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Why has HONDA not dominated pre-season tests.

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Joined Jul 2006
11K Posts | 291+
Texas
For the past 20 plus years HONDA has dominated in pre and season racing...why not now...why not 2007 (so far)

It came to me in a dream....
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the NSR...the best bike out there in the 500 days....why?

First there's Wayne Gardner on the 500...
then came Mr. Doohan on the 500....
the NSR dominated all those 2 stroke years right.....

then come the 4 strokes...the RC211V...with Rossi.....

not that HONDA doesn't build outstanding race bikes, but they've always had the BEST rider / "DEVELOPER" for said machines...

we all know what Rossi did on the RC.....and we've seen what the RC built by HONDA and developed by Rossi did in the hands of others...

ok fast forward to 2007....HONDA as of yet are not up to speed on the new machines....who is the developer/rider? Hayden/Pedrosa


i'll leave it at that....discuss
 
I think the answer is more complicated than that... they switched from a V5 to a V4 while other teams retained their configuration but just lowering their capacity.
 
I don't know, I think we may need to wait on the bike development question until the season gets started? It's too soon to tell just yet. I think everyone can agree though that if Honda isn't running up front for every test there could be cause for concern. If they were way off the pace I could see what you mean, but they are right there with everyone else in my opinion. I believe Rossi and Hopkins set their fastest time at Sepang on Q tires?
Damn, how much longer before the racing starts! I can't wait.
 
I think is a lot to do with Honda being the only team to change significantly in direction, with new ideas and configurations. Their project is only just starting. On the off chance that the Honda isn't up the sharp end by Quatar, i am absoloutely sure that by the time Brno comes the Honda will be THE best bike on the grid, and only rossi will be able to stop it (Kinda like the last few years).
 
Let's not forget the absence of Jeremy Burgess. He worked on the NSR and the RC211V. Rossi took Burgess with him to Yamaha for a reason.
 
I can't help to wonder if HRC gave Rossi that NSR that he won the last 500 gp with, he would still have a Honda between his legs as he would have still set the top lap #'s this last weekend on the same bike as Dani or Nicky have now. You all know HRC..."We know everything...you know @#$%!"
 
im with you al
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its because arseimo and the crusin cartaker couldnt develope a cold let alone a gp bike,and even if they could have they got strong enough personalitys to TELL the allmighty honda what to do.......me thinks not.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (roger-m @ Jan 25 2007, 10:46 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>im with you al
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its because arseimo and the crusin cartaker couldnt develope a cold let alone a gp bike,and even if they could have they got strong enough personalitys to TELL the allmighty honda what to do.......me thinks not.


Absolute genius post mate!
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Pete
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ChemiKaze @ Jan 25 2007, 10:53 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I think the answer is more complicated than that... they switched from a V5 to a V4 while other teams retained their configuration but just lowering their capacity.

Thats a very weak excuse dont you think? Honda's legendary research and development department is bigger that all of Ducati, Yamaha, Kawasaki, and Suzuki combined. I think instead of thinking Honda Dropped the ball maybe there is a chance that the other factories have gotten better and quicker.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (basspete @ Jan 25 2007, 03:04 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Absolute genius post mate!
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You sure are easily impressed...

Is it possible to jerk eachother off online? Well if a way is ever discovered, I'm sure you two will be the ones winning the Nobel prize for it.


<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ogunski @ Jan 25 2007, 05:29 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Thats a very weak excuse dont you think? Honda's legendary research and development department is bigger that all of Ducati, Yamaha, Kawasaki, and Suzuki combined. I think instead of thinking Honda Dropped the ball maybe there is a chance that the other factories have gotten better and quicker.
I'm not so sure it’s a weak excuse as much as it is that technology is advancing quickly. The advantage that Honda had in money and engineers has been narrowed by the ability of any Joe with a computer to figure out complex problems. The availability of knowledge is unprecedented in today’s global arena. The end is near, ladies and gentlemen. No longer will the lack engineers working on a racing quandary be the foremost factor in developing a superior bike. But you will always have your diminutive analyzers saying it’s the rider talent pool to blame (as you may have noticed on this thread).

But I need not remind you, it is the pre-season.
 
You don't wanna be predicting the demise of Honda, trust me. You end up with a face full of crow pie. It's nice to dream, though, isn't it?
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Racejumkie @ Jan 25 2007, 08:50 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>You sure are easily impressed...

Is it possible to jerk eachother off online? Well if a way is ever discovered, I'm sure you two will be the ones winning the Nobel prize for it.
I'm not so sure it’s a weak excuse as much as it is that technology is advancing quickly. The advantage that Honda had in money and engineers has been narrowed by the ability of any Joe with a computer to figure out complex problems. The availability of knowledge is unprecedented in today’s global arena. The end is near, ladies and gentlemen. No longer will the lack engineers working on a racing quandary be the foremost factor in developing a superior bike. But you will always have your diminutive analyzers saying it’s the rider talent pool to blame (as you may have noticed on this thread).

But I need not remind you, it is the pre-season.

stop being a prick Junker...cause if we can jack each other on-line i'd shoot a load across your living-room.
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anyhow...you are way off and wrong... Honda has all the money, all the best engineers, and are the BEST at what they do...BUT!..all that means poo if the RIDER is not there to develop the bike..... to take said machine out and push it to its limit and find its weakness....with out the RIDER to impute his info on where the bike development has to go all you have is a computer to crunch numbers.....that computer (computer being the engineers also) WILL and CAN build the bike...but can't make it faster...
 
To assume the slowed development of the RC212V in comparison to the RC211V and NSR500 because of rider development (or lackthereof, as you claim) is ridiculous. It's not as if Rossi or Doohan were in Japan every week between races testing the new bike. Someone besides those two was doing the same thing Tady Okada and Tohru Ukawa do now, test new stuff daily.

It would be foolish to assume that Hayden or Pedrosa and their crews have the same development genius that Rossi and Burgess have. But at the same time, they aren't the kids wearing hockey helmets riding the short bus either. This is a team consisting of two world champions, I certainly have no question regarding their abilities. Maybe that's because I'm a Hayden fan. But I also won't dismiss the fact that this thread was started simply because Rossi disciples never pass up a chance to take a shot at a threat either.

Discuss
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (richo @ Jan 26 2007, 07:46 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>You don't wanna be predicting the demise of Honda, trust me. You end up with a face full of crow pie. It's nice to dream, though, isn't it?


Me? easily impressed? Nah, its takes more than 3 race wins to impress me....

Pete
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Ooost @ Jan 26 2007, 12:13 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>But I also won't dismiss the fact that this thread was started simply because Rossi disciples never pass up a chance to take a shot at a threat either.

Discuss
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Oostin i think they post this stuff to blow smoke up jumkies shorts.
 

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