Has your view on Dani changed after his Brno win?

ratdeal said:

Forgive my ignorance, but alot of people talk about a specific controverial issue regardlng Puig. Apart from generally being an evil ....... ...., what is it specifically that he did that everyone seems to repeatedly refer to?

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I wasn't on the forum in 2006, but I believe there was a view that with puig's multiple hat wearing (including redbull rookies one thing for which he is it would seem rightly praised, some official or semi-official position with dorna at one stage, a role with honda which has mainly been ill-defined, heavy connections to and influence with hrc's spanish sponsor repsol, and being dani's manager) he had undue influence in the internal workings of hrc, to nicky hayden's detriment, contributing to an environment/sense of entitlement in dani which prompted that ill-advised pass attempt/torpedo at a time when nicky was a shoe-in for the championship in the absence of misadventure and dani mainly a mathematical chance only.



People think dani should have sacked puig because of an incident at the sachsenring 2008 race, which dani started in strong contention for the championship and where he had built up a 7 second lead early in a very wet race; Puig came out with a pitboard telling him he was only just ahead, followed soon after by dani crashing out of the race and incurring significant injuries which basically ended his championship chance apart from anything else.



The first is perhaps debatable (not necessarily by me though), but I don't know what puig thought he was doing at sachsenring; whatever their faults stoner's dad and spies' mum don't seem to be in the business of displaying false pit boards to the riders they manage.

Go Dani!! Dani is the new Casey Stoner!!

Thank you Michaelm for the usefull informations about Puig, I see the dickness in the guy just like other members on the forum but I have never saw some specific reason, I don't know about his influence and as a Pedrosa fan I completely agree with the fact that the Estoril incident was a pretty stupid, aggressive and unnecessary overtake. But there are three questions:



1) How can we distinguish an intentional accident from a normal accident like the Le Mans accident (I agree that the ride through for Marco was unnecessary) and if Pedrosa got penelised or Marco never got that ride through how should we judge about the situations?



2) If we agree that the overtake was intentional, In what words he advised Pedrosa to do that before the race? was he like: "Hey you stupid midget Knock Nicky Down" or "Don't let him pass" or "Ride Aggressive"?



3) Was Puig the same .... when Dani was racing back in his 250 days or the amount of hatred (even sometimes in the press) increased in Pedrosa's Motogp carear and especially after the Estoril accident?





Cheers

mh_kingcobra said:

Thank you Michaelm for the usefull informations about Puig, I see the dickness in the guy just like other members on the forum but I have never saw some specific reason, I don't know about his influence and as a Pedrosa fan I completely agree with the fact that the Estoril incident was a pretty stupid, aggressive and unnecessary overtake. But there are three questions:



1) How can we distinguish an intentional accident from a normal accident like the Le Mans accident (I agree that the ride through for Marco was unnecessary) and if Pedrosa got penelised or Marco never got that ride through how should we judge about the situations?



2) If we agree that the overtake was intentional, In what words he advised Pedrosa to do that before the race? was he like: "Hey you stupid midget Knock Nicky Down" or "Don't let him pass" or "Ride Aggressive"?



3) Was Puig the same .... when Dani was racing back in his 250 days or the amount of hatred (even sometimes in the press) increased in Pedrosa's Motogp carear and especially after the Estoril accident?





Cheers

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My oen recollection of Puig racing, was he was a fair enough, but hardly outstanding rider, who is best remembered for breaking his leg uder an air fence, in a pretty scary looking crash.

mh_kingcobra said:

Thank you Michaelm for the usefull informations about Puig, I see the dickness in the guy just like other members on the forum but I have never saw some specific reason, I don't know about his influence and as a Pedrosa fan I completely agree with the fact that the Estoril incident was a pretty stupid, aggressive and unnecessary overtake. But there are three questions:



1) How can we distinguish an intentional accident from a normal accident like the Le Mans accident (I agree that the ride through for Marco was unnecessary) and if Pedrosa got penelised or Marco never got that ride through how should we judge about the situations?



2) If we agree that the overtake was intentional, In what words he advised Pedrosa to do that before the race? was he like: "Hey you stupid midget Knock Nicky Down" or "Don't let him pass" or "Ride Aggressive"?



3) Was Puig the same .... when Dani was racing back in his 250 days or the amount of hatred (even sometimes in the press) increased in Pedrosa's Motogp carear and especially after the Estoril accident?





Cheers

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As I said the hayden thing is debatable, and I am sure dani didn't intentionally take nicky down, but on most historical precedent there would have been team orders not to risk such an incident given the points situation and the late stage in the season; whether puig should be blamed for this is a further debate.



As arrabbiata has recently said, the sachsenring thing was near homicidal though and impossible to justify anyway that I can see, and strongly implies a lack of a sense of proportion.



I think he was an uncontroversial journeyman racer as basspete says, but still has 1 more premier class win than most riders let alone most people. Reports of his involvement in the red bull development programme seem to be universally positive and he has contributed to the development of prominent riders other than dani, including casey stoner and I believe tony elias.

basspete said:

My oen recollection of Puig racing, was he was a fair enough, but hardly outstanding rider, who is best remembered for breaking his leg uder an air fence, in a pretty scary looking crash.

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According to my motogp Top Trumps, he only won one race in his career.

michaelm said:

As I said the hayden thing is debatable, and I am sure dani didn't intentionally take nicky down, but on most historical precedent there would have been team orders not to risk such an incident given the points situation and the late stage in the season; whether puig should be blamed for this is a further debate.



As arabbiata has recently said, the sachsenring thing was near homicidal though and impossible to justify anyway that I can see, and strongly implies a lack of a sense of proportion.



I think he was an uncontroversial journeyman racer as basspete says, but still has 1 more premier class win than most riders let alone most people. Reports of his involvement in the red bull development programme seem to be universally positive and he has contributed to the development of prominent riders other than dani, including casey stoner and I believe tony elias.

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Thank You , It will be funny and yet impossible if Stoner and Pedrosa get into the same situation later in the season. Karma in the hands of Casey Stoner bites Pedrosa's ...!!!

mh_kingcobra said:

Thank You

, It will be funny and yet impossible if Stoner and Pedrosa get into the same situation later in the season. Karma in the hands of Casey Stoner bites Pedrosa's ...!!!

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I would be really disappointed given this is not stoner's rookie season if he pulled a move like that on dani. I think it would reflect best on him if he aided dani's championship bid on his presumptive return. Team orders could be difficult to enforce given he is gone forever at the end of the season however.

Casey is surely going to be missed in my opinion!!

mh_kingcobra said:

Thank you Michaelm for the usefull informations about Puig, I see the dickness in the guy just like other members on the forum but I have never saw some specific reason, I don't know about his influence and as a Pedrosa fan I completely agree with the fact that the Estoril incident was a pretty stupid, aggressive and unnecessary overtake. But there are three questions:



1) How can we distinguish an intentional accident from a normal accident like the Le Mans accident (I agree that the ride through for Marco was unnecessary) and if Pedrosa got penelised or Marco never got that ride through how should we judge about the situations?



2) If we agree that the overtake was intentional, In what words he advised Pedrosa to do that before the race? was he like: "Hey you stupid midget Knock Nicky Down" or "Don't let him pass" or "Ride Aggressive"?



3) Was Puig the same .... when Dani was racing back in his 250 days or the amount of hatred (even sometimes in the press) increased in Pedrosa's Motogp carear and especially after the Estoril accident?





Cheers

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Alberto has done little to befriend the PS membership (or any non-Spanish fans of the sport.)

Possibly his lowest, sleaziest public act was his 'interview' on the official MotoGP site.

http://www.motogp.co...psol Honda role

"All I can say is that Hayden may be bothered because now he can´t access information and telemetry data from Dani´s bike. With this information he was able to improve his riding, as he had all of Dani´s references and now he can´t use that any longer. He was simply copying as he never knew how to set-up a bike. A professional rider can´t be complaining because he can´t get access to the other rider´s data, because finding what works best is his job, not the other rider´s. Everybody knows that a racing team doesn´t work like a football team. It involves two riders, but each is working for himself and the factory will support the rider who has the best chance. Because when it comes to winning, only one rider wins. It has always been like this and it always will be like this - anybody who says the opposite is just lying to look good."

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Yea, suuuuure.... Nicky must weigh something like 40 pounds more than Peddles, and he rides the bike in an obviously different manner. The notion that Nicky would have any use for the midget's setups is beyond absurd. If Puig, then at the height of his political powers, was willing and able to spew this sort of toxic crap in public, you've got to wonder how bad it was behind the scenes. People took to calling calling him 'Rasputin' or 'Darth Puig.' Hell, even the oh-so-PC Eurosport .... made a remark or two. Later that year (?) Honda felt the need to step in and limit his powers, although no one ever clearly explained the details.

Geonerd said:

Alberto has done little to befriend the PS membership (or any non-Spanish fans of the sport.)

Possibly his lowest, sleaziest public act was his 'interview' on the official MotoGP site.

http://www.motogp.co...psol Honda role







Yea, suuuuure.... Nicky must weigh something like 40 pounds more than Peddles, and he rides the bike in an obviously different manner. The notion that Nicky would have any use for the midget's setups is beyond absurd. If Puig, then at the height of his political powers, was willing and able to spew this sort of toxic crap in public, you've got to wonder how bad it was behind the scenes. People took to calling calling him 'Rasputin' or 'Darth Puig.' Hell, even the oh-so-PC Eurosport .... made a remark or two. Later that year (?) Honda felt the need to step in and limit his powers, although no one ever clearly explained the details.

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Thanks for the link, I read the whole interview, well that is harsh and it is not what true sportsmen do, But it all seems like a stupid childish fight. Conspiracies and behind the scene theories are too far to touch but if you just look at Puig's next answer, you find the dickness inside the guy:



Would it be true to say that the relationship between Dani and Hayden has always been quite tense, and that there's nothing new in this respect?



`That´s not the case. Everything changed with the incident in Portugal (in 2006), where Dani made a mistake during the race and apologised for it afterwards. Nicky eventually won the title and Dani did what he had to do in Valencia, which was to help him. But from that point -even if Hayden denies it- all he´s been doing has been talking about how Dani was `weird´ and bringing the people around Pedrosa into the subject. He shouldn´t act like a hypocrite and say that he doesn´t have a problem with Dani, because since that incident in Portugal I think he has talked to him about twice. He shouldn´t involve Dani´s manager in this just because he´s jealous of another rider.´



If Nicky had started the whole thing according to this ....... then the whole story was ........ and unnessecary to grow this much for six years. Puig was just being a .... in the interview and he was making the situation worse.



In my opinion if this was just an issue between riders, it had to remain between them and somehow time fixed it in a way, Just like Jorge and Rossi's issue in Yamaha or Pedrosa and Lorenzo's fights in their early years.



It was non of Puig's bussiness.

Still a midget...











But I hope he beats JLo

Who cares

I'm still on the fence whether Pedrosa has what it takes to make it to the end as #1. One crash in the next race or two with a significant injury and he's out. He just hasn't put it all together in a season before and this is the closest he's been, probably has jinxed himself. I'm not a Pedrosa hater, if he wins the championship this year it will be well deserved for him.

So I wonder how Dani will bounce back from this crash he caused. I hope he puts it behind him.

Pendulum has swung back to Lorenzo's favor. He's pretty much sealed the deal.

View hasn't changed. Always had potential. Just had to string it together for a whole season. It would be an unlikely victory now.

woody996 said:

View hasn't changed. Always had potential. Just had to string it together for a whole season. It would be an unlikely victory now.

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He has five races, that is a lot. Just how Pedro created his own bad luck by desperately lunging to gain positions, instead of staying calm, it can happen to Lorenzo too. I still remember Lorenzo doing the same thing at PI when he took Nicky out. It was a again, a rush of desperation, instead of staying calm that put Lorenzo in a deep whole points wise. We got five races to go, and to me, it seems the pressure is more on Lorenzo than Pedro now. Plus, that Ducati could probably get in between the Japanese factories now.

The way i see it is now the championship is where its supposed to be points-wise. Jorge got taken out as well, so now its fair game.



125 points up for grabs...still a long way to go

Ngads said:

The way i see it is now the championship is where its supposed to be points-wise. Jorge got taken out as well, so now its fair game.



125 points up for grabs...still a long way to go

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+1

as much as it sucks for dani, we must not forget that jorge lost out on a possible 25 points, (16 for sure IMO) at assen because he was taken out.

or was that his fault jum?



with honda having chatter and tyre problems and stoner first announcing his departure,then getting hurt by riding too wild on a .... track this is going to be lorenzos year.

think about it. he finished every race so far in first or second place. i have no doubt he would have done the same at assen , or at very least scored a solid 3rd place podium.



i tend to root for the guy in second place in the championship (as i always did ,except for 2001-2002) ,so i'd love to see dani win some races.

but its near impossible to beat a rider whose worst result is second place.

i don't know how much of a team player casey can and will be.

at least i can't imagine him letting dani pass at his last home round.

we talk a lot about spies bad luck and how lucky pedrosa is to have always had a rossi like string of equipment.

but actually i feel kinda bad for him, his title ambitions have been sabotaged by injury every year up until now, and since last year dani really stepped up his game.

he really deserves a chance to fight for the championship in valencia.

i hope he will get the chance