Shark Gran Prix de France - Le Mans 2022

Hello chaps. Been a while. Mainly because I got a bit spicy with Giu22a when Marc had his big off in 2020. Apologies for that Giu22a. Its all love here.

My thoughts on today's race, particularly Ducati:

The theory that having a large number of saucy riders on Ducati machines is proving to be a fools errand. Too many ambitious young riders vying for a factory seat, stealing points off the chosen one, in this case Pecco.

On Pecco, I think much needs to be said for his attitude toward proving himself the number one, particularly where satellite riders are concerned. This isn't the first time he's bottled it when trying to impose his number 1 status upon junior team mates (Qatar anyone?).

Compounding my view is the fact that the other factories (Suzuki and KTM not withstanding) have clear number 1 riders, and through merit. Whilst Ducati's strategy is a great one for winning the constructors, their desire to win the riders championship is clearly compromised as a result.

Overall one of the best races in memory for me (which reaches back to 2004). Alot of people bemoan the large pack races we had for a time. My opinion has shifted some what. I used to love them. However, the crap shoots from the past (Assen 2018 and Philip Island 2015 come to mind) are no longer, and whilst the initial laps are frantic, I'm appreciating the developing narratives when the race settles down now.

On the subject of aero, I'm still undecided, but it does seem to me that these additional tech add ons like wings and ride height devices make the action seem a little more on edge. Good or bad thing? Unsure. But bits of carbon flying through the pack are obviously a hazard from my armchair.

P.s. Good to be back!!!

Great to see you back; because you’re always a welcome contributor and also because you’re further evidence that the oft repeated scenario of this forum dying a sad and lonely death in the absence of the Gang of Four was a provably false narrative.

Funnily enough Enea seems to have taken personally the news that Pecco doesn't want him as his teammate next year, preferring instead to keep Miller as a non-threatening 2nd option.

As a personal observation, I'm beginning to think Enea is the real deal (one doesn't fluke 3 wins on satellite machinery) and I wonder if not being a VR46 academy rider has something to do with it. Meanwhile your Bagnaias, Marinis, Morbidellis and the rest seem to lack in mental fortitude and other skills.

MichaelBolton said:

Funnily enough Enea seems to have taken personally the news that Pecco doesn't want him as his teammate next year, preferring instead to keep Miller as a non-threatening 2nd option.

As a personal observation, I'm beginning to think Enea is the real deal (one doesn't fluke 3 wins on satellite machinery) and I wonder if not being a VR46 academy rider has something to do with it. Meanwhile your Bagnaias, Marinis, Morbidellis and the rest seem to lack in mental fortitude and other skills.

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Their teacher and dear leader recently retired was likewise lacking in mental fortitude and other skills.

Interesting and frank interviews with Fabs, Marquez and Zarco after the race.

Watching the start and the close jostling between Fabio, Marc and Nakagami was breathtaking. Tribute to everybody’s skill that nobody fell off.

If Pecco said that he didn’t want Enea as his teammate, he goes down a notch in my estimation. He’s losing the mental battle already with that ill advised first shot.

Just read what Pecco said about potential teammates on crash. If accurate, he just said he was used to Jack and that he liked him. He also said it was up to Ducati and that Enea was deserving of the seat with 3 victories this year.

Sorry I slagged Bagnaia on second hand info.

mylexicon said:

The interesting thing about Enea is his style. People comment that he’s fast through the corners and has awesome edge grip off of the rear tire, particularly late in races. The descriptions make his style sound Lorenzo-esque, but he keeps winning at circuits that riders often brand as stop-and-go circuits.

He’s a potential Lorenzo with the ability to win at Marquez tracks? Could be interesting, but as is the case in the spec tire era, his career might depend on the direction of Michelin’s control tire. He’s definitely the rider of the moment.

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From my limited understanding, Enea sits alot more inboard the machine, differing from the accepted hang off style of recent years. If I'm not mistaken it was a Miller observation that brought this to my attention. If correct it would make sense that he stresses the edge of the tyre less, resulting in his end of race advantage where attrition is taken into account.

When viewed with the Lorenzo form in mind it makes sense. Jorge always kept his arse-end in the seat alot more than the other riders of his era, effectively steering the bike using a unique "man/machine" harmonious style.

ratdeal said:

Hello chaps. Been a while. Mainly because I got a bit spicy with Giu22a when Marc had his big off in 2020. Apologies for that Giu22a. Its all love here.

My thoughts on today's race, particularly Ducati:

The theory that having a large number of saucy riders on Ducati machines is proving to be a fools errand. Too many ambitious young riders vying for a factory seat, stealing points off the chosen one, in this case Pecco.

On Pecco, I think much needs to be said for his attitude toward proving himself the number one, particularly where satellite riders are concerned. This isn't the first time he's bottled it when trying to impose his number 1 status upon junior team mates (Qatar anyone?).

Compounding my view is the fact that the other factories (Suzuki and KTM not withstanding) have clear number 1 riders, and through merit. Whilst Ducati's strategy is a great one for winning the constructors, their desire to win the riders championship is clearly compromised as a result.

Overall one of the best races in memory for me (which reaches back to 2004). Alot of people bemoan the large pack races we had for a time. My opinion has shifted some what. I used to love them. However, the crap shoots from the past (Assen 2018 and Philip Island 2015 come to mind) are no longer, and whilst the initial laps are frantic, I'm appreciating the developing narratives when the race settles down now.

On the subject of aero, I'm still undecided, but it does seem to me that these additional tech add ons like wings and ride height devices make the action seem a little more on edge. Good or bad thing? Unsure. But bits of carbon flying through the pack are obviously a hazard from my armchair.

P.s. Good to be back!!!

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Welcome back mate. I don't remember that, I would never imagine you get out of the forum because of me - one random somebody - really. My apologies if I did anything rude, you know, it's hard to express ourselves correctly with a language we don't tame.

Bern1 said:

If Pecco said that he didn’t want Enea as his teammate, he goes down a notch in my estimation. He’s losing the mental battle already with that ill advised first shot.

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So apparently he's looking for an easy work. Maybe Bastianini arrival will make good for Bagnaia and Ducati factory.

ratdeal said:

Hello chaps. Been a while. ...

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I was just reviewing what the problem was between you and me and now I recalled that .... mate, sorry I was so rude and stupid, maybe not on a good day, I can't recall but I apologize.

Been working a lot by years, maybe I'm suffering some burnout syndrome or something.

Keshav said:

Great to see you back; because you’re always a welcome contributor and also because you’re further evidence that the oft repeated scenario of this forum dying a sad and lonely death in the absence of the Gang of Four was a provably false narrative.

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It is not what it was but I think a lot of the rancor was due to the pro- and anti-Rossi stuff; I was certainly guilty myself of the lartter.

Perhaps discussing current racing might have a future. Even for MM who was partially in that era then dominated the next era 6th seems like an expected/fairly good result at this point in time result now.

The season is heating up!

This last race at Le Mans was really exciting. It’s making the rest of the calendar really appealing.

Mugello will be awesome as always. We’ll see how that really long straight affects everybody not on a Ducati.

I wonder how Yamaha are going to deal with the power deficiency going forward.

Fabio appeared drained in the post race presser and said that they (the team) has to “take more chances.” He is already taking plenty himself.

Just another sign of the times. I wonder if Yamaha is going to do anything at all in fact. If they even can.
What bike could Fabio go to anyway? His style totally suits the Yamaha, except it’s not fast enough! He said he could not make a single overtake after the start of the race. He didn’t say it but it wasn’t for lack of trying. (He did say he was riding at 100%.)

Honda and KTM appear to not have the goods at all. MM was all out of shape everywhere.

Seems this year the bikes have “their tracks.”

Looks like Ducati will be hard to beat at Mugello.

gui22a said:

I was just reviewing what the problem was between you and me and now I recalled that .... mate, sorry I was so rude and stupid, maybe not on a good day, I can't recall but I apologize.

Been working a lot by years, maybe I'm suffering some burnout syndrome or something.

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To use an old English idiom, it was six of one and half a dozen of the other.

I didn't leave because of you, I left because I became too emotional on an Internet forum about the health of a person I've never met, who does not know I exist, and ended up having a bitter argument about it with a stranger on the internet, that just so happened to be you. Clearly I was looking for trouble that day as I am not an argumentative person.

I decided that was a good sign I should take some time away from the Internet. Life is too short to be governed by one's ego like that. The Internet thrives off people showing the worst of themselves to the world and I don't want to be a part of that nonsense.

I'm glad we could put that in the past and look forward to sharing in our passion for the sport again!

Bern1 said:

The season is heating up!

This last race at Le Mans was really exciting. It’s making the rest of the calendar really appealing.

Mugello will be awesome as always. We’ll see how that really long straight affects everybody not on a Ducati.

I wonder how Yamaha are going to deal with the power deficiency going forward.

Fabio appeared drained in the post race presser and said that they (the team) has to “take more chances.” He is already taking plenty himself.

Just another sign of the times. I wonder if Yamaha is going to do anything at all in fact. If they even can.
What bike could Fabio go to anyway? His style totally suits the Yamaha, except it’s not fast enough! He said he could not make a single overtake after the start of the race. He didn’t say it but it wasn’t for lack of trying. (He did say he was riding at 100%.)

Honda and KTM appear to not have the goods at all. MM was all out of shape everywhere.

Seems this year the bikes have “their tracks.”

Looks like Ducati will be hard to beat at Mugello.

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It really feels to me like we are seeing the reality of Marc's situation, and the inherent weaknesses in his approach, exposed by Fabio right now.

No one can doubt Marc's talent, or that he was box office to watch. Throwing himself at the scenery for years trying to bend recalcitrant machines and uncompromising competitors to his will. However, with the benefit of the hindsight that Fabio has brought to the table it really is starting to look like that approach is, and always was a short lived one. Looking at the bigger picture I think Marc has likely thrown away a good few extra years of competition in his win it or bin it style. We can never know but he may even end up with less WC's than he might other wise have had, simply due to the fact he's now quite broken.

His style used to seem quite innovative, taking the machine beyond its limit in practice sessions, but it also betrays a lack of respect for his own biological machine. The real skill that has defined this sport has been to identify, then dance on the limit, not go over it on purpose to find it, then brutalise that limit for 25 laps on a Sunday.

It also seems to me that Fabio is now putting the "Honda is a .... bike, it's all Marc" narrative into focus, with the help of a certain Aleix. Besides maybe KTM, there are no bad bikes, and the Honda never was one. The number of titles Marc won can attest to that. Its just that we've been in an era for some time now where a rider at his peak needs a perfect combination of factors to be competitive and remain that way for a number of years. The end of the Saturday night specials has meant there are no longer any shortcuts to success. Perfect harmony between man, machine and pitbox is required.

Right now Fabio is looking like the perfect rider, and whilst the bike is just lacking an edge on the straights, every other part of the package is just right. And I will happily admit that whilst Marc has been fantastic to watch over the years, watching Fabio with his serene brilliance, and calm demeanour even in intense battles is making me think he might be better than even Marc was at his best. We'll find out in the next few years.

Regarding Pecco, I'm sorry but unless something transformative happens to him psychologically (it could happen, look at Fabio in the 2020 off season), he's going to be consumed by the pressure. His fortitude at this point is such a glaring weakness that has destroyed many a rider in the past. I hope he can sort himself out, but if not Enea has clearly been taking advice from Pernat on how to assert his dominance on the factory boys, both on track and off. And it's a joy to watch Enea become a cocky little .....

Marc is now weaker, that R shoulder still appears to have no strength. Yeah he is beaten up.
You can also speculate, the front end is even harder to catch in a slide with the extra downforce the wings are putting on it.
The bikes and tyres have changed and the high corner speed style seems to be more dominant than it was.
Stuff it in, square it off, and fire out doesn't seem to be the fastest way around many tracks anymore

MichaelBolton said:

As a personal observation, I'm beginning to think Enea is the real deal (one doesn't fluke 3 wins on satellite machinery) and I wonder if not being a VR46 academy rider has something to do with it. Meanwhile your Bagnaias, Marinis, Morbidellis and the rest seem to lack in mental fortitude and other skills.

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Marini for sure is really not dominating bis team mate like one should when 1. You are in your 2nd season and the team mate is a rookie and 2. Said team mate is on an older bike.

mylexicon said:

Aprilia Says Espargaro Row Is Just Part Of The Game

Sad but true. Posturing and emotionally manipulating the fans and commercial environment is part of the game these days.

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Indeed, especially post ......

ratdeal said:

To use an old English idiom, it was six of one and half a dozen of the other.

I didn't leave because of you, I left because I became too emotional on an Internet forum about the health of a person I've never met, who does not know I exist, and ended up having a bitter argument about it with a stranger on the internet, that just so happened to be you. Clearly I was looking for trouble that day as I am not an argumentative person.

I decided that was a good sign I should take some time away from the Internet. Life is too short to be governed by one's ego like that. The Internet thrives off people showing the worst of themselves to the world and I don't want to be a part of that nonsense.

I'm glad we could put that in the past and look forward to sharing in our passion for the sport again!

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Excellent post, more people should be like this. Welcome back!