Rossi speaks out over Lorenzo contract

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Talpa @ Sep 9 2009, 02:28 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>VR rides a Motorcycle, with two wheels, a frame, some handlebars and an engine, this is prototype racing and any advantage he gains through his superior development, the unbelievable talent and experience/record of people like JB, is surely deserving of acknowledgment....

Yeah, the bikes are all the same. (This alone should disqualify any further meaningful debate with you). But as I love to burry the boppers, I will continue to indulge in this reply.



<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <div class='quotemain'>Your logic sucks, even if VR has always had the best bike (which he hasn't) ask yourself why?

Ah, a little kink in your armor? Didn't you just say that the bikes are all the same (two wheels, handlebars, etc.)? Then it would be quite impossible for Rossi or anyone to have the best bike. Wait wait, that reminds me...oh yeah, only Stoner had the best bike in 07. Interesting, how will you weasel you way out of this corner? Lets see, you said that they are the same but only the rider could, through their superior development, talent, and experience overcome. (In case you forgot what you just said: "any advantage he gains through his superior development, the unbelievable talent and experience") So then you admit that Stoner was superior to Rossi? If not, then Stoner had better gear? Wai, but you just said that all the bikes are the same?

<commence weaseling you way out>

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <div class='quotemain'>Dorna would never want VR on superior machinery as it removes the competition and spectacle of Motogp (they are trying to do this in other ways!!)

I guess Dorna didn't get your imaginary memo, since only one rider was allowed to switch to bridgestones. Rossi is the cash cow of Dorna. Naive? Yes.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <div class='quotemain'>his main rivals over the years have always had top notch machinery, and machinery capable of beating VR-this is a fact. Most of them have also had the biggest motorcycle manufacturer in the world backing them......explain how VR has still beaten Honda's top riders despite the big 'h' pouring in truckloads of cash and their more than considerable knowledge and experience in to beat him?

You already clearly have shown that you have no idea what "prototype racing means. So how could you understand that a small disadvantage can translate into sub par results? But if you could bring your head out from the sand for a moment, you might realize that Rossi not having his Saturday night specials may have gone a lone way for his drop in wins in 06/07. That is how important everything is. Its like a puzzle, if you are missing one piece you don't get the full picture. Well the fact is others have been missing more pieces that your Lord.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <div class='quotemain'>So JL now has the same gear, right?

No, but very close to it, hence his great results.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <div class='quotemain'>.... yes he does, and hes quick too, hes beaten VR on more than one occasion and the two of them have pretty much decimated the field in 09.....the main problem (there are many!) with the conspiracy theories starts here, Jorge has now undeniably got the same machinery and VR currently has the most wins this year, the most podiums and is leading the champs by 30 points......superior machinery myth-BUSTED!

Haha, the only myth you've managed to bust is that when another rival has Rossi's near equipment, then that rider is capable of running with the great Rossi. I know you can't make the connection of this implication, but hey, its here for you to read anyway.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <div class='quotemain'>I'm jumping in the sandpit again now.....

Go ahead, your head has been in the sand already, you might as well invite the rest of your body.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <div class='quotemain'>For the uninitiated and those who joined the ranks of Motogp followers in 2006 or 2007, in order to win a Motogp race the 'rider' has to use the clutch and accelerator to make the bike go forward, then the 'rider' has to use the clutch, accelerator and gear shifter to make the bike change gear and build speed, then the 'rider' has to use a combination of the Front and Rear brake to slow the bike down, then the 'rider' has to counter steer the bike through the corners while using a combination of all of the above. The 'rider' also has to do all of this faster than anybody else in the world in a lot of different locations all around the world, the M1 isn't a magic carpet.........Food for thought, if the latter process is still happening

Thanks for the lesson on riding a bike. BTW, what are those round black things on the rims for?

(Talps, don't take anything I say personal. Its just debate, granted you're not very good at it, but its all ........ in the end. I don't like to see people get butt hurt. As you can see, I always make Ros look silly, yet he still love me).

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Sep 9 2009, 10:26 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>

#2 Test rider.

You know brotha, you bring up a very interesting point. Rossi, being the oracle, has said its normal for teams to only have one rider that benefits from the factory’s effort. And really, we knew this right? As I read this thread and many of Rossi's defenders for him wanting to keep the status quos, I was reminded that some of these very same defenders (that is the boppers that discredited Hayden when he beat Rossi) had pointed to his equipment as reason for his success. And when we continued to point it out in 07/08, I recall getting shot down as conspiracy, when the entire reasonable world knew that the only world champion on the repsol team was no more than a test rider, #2 on the team: 06, 07, 08.

So then, what's all the fuss about? If Hayden could win a title being clearly #2, why can't Rossi do it being co #1? (cue up rewriting of history)

And my second question, why is it that you guys (especial the defenders of Rossi's comments here) didn't accept that Hayden's #2 status in the 800 era at Repsol was detrimental to his results? (cue up, it wasn't me).



Consider this a preview of that "upper cut" you got coming.
Answer this jum, Is the rider who gets the new parts to figure out the #1 favored rider or the test rider, because using your logic if rossi gets it its because he is favored but if hayden gets them he is a test rider for the #1 Bear in mind your views when dani was not using any new parts but hayden was and losing. Even lorenzo has stated he does not feel disadvantaged and his bike is competitive, his gripe was money and status.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (chopperman @ Sep 9 2009, 04:57 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Answer this jum, Is the rider who gets the new parts to figure out the #1 favored rider or the test rider, because using your logic if rossi gets it its because he is favored but if hayden gets them he is a test rider for the #1 Bear in mind your views when dani was not using any new parts but hayden was and losing. Even lorenzo has stated he does not feel disadvantaged and his bike is competitive, his gripe was money and status.
It depends on whether the parts he gets are the ones he wants and is asking for.

Ask for parts and get them...#1
Ask for parts and get something else...test rider

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mattsteg @ Sep 9 2009, 03:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>It depends on whether the parts he gets are the ones he wants and is asking for.

Ask for parts and get them...#1
Ask for parts and get something else...test rider

Not only that, but Rog knows that these parts aren't just dreamed up on the spur of the moment. They got their test riders back home. And when the #1 says, you know this is what I need, then the factory goes and tries to make such an improvement. Have their test rider use it, then if it solves or improves the issue, it presented to the #1. Meanwhile the secondary problem (as they can't tackle all issues at once) is tested by the #2. Keep in mind, #2 has still not received that previous improvement, assuming he even requested that as an issue, but regardless they are testing a solution for the secondary problem. So then, when the #2 request an improvement to a particular issue they specifically want address, its usually a back burner deal. But Rog knew that Matt.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mattsteg @ Sep 9 2009, 11:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>It depends on whether the parts he gets are the ones he wants and is asking for.

Ask for parts and get them...#1
Ask for parts and get something else...test rider
so jumkie, you know enough about who asks for what parts to determine lornezo is being used as a test rider even though he himself has not indicated any dissatisfaction with his bike

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <div class='quotemain'>“Usually the big manufacturers in the last years have always just one top rider each. In Yamaha, we are two … so this is a different strategy that can bring good results, but also big disaster,” said Rossi, in an exclusive interview at Misano.

Let's see here...hmmmm...yup...looks like Rossi is saying that no 2 rival or top riders have been on the same bike/manfacturer. Let me know if you read something different Rog

The only thing left up for speculation is the "big disaster". So far they have pretty much finished 1-2 so it's worked out pretty good. WTF does he mean by big disaster?

I read this quote and said yeah this is going to be good. I can't wait to see Rossi battle with a rival on the same bike and you guys get all defensive.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE <div class='quotemain'>“Before I never thought of going out of Yamaha, but now with this situation with Lorenzo, I have to make a decision,” he said.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Talpa @ Sep 8 2009, 04:06 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Worrying signs for MotoGP and Yamaha, very Mick Doohan esk with Alex grabbing his hard work to then beat him-must be a little bit hard especially with the difficult years of 06-07 where VR dragged Yamaha back up again, the man could be planning a move earlier than we think......

I still think RSV4 in WSBK with Max as teammate!! Now that's a challenge! And a somewhat fitting end, to grab a WSBK title on his manufacturer of origin......and of course beat Spies and Yamaha for pissing him off!!!

This I agree with.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (SackWack @ Sep 9 2009, 11:12 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Let's see here...hmmmm...yup...looks like Rossi is saying that no 2 rival or top riders have been on the same bike/manfacturer. Let me know if you read something different Rog

The only thing left up for speculation is the "big disaster". So far they have pretty much finished 1-2 so it's worked out pretty good. WTF does he mean by big disaster?

I read this quote and said yeah this is going to be good. I can't wait to see Rossi battle with a rival on the same bike and you guys get all defensive.




I think you read too much into the translation. I take that as just rossi's way of complementing lorenzo and his ability. He has said himself in parc ferme how good a fighter lorenzo is . The last time rossi had someone fight like that race in race out was gibbers. Everyone else lately who has beaten him or raced to the line was not by race craft fighting. Rossi is right, this can cause problems in a team. It can end in an 06 estoril crash or it can cause friction like the doohan criville years.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (SackWack @ Sep 9 2009, 05:12 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>The only thing left up for speculation is the "big disaster". So far they have pretty much finished 1-2 so it's worked out pretty good. WTF does he mean by big disaster?Say, for example, Stoner had been able to compete at the level of 2007-2008 this season, rather than coming down with a "mystery illness" and skipping several rounds. Even just finishing right behind the fiat riders the last three rounds and winning (instead of going with an insane gamble) at Donnington would put him right up in contention, points-wise. At that level of competition, it'd be pretty easy for the fiat riders to take enough points off of each other to lose the championship for them both (and Yamaha). Alternatively, resources could be spread too soon and neither rider gets the full development effort that they want, or development could fall into some sort of indecision-induced stagnation. There are some risks associated with running and "fully supporting" 2 championship contenders simultaneously. There's always the possibility that Lorenzo (or whoever is behind at the moment, for that matter) pushes too hard to match rossi, crashes, and takes them both out. That'd be a bit of a disaster, although not one necessarily related to teammate status.

I doubt it'd be much of a disaster for fans, other than those that want Rossi to succeed above all else.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Sep 10 2009, 07:55 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Ah, a little kink in your armor? Didn't you just say that the bikes are all the same (two wheels, handlebars, etc.)? Then it would be quite impossible for Rossi or anyone to have the best bike. Wait wait, that reminds me...oh yeah, only Stoner had the best bike in 07. Interesting, how will you weasel you way out of this corner? Lets see, you said that they are the same but only the rider could, through their superior development, talent, and experience overcome. (In case you forgot what you just said: "any advantage he gains through his superior development, the unbelievable talent and experience") So then you admit that Stoner was superior to Rossi? If not, then Stoner had better gear? Wai, but you just said that all the bikes are the same?

<commence weaseling you way out>

Ne need to Weasle here, my point was that 'IF!!!!' VR had machinery that was superior, He and JB made it that way......I don't believe this to be true as I don't believe he has-had superior Machinery-he did however have superior set-up and riding skill!!! Note the subtle yet obvious use of terminology......Where is CS now? Threw his puzzleboard in the air and is on a sun lounge at Uluru! Your wrong here again he had the best bike and Round Black things in 07, and he had the best package in 08 as well-yet what happened-he lost......this helps dispel the superior machinery even more, cheers for that....never said the bikes were the same, just that their principles were......


<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Sep 10 2009, 07:55 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I guess Dorna didn't get your imaginary memo, since only one rider was allowed to switch to bridgestones. Rossi is the cash cow of Dorna. Naive? Yes.
Rubbish, Dani Pedrosa mid-season switch in 08!!!!!!!! Farck did you really miss that one, I would be bagging others debating skill with replies like this....


<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Sep 10 2009, 07:55 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>You already clearly have shown that you have no idea what "prototype racing means. So how could you understand that a small disadvantage can translate into sub par results? But if you could bring your head out from the sand for a moment, you might realize that Rossi not having his Saturday night specials may have gone a lone way for his drop in wins in 06/07. That is how important everything is. Its like a puzzle, if you are missing one piece you don't get the full picture. Well the fact is others have been missing more pieces that your Lord.

VR had his specials in 06, wrong again, tyre rules came in 07 me thinks, correct if wrong, VRs drop in wins in 06 also came down to 2 blown up engines, a disintegrated tyre-not so special that one! And a cruise missile called Elias!. Your facts are a little off today Jum, The others need to find their puzzles pieces to become a multiple world champ no? Why haven't they, maybe give them all a GPS next time you see em!!


<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Sep 10 2009, 07:55 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Haha, the only myth you've managed to bust is that when another rival has Rossi's near equipment, then that rider is capable of running with the great Rossi. I know you can't make the connection of this implication, but hey, its here for you to read anyway.

HAHAHAHAHA......Rubbish, JL is on the same gear, and the only myth remaining is 'Where do you get your facts from?' I can't bust this one So your saying Rossi is great now? I thought you said he couldn't beat anyone, anywhere?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Sep 10 2009, 07:55 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Go ahead, your head has been in the sand already, you might as well invite the rest of your body.



<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Sep 10 2009, 07:55 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Thanks for the lesson on riding a bike. BTW, what are those round black things on the rims for?

(Talps, don't take anything I say personal. Its just debate, granted you're not very good at it, but its all ........ in the end. I don't like to see people get butt hurt. As you can see, I always make Ros look silly, yet he still love me).

Love you too Jum, you do like to play the tyre trump a lot, in prototype racing, I'm assuming as apparently I don't know anything about it, that fitting the set-up pieces of the puzzle around those round black things and the specific track/surface is just as important as the Black things themselves....

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Talpa @ Sep 9 2009, 05:31 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Ne need to Weasle here, my point was that 'IF!!!!' VR had machinery that was superior, He and JB made it that way......I don't believe this to be true as I don't believe he has-had superior Machinery-he did however have superior set-up and riding skill!!! Note the subtle yet obvious use of terminology......Where is CS now? Threw his puzzleboard in the air and is on a sun lounge at Uluru! Your wrong here again he had the best bike and Round Black things in 07, and he had the best package in 08 as well-yet what happened-he lost......this helps dispel the superior machinery even more, cheers for that....never said the bikes were the same, just that their principles were......
I have to disagree here. Personally, I think the 2008 M1/Bridgestone was stronger than the GP8/Bridgestone package, perhaps quite equal but certainly not worse, but that's nothing more than difference of opinion, no point in arguing that. But if your opinion is that the Ducati/Bridgestone package of 2007 was the best out there then surely you can't disagree that the RC211V/Michelin package of 2002 was equally superior. The only man who made Rossi look relatively human that year was Alex Barros, when Honda decided to give him a 211 of his own with four races to go.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (chopperman @ Sep 9 2009, 03:09 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>so jumkie, you know enough about who asks for what parts to determine lornezo is being used as a test rider even though he himself has not indicated any dissatisfaction with his bike
Yes.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (chopperman @ Sep 9 2009, 04:50 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>pay no mind to sacky, he's typical of the rossi haters in denial. No matter what rossi achieves they will always move there goal post's. Rossi has won 8 championships and on the way to his 9th. he has won 103 races in the premier class. he has won championships on 3 makes of bike 2 in the premier class yet sacky moves the posts further back . As i aid ,pay the haters no mind


Geez, surprised it lasted this long but nope Roger he has not won 103 aces in the premier class but has won 103 races across 125/250/500/MotoGP).

He has won 12x125cc, 14x250cc and 77x500/MotoGP (source http://www.motogp.com/en/riders/profiles/Valentino+Rossi)

Doesn't diminish achievements in any way, just correctingbecause I am a pedantic Aussie prick who can't spell (and becasue we keep getting bloody beaten - but dd do the springboks on the weekend)








Gaz

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Talpa @ Sep 9 2009, 11:31 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Rubbish, Dani Pedrosa mid-season switch in 08!!!!!!!! Farck did you really miss that one, I would be bagging others debating skill with replies like this....

Ok, lets look.

Factually you can claim to be correct as DP did get his Bridgestones that were so coveted - but did he get them at the same time and by the same processes as Rossi?

Rossi (it is said) made numerous overtures at the end of 2007 about not being able to be competitive without the Bridgestone tyres and that if he could not be competitive he may need to think about his future (interesting parrallel to another in 2009 I feel).

At the same time, DP was saying much the same albeit in fairness likely because VR was and DP wanted equal treatment or at least wanted same tyres as he felt he needed what VR has to be competitive (for DP read the EvilPuigEmpire or EPE for short).

Bridgestone were reported as saying that they could not provide the tyres.

Dorna start talking of spec tyre rules to be implemented using the 'quality' oft he Michelin and resultant safety and competition concerns as the reason.

Bridgestone suddenly say they can provide VR but cannot provide DP.

Season commences with VR on the Bridgestones and DP/EPE on the Michelin.

As season progresses the tyres continue to play a major part with Bridgestone being the more dominant, although Michelin had some good days.

DP/EPE lie on their stomach kicking and screaming whilst crying about tyres and with a few races left (4 from memory) Bridgestone are 'encouraged' by Dorna to provide tyres and do so.

So, yes, DP/EPE and VR both were able to access Bridgestone tyres in 2008 but they were not able to access at the same time, but I am sure you knew that anyway but within the context of Jumkies post timing is crucial.




Gaz

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Austin @ Sep 10 2009, 12:01 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I have to disagree here. Personally, I think the 2008 M1/Bridgestone was stronger than the GP8/Bridgestone package, perhaps quite equal but certainly not worse, but that's nothing more than difference of opinion, no point in arguing that. But if your opinion is that the Ducati/Bridgestone package of 2007 was the best out there then surely you can't disagree that the RC211V/Michelin package of 2002 was equally superior. The only man who made Rossi look relatively human that year was Alex Barros, when Honda decided to give him a 211 of his own with four races to go.


Austin (not at you personally) but all championship results would bear out that the M1 was the superior bike throughout 2008 as per your point (refer below).

Riders championship:
VR - Yamaha
CS - Ducati
DP - Honda
JL - Yamaha
Dovi - Honda
Hayden - Honda
CEii - Yamaha
Vermuelen - Suzuki
Nakano - Honda
Capirex - Suzuki

The table clearly shows that the two Factory M1's finishing higher than any other two rider team.


Manufacturer:
Yamaha
Ducati
Honda
Suzuki
Kawasaki

Again we see Yamaha as #1


Team:
FIAT Yamaha
Respol Honda
Marlboro Ducati
Tech3 Yamaha
Rizla Suzuki
Gresini Honda

Again we see the M1 as top of the tree which would indicate that the FIAT M1's were superior across the year to the other team bikes.


Source for the above information - http://resources.motogp.com/files/results/...ld+standing.pdf

Given that the tendered by some is that the rider and setup makes the difference as all bikes supplied by the factory to the team are identical in componentry (as I understand the argument) then it has to be said that the M1 was the superior bike throughout 2008.






Gaz

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Gaz @ Sep 10 2009, 01:59 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Austin (not at you personally) but all championship results would bear out that the M1 was the superior bike throughout 2008 as per your point (refer below).

Riders championship:
VR - Yamaha
CS - Ducati
DP - Honda
JL - Yamaha
Dovi - Honda
Hayden - Honda
CEii - Yamaha
Vermuelen - Suzuki
Nakano - Honda
Capirex - Suzuki

The table clearly shows that the two Factory M1's finishing higher than any other two rider team.


Manufacturer:
Yamaha
Ducati
Honda
Suzuki
Kawasaki

Again we see Yamaha as #1


Team:
FIAT Yamaha
Respol Honda
Marlboro Ducati
Tech3 Yamaha
Rizla Suzuki
Gresini Honda

Again we see the M1 as top of the tree which would indicate that the FIAT M1's were superior across the year to the other team bikes.


Source for the above information - http://resources.motogp.com/files/results/...ld+standing.pdf

Given that the tendered by some is that the rider and setup makes the difference as all bikes supplied by the factory to the team are identical in componentry (as I understand the argument) then it has to be said that the M1 was the superior bike throughout 2008.


Gaz
Ok Gaz if you think M1 was the superior bike in 08 season then can you tell me in your opinion who had the superior bike during 07 season.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (inam @ Sep 10 2009, 04:23 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Ok Gaz if you think M1 was the superior bike in 08 season then can you tell me in your opinion who had the superior bike during 07 season.


Umm, where do I say that the post you quoted is my opinion?

What I put forward are numbers that can well be used to discern what is or is not the best bike in the field.

As to you question, I will answer as I have previously.

Ducati won the riders, manufacturers and teams championship which can well be deduced that the Ducati is/was the better bike (despite Suzuki finishing with it's two factory riders in the highest position of any factory).


So, converse and let me ask you.

If the Yamaha was not the best bike in 2008, what was, why and why then is 2007 so different?





Gaz

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ganz @ Sep 8 2009, 04:30 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>wonder when this is going to happen... Lorenzo is not as good as he thinks, benefiting from Rossi/Burgess work

+1. Could not have said it better!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (chopperman @ Sep 9 2009, 03:33 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>So what about gibbers hrc Telefonica rc211v ? or are you going to move those goal posts again and say it now has to be the same team

Same Bike, Same Season… And Riders with ‘Wins’ in order to get rid of none probable World ‘Champions’:

2000 Honda = Barros / Capirossi / Criville / Rossi.
2001 Honda = Barros / Rossi.
2002 Honda = Barros / Rossi / Ukawa.
2003 Honda = Biaggi / /Gibernau / Rossi.
2004 Yamaha = Rossi.
2005 Yamaha = Rossi.
2006 Yamaha = Rossi.
2007 Yamaha = Rossi.
2008 Yamaha = Lorenzo / Rossi.
2009 Yamaha = Lorenzo / Rossi.

When was Rossi on ‘Inferior’ Machinery against other Manufactures? Must have been between 2004 and 2007 because nobody else could win with the same Machinery!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Gaz @ Sep 9 2009, 11:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>If the Yamaha was not the best bike in 2008, what was, why and why then is 2007 so different?

Gaz

Because Rossi has wan ‘Championships’ in 6 different bikes / 3 different makes. Several of them Wins, in several tracks, with several tyres, with several conditions, against several odds, defying a Best Manufacturer in its moment, etc. It is obvious he has some wins in which he did not have all roses for him, and still managed to get Championship‘S’ (as in several)… Who else has done this?

That’s why it is different!

Even in 2007 we have a Capirossi ‘One’ Win!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (VHMP01 @ Sep 10 2009, 05:38 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Because Rossi has wan ‘Championships’ in 6 different bikes / 3 different makes. Several of them Wins, in several tracks, with several tyres, with several conditions, against several odds, defying a Best Manufacturer in its moment, etc. It is obvious he has some wins in which he did not have all roses for him, and still managed to get Championship‘S’ (as in several)… Who else has done this?

That’s why it is different!

Sorry V, but you have kinda lost me so here goes.

Are you saying that 2007 is different to 2008 because VR had more championships and therefore it makes it different when the discussion was around bikes?

So the more championships of a rider should impact a discussion about bikes?

Ok, so lets say that because a rider is 'great' he therefore has more winds and therefore makes the bike seem better than it actually may be in reality - is this your point?

If so, how then can anyone not ride a better bike until Rossi, Stoner or Hayden win again (ie. the next champion not lone of the aforementioned three has to have been a superior bike because they would not be a multiple champion?)?



So, if we are to say that the more championships a rider wins makes them better, should we also not therefore adjust our expectations to suit?








Gaz