*SPOILERS* Jerez Rd3 Race Discussion

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (johnny @ May 4 2009, 07:59 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>My bad man. I tought you were having a Barrymachine moment


Is that why you instantly sooked at him

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (MigsAngel @ May 4 2009, 09:56 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Fine....but where will Ducati find a crew to fix the problems Nicky is having and understand the Ducati? If you think about it Ducati are not going to build a 100% new machine just to suit Nicky are they....so Nicky and wherever his new crew comes from will have to live with the bike they have....


I'm not here to recommend crew chiefs, I'm just pointing out that if they were any good they would be able to setup the bike to suit the rider. I think it is very short sighted of Ducati to think that their bike is fine when only one person can ride it.

In Rossi's autobiography he mentions that Ducati wanted him to move to their team in 2004 before he eventually chose Yamaha. One of the reasons he never went to Ducati was because they had the same attitude as Honda, in that they felt that they build the bike and the rider just riders it and has no input. Ducati and Honda clearly haven't learned from their misjudged assumptions.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (roger-m @ May 3 2009, 10:19 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BarryMachine @ May 4 2009, 11:21 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Is that why you instantly sooked at him


Whats sooked mean? I don't understand yer backward lingo speak\type english man

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (basspete @ May 4 2009, 08:17 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I thought the weekend was ...., Rossi is finished and a brit will never win a 125 gp. I also like to dress as a girl and go to Hong Kong websites to work on my forearm strength.

Oh ...., sorry, I thought I was someone else there,great weekend, Rossi was awesome, Bradley was amazing, and the forum troll is crying into a jazz mag as we speak.

Pete


Whats really funny ..... or perhaps sad , is how long it took till you could use that

Must have been like "the eclipse" for you guys

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (johnny @ May 4 2009, 09:59 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>My bad man. I tought you were having a Barrymachine moment
They do seem to have very similar styles and opinions dont they

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (MigsAngel @ May 4 2009, 02:19 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I totally agree with you. Ducati try to help each of their riders as much as possible to ensure they are happy and can be successful. However, Ducati can only do so much for a rider eventually the rider has to adapt to some extent to characteristics of the bike.

Remember the 80/20 rule, 80% of motorcycle racing is the rider and 20% the bike....so we can't or shouldn't keep blaming Ducati for a former world champions poor results when their part and contribution is a small part of the package.

Lastly, several Hayden fanboys on this site said Nicky riding Style would suit the Ducati and now many of those same fanboys are now saying its Ducati thats the problem ....make your minds up, please.

I know that rule, so it only increases my theory that Ducati only focuses in One Bike / One Rider. If they are the smallest Constructors out there, simply focus that '20% is bike' completely, all of it in getting it the best way, meaning 'One Rider' complete focus for them. I had not thought about it like this, thanks MigsAngel. It even proves to me that is completely their team inside politics and strategy.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (MigsAngel @ May 4 2009, 02:19 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Remember the 80/20 rule, 80% of motorcycle racing is the rider and 20% the bike....
This is a dogma not a rule.

dog·ma
noun
something held as an established opinion ; especially a point of view or tenet put forth as authoritative without adequate grounds

It's funny how you guys assume its Nicky Haydens side of the garage that is screwing him up.... not only him but also Melandri and Caparossi, but I've yet to hear complaints coming from those guys that their engineers were incompetent. In fact I remember Melandri giving nothing but thanks to the Ducati team when he bid his farewell.

Is it soo hard to believe that Nicky Hayden is nothing more than your average run of the mill motorcycle racer? Don't get me wrong, he's a good rider and quite entertaining to watch..... but nothing to write home about.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (SuperShinya56 @ May 4 2009, 11:24 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>It's funny how you guys assume its Nicky Haydens side of the garage that is screwing him up.... not only him but also Melandri and Caparossi, but I've yet to hear complaints coming from those guys that their engineers were incompetent. In fact I remember Melandri giving nothing but thanks to the Ducati team when he bid his farewell.

Is it soo hard to believe that Nicky Hayden is nothing more than your average run of the mill motorcycle racer? Don't get me wrong, he's a good rider and quite entertaining to watch..... but nothing to write home about.

SuperShinya, I would not pick Hayden as my favourite rider but that aside, " run of the mill motorcycle racers " don't win World Championship in the premier class of racing... Sure you can argue that it was a fluke, but to even score consistently throughout the season is something that is worth giving credit for, let alone winning the championship. I am not sure what problems Hayden is experiencing with the duke and from the impression so far I highly doubt in my opinion he will totally click with the bike. Though I still place Hayden higher, JT, Elias, Canepa, Taka, Vermulen, so to come to a conclusion, there is not doubt I think Hayden took a gamble to go to Ducati and know he's paying for it, though if Hayden were to move to Yamaha and take Toselands spot or Edwards which is doing average now, we would see much better potential... Look at Melandri... Leaves you with only one question? When are the duc boys going to resolve their current one hit wonder stoner problem, since (KNOCK ON WOOD) something happens to stoner... DUCATI IS DONE...

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (MikePio @ May 4 2009, 05:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>" run of the mill motorcycle racers " don't win World Championship in the premier class of racing... Sure you can argue that it was a fluke

yamaha won that championship for hayden. it was fluke.

Better race then I originally thought considering Pedrosa getting the holeshot, thought for sure he would check out.

1. Rossi - Good on him for playing it smart, slowly gaining, and taking the win.
2. Pedrosa - A lot better showing then I expected. Guy is showing his has real strength considering his recent surgeries.
3. Stoner - Nice showing, bring it home for the points.
4. RdP - Are we seeing a new de Puniet?
5. Melandri - Kawasaki wondering if they should have pulled out? I'm willing to guess they get development in some way. Great job Melandri.
6. Cappers - Solid ride, Suzuki not looking as great as was expected in pre-season. Getting beat by the black bike has to suck.
7. Edwards - You are so terrible you should retire! Just kidding... best non-factory rider, and beating factory teams.
8. Dovi - Great finish considering you went off track.
9. Elias - Keep trying to figure out those new tires.
10. Vermi - Suzuki, are they really a factory team?
11. Gibbers - Good finish, got that Ducati figured out.
12. Takahashi - Nice finish in front of others expected to do better.
13. Toseland - What's going on with your side of the garage. Hope he can get it together.
14. DeA - Hot and cold for de Angelis.
15. Hayden - Seriously, forget all you know. Start over. Whatever they are trying, it's not working. I'm beginning to think superbikes are looking good for you.

Lorenzo - man think about the points, but still, thankfully a lowside.
Kallio - issues beyond your control?
Canepa - again, why are you here?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (#27aus @ May 4 2009, 12:12 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>yamaha won that championship for hayden. it was fluke.

Actually lol, it was HONDA who would have won Hayden the championship, but in that case Pedro would already be champion?!?!??!

no it was yamaha. in china, france and usa... 57 points...

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Pinky @ May 3 2009, 08:20 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>well when people stop putting hayden on a pedestal then maybe we can move on.

firing the whole crew is the most ridiculous thing i ever heard

No - when you stop obsessing about Hayden - you can move on.
But I don't think that will ever happen. You're a one-trick-pony.
Love Stoner / Hate Hayden . . . that's all you got.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (MikePio @ May 4 2009, 06:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>SuperShinya, I would not pick Hayden as my favourite rider but that aside, " run of the mill motorcycle racers " don't win World Championship in the premier class of racing... Sure you can argue that it was a fluke, but to even score consistently throughout the season is something that is worth giving credit for, let alone winning the championship. I am not sure what problems Hayden is experiencing with the duke and from the impression so far I highly doubt in my opinion he will totally click with the bike. Though I still place Hayden higher, JT, Elias, Canepa, Taka, Vermulen, so to come to a conclusion, there is not doubt I think Hayden took a gamble to go to Ducati and know he's paying for it, though if Hayden were to move to Yamaha and take Toselands spot or Edwards which is doing average now, we would see much better potential... Look at Melandri... Leaves you with only one question? When are the duc boys going to resolve their current one hit wonder stoner problem, since (KNOCK ON WOOD) something happens to stoner... DUCATI IS DONE...
You people are talking like hayden has had EVERY opportunity to do the things he needed to do in order to sort the bike out a bit. IF it wasn't for some setbacks such as his highside at quatar and dipshit Nukeio Tacacrashit, hayden might be in the spot to get his development in gear. If you are hurt you cant ride the way you want to, especially when it is your back that is hurt. SO I still think alot of what you guys are saying is premature. If after halfway through the season, and is healthy, he still has these problems well then he might be done. IF he has a chance to test and tune without the health issues he should be ok. Think about this as well. He is on a very limited test schedule and is also hurting. SO go ahead and speculate all you want, but the real facts of the matter are pressing at the moment. And he isn't in any real order to get that bike which is the hardest to tame supposedly, so give him a break for now.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ROCKGOD01 @ May 4 2009, 09:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>You people are talking like hayden has had EVERY opportunity to do the things he needed to do in order to sort the bike out a bit. IF it wasn't for some setbacks such as his highside at quatar and dipshit Nukeio Tacacrashit, hayden might be in the spot to get his development in gear. If you are hurt you cant ride the way you want to, especially when it is your back that is hurt. SO I still think alot of what you guys are saying is premature. If after halfway through the season, and is healthy, he still has these problems well then he might be done. IF he has a chance to test and tune without the health issues he should be ok. Think about this as well. He is on a very limited test schedule and is also hurting. SO go ahead and speculate all you want, but the real facts of the matter are pressing at the moment. And he isn't in any real order to get that bike which is the hardest to tame supposedly, so give him a break for now.


I agree man but I think all you just typed was wasted. They just don't want him to do well and are lapping it up like the pathetic douchbags they are. Its obvious they never rode a bike with even a minor injury to even imagine the pain the guy must be in after those horrific crashs

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (johnny @ May 4 2009, 09:18 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I agree man but I think all you just typed was wasted. They just don't want him to do well and are lapping it up like the pathetic douchbags they are. Its obvious they never rode a bike with even a minor injury to even imagine the pain the guy must be in after those horrific crashs
When Jorge first came into the series I didn't like him much. After he got his ... kicked, booted, smashed, slammed, etc. I had gained major respect for the guy. Not like I am a huge fan of his today but he is someone I really respect now. I think because he rode while he had been busted up as much as he was I had to give it to the guy. THis right now is no different than the Hayden situation but people just like to hate on the guy cause he beat Vale to a world championship. Plus no one except real gp fans and who get it have respect for Nicky for what he did.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Bootsakah @ May 5 2009, 03:26 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Better race then I originally thought considering Pedrosa getting the holeshot, thought for sure he would check out.

1. Rossi - Good on him for playing it smart, slowly gaining, and taking the win.
2. Pedrosa - A lot better showing then I expected. Guy is showing his has real strength considering his recent surgeries.
3. Stoner - Nice showing, bring it home for the points.
4. RdP - Are we seeing a new de Puniet?
5. Melandri - Kawasaki wondering if they should have pulled out? I'm willing to guess they get development in some way. Great job Melandri.
6. Cappers - Solid ride, Suzuki not looking as great as was expected in pre-season. Getting beat by the black bike has to suck.
7. Edwards - You are so terrible you should retire! Just kidding... best non-factory rider, and beating factory teams.
8. Dovi - Great finish considering you went off track.
9. Elias - Keep trying to figure out those new tires.
10. Vermi - Suzuki, are they really a factory team?
11. Gibbers - Good finish, got that Ducati figured out.
12. Takahashi - Nice finish in front of others expected to do better.
13. Toseland - What's going on with your side of the garage. Hope he can get it together.
14. DeA - Hot and cold for de Angelis.
15. Hayden - Seriously, forget all you know. Start over. Whatever they are trying, it's not working. I'm beginning to think superbikes are looking good for you.

Lorenzo - man think about the points, but still, thankfully a lowside.
Kallio - issues beyond your control?
Canepa - again, why are you here?

Congratulations for posting on topic. First one in how many pages?

Aren't there enough threads already devoted to bashing or defending Hayden / Ducati? Waited all Euro winter for racing and you guys are just arguing back and forth about .... that was argued before the season. I bet if they bought 500's or 990's back you would all continue to argue about 800's.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (TP70 @ May 5 2009, 06:14 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Congratulations for posting on topic. First one in how many pages?

Aren't there enough threads already devoted to bashing or defending Hayden / Ducati? Waited all Euro winter for racing and you guys are just arguing back and forth about .... that was argued before the season. I bet if they bought 500's or 990's back you would all continue to argue about 800's.


Is'int that the great thing about this forum, a thread can have so many tangents but in the end all related.

And to be a bit pedantic like Tom!! Have you not just contracdicted youself by going of topic with your bitchin' about us going off topic..