DSB Race 1 Results
I heard SBK was a barnburner, but I haven't seen the race or looked at the timing.
I heard SBK was a barnburner, but I haven't seen the race or looked at the timing.
Young apparently got the double (with an ). Is this kid for real?
Schwantz has been coaching him for a while, but I've always thought he was way overrated. This weekends results are making the competitive landscape in the AMA even more convoluted.
Schwantz has been coaching him for a while, but I've always thought he was way overrated. This weekends results are making the competitive landscape in the AMA even more convoluted.
Joined Feb 2007
11K Posts | 2K+
Tennessee
I broke my boycott of DMG and drove down to Road Atlanta yesterday to watch the races. I did it for 1 reason and 1 reason only.My son is leaving in a couple of weeks and i took him and my son in law, who had never been to a race, along with us us. Trying to pack in some quality time before he leaves.Driving a car to the track was a different dynamic, first time i had ever done that. When your traveling with other bikers and they are having to do the same mental checklists, the careful packing and unpacking,stopping for fuel every 150 miles, gear on , gear off, looking for a place to put your stand down, worrying if some ....... is going to steal your gear, your bike, etc, you really dont stop to think of how big a pain in the ... it all is until you dont have to do all that ..... What i realized yesterday was, even though traveling by bike is a pain in the ..., its the planning and the ride with friends is what its all about. The races are just an excuse to go. I dont know why it felt so different, but for the 1st time in my life, i was bored and was telling myself, i would much rather watch bike racing on the tube. I think the reason i was bored was because i didnt have anything to do or plan because i was in a car, it was to simple. .As far as the racing, they are trying and its close and all, but i still get the feeling its more of a controlled entertainment than racing.The performance of the machines, or lack thereof, has many riders in a comfort zone that they wouldnt be in if the bikes were 2 seconds a lap faster, hence the packs at the front. I did not know until i got to the track yesterday that Hayes had been stripped of the win. It only makes sense that you should have to serve a penalty, regardless of the situation.There should be no lucking out of a penalty.The last few laps of DSB #2 were crazy at turn 10. I have to admit it was entertaining
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (povol @ Apr 19 2010, 06:37 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>As far as the racing, they are trying and its close and all, but i still get the feeling its more of a controlled entertainment than racing.The performance of the machines, or lack thereof, has many riders in a comfort zone that they wouldnt be in if the bikes were 2 seconds a lap faster, hence the packs at the front. I did not know until i got to the track yesterday that Hayes had been stripped of the win. It only makes sense that you should have to serve a penalty, regardless of the situation.There should be no lucking out of a penalty.The last few laps of DSB #2 were crazy at turn 10. I have to admit it was entertaining
Glad to hear you had a fairly decent time.
Just keep reminding yourself that DMG are using the WSS rulebook in both SBK and DSB. The bikes look inept b/c a some cost cutting measures are probably slowing them down (maybe Jumkie can clarify). If you look at the rulebook, the engine are as sophisticated as WSS.
I'm pretty sure DSB is different this year than last year. Last year, Hondas were blowing up which doesn't sound like WSS rules. DMG were probably screwing with the bikes too much behind the scenes to even things up. Since everyone seems to be at ease, I'm guessing Edmondson's technical system has been chucked for a more seasoned rulebook with less interference from DMG.
Perhaps the bikes aren't as fast as you'd like, but this year looks like it's geared more towards the more established core fans. It could end up being really cool for what you like b/c neither Yamaha nor Suzuki run decent teams in WSS. If the AMA teams develop the technical savvy to run WSS spec machines, Graves and Team Hammer or Yoshimura (or whoever tunes the Suzuki 600) may end up running the Yamaha and Suzuki efforts in WSS.
You've got to figure Honda and Kawasaki will return when they pull their heads out. They can both run 600s very well under WSS rules, and they can probably make decent SBKs, too. Parts homologation should give AMA the freedom to do some fun things with the class structure if they can stabilize the sport financially.
Glad to hear you had a fairly decent time.
Just keep reminding yourself that DMG are using the WSS rulebook in both SBK and DSB. The bikes look inept b/c a some cost cutting measures are probably slowing them down (maybe Jumkie can clarify). If you look at the rulebook, the engine are as sophisticated as WSS.
I'm pretty sure DSB is different this year than last year. Last year, Hondas were blowing up which doesn't sound like WSS rules. DMG were probably screwing with the bikes too much behind the scenes to even things up. Since everyone seems to be at ease, I'm guessing Edmondson's technical system has been chucked for a more seasoned rulebook with less interference from DMG.
Perhaps the bikes aren't as fast as you'd like, but this year looks like it's geared more towards the more established core fans. It could end up being really cool for what you like b/c neither Yamaha nor Suzuki run decent teams in WSS. If the AMA teams develop the technical savvy to run WSS spec machines, Graves and Team Hammer or Yoshimura (or whoever tunes the Suzuki 600) may end up running the Yamaha and Suzuki efforts in WSS.
You've got to figure Honda and Kawasaki will return when they pull their heads out. They can both run 600s very well under WSS rules, and they can probably make decent SBKs, too. Parts homologation should give AMA the freedom to do some fun things with the class structure if they can stabilize the sport financially.
Joined Feb 2007
11K Posts | 2K+
Tennessee
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mylexicon @ Apr 19 2010, 02:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Glad to hear you had a fairly decent time.
Just keep reminding yourself that DMG are using the WSS rulebook in both SBK and DSB. The bikes look inept b/c a some cost cutting measures are probably slowing them down (maybe Jumkie can clarify). If you look at the rulebook, the engine are as sophisticated as WSS.
I'm pretty sure DSB is different this year than last year. Last year, Hondas were blowing up which doesn't sound like WSS rules. DMG were probably screwing with the bikes too much behind the scenes to even things up. Since everyone seems to be at ease, I'm guessing Edmondson's technical system has been chucked for a more seasoned rulebook with less interference from DMG.
Perhaps the bikes aren't as fast as you'd like, but this year looks like it's geared more towards the more established core fans. It could end up being really cool for what you like b/c neither Yamaha nor Suzuki run decent teams in WSS. If the AMA teams develop the technical savvy to run WSS spec machines, Graves and Team Hammer or Yoshimura (or whoever tunes the Suzuki 600) may end up running the Yamaha and Suzuki efforts in WSS.
You've got to figure Honda and Kawasaki will return when they pull their heads out. They can both run 600s very well under WSS rules, and they can probably make decent SBKs, too. Parts homologation should give AMA the freedom to do some fun things with the class structure if they can stabilize the sport financially.
You keep saying this and i dont know why? WSS engines have a substantial power advantage over DSB. One quick glance at the regulations for 2010 for both, reveals that a big part of WSS's power advantage is coming from cylinder head modifications that are not allowed in DSB
Just keep reminding yourself that DMG are using the WSS rulebook in both SBK and DSB. The bikes look inept b/c a some cost cutting measures are probably slowing them down (maybe Jumkie can clarify). If you look at the rulebook, the engine are as sophisticated as WSS.
I'm pretty sure DSB is different this year than last year. Last year, Hondas were blowing up which doesn't sound like WSS rules. DMG were probably screwing with the bikes too much behind the scenes to even things up. Since everyone seems to be at ease, I'm guessing Edmondson's technical system has been chucked for a more seasoned rulebook with less interference from DMG.
Perhaps the bikes aren't as fast as you'd like, but this year looks like it's geared more towards the more established core fans. It could end up being really cool for what you like b/c neither Yamaha nor Suzuki run decent teams in WSS. If the AMA teams develop the technical savvy to run WSS spec machines, Graves and Team Hammer or Yoshimura (or whoever tunes the Suzuki 600) may end up running the Yamaha and Suzuki efforts in WSS.
You've got to figure Honda and Kawasaki will return when they pull their heads out. They can both run 600s very well under WSS rules, and they can probably make decent SBKs, too. Parts homologation should give AMA the freedom to do some fun things with the class structure if they can stabilize the sport financially.
You keep saying this and i dont know why? WSS engines have a substantial power advantage over DSB. One quick glance at the regulations for 2010 for both, reveals that a big part of WSS's power advantage is coming from cylinder head modifications that are not allowed in DSB
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (povol @ Apr 19 2010, 02:24 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>You keep saying this and i dont know why? WSS engines have a substantial power advantage over DSB. One quick glance at the regulations for 2010 for both, reveals that a big part of WSS's power advantage is coming from cylinder head modifications that are not allowed in DSB
Check the rules. They can machine the cylinder head. I'm pretty sure last year that cylinder head mods were illegal and Hondas were garbage as a result (not the case in WSS).
Check the rules. They can machine the cylinder head. I'm pretty sure last year that cylinder head mods were illegal and Hondas were garbage as a result (not the case in WSS).
Joined Feb 2007
11K Posts | 2K+
Tennessee
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mylexicon @ Apr 19 2010, 06:58 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Check the rules. They can machine the cylinder head. I'm pretty sure last year that cylinder head mods were illegal and Hondas were garbage as a result (not the case in WSS).
WSS
2.5.8.2 Cylinder Head
Cylinder head must be as homologated. The following modifications are allowed.
1. Grinding of the cylinder head surface on the side of the gasket;
2. Modifications of the inlet and exhaust ports by taking off or adding material
(welding is forbidden);
3. Original homologated valves guides may be cut or modified, but only on the
intake or exhaust port side;
4. Polishing of the combustion chamber;
5. Original valve seats must be used, but modifications are allowed to the
shape;
6. Compression ratio is free, but the combustion chamber may be modified
only by taking material off.
. The
use of titanium valves is permitted only if the homologated machines are
equipped with such kind of valves.
Valve springs may be changed.
Valve spring retainers may be replaced or modified, but their weight must be theValves may be altered or replaced and the material may be changed, but
maximum diameters and minimum weights must remain as homologated
same or higher than the original ones
2.5.8.3 Camshaft
The method of drive must remain as homologated.
The duration is free but the lift must remain as homologated.
The cam chain or cam belt tensioning device(s) are free.
At the technical checks: for direct cam drive systems, the cam lobe lift is
measured; for non direct cam drive systems (i.e. with rocker arms), the valve lift
is measured.
DSB
5.8 Engine Modifications
a. Cylinder Head
i. Cylinders heads must remain as homologated with the following
modifications allowed:
1. Cylinder head, cylinder and crankcase gasket surfaces
only may be machined for increased compression. All other
surfaces of the cylinder head, cylinder and crankcases must
remain absolutely as homologated with no metal removal.
2. Light cleaning of gasket surfaces with steel wool, Scotch-
Brite®, etc. is permitted. Deburring radius of machined area
must not be greater than 0.020 inches or 0.5mm.
3. Valve seats may be machined or replaced. Replacements
must be of the same material and parts as the homologated
valve seat.
4. The cylinder head gasket may be changed.
d. Valves, Springs, and Retainers
i. The valves, valve seats, guides, springs, tappets, oil seals,
shims, cotter valve, spring base and spring retainers must be
as originally produced by the manufacturer for the homologated
machine. Valve spring shims are allowed.
e. Camshaft and Sprockets
i. No camshaft modifications are allowed.
ii. At the technical checks: for direct cam drive systems, the cam
lobe lift is measured; for non direct cam drive systems (i.e. with
rocker arms), the valve lift is measured.
iii. Cam timing other then stock is allowed.
iv. No cam sprocket dimensional modifications are allowed.
v. Cam sprockets may be slotted solely for the purpose of altering
cam timing.
vi. Press-on cam sprockets may be replaced with aftermarket steel
bolt-on cam sprockets and adapters.
vii. Aftermarket cam chain tensioners are permitted.
viii. The tooth count of the cam sprockets and cam drive sprocket
on the crank must remain as homologated.
ix. The cam chain style must remain as homologat
WSS
2.5.8.2 Cylinder Head
Cylinder head must be as homologated. The following modifications are allowed.
1. Grinding of the cylinder head surface on the side of the gasket;
2. Modifications of the inlet and exhaust ports by taking off or adding material
(welding is forbidden);
3. Original homologated valves guides may be cut or modified, but only on the
intake or exhaust port side;
4. Polishing of the combustion chamber;
5. Original valve seats must be used, but modifications are allowed to the
shape;
6. Compression ratio is free, but the combustion chamber may be modified
only by taking material off.
. The
use of titanium valves is permitted only if the homologated machines are
equipped with such kind of valves.
Valve springs may be changed.
Valve spring retainers may be replaced or modified, but their weight must be theValves may be altered or replaced and the material may be changed, but
maximum diameters and minimum weights must remain as homologated
same or higher than the original ones
2.5.8.3 Camshaft
The method of drive must remain as homologated.
The duration is free but the lift must remain as homologated.
The cam chain or cam belt tensioning device(s) are free.
At the technical checks: for direct cam drive systems, the cam lobe lift is
measured; for non direct cam drive systems (i.e. with rocker arms), the valve lift
is measured.
DSB
5.8 Engine Modifications
a. Cylinder Head
i. Cylinders heads must remain as homologated with the following
modifications allowed:
1. Cylinder head, cylinder and crankcase gasket surfaces
only may be machined for increased compression. All other
surfaces of the cylinder head, cylinder and crankcases must
remain absolutely as homologated with no metal removal.
2. Light cleaning of gasket surfaces with steel wool, Scotch-
Brite®, etc. is permitted. Deburring radius of machined area
must not be greater than 0.020 inches or 0.5mm.
3. Valve seats may be machined or replaced. Replacements
must be of the same material and parts as the homologated
valve seat.
4. The cylinder head gasket may be changed.
d. Valves, Springs, and Retainers
i. The valves, valve seats, guides, springs, tappets, oil seals,
shims, cotter valve, spring base and spring retainers must be
as originally produced by the manufacturer for the homologated
machine. Valve spring shims are allowed.
e. Camshaft and Sprockets
i. No camshaft modifications are allowed.
ii. At the technical checks: for direct cam drive systems, the cam
lobe lift is measured; for non direct cam drive systems (i.e. with
rocker arms), the valve lift is measured.
iii. Cam timing other then stock is allowed.
iv. No cam sprocket dimensional modifications are allowed.
v. Cam sprockets may be slotted solely for the purpose of altering
cam timing.
vi. Press-on cam sprockets may be replaced with aftermarket steel
bolt-on cam sprockets and adapters.
vii. Aftermarket cam chain tensioners are permitted.
viii. The tooth count of the cam sprockets and cam drive sprocket
on the crank must remain as homologated.
ix. The cam chain style must remain as homologat
Port and polish is an ...-load of work that nets about 3% horsepower gains so I've been told. It's noticeable I'm sure, but DSB bikes are not slow b/c they lack these costly modifications.
Cams on the other hand, are probably a big difference. I forgot cams are not free. That's probably the biggest reason DSB is slow. Without cams they probably stop producing power in the high rev range.
Oh well, one big mod away from WSS. Port and polish is not a big deal.
Cams on the other hand, are probably a big difference. I forgot cams are not free. That's probably the biggest reason DSB is slow. Without cams they probably stop producing power in the high rev range.
Oh well, one big mod away from WSS. Port and polish is not a big deal.
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<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mylexicon @ Apr 19 2010, 08:44 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Port and polish is an ...-load of work that nets about 3% horsepower gains so I've been told. It's noticeable I'm sure, but DSB bikes are not slow b/c they lack these costly modifications.
Cams on the other hand, are probably a big difference. I forgot cams are not free. That's probably the biggest reason DSB is slow. Without cams they probably stop producing power in the high rev range.
Oh well, one big mod away from WSS. Port and polish is not a big deal.
Yea, i doubt the teams even bother to .... with it. That 4-5 horsepower wouldnt mean .... in a sport decided by hundreths of seconds.
Cams on the other hand, are probably a big difference. I forgot cams are not free. That's probably the biggest reason DSB is slow. Without cams they probably stop producing power in the high rev range.
Oh well, one big mod away from WSS. Port and polish is not a big deal.
Yea, i doubt the teams even bother to .... with it. That 4-5 horsepower wouldnt mean .... in a sport decided by hundreths of seconds.
AMA racing was some good stuff this past weekend. SBK race 1 was good down to the end. I'm glad the officials fixed the mistake they made with Hayes. Even Hayes himself felt relieved that they put him where he felt he deserved to be. SBK race 2 was a great battle between Hayes and Young, with Young finally picking up a fully earned win. I'm kinda with Lex on this one, I always felt Young was overrated and wondered why he was billed as the next big thing, who knows, perhaps he will start living up to it now. One thing is for sure, the overall champion will not be easy to pick at this stage as it has been in past seasons.
DSB racing was the best. Both races were incredible to watch with anywhere from 5-8 guys battling for the lead the entire time. Turn 10 was some good stuff, especially race 2 when Cory West slipped it in there and went past 4-5 guys in one pass. In the end Cardenas had a little more in him saved for the last few laps and checked out. The racing reminded me of WSS from two years ago, when there were loads of guys capable of running at the front. The overall championship is looking pretty good in DSB.
Good racing in the AMA, I'm actually looking forward to more this year rather then just watching it because it's on. Next round at Infineon is 4 weeks out.
DSB racing was the best. Both races were incredible to watch with anywhere from 5-8 guys battling for the lead the entire time. Turn 10 was some good stuff, especially race 2 when Cory West slipped it in there and went past 4-5 guys in one pass. In the end Cardenas had a little more in him saved for the last few laps and checked out. The racing reminded me of WSS from two years ago, when there were loads of guys capable of running at the front. The overall championship is looking pretty good in DSB.
Good racing in the AMA, I'm actually looking forward to more this year rather then just watching it because it's on. Next round at Infineon is 4 weeks out.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (povol @ Apr 20 2010, 05:55 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Yea, i doubt the teams even bother to .... with it. That 4-5 horsepower wouldnt mean .... in a sport decided by hundreths of seconds.
You're construing the argument. The point was to find the source of the major performance differences between DSB and WSS. It's not port and polish.
It probably is the cams.
You're construing the argument. The point was to find the source of the major performance differences between DSB and WSS. It's not port and polish.
It probably is the cams.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Bootsakah @ Apr 20 2010, 07:33 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>AMA racing was some good stuff this past weekend. SBK race 1 was good down to the end. I'm glad the officials fixed the mistake they made with Hayes. Even Hayes himself felt relieved that they put him where he felt he deserved to be. SBK race 2 was a great battle between Hayes and Young, with Young finally picking up a fully earned win. I'm kinda with Lex on this one, I always felt Young was overrated and wondered why he was billed as the next big thing, who knows, perhaps he will start living up to it now. One thing is for sure, the overall champion will not be easy to pick at this stage as it has been in past seasons.
DSB racing was the best. Both races were incredible to watch with anywhere from 5-8 guys battling for the lead the entire time. Turn 10 was some good stuff, especially race 2 when Cory West slipped it in there and went past 4-5 guys in one pass. In the end Cardenas had a little more in him saved for the last few laps and checked out. The racing reminded me of WSS from two years ago, when there were loads of guys capable of running at the front. The overall championship is looking pretty good in DSB.
Good racing in the AMA, I'm actually looking forward to more this year rather then just watching it because it's on. Next round at Infineon is 4 weeks out.
AMA has improved from last year. Almost all of the big names are in SBK, but for some reason I find DSB to be the more interesting class. Something about the way the racing unfolds makes it a little bit more interesting to watch. West has been a really big surprise even though he showed something at NJMP last year on the 1125RR. During the broadcast the commentary team was talking about how Vesrah are still trying to learn the ins and outs of tuning DSB bikes and Penske has been helping them. Pretty impressive showing for a group of guys who are still learning how to make power.
Anyway, I hope Young is not overrated b/c SBK needs more winners and more guys at the front pushing the issue, but I've never seen consistent front running from him.
Hopkins also needs to get it together as well. I know he's been battling a serious wrist problem, but he's got more than enough skill to ride at the front in AMA SBK. He's going to be 27 in about a month, and he needs to notch some career credentials in case his body never fully recovers from the hard years he endured on the international stage.
DSB racing was the best. Both races were incredible to watch with anywhere from 5-8 guys battling for the lead the entire time. Turn 10 was some good stuff, especially race 2 when Cory West slipped it in there and went past 4-5 guys in one pass. In the end Cardenas had a little more in him saved for the last few laps and checked out. The racing reminded me of WSS from two years ago, when there were loads of guys capable of running at the front. The overall championship is looking pretty good in DSB.
Good racing in the AMA, I'm actually looking forward to more this year rather then just watching it because it's on. Next round at Infineon is 4 weeks out.
AMA has improved from last year. Almost all of the big names are in SBK, but for some reason I find DSB to be the more interesting class. Something about the way the racing unfolds makes it a little bit more interesting to watch. West has been a really big surprise even though he showed something at NJMP last year on the 1125RR. During the broadcast the commentary team was talking about how Vesrah are still trying to learn the ins and outs of tuning DSB bikes and Penske has been helping them. Pretty impressive showing for a group of guys who are still learning how to make power.
Anyway, I hope Young is not overrated b/c SBK needs more winners and more guys at the front pushing the issue, but I've never seen consistent front running from him.
Hopkins also needs to get it together as well. I know he's been battling a serious wrist problem, but he's got more than enough skill to ride at the front in AMA SBK. He's going to be 27 in about a month, and he needs to notch some career credentials in case his body never fully recovers from the hard years he endured on the international stage.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mylexicon @ Apr 20 2010, 03:12 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>AMA has improved from last year. Almost all of the big names are in SBK, but for some reason I find DSB to be the more interesting class. Something about the way the racing unfolds makes it a little bit more interesting to watch. West has been a really big surprise even though he showed something at NJMP last year on the 1125RR. During the broadcast the commentary team was talking about how Vesrah are still trying to learn the ins and outs of tuning DSB bikes and Penske has been helping them. Pretty impressive showing for a group of guys who are still learning how to make power.
Anyway, I hope Young is not overrated b/c SBK needs more winners and more guys at the front pushing the issue, but I've never seen consistent front running from him.
Hopkins also needs to get it together as well. I know he's been battling a serious wrist problem, but he's got more than enough skill to ride at the front in AMA SBK. He's going to be 27 in about a month, and he needs to notch some career credentials in case his body never fully recovers from the hard years he endured on the international stage.
I agree DSB is fun to watch. With exception of Cardenas two race end checkouts for the win, the bikes and riders are fairly closely matched. It's also good to see some new guys run near the front and build some confidence. West's two podiums are going to get him over that mental hump and get him thinking that he could be a race winner. Herrin is starting to show some smarts with his racing, but still gets wound up when he messes up, I guess that is youth. He was lucky to pull 2nd in race 2 after almost going off the track for a 2nd time. Aquino is lacking something, he certainly has the speed but missing the aggression to push it and pass.
On the cover, Hopkins appears a let down. I think most people would assume he should be front running in a national series after having finished 4th in GP's a few years back. Granted the guy has had the crap beat out of his body, so all the credit for just sticking in there. He did manage two 5ths in the race and is starting to look better overall.
Anyway, I hope Young is not overrated b/c SBK needs more winners and more guys at the front pushing the issue, but I've never seen consistent front running from him.
Hopkins also needs to get it together as well. I know he's been battling a serious wrist problem, but he's got more than enough skill to ride at the front in AMA SBK. He's going to be 27 in about a month, and he needs to notch some career credentials in case his body never fully recovers from the hard years he endured on the international stage.
I agree DSB is fun to watch. With exception of Cardenas two race end checkouts for the win, the bikes and riders are fairly closely matched. It's also good to see some new guys run near the front and build some confidence. West's two podiums are going to get him over that mental hump and get him thinking that he could be a race winner. Herrin is starting to show some smarts with his racing, but still gets wound up when he messes up, I guess that is youth. He was lucky to pull 2nd in race 2 after almost going off the track for a 2nd time. Aquino is lacking something, he certainly has the speed but missing the aggression to push it and pass.
On the cover, Hopkins appears a let down. I think most people would assume he should be front running in a national series after having finished 4th in GP's a few years back. Granted the guy has had the crap beat out of his body, so all the credit for just sticking in there. He did manage two 5ths in the race and is starting to look better overall.
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<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mylexicon @ Apr 20 2010, 11:12 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>AMA has improved from last year. Almost all of the big names are in SBK, but for some reason I find DSB to be the more interesting class. Something about the way the racing unfolds makes it a little bit more interesting to watch. West has been a really big surprise even though he showed something at NJMP last year on the 1125RR. During the broadcast the commentary team was talking about how Vesrah are still trying to learn the ins and outs of tuning DSB bikes and Penske has been helping them. Pretty impressive showing for a group of guys who are still learning how to make power.
Anyway, I hope Young is not overrated b/c SBK needs more winners and more guys at the front pushing the issue, but I've never seen consistent front running from him.
Hopkins also needs to get it together as well. I know he's been battling a serious wrist problem, but he's got more than enough skill to ride at the front in AMA SBK. He's going to be 27 in about a month, and he needs to notch some career credentials in case his body never fully recovers from the hard years he endured on the international stage.
Hopkins is hurt and the talk at the track was his pace in second half of Sundays Superbike race. You could see him put the bit between his teeth when he made a pass for i believe 7th place. At that point, Pegram and someone else, Knapp i think, were 3 seconds ahead of him. He started pulling a second a lap on that duo and easily caught and passed them with very nice braking at 10a. The cat is still smooth. John Ulrich said it was amazing he rode as well as he did considering how much pain his wrist is causing him. He set his fastest lap of the weekend in the second race, knocking 4/10ths off his qualifying time. He still needs to find another 1/2 second to run with the top guys but that doesnt seem out of the question once his wrist heals. We will see.
Anyway, I hope Young is not overrated b/c SBK needs more winners and more guys at the front pushing the issue, but I've never seen consistent front running from him.
Hopkins also needs to get it together as well. I know he's been battling a serious wrist problem, but he's got more than enough skill to ride at the front in AMA SBK. He's going to be 27 in about a month, and he needs to notch some career credentials in case his body never fully recovers from the hard years he endured on the international stage.
Hopkins is hurt and the talk at the track was his pace in second half of Sundays Superbike race. You could see him put the bit between his teeth when he made a pass for i believe 7th place. At that point, Pegram and someone else, Knapp i think, were 3 seconds ahead of him. He started pulling a second a lap on that duo and easily caught and passed them with very nice braking at 10a. The cat is still smooth. John Ulrich said it was amazing he rode as well as he did considering how much pain his wrist is causing him. He set his fastest lap of the weekend in the second race, knocking 4/10ths off his qualifying time. He still needs to find another 1/2 second to run with the top guys but that doesnt seem out of the question once his wrist heals. We will see.
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<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mylexicon @ Apr 20 2010, 10:34 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>You're construing the argument. The point was to find the source of the major performance differences between DSB and WSS. It's not port and polish.
It probably is the cams.
Its a combination of things, with port and polishing and cams being just 2. More allowable valve work, 13 pound weight difference, tires etc:. The WSS 600 is way closer to the old FX engine regs than todays DSB.
It probably is the cams.
Its a combination of things, with port and polishing and cams being just 2. More allowable valve work, 13 pound weight difference, tires etc:. The WSS 600 is way closer to the old FX engine regs than todays DSB.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (povol @ Apr 20 2010, 10:47 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Its a combination of things, with port and polishing and cams being just 2. More allowable valve work, 13 pound weight difference, tires etc:. The WSS 600 is way closer to the old FX engine regs than todays DSB.
I'm pretty sure FX was more like WSBK rules for 600s. The power was only marginally better than WSS b/c you can't run a 600 much harder than WSS no matter how many trick parts you add.
I'm pretty sure the main difference between DSB and WSS is just the cams (maybe the fuel as well). I forgot cams could not be changed. Without cams, I don't think the bikes can unlock the top end of the powerband (14,500-16,000rpm).
I'm pretty sure FX was more like WSBK rules for 600s. The power was only marginally better than WSS b/c you can't run a 600 much harder than WSS no matter how many trick parts you add.
I'm pretty sure the main difference between DSB and WSS is just the cams (maybe the fuel as well). I forgot cams could not be changed. Without cams, I don't think the bikes can unlock the top end of the powerband (14,500-16,000rpm).
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (povol @ Apr 20 2010, 08:39 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Hopkins is hurt and the talk at the track was his pace in second half of Sundays Superbike race. You could see him put the bit between his teeth when he made a pass for i believe 7th place. At that point, Pegram and someone else, Knapp i think, were 3 seconds ahead of him. He started pulling a second a lap on that duo and easily caught and passed them with very nice braking at 10a. The cat is still smooth. John Ulrich said it was amazing he rode as well as he did considering how much pain his wrist is causing him. He set his fastest lap of the weekend in the second race, knocking 4/10ths off his qualifying time. He still needs to find another 1/2 second to run with the top guys but that doesnt seem out of the question once his wrist heals. We will see.
Good to hear.
Good to hear.
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I know its a little late, but the racing was outstanding. Lenny did good considering, 14th/15 is respectable. He hung in there with the 2nd lead group that was just 2 seconds adrift of the lead group for a while. He was running 11th in the first race then had a few issues ad dropped back to 14th.
I'm very impressed with Corey West & Dane Wesby. They are spectacular. I was hoping to see Eslick on the podium for both races. I'm rooting for him to win the title.
Congrats to Cardenas, I still don't like him but I think he's learning to ride with more decency (I'm sure he'll prove me wrong.)
The superbike races were also very good, except for that horrible lapse in officiating. Not putting Josh Hayes at the back of the grid then later taking his win away was very stupid. Saying the decision was based on some bum info was ........
I expect to see Lenny in the top ten or higher at Infineon. Its 50/50 for me to make the trip. It actually depends on if Cali Kid can get some sponsorship for Jake Holden as I am also trying to convince the owner of Motoyard to provide some sponsorship parts too. Keep your fingers crossed.
I'm very impressed with Corey West & Dane Wesby. They are spectacular. I was hoping to see Eslick on the podium for both races. I'm rooting for him to win the title.
Congrats to Cardenas, I still don't like him but I think he's learning to ride with more decency (I'm sure he'll prove me wrong.)
The superbike races were also very good, except for that horrible lapse in officiating. Not putting Josh Hayes at the back of the grid then later taking his win away was very stupid. Saying the decision was based on some bum info was ........
I expect to see Lenny in the top ten or higher at Infineon. Its 50/50 for me to make the trip. It actually depends on if Cali Kid can get some sponsorship for Jake Holden as I am also trying to convince the owner of Motoyard to provide some sponsorship parts too. Keep your fingers crossed.
