Yes, it seems you can't just complement Stoner around here, you have to bow before the god that is. I am a fan of Casey, however the more I read here the less I like his supporters.
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Yes, it seems you can't just complement Stoner around here, you have to bow before the god that is. I am a fan of Casey, however the more I read here the less I like his supporters.
At no point did I say that either is consistently faster, I said- at present-at Brno, Dani's Style seems to be gelling with the Honda better, Stoner is chewing up his rubber, this is fact. You have to accept that not everybody is
out to get Casey Stoner, these are opinions based on evidence. As we all know Dani has broken his collarbone twice recently, this is a very large injury and on both occasions it was bad luck. To be back and leading this field, 'this weekend'
and winning the race in Germany shows what an immense talent he is. Stoner has not suffered anywhere near the injury that Dani has sustained, nor the ongoing treatment and recovery.
So clearly on his day, at some circuits on the same machinery, Dani is faster than Stoner and vice-versa.
As Lorenzo was faster than Rossi, at some circuits, on his day in 2009. As I said they are the Aliens, all have tremendous talent.
The Honda is the best bike in the field this season, better than it was last season, of this there is little doubt and I have stated it many times. Only Stoner and Dani have been able to consistently take full advantage of this, kudos to both of them.
I don't think anyone is saying that Stoner's relative injury luck is the only thing that is keeping him in front at all, his high-side at Germany was unbelievably scary, and Jorge, Dani and Rossi have all had similar huge accidents in recent years-only they were in hospital for quite a
period afterwards with several rounds missed, you have to admit on this particular occasion Stoner was very lucky not to suffer the same fate. Luck in situations like these can certainly help to win or lose championships.
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I certainly don't wish Stoner or any other rider to get injured mate. The point that was made was that Stoner, like Rossi until 2010, has been relatively lucky with injury unlike Pedrosa or some other riders.
What irks me, and others, is that this season, when Rossi is struggling with a bike that Stoner was achieving wins on, (and lets not forget having his ambition outweigh his talent on regularly,) that now Vale is a dirty rider, all his titles are worthless can't ride a motorcycle, Rossi fans aren't race fan, they are all 13 year old girls etc ..... from the usual suspects on here. And I don't see many posts on here saying Casey can't ride a bike, because it's obvious the guy is a ....... awesome rider, as are Rossi, Lorenzo, Pedrosa etc etc.
One of the reasons a lot of people dislike Stoner, myself included, is that he comes across as a moaner with his childish outbursts when he gets beaten on track or go forbid, someone should be trying to qualify when he is on the track. A lot of, it has to be said Aussie, Stoner fans who have totally misinterpreted posts on here, then go off throwing the toys out of the pram.
The facts are simple, Rossi is one of the most successful motorcycle racers ever, viewed by many who know more than we will ever know as the GOAT. Casey is an incredible rider, who, on current form will no doubt take another title in his career, but we can't rewrite history and give him Rossi's achievements because of his passport. And like it or not, he does himself no favours with race fans when he greets an whines about other racers as he does in the press frequently.
Pete
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Pete, in terms of MGP you are absolutely correct in respects of the 'relative' injury free runs of CS & VR to name but two however certainly CS has had some injuries in his development categories (from memory a serious concussion and also back issues that have resurfaced).
But certainly I do think that Pedrosa has more than had his (un)fair share of injuries and I for one seriously wonder what could have been in terms of his career as he is (IMO only here) very much the forgotten amongst the top 4 as DP's results may not be the equal but his ability is.
Personally I see the same argument from the counter side and so on.
Sadly the internet does not yet seem to have an '.....' sensor (but you can bet that Microsoft will be working on it) that prohibits the complete tool from accessing and providing their 'opinions as fact' etc, if only it were so.
By all means if you choose include me with the Aussie fans you mention, your call but I will take issue with the comments that CS carries on like a child when beaten as it is generally untrue (yes, on some occasions certainly but they all have that streak in them). In most occasions when beaten Stoner is gracious to those that beat him (again to all, note it says most times as we do know there have been exceptions) but will on occasion sadly let himself down in his public comments which I personally suspect are just his way of stating what he sees as the facts of the situation.
Anyone who seriously questions the worth of Rossi to the history of the sport fits into the category mentioned earlier, an ......
I am no fan of the Rossi 'over the top' persona (no surprise to many there) but to question what he has done and to seriously attempt to compare achievements between any of the current crop and Rossi is ludicrous. If Rossi is to be compared in terms of achievements it surely has to be against past champions as there are none in the current crop that will match the level of race wins and/or championships no matter how long they remain in the game.
Simply put, like him or not what has been done cannot be undone and you can only achieve against those that compete at the time, not those that did not and while as an Aussie I would love to see CS win more, he will not beat the Rossi race win record nor 7 championships without much, much luck going his way.
And like you I have turned with Hopper, I questioned him a lot but am glad that he has turned the distraction around and produced what he has in BSB, WSBK and his short sting back in MGP.
Like you, I eat my hat on it.
Gaz
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Can you give your source for this FACT. I have read or heard no report that suggests Stoner has rubber issues or that he is chewing through his rubber in Brno.
I have read that he is suffering front and rear grip. I assume this is to do with set up rather than wear or unsuitable rubber.
Since you stated it as FACT can you please supply the source of these FACTS?
I have posted on several occasions including probably on this thread against people including my fellow countrymen who argue that valentino finally both suffering a severe injury and getting on what very much appears to be a bad bike in any way invalidates his previous success, and to be exact that it is ridiculous to argue that his "enormous success over such a prolonged period on 5 or so different types of bikes for 3 or 4 different manufacturers including his 125 and 250 days and 1st year on the honda 500 is down to preferment" to no reply from a fellow antipodean poster. The reason he is at the pinnacle of the sport is because injury and equipment haven't been allowed to impinge on his performances over a longer period than anyone except ago, very much due to good management rather than good luck imo, and likely to continue to set him apart even from riders as good as pedrosa, lorenzo and stoner.
However now that he has had an injury and got on a bad bike, this is not more or less unfortunate than it happening to other riders, and it is not as if stoner in particular hasn't been blamed for the deficiencies of a bike and been disbelieved and in fact vilified for significant injuries and illness which there was no reason other than prejudice to believe were not genuine. In your particular case the criticism was always at least pithy and humorous.
I disagree vehemently with the current criticism of rossi and have endeavoured not to participate as far as my own prejudices allow. When it comes to bike racing it is what it is, and whilst no one would wish dani's injuries on him and they may well have prevented him winning championships, the fact is that if anything he crashes less than most but usually gets more injured than others. It is "unfair" and in no way his fault but it has gone past being unlucky, he is fairly obviously physically fragile. In the same sense I would like to think that mick doohan would have won 7 championships and would be co-equal with valentino if he hadn't crashed and injured himself, but he did crash and he didn't win the extra 2 championships.
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Gaz and Michael M, great posts guys.
You have restored my faith in Aussies
Seirously though, what ifs and mean have been mean jack. Stoner has the package this year, and is on top of his game, Vale unfortunately isn't. I'm just looking forward to seeing Vale back at the front fighting Stoner Lorenzo et al,at the end of the day, it's great racing we are all looking for.
Pete
You have restored my faith in Aussies
Seirously though, what ifs and mean have been mean jack. Stoner has the package this year, and is on top of his game, Vale unfortunately isn't. I'm just looking forward to seeing Vale back at the front fighting Stoner Lorenzo et al,at the end of the day, it's great racing we are all looking for.
Pete
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Well, why do you think I did so? Wait, don't answer too quick. Maybe take the trouble of reading my original post again first. Then pause and ponder: 'Is stiefel really suggesting we should compare Stoner's 2007 to Rossi's 2011? Could it be that I misinterpreted his post? What else could he have meant?' If you're still puzzled after that, I will take the trouble to spell it out for you. Promise.
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Your post was irrelevant and flawed. Did nothing to disprove Rossi's statement due to the big front end differences between the 07 and 10/11 bikes and the comparative strength of the honda/yamahas being different making such a comparison of 07 to 11 irrelevant. Rossi wasn't referring to this. By the time stoner got to the 10 ducati, he had a lot of experience with the red beasts.
No I don't think Rossi could match stoner on the duc if he had four years of experience unless he had successfully changed it into something that gave him the feel he was after.
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You’re so intelligent Pete and as ‘michaelm' posted “you guys are getting rather desperate these days for avenues of attack on Stoner. Detracting from his performances on the basis that he didn't get as injured from a highside as you think he should have would certainly qualify as desperate by most standards”
Well keep on digging some other excuses Pete and let’s see what else anyone can come up with??? You might as well say that, JLo Pedro Rossi Simo (you might as well include the whole grid) are all below par and injured and that is why Stoner is winning and is lucky that he hasn’t injured himself and that is why he’s the championship, blah blah blah
Well my friend Stoner is miles ahead of the rest because he rides like he did at laguna seca and did you watch Brno Pete? What excuses were there for him winning Brno? ohh I know one that you can go with and it's, because Pedro crashed out and that is why Stoner won ...look at the racing Pete and don’t play the man and let’s see what happens this year next year, I admit that I’m a Stoner fan but I’ve been a Stoner fan when he rode the 125’s the 250’s and all throughout his motogp carrier and I also predicted that he will win the 2007 W/C on Crash.net forum (and there is a reference of my comment that I have, because that is the type of rider that Stoner was all throughout his riding "he needed a factory bike' not an LCR that he started with in motogp) and at the end of 2006 when he got the ride with Ducati! Stoner was always quick and gutsy good style and most definitely not afraid to put his balls where his ability lay!
Oh, I will give you another excuse that you can go with from 07...the Honda is faster down the straight ala the Ducati of 2007, why don’t you all pursue that excuse now seeing that Stoner is winning races by 6,7, or 10 seconds and more from now on or whatever, the typical comment that we will have from now on will be “Its going to be another one of the CS shows up front...how boring I think I will go back to Superbikes or F1”
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You’re so intelligent Pete and as ‘michaelm' posted “you guys are getting rather desperate these days for avenues of attack on Stoner. Detracting from his performances on the basis that he didn't get as injured from a highside as you think he should have would certainly qualify as desperate by most standards”
Well keep on digging some other excuses Pete and let’s see what else anyone can come up with??? You might as well say that, JLo Pedro Rossi Simo (you might as well include the whole grid) are all below par and injured and that is why Stoner is winning and is lucky that he hasn’t injured himself and that is why he’s the championship, blah blah blah
Well my friend Stoner is miles ahead of the rest because he rides like he did at laguna seca and did you watch Brno Pete? What excuses were there for him winning Brno? ohh I know one that you can go with and it's, because Pedro crashed out and that is why Stoner won ...look at the racing Pete and don’t play the man and let’s see what happens this year next year, I admit that I’m a Stoner fan but I’ve been a Stoner fan when he rode the 125’s the 250’s and all throughout his motogp carrier and I also predicted that he will win the 2007 W/C on Crash.net forum (and there is a reference of my comment that I have, because that is the type of rider that Stoner was all throughout his riding "he needed a factory bike' not an LCR that he started with in motogp) and at the end of 2006 when he got the ride with Ducati! Stoner was always quick and gutsy good style and most definitely not afraid to put his balls where his ability lay!
Oh, I will give you another excuse that you can go with from 07...the Honda is faster down the straight ala the Ducati of 2007, why don’t you all pursue that excuse now seeing that Stoner is winning races by 6,7, or 10 seconds and more from now on or whatever, the typical comment that we will have from now on will be “Its going to be another one of the CS shows up front...how boring I think I will go back to Superbikes or F1”
God you are thick as ...., I'm not knocking Stoners' riding, as I say I think he makes a .... of himself when he opens his mouth. Once again you have proved you have the literacy of a spanner. I just posted in the race thread that today was a great race too. I love debating wi you, it's like shooting fish in a barrel with an Uzi. What amazing fact are you going to give us next? Adriana is pregnant so Casey is not only fast but fertile with it?
Bye the way, love the fact that the Honda was faster than the Duc in a straight line in 2007, bloody hell, how ..... is Rossi? How could he possibly not beat Stoner while riding a bike he had stopped riding 3 years previously?
Leave it to the grown ups on here sonny, I believe the Wiggles have a website that you might just be able to understand.
You are more to be pitied than scolded.
Bless
Pete
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Well Pete, that is you and no one out there can .... Pete’s brain because it’s already ratshit! And by the way you’re no grownup sweetheart! What I said in my post is true but you have to up your level and be abusive and a complete tool. Listen here, just calm down and stop being so negative, you must love to post like you do on this forum it must be the only thing that must make your day or life! You’re a sad case when you have to be so abusive and utter tool! All you do is ..... and wine and complain...this forum was once full of tools like you and thank god that the boys and gals from down under are invading and bringing some common sense into this forum! Otherwise it would be full of your B/S which is always to knock the man be it his private life etc, and the amazing facts are that the wiggles are smarter than you and that is why there such a success the world which you’re not ...give it up sunshine!!!
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Well put a nappy on, you probably need one
Yawn! is that your best?
More interest in my sunday lunch!
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Well Pete, that is you and no one out there can .... Pete’s brain because it’s already ratshit! And by the way you’re no grownup sweetheart! What I said in my post is true but you have to up your level and be abusive and a complete tool. Listen here, just calm down and stop being so negative, you must love to post like you do on this forum it must be the only thing that must make your day or life! You’re a sad case when you have to be so abusive and utter tool! All you do is ..... and wine and complain...this forum was once full of tools like you and thank god that the boys and gals from down under are invading and bringing some common sense into this forum! Otherwise it would be full of your B/S which is always to knock the man be it his private life etc, and the amazing facts are that the wiggles are smarter than you and that is why there such a success the world which you’re not ...give it up sunshine!!!
Ha Ha Ha!!!!!!!!!
You are such a .......!
Show me the negativity in my last post sonny, I'm just calling you out for being a silly wee boy who wants to read "Stoner is amazing, he invented motorbikes" and "I want to be Adriana" in posts.
Get a pair son, or at least learn what the letters in the alphabet are.
Can't wait for you're reply girlfriend!
Pete
