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Joined Aug 2013
342 Posts | 1+
Louisiana, USA
Joined Oct 2007
4K Posts | 744+
Tuscany, Italy
rezonator636
Yes of course it's the FGM Yamahas. While Honda is only faking it, they never meant Open to be competitive as is evident from the poor performance of their Prod racer. On the other hand Yamaha made their Open bikes honest and good.
Yes of course it's the FGM Yamahas. While Honda is only faking it, they never meant Open to be competitive as is evident from the poor performance of their Prod racer. On the other hand Yamaha made their Open bikes honest and good.
Joined Feb 2007
11K Posts | 2K+
Tennessee
J4rn0
I still say Honda built their proddy racer to beat the best CRT and became a victim of Dorna's typical midstream change of direction when they just up and decided to shitcan the CRT's. Still doesnt forgive them for lying about its performance.
I still say Honda built their proddy racer to beat the best CRT and became a victim of Dorna's typical midstream change of direction when they just up and decided to shitcan the CRT's. Still doesnt forgive them for lying about its performance.
Joined Apr 2011
900 Posts | 4+
somewhere else
Joined Apr 2011
900 Posts | 4+
somewhere else
povol
when is the date for "the .... canning of CRT's"? I thought these open regs have been known for some time now, even before end of last season
when is the date for "the .... canning of CRT's"? I thought these open regs have been known for some time now, even before end of last season
Joined Aug 2013
342 Posts | 1+
Louisiana, USA
barbedwirebiker
I've been thinking about that as well. In truth, we haven't really seen what the "true" Yamaha open bike will be like. Aleix might start running a lot slower when he gets on the FTR frame.
I've been thinking about that as well. In truth, we haven't really seen what the "true" Yamaha open bike will be like. Aleix might start running a lot slower when he gets on the FTR frame.
Joined Feb 2007
11K Posts | 2K+
Tennessee
barbedwirebiker
It was known that it was going to be dropped in May of 2013. It wasnt officially dropped until October 2013.
Honda had chosen direction and began work on the proddy racer in the summer of 2012. Yamaha didnt make a decision of what direction they were going to go until after the CRT's were shitcanned. And like someone else mentioned, we still have not seen an FTR with its own frame. I doubt that will be a big deal though since Yamaha is basically giving them the blueprint to copy at their leisure.
It was known that it was going to be dropped in May of 2013. It wasnt officially dropped until October 2013.
Honda had chosen direction and began work on the proddy racer in the summer of 2012. Yamaha didnt make a decision of what direction they were going to go until after the CRT's were shitcanned. And like someone else mentioned, we still have not seen an FTR with its own frame. I doubt that will be a big deal though since Yamaha is basically giving them the blueprint to copy at their leisure.
rezonator636
I understand the point but I think it can just as easily be seen the other way. Instead of Rossi being just what he is for 14 years & the competition fluctuating around him, it is possible that the overall level of motogp stays relatively stable & rossis own performance has gone from vast superiority to 'just another front runner'.
I understand the point but I think it can just as easily be seen the other way. Instead of Rossi being just what he is for 14 years & the competition fluctuating around him, it is possible that the overall level of motogp stays relatively stable & rossis own performance has gone from vast superiority to 'just another front runner'.
Joined Feb 2007
11K Posts | 2K+
Tennessee
Tom
Anything is possible, but for that statement to be plausible, you would have to deduce that Gibernau, Biaggi, Melandri, Capirossi, Hayden, Barros etc etc, were on the same plane as Lorenzo,Stoner, Pedrosa, and now Marquez. I would strongly disagree with anyone who came to that conclusion.
Anything is possible, but for that statement to be plausible, you would have to deduce that Gibernau, Biaggi, Melandri, Capirossi, Hayden, Barros etc etc, were on the same plane as Lorenzo,Stoner, Pedrosa, and now Marquez. I would strongly disagree with anyone who came to that conclusion.
Joined Aug 2013
342 Posts | 1+
Louisiana, USA
Tom
I see your point as well, but I think the level of talent in MotoGP now is light years ahead of where it was when Rossi first entered the premier class. Rossi's closest rivals were Biaggi and Giberneau; good riders, but not once in a generation special. By contrast, Lorenzo and Marquez are otherworldly riders, and Dani is close (I don't rate him as highly because he's been too fragile to make a serious run). I'd liken this era more to that of the early eighties, when three other all-time greats (Roberts, Sheene, and Spencer) were dueling it out and snatching titles from each other.
Having said that, I'm a hair too young to have seen Sheene, Roberts, and Spencer in their heyday; all I know of them I got from books and YouTube videos. I'd be interested to hear what other PSers who have seen both eras think about the comparison.
I see your point as well, but I think the level of talent in MotoGP now is light years ahead of where it was when Rossi first entered the premier class. Rossi's closest rivals were Biaggi and Giberneau; good riders, but not once in a generation special. By contrast, Lorenzo and Marquez are otherworldly riders, and Dani is close (I don't rate him as highly because he's been too fragile to make a serious run). I'd liken this era more to that of the early eighties, when three other all-time greats (Roberts, Sheene, and Spencer) were dueling it out and snatching titles from each other.
Having said that, I'm a hair too young to have seen Sheene, Roberts, and Spencer in their heyday; all I know of them I got from books and YouTube videos. I'd be interested to hear what other PSers who have seen both eras think about the comparison.
J4rn0
Have you heard anything about what Ducati have changed on the bike to get the recent improvements?
Have you heard anything about what Ducati have changed on the bike to get the recent improvements?
Joined Oct 2007
4K Posts | 744+
Tuscany, Italy
hawkdriver
Yes, Dall'Igna shortened the distance between front wheel and engine and made the swingarm a little longer, and that did improve riders' feeling, but the bike is still understeering.They changed many little things, but the current GP14 had already been designed before Dall'Igna was hired so it's not radically different from the GP13. I think the bigger factor is actually the tires; in order to avoid the blistering problems seen last year, Bridgestone have re-introduced the harder-body tire (not to be confused with a harder compound), and some may remember that Ducati's problems began when Bridgestone discontinued this harder-body type in 2009. Now that something similar is back, suddenly Ducati is more competitive. Tires have such an importance in GP performance... A wrong tire can spoil the performance even of a stellar bike like the Yamaha M1, as we have seen.
This dependency on tire choices is the biggest single problem in MotoGP now: the problem is not having a single supplier, but the narrow choice offered. The supplier should offer a wider range of options so that each manufacturer can find something suitable and none is obliged to spend millions redesigning their bikes around a stupid tire.
Yes, Dall'Igna shortened the distance between front wheel and engine and made the swingarm a little longer, and that did improve riders' feeling, but the bike is still understeering.They changed many little things, but the current GP14 had already been designed before Dall'Igna was hired so it's not radically different from the GP13. I think the bigger factor is actually the tires; in order to avoid the blistering problems seen last year, Bridgestone have re-introduced the harder-body tire (not to be confused with a harder compound), and some may remember that Ducati's problems began when Bridgestone discontinued this harder-body type in 2009. Now that something similar is back, suddenly Ducati is more competitive. Tires have such an importance in GP performance... A wrong tire can spoil the performance even of a stellar bike like the Yamaha M1, as we have seen.
This dependency on tire choices is the biggest single problem in MotoGP now: the problem is not having a single supplier, but the narrow choice offered. The supplier should offer a wider range of options so that each manufacturer can find something suitable and none is obliged to spend millions redesigning their bikes around a stupid tire.
Joined Feb 2007
11K Posts | 2K+
Tennessee
J4rn0
That has not been decided, the M1 looked just fine Sunday. What the new tire has spoiled is Lorenzo's psyche. He thinks, like most champions, that the regs should somhow favor him, and when they dont, they freak the .... out and whine like a ...... Personally, i think the whole bitchy off season was gamesmanship on his part, and it worked, because Bridgestone is coming with another tire in June. Whatever happened to the tire you tested in winter testing was it for next year.
That has not been decided, the M1 looked just fine Sunday. What the new tire has spoiled is Lorenzo's psyche. He thinks, like most champions, that the regs should somhow favor him, and when they dont, they freak the .... out and whine like a ...... Personally, i think the whole bitchy off season was gamesmanship on his part, and it worked, because Bridgestone is coming with another tire in June. Whatever happened to the tire you tested in winter testing was it for next year.
J4rn0
Yeah it's always going to be hard to find the right balance with how much they change the tires and how quickly the teams can work around it. The Honda, Ducati, and Yam were all able to win races though even after the tires changed. They did have CS riding at that time and when he was healthy that season he was fast, but Casey was special. These things are so hard to compare though and the fundamental flaw is still there, hopefully they can get it turned around.
Yeah it's always going to be hard to find the right balance with how much they change the tires and how quickly the teams can work around it. The Honda, Ducati, and Yam were all able to win races though even after the tires changed. They did have CS riding at that time and when he was healthy that season he was fast, but Casey was special. These things are so hard to compare though and the fundamental flaw is still there, hopefully they can get it turned around.
