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Interview with Ezpeleta (head of DORNA)

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tom @ Jul 16 2008, 10:27 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Can anyone identify what it is about the leaders that stops them from battling hard, when it goes on with riders just a few thenths slower?
I'll take a shot for ya Tom, but I'm not sure you're gonna like my answer.
<

Casey is using a new TC system that is allowing him to literally disappear into the distance. No battling there. Rossi and Pedrosa are on roughly the same bike but there has been such a disparity in starting position of late that neither of them have been near each other. Just my take.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tom @ Jul 16 2008, 09:27 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Can anyone identify what it is about the leaders that stops them from battling hard, when it goes on with riders just a few thenths slower?


i think acouple of things.

1) pure talent
2) the best talent USUALLY ends up on the best team
3) best team USUALLY = the best bikes
4) best bike + best rider = run away wins
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (djm @ Jul 16 2008, 03:36 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>i think acouple of things.

1) pure talent
2) the best talent USUALLY ends up on the best team
3) best team USUALLY = the best bikes
4) best bike + best rider = run away wins

Thing is, other people ride in those teams, with those bikes. And why would the 4 best riders in the wolrd be all spread out while riders 5-10 are so close togehter in ability. coincedence? i doubt it.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Teomolca @ Jul 16 2008, 08:14 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>The displacement is irrelevant, the 990 with the current level of electronics would be the same as the 800cc, just a bit quicker on the straight, and more work for the computer to deal with the extra power output when opening the throtle.

...Yes they would have just as much electronics as the 800s...BUT the riders would have more HP, more importantly Torque to play with....no more follow the leader through corners....they'd be able to make their own lines
<
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (xx CURVE xx @ Jul 16 2008, 10:46 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>...Yes they would have just as much electronics as the 800s...BUT the riders would have more HP, more importantly Torque to play with....no more follow the leader through corners....they'd be able to make their own lines
<

Spot on.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tom @ Jul 16 2008, 09:38 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Thing is, other people ride in those teams, with those bikes. And why would the 4 best riders in the wolrd be all spread out while riders 5-10 are so close togehter in ability. coincedence? i doubt it.
The following few riders aren't always the same or in the same order. If the 10th best rider absolutely nails his setup, he'll probably be fighting towards the front of the pack, not disappearing into the distance. If stoner or one of the other top riders absolutely nails it, they're off in the distance. We've also had some close racing near the front, just not for the lead.

Maybe it's like a bell curve - a few people really fast or really slow, and a bunch of people relatively close toward the middle.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mattsteg @ Jul 16 2008, 03:49 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>The following few riders aren't always the same or in the same order. If the 10th best rider absolutely nails his setup, he'll probably be fighting towards the front of the pack, not disappearing into the distance. If stoner or one of the other top riders absolutely nails it, they're off in the distance. We've also had some close racing near the front, just not for the lead.

Maybe it's like a bell curve - a few people really fast or really slow, and a bunch of people relatively close toward the middle.

good point, this is possible. I actually think its a lot to do with set up. If a rider can optimise his setup he eliminates as many variables as possible, and runs whatever pace he can for the race. If a rider cannot optimise his setup he will be left with gambles to take with (setup and riding) which will lead to variation between him and all the others, leading to a race.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tom @ Jul 16 2008, 03:27 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Can anyone identify what it is about the leaders that stops them from battling hard, when it goes on with riders just a few thenths slower?
Maybe it is more obvious with this formula what your potential is early given that tyres don't seem to go off etc, and with the championship battle if not the races so close the consequences of dnfs are severe as has recently been demonstrated.

I should stop speculating from ignorance about what they should do with the formula; I guess the cleverness of the engineering fraternity which you are going to join makes a development formula a problem with the level modern technology has reached given that human physiology does have limits.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (The Doc 79 @ Jul 16 2008, 03:35 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I'll take a shot for ya Tom, but I'm not sure you're gonna like my answer.
<

Casey is using a new TC system that is allowing him to literally disappear into the distance. No battling there. Rossi and Pedrosa are on roughly the same bike but there has been such a disparity in starting position of late that neither of them have been near each other. Just my take.
The problem with this line of argument leaving aside your and my particular prejudices is that even accepting casey now has magic tc the races when he presumably didn't have it which were won by other riders also didn't feature close dicing at the front
<
.

EDIT
It would seem likely that the technology/tyre etc advantage has fluctuated over the racing year
<
.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (michaelm @ Jul 16 2008, 11:17 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>The problem with this line of argument leaving aside your and my particular prejudices is that even accepting casey now has magic tc the races when he presumably didn't have it which were won by other riders also didn't feature close dicing at the front
<
.

EDIT
It would seem likely that the technology/tyre etc advantage has fluctuated over the racing year
<
.
No that's true, I was speaking more of the recent races. Don't mistake my mentioning Casey here as a prejudice, its widely known that a major breakthrough was made on the TC on the Desmo which has been instrumental in Casey's recent form. And even saying that, in those races you mention, there was certainly more going on up front than these past three GP parades.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tom @ Jul 16 2008, 08:27 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Can anyone identify what it is about the leaders that stops them from battling hard, when it goes on with riders just a few thenths slower?
My assumption is leaders recognize they have the pace to stay at the front so as long as the pace is fast enough to separate them from 5th and back, it works. They can bide their time and calculate making their move before they actually do so. Passing is slow. It adds time to the lap, only a tenth or two but that adds up when you pass and re-pass. The riders in places 5th through 10th generally are a tenth or two off that lead pace, so the thought process is they need to get on the back of that group and hope to hang out. Thus, it's a constant battle to get to the front of the second pack and try to catch the tail end of the leaders.

Just my guess.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (The Doc 79 @ Jul 16 2008, 04:30 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>No that's true, I was speaking more of the recent races. Don't mistake my mentioning Casey here as a prejudice, its widely known that a major breakthrough was made on the TC on the Desmo which has been instrumental in Casey's recent form. And even saying that, in those races you mention, there was certainly more going on up front than these past three GP parades.
Rossi crashed early at assen, pedrosa at sachsenring, and lorenzo has been absent/injured/crashed in all 3 races recently won by casey which may have detracted from their contribution to up front goings on (just for the sake of argument
<
) .

I don't disagree that technology is having too much influence, and whilst part of the appeal of gp bike racing for me as always been that it has been at the cutting edge, I reluctantly now have to think it may be time for a change in philosophy given the high level of current technology and the pace of its advance.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (michaelm @ Jul 16 2008, 04:17 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>...it may be time for a change in philosophy given the high level of current technology and the pace of its advance.

Riders still crash, but the tech is too advanced? If it's so advanced, how come it doesn't make the bikes crash proof? Is anyone so good of a rider that having traction control on their next bike would stop them from enjoying riding? Is fuel consumption efficiency a bad thing? It think part of the problem is we don't get to see what setup changes they make and how riders adjust for changing conditions. We just see them go out and somebody's got it perfect. Personally, if they had more brake/gear/throttle cams I could watch Lorenzo/Stoner/Rossi/Hayden etc go around the track by themselves.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (clarkjw @ Jul 16 2008, 12:31 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>we don't get to see what setup changes they make and how riders adjust for changing conditions. We just see them go out and somebody's got it perfect. Personally, if they had more brake/gear/throttle cams I could watch Lorenzo/Stoner/Rossi/Hayden etc go around the track by themselves.
I agree man. Trouble with this is, and you may already know this, but if spectators like us had information like that, you can bet your ... the other teams would be looking at competitors to gain advantages.
 
I think yamaha should just go and knock on Magnetti Marelli's door
<


If you can't beat them, join them by trying to get some of their special stuff
<
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (an4rew @ Jul 16 2008, 02:16 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I think yamaha should just go and knock on Magnetti Marelli's door
<


If you can't beat them, join them by trying to get some of their special stuff
<

I don't know why more haven't. Too much pride in the Japanese factories?
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Teomolca @ Jul 16 2008, 02:17 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>With the tyres I could impose a single tyre because I don't have a pact with the tyre manufacturers,

Yeah. All the haters can drink it all in.

He's asked about the tire situation, he talks about the history of tire rules and makes no mention of the current solution hammered out in the meetings of 2007. For some reason he can't publish that info.
<


You poor .......s. What must it be like to drink the marketing Kool-Aid? I bet it's ... flavored.
<


Ezy runs train on the tire manufacturers. The End.



It will take 5 years to sort MotoGP's problems out.
<
Good the AMA will be fixed by then and I won't have to watch Euro midgets ingratiate themselves to the disgruntled remainder of Rossi's fans.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tom @ Jul 16 2008, 04:27 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Can anyone identify what it is about the leaders that stops them from battling hard, when it goes on with riders just a few thenths slower?

With the computers they have on MotoGP bikes, laptimes in a field of the best riders in the world will have natural spread, with a few on top and a few at the bottom and the majority bunched together in the middle. That's why we allways see battles for 4-6th place with 3-6 guys fighting for that spot. It's just as mathematical as their onboard computers.
<
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (an4rew @ Jul 16 2008, 02:16 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I think yamaha should just go and knock on Magnetti Marelli's door
<


If you can't beat them, join them by trying to get some of their special stuff
<


If Rossi doesn't have their best stuff he needs to be knocking down their door since they have his picture all over their website.

If the software is all written in house maybe he needs to go buy Ducati's programmer. I am sure he can still afford it even after he paid his taxes.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (an4rew @ Jul 16 2008, 10:16 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I think yamaha should just go and knock on Magnetti Marelli's door
<


If you can't beat them, join them by trying to get some of their special stuff
<


I thought MM were owned by Yamaha and that Rossi now are using a newer model hardware than what they use at Ducati, but then again I think I heard it here on the forum and you hear a lot of strange things here
<


What he need is not help from MM but a download from the ducati ECU.
 

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