.

That unpredictability factor is increased five hundred fold (yes- just a number I made up) in a high-side. You can be sure that MM does is not factoring in the mathematic likelihood of a high-side at any time in the race. He's totally sold on the idea that he will not crash. Ask anyone who's been violently thrown in the air at speed and they will (and have done) tell you, there's no way to manipulate the landing - simply because when you're in the air, there is NOTHING to push against. There is no resisting that kind of violent force. Watch video of astronauts floating around in a space station. Once they push away from a wall (moving at 2 mph) there's some room to change attitude, but alternately, when a rider is launched violently in a normal gravity environment at over 100 mph there's no time for acrobatics. It's just bag of meat being shot out of a cannon.
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I am well aware of the laws of physics which you canna change as it is said, the speed with which you are thrown is the speed with which you are thrown, and while I haven’t and will never ride a bike in a race I am aware that high sides are the problematic and much more violent crashes compared with low sides, and that the decreased frequency of same in modern gp bike racing which is likely both a result of and a significant aim of the modern rider aid technology is a significant reason there has been an improvement on the injuriy front.

Of course he can’t continue to get away with high sides like the recent one as I believe I have said several times, and he has been lucky in both this recent crash and several previous ones.if his head/helmet scraping along the ground was a result of any volition of his concerning which Mick D is rightly facetious then it wasn’t a good idea anyway.

I was on board with Jumkie’s application in MM’s early days of the murder Marc soubriquet and the thrust of him labelling MM as slightly autistic, basically referring I think to him being careless of consequences which he was then and continues to be to an extent imo. As you allude to, I am sure he rides with the mind set that he isn’t going to highs side rather than with the belief he can ameliorate high sides and hence they are less of a concern. What is remarkable if not necessarily wise is that he continues to ride the same way. I didn’t expect him to ride conservatively in the race after that massive high side and he probably didn’t.
 
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michaelm said:
I am well aware of the laws of physics which you canna change as it is said, the speed with which you are thrown is the speed with which you are thrown, and while I haven’t and will never ride a bike in a race I am aware that high sides are the problematic and much more violent crashes compared with low sides, and that the decreased frequency of same in modern gp bike racing which is likely both a result of and a significant aim of the modern rider aid technology is a significant reason there has been an improvement on the injuriy front.

Of course he can’t continue to get away with high sides like the recent one as I believe I have said several times, and he has been lucky in both this recent crash and several previous ones.if his head/helmet scraping along the ground was a result of any volition of his concerning which Mick D is rightly facetious then it wasn’t a good idea anyway.


I was on board with Jumkie’s application in MM’s early days of the murder Marc soubriquet and the thrust of him labelling MM as slightly autistic, basically referring I think to him being careless of consequences which he was then and continues to be to an extent imo. As you allude to, I am sure he rides with the mind set that he isn’t going to highs side rather than with the belief he can ameliorate high sides and hence they are less of a concern. What is remarkable if not necessarily wise is that he continues to ride the same way. I didn’t expect him to ride conservatively in the race after that massive high side and he probably didn’t.
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I hope you didn't feel as if I was "lecturing". Just trying to make crystal clear the reasoning behind my position. Honestly I can kind of understand how someone might roll on to the idea that MM has some supernatural power to avoid serious injury considering the frequency of falls and the concurrent velocity. If I had to posit a reason why he (more or less) gets away with it, apposite to Pedrosa's case, I'd say it has to do with body type, same as it probably has for Rossi, tho - like you, in that he's much more reckless than Rossi ever was, I think it's only a matter of time before he incurs a much more debilitating injury. Re: the autism angle; that sounds like something I would have said. I worked as a counselor at a summer camp for autistic kids many years ago, and have a nephew who is a very high-functioning Aspergers case, who ended up working in the Obama White House at age 18 and at age 22 is earning 6 figures working for Google. I'm currently teaching guitar to an autistic kid who is the son of my neighbor. It's a fascinating (if that's the right word) disease.
 
Keshav said:
I hope you didn't feel as if I was "lecturing". Just trying to make crystal clear the reasoning behind my position. Honestly I can kind of understand how someone might roll on to the idea that MM has some supernatural power to avoid serious injury considering the frequency of falls and the concurrent velocity. If I had to posit a reason why he (more or less) gets away with it, apposite to Pedrosa's case, I'd say it has to do with body type, same as it probably has for Rossi, tho - like you, in that he's much more reckless than Rossi ever was, I think it's only a matter of time before he incurs a much more debilitating injury. Re: the autism angle; that sounds like something I would have said. I worked as a counselor at a summer camp for autistic kids many years ago, and have a nephew who is a very high-functioning Aspergers case, who ended up working in the Obama White House at age 18 and at age 22 is earning 6 figures working for Google. I'm currently teaching guitar to an autistic kid who is the son of my neighbor. It's a fascinating (if that's the right word) disease.
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It is/they are a complex condition/group of conditions which I don’t understand, and are still not well understood in general afaik. I don’t think Jumkie was actually intending to diagnose MM and I certainly wouldn’t, the gist of his labelling of MM was I believe that Marc”s emotional response to or perception of danger, both his own and the danger to others from him, was rather different from the norm.

I think that one thing which was proposed, that MM has the sangfroid/nervelessness and reflexes to elect to break his fall with his padded elbow rather than his outstretched hand as we are pretty much hardwired to do, is possible. That he can always land cat-like on his feet is I am sure implausible for the reasons you say, and probably a romantic notion.

(EDIT Just read the current edition of AMCN focused on MM’s most recent title win with comments from a number of people from the paddock including fellow riders and Ohlins engineers which included how much training he does and how strong he is, particularly in regard to upper body strength, and from one of the Ohlins guys how everyone thought in his first year that he would have a major crash which would chasten him, but that this hasn’t happened and that he continues to crash then bounce out of the resultant cloud of dust like a rubber doll and sprint back to the pits. Doesn’t mean this will continue forever of course as we have both said ).
 
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