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Spies to announce deal at Indy.

with all respect to nakano-san, the only thing that he will be remembered for, by the motogp watching public, is THAT crash...

<span style="font-size:8pt;line-height:100%<span style="font-family:palatino Linotypeunless something REALLY special happens

 
Rumor going around is that Spies's team manager did a sneaky quick swap of the crank on Spies' bike with a stock crank at the road atlanta quali...hence the reason he passed the test. In the first tear down of mladin's at Virginia spies' wasn't torn to the crank and neither was Tommy's. I am certain all three were illegal. I am sure you all may have read this on sbkplanet though, but for those who havent.

Supershinya, I hope spies' gets his ... kicked too when/if he arrives in the GP's. He is an arrogant prick who thinks he's hot .... for winning the AMA. He needs to be humbled before he can even dream to win the world championship. Sure the talent may be there for him to win it...eventually...if the stars align. With the prima donna attitude it aint happening ever though.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (SackWack @ Sep 6 2008, 10:41 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Wasn't T.Hayden's found to be dirty as well?
Yes, but that doesn't count, he was framed!
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BigAl @ Sep 7 2008, 08:58 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>THAT crash...
Dude, did that make you cringe or what. Outch man.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (yello13 @ Sep 7 2008, 09:23 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Rumor going around is that Spies's team manager did a sneaky quick swap of the crank on Spies' bike with a stock crank at the road atlanta quali...hence the reason he passed the test. In the first tear down of mladin's at Virginia spies' wasn't torn to the crank and neither was Tommy's. I am certain all three were illegal. I am sure you all may have read this on sbkplanet though, but for those who havent.

Supershinya, I hope spies' gets his ... kicked too when/if he arrives in the GP's. He is an arrogant prick who thinks he's hot .... for winning the AMA. He needs to be humbled before he can even dream to win the world championship. Sure the talent may be there for him to win it...eventually...if the stars align. With the prima donna attitude it aint happening ever though.
Yello, how do you now the first claim? Seems like you would need someone in the inside. Its not beyond teams to try to cheat, so I'll listen. Is it possible that they were getting away with .... before and this time they have been busted?

As far as Spies attitude, I agree, he doesn't seem very humble.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (yello13 @ Sep 7 2008, 06:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Rumor going around is that Spies's team manager did a sneaky quick swap of the crank on Spies' bike with a stock crank at the road atlanta quali...hence the reason he passed the test. In the first tear down of mladin's at Virginia spies' wasn't torn to the crank and neither was Tommy's. I am certain all three were illegal. I am sure you all may have read this on sbkplanet though, but for those who havent.

Supershinya, I hope spies' gets his ... kicked too when/if he arrives in the GP's. He is an arrogant prick who thinks he's hot .... for winning the AMA. He needs to be humbled before he can even dream to win the world championship. Sure the talent may be there for him to win it...eventually...if the stars align. With the prima donna attitude it aint happening ever though.
can you post any link's or any proof of this claim, swapping cranks is not a quick job in my experience.
 
Just got back from 170 miles of twisties and thought about this thread most of the time.

If Maladins/Haydens crank was illegal and by default Spies was also( even with the alleged quick swap without anybody noticing?). Shouldn't............................ Jason Desalvo be champion? If the ama was run conscientiously?
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Nice forum.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Parc Ferme @ Sep 6 2008, 03:54 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>If you've read the press releases from both sides, they've been very open about what they (AMA) wanted, when they wanted it, why they wanted it and Suzuki have responded in public as well. Suzuki came nowhere near providing what the AMA asked for.

Don't forget the other DQs this season.

The only real conspiracy is why nobody is asking the Question of the Year which is How long have Suzuki (and others) been using illegal cranks (or other parts), how long has the AMA been looking the other way, and why?

Go back and read again why the AMA DQ'd the crank. No visible tagging, visibly different metallic color, different surface. If the crank met the rules, it would super easy for Suzuki to provide a similar crank from a production machine.

Instead, Suzuki hemmed and hawed and in the end produced nothing even close to a part meeting spec, nor provided the requested number of samples. You would assume that if the part was correct, they would do everything in their power to comply with the requests from the AMA if nothing more than to clear their name and reputation.

The part either meets regs or it doesn't. If the part was correct, you can bet that Suzuki wouldn't acquiesce so easily. They'd be like, "Here's the friggin part, get stuffed!" So, why haven't they?

^^^You have some of the facts my friend. It is not as clear cut as you may think. Read this and ask yourself if Mladin was cheating, or if he was the most vocal opponent to DMG,s plans for AMA racing(I have no desire to watch 600cc races become the premiere class in AMA). They actually got the parts to AMA headquarters on time and the AMA did not even look at the evidence they asked for in the first place.

Suzuki Blasts AMA Pro Racing Denial Of Mladin Appeal Hearing

Sep 05, 2008, ©Copyright 2008, Roadracing World Publishing, Inc.

From a press release issued by American Suzuki

Rockstar Makita Suzuki’s Mat Mladin Appeal Rejected

BREA, Calif. (Sept. 5, 2008) – American Suzuki Motor Corporation and Yoshimura Racing were shocked and dismayed when, less than 30 minutes after they submitted, on behalf of Mat Mladin, the written evidence demanded by the AMA, the request for an appeal of Mladin's disqualification from the VIR Superbike races was summarily rejected. Both companies believe the decision is arbitrary and unreasonable, and flagrantly ignores the letter and spirit of the AMA rules.

On Saturday, August 30th, AMA Special Projects Manager Bill Syfan informed Don Sakakura of Yoshimura Racing that they must produce supporting documentation and crankshaft production records and information by 5:00 p.m. (EST) today. The written submission, along with an opinion from an independent crankshaft expert, was faxed to the AMA shortly before 5:00 p.m. (ET) this afternoon. In addition, early this morning Yoshimura Racing and American Suzuki Motor Corporation delivered to the AMA offices in Ohio an exemplar crankshaft for inspection and comparison. Shortly after 5:00 p.m. (ET) today, less than half an hour after the written submission was timely sent to the appropriate AMA officials, Don Sakakura and Mat Mladin were notified by phone by Bill Syfan that an appeal board would not be convened. However, it took a posting on roadracingworld.com for them to learn that the AMA had, within minutes after receiving the written submission, concluded that the appeal was "without merit."

A spokesperson for Yoshimura Racing stated that the decision stunned everyone, and team officials were bewildered as to why the AMA would make such an onerous request for evidence on short notice and then refuse to consider any of it. "It makes us question the integrity behind the enforcement of the rules and suggests that there was never an intention to assemble an appeal board to conduct an objective and impartial hearing. From all appearances, the AMA had clearly made its decision well before 5:00 p.m. The 'deadline' was obviously a ruse to create the impression of fairness."

Mladin has asked the AMA to immediately provide a written statement of the basis for its summary rejection of his appeal.

For more details about Rockstar Makita Suzuki Factory Racing, please log on to www.teamsuzuki.com.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (yello13 @ Sep 7 2008, 01:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>It isn't exactly proof but a bit of heresay.

http://www.superbikeplanet.com/2008/Aug/080830b17.htm

Not sure how you 'quickly' swap a crankshaft either, but who knows.

Well then, if they changed the crank to a stock crank in time for qual, then it’s all good. It kinda sounded like you had misinterpreted the report by using the word "sneaky" to mean they swapped the crank after qual but before inspection. If in fact that is what happened, that is, Ben’s crew not wanting to risk embarrassment, swapped it before qual so he could run it, then its all good. I don’t understand why you say it was “sneaky”. Seems to me Mladin’s crew where stupid and should have done the same thing. Especially after already being DQ.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ogunski @ Sep 7 2008, 01:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>However, it took a posting on roadracingworld.com for them to learn that the AMA had, within minutes after receiving the written submission, concluded that the appeal was "without merit."

Mladin has asked the AMA to immediately provide a written statement of the basis for its summary rejection of his appeal.
Maybe their submission was empty and lame and called Suzuki on it. If they didn't turn anything substantial in, hell why convene a review committee? It seems the team has requested a detail answer as to why they rejected it so quickly, I hope they have a good answer. It might help to make Suzuki's submission public so there is more transparency in the process. As it looks, both sides seem to be posturing.

BTW, ParcFerme, I think you nailed it when you asked why Suzuki hasn’t been examined more closely before. I think it’s been so lob sided that you would think it would beg ore scrutiny. I have never read about Suzuki have an unfair advantage. Try to find something in the press about the sport, I bet you won’t find much if anything. I’ve often wondered myself how a team could be so over the top dominant. My cynical side has always thought they had some kind of an unfair advantage. It seems the new management are either scrutinizing this or demanding a level playing field, or as those that believe this is some kind of retaliation to Mladin, that they are sabotaging him. My bias is that I tend to think Suzuki was cheating.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Sep 7 2008, 06:46 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Dude, did that make you cringe or what. Outch man.

curls my toenails every time i see it...kudos to nakano for waving to the crowd from the stretcher too!

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<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Sep 6 2008, 08:43 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Nah man, that is not definitive. I admit, my Italian sucks, but it doesn't read like you think (according to me). The highlighted part is saying though he is linked to the satellite Honda; they may make an announcement about the "future" for Spies at the Indy GP. Didn't they make the same claim that an announcement would be made about Hayden and Ducati at Misano that didn't happen? I guess Indy is where a wave of info is gonna hit the fan.



Biker Girl, we need your help please.

BTW, while we are on the subject, BEN SPIES IS THE 2008 AMA SUPERBIKE CHAMPION! (OFFICIAL)
LINK 2008 AMA CHAMP


Oh, and Mat Mladin is the 2008 AMA SUPERBIKE CHEATER OF THE YEAR.
LINK TO CHEATER

It actually does say he's the guy...translated it says...

"Just these days the team manager and ex spanish rider has also found a rider: Toni Elias.
The Catalan Manresa will therefore be aboard the green zx-rr after having been on practically every other bike manufacturer with the exception of Suzuki. Yamaha in his debut year in 2005, Honda is 2006 and 2007 and Ducati this year.

So official ut unofficial...but expect the "official" release soon...

Regarding Spies...Good Job to him for his 3rd....but if he wants to go into Moto GP he needs to take it easy and not ask for too much money otherwise teams are never going to sign him. Sure he is champ but of the AMA Superbike. Look at Toseland...ex multi WSBK champ who went to a medium tier team not asking for the world. Difference is piano man is not arrogant like Spies seems may be...
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (yello13 @ Sep 7 2008, 10:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>It isn't exactly proof but a bit of heresay.

http://www.superbikeplanet.com/2008/Aug/080830b17.htm

Not sure how you 'quickly' swap a crankshaft either, but who knows.
well they would have to change the crank and big end shells as a set really to make sure they had the right tolerance. race bikes use a different material than in there bearing than road bikes so im sure whoever the person examining the parts would know if this had happened. that not to say that they could not find race bearing to fit the crank out of the road bike because there normally just colour coded but it all takes time. normally having to plastigauge them to check tolerance, not a quick job and if this wasn't done the inspector could do it and find out that that part was not used in that race because the tolerances were wrong.
 
WTF @ Suzuki not running a third bike?!!! How stupid are they? Maybe it will all change after Indy, but Ben Spies would have to podium
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jumkie @ Sep 8 2008, 12:00 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>BTW, ParcFerme, I think you nailed it when you asked why Suzuki hasn’t been examined more closely before. I think it’s been so lob sided that you would think it would beg ore scrutiny. I have never read about Suzuki have an unfair advantage. Try to find something in the press about the sport, I bet you won’t find much if anything. I’ve often wondered myself how a team could be so over the top dominant. My cynical side has always thought they had some kind of an unfair advantage. It seems the new management are either scrutinizing this or demanding a level playing field, or as those that believe this is some kind of retaliation to Mladin, that they are sabotaging him. My bias is that I tend to think Suzuki was cheating.
Remember when TC was made legal in 2007 (or was it 2006? Can't remember)? Suzuki were running it all season and were never called on it by the AMA. Finally the media had made such a point of how all the Suzukis made weird sounds and how everyone was sure that they were running TC, so the AMA decided that they needed to make a change mid-season. Rather than take away the advantage Suzuki had illegally made for themselves, they legalized it.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Austin @ Sep 8 2008, 03:52 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Remember when TC was made legal in 2007 (or was it 2006? Can't remember)? Suzuki were running it all season and were never called on it by the AMA. Finally the media had made such a point of how all the Suzukis made weird sounds and how everyone was sure that they were running TC, so the AMA decided that they needed to make a change mid-season. Rather than take away the advantage Suzuki had illegally made for themselves, they legalized it.

This is part of the reason you can't really gauge Spies or Mladin true talent versus the rest of the AMA field not to mention vs the world stage riders in GPs or WSBK...Cheating does not make you a great rider it only makes you a great cheater....
 
What difference really can a hardened, polished and carbide coated crankshaft make? You can run thinner oil and the crank will last the race is maybe it. How much HP is that really worth to run a 5 weight oil compared to 10W? Seems like a small advantage to me. Surely it isn't night and day like I would expect a spring to desmo system change would be. I have to laugh at the idea that the riders would say to the team "give me the coated crank this time". I think they don't have the input on the engine internals everyone thinks or would even know. If blame should be levied then the team manager gets it. That guy is in control of the machine not the rider. As far as TC goes Suzuki developed an engine internal TC and surely used it illegally in my view (which is far away from the action so just an opinion).
 
The best thing that can happen to Spies is he stands on the podium this weekend and gets to shove it down Rizlas throat. Handing Suzuki there first dry win while announcing a Honda MotoGP deal would be the worst insult, although unlikely. He stands his best chance this weekend on a track only he has any knowledge of and 2 races including hundreds of laps under his belt. Also with the AMA title wrapped up, he has the ability to hang it out there a bit more.

I guess we'll see what Spies is made of this weekend won't we?
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (gsfan @ Sep 8 2008, 07:58 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>What difference really can a hardened, polished and carbide coated crankshaft make? You can run thinner oil and the crank will last the race is maybe it. How much HP is that really worth to run a 5 weight oil compared to 10W? Seems like a small advantage to me. Surely it isn't night and day like I would expect a spring to desmo system change would be. I have to laugh at the idea that the riders would say to the team "give me the coated crank this time". I think they don't have the input on the engine internals everyone thinks or would even know. If blame should be levied then the team manager gets it. That guy is in control of the machine not the rider. As far as TC goes Suzuki developed an engine internal TC and surely used it illegally in my view (which is far away from the action so just an opinion).
Races, and thus championships, are won on very small advantages. The rider is part of the team, and of course the most visible one, you don't think they have any input? These guys are the ones that make or break the team, of course they have input.
 

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