Joined Feb 2008
2K Posts | 0+
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Joined Jun 2007
10K Posts | 1K+
Norah Head
That'd be right ....... whats wrong with all these youngons these days! There's electronics aids and TC everywhere!
In that case Tone Control
Joined Jun 2007
10K Posts | 1K+
Norah Head
The GP11.1 was a destroked version of the original GP12. They literally just moved the crank pin and put in a longer con rod, having reduced the bore (all previous versions of the 800 had a much wider bore). So the GP12 is probably a modified version of that original design for the bike.
Joined Oct 2007
4K Posts | 744+
Tuscany, Italy
Ducati will never tell; but yes, their current engine is a 930cc., the one meant for the first GP12 "1000", i.e. designed to function as a stressed member. A new engine is due, which will be lighter (natively designed to fit into a twin spar frame) and running (or ready to run) at full capacity. I even heard that Barbera has been testing a full capacity 1000cc engine -- it could actually make sense, using the satellite team for testing rather than the other way round; but, who knows.
Joined Aug 2007
11K Posts | 3K+
Pomona NY
That'd be right ....... whats wrong with all these youngons these days! There's electronics aids and TC everywhere!
In that case Tone Control
This stuff has been around in recording studios since before the advent of the internet.
Joined Jun 2007
10K Posts | 1K+
Norah Head
Ah that would explain why Cher used one ....... cos she's from the dawn of time isn't she?
I heard that too, but his bike sounds exactly the same as the others. So if he is, I never heard him using it.
Joined Jun 2007
10K Posts | 1K+
Norah Head
Joined May 2008
3K Posts | 79+
Southern Aridzona - Hell's doorstep.
See post 82, earlier in this thread. They seem to have turned the engine down in the video you mention.
I did find a Spies sample at 16,350 during Qatar qualifying, so Yamaha CAN run with the Honda when they need to.
From these few examples, it seems (?) they may be more concerned with engine durability than HRC.
Joined May 2008
3K Posts | 79+
Southern Aridzona - Hell's doorstep.
Found another Ducati record, 17,660. Averaged over 6 waveform cycles, so it's likely pretty accurate.
If we assume that Duc 'must' be running a short-stroked 9XX cc, we can all speculate that they need to run a peakier engine in order to make competitive power. When Rossi ....... about harsh power delivery he's really complaining about the displacement. (Everyone on the team surely knows the true cc count, right?)
If we assume that Duc 'must' be running a short-stroked 9XX cc, we can all speculate that they need to run a peakier engine in order to make competitive power. When Rossi ....... about harsh power delivery he's really complaining about the displacement. (Everyone on the team surely knows the true cc count, right?)
Correct.
BTW, if everyone agrees, I will be writing up the findings of this thread, complete with pointers to this thread and credits to you all to post on the site. If you would prefer not to, then I will merely drop little tidbits of info into other articles on the site. I think Barry and Geo should get to decide, as they have done most of the legwork.
Joined May 2008
3K Posts | 79+
Southern Aridzona - Hell's doorstep.
Sure, go for it.
I'd suggest you have someone double check my numbers and procedure before putting anything down in blood. This should be quite straightforward, but it's possible I'm making some enormous blunder. (Hey, it's your reputation!
Here's a link to a dirt-simple spreadsheet. It converts samples or Hz to RPM. (The various divisors in the Hz section correct any harmonics the software picks up.)
http://dl.dropbox.co...0092457/RPM.xls
Joined May 2008
3K Posts | 79+
Southern Aridzona - Hell's doorstep.
Ah that would explain why Cher used one ....... cos she's from the dawn of time isn't she?
The software is VERY powerful.
Cher, raw studio recording:
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5rz8iX9hQP4[/media]
After processing:
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W0A8OxsI3Ao[/media]
Joined Aug 2007
11K Posts | 3K+
Pomona NY
Rossi was already bitching about how viciously the power comes on last year, and was pushing
for an engine that would more closely mimic the power delivery of the Yamaha.
Obviously you don't do this professionally.........You should be able to get what you need from the isolated mics trackside at various sections using two mics, the doppler effect will be in play across all channels-having just one to work with is very limiting, however having the two channels in isolation gives more options and I would say enough to gain a section of waveform to analyze. The Zoom H4n also has two built in top mics which are quite good, you can record 4 channels in isolation, if you separated the shotguns enough either side the result would give you the best chance of obtaining a good section of waveform. If it still doesn't work, you could then always sell the recordings to Mr Neale for his next movie
an easier thing to do is to sneak on into the pits when they give the engines a warm-up and hope they hold the rpm long and high enough to get what you need....
Of course the on-board is filtered well, for the TV audience-Filtering means you are removing frequencies by using either a Low-pass or High-pass-not too mention what else they may be removing or doing to the low and high mids thus altering the frequency envelope to enhance the experience for the audience-we are looking at analyzing waveforms-ideally you need a signal which is as clean and uncompressed as possible to claim accuracy of the results. The issue is with Auto-gain-if in use with the on-boards, compresses the signal making it more difficult to analyze, then it would be compressed and eq-ed again at the desk-and then limited again at broadcast-streaming even worse-these waveforms can potentially contain all sorts of added noise which is not the engine.
On top of all this, are we hearing the results of electronics retarding the situation? As I'm not a mechanical engineer-how would this, combined with the audio compression and eq effect the outcome if we are trying to nail down precise capacity?
Joined May 2008
3K Posts | 79+
Southern Aridzona - Hell's doorstep.
Talpa, I fail to see how multiple mics and channels is going to make the doppler issues go away. Without knowing the instantaneous radial velocity between bike and microphone, it will be rather difficult to correct for the frequency shift.
I was somewhat surprised at all the high frequency signal in the on-board videos. While the broadcasters may be boosting certain frequency ranges, I don't see any sign of harsh FFT application. CoolEdit does waterfall plots; these show plenty of signal to ~13KHz, and at least some energy well over 19KHz.
I was somewhat surprised at all the high frequency signal in the on-board videos. While the broadcasters may be boosting certain frequency ranges, I don't see any sign of harsh FFT application. CoolEdit does waterfall plots; these show plenty of signal to ~13KHz, and at least some energy well over 19KHz.
Joined May 2008
3K Posts | 79+
Southern Aridzona - Hell's doorstep.
Auto-tune, with the dials cranked to 11, produces highly irritating effects. Thankfully, it's not everywhere... yet.
But what's even worse is the horrendous dynamic compression that goes on in 90% of the industry. Google 'loudness war' for an explanation and examples.
