Michelin 070 chosen by riders

J4rn0 · May 19, 2017

It won with with 20 votes out of 23, and it is going to be the only construction availabe from Mugello on. No official press release, but the announcement is out. GPOne:
https://www.gpone.com/en/2017/05/19/motogp/the-old-front-tyre-to-return-as-of-the-mugello-gp.html
There is a also video on the official MotoGP web site with Capirossi giving the announcement.

povol · May 19, 2017

J4rn0 said:
It won with with 20 votes out of 23, and it is going to be the only construction availabe from Mugello on. No official press release, but the announcement is out. GPOne:
https://www.gpone.com/en/2017/05/19/motogp/the-old-front-tyre-to-return-as-of-the-mugello-gp.html
There is a also video on the official MotoGP web site with Capirossi giving the announcement.

Was there ever any doubt the harder construction tire would be available.

Iamapony · May 19, 2017

I started to post about this in the Frenchie thread to get that out of the dumps, since there has been a bit of talk about the 70. It's hard to get that many people to agree about anything, let alone motorcycle racers and their equipment. :laughing

I would like a poll:
Is Capirossi telling the truth about the number of riders that want it? Link requires MotoGP video pass, I think. Front tire choice
I vote no.
[ ] Yes
[ ] No

Gaz · May 19, 2017

The shame of a lot of this is that the vote is secret .............. make the vote public and often the results are different .

That said, all BS anyway, bring back multiple choice selections and competition

J4rn0 · May 20, 2017

Iamapony said:
I started to post about this in the Frenchie thread to get that out of the dumps, since there has been a bit of talk about the 70. It's hard to get that many people to agree about anything, let alone motorcycle racers and their equipment. :laughing

I would like a poll:
Is Capirossi telling the truth about the number of riders that want it? Link requires MotoGP video pass, I think. Front tire choice
I vote no.
[ ] Yes
[ ] No

The votes of 23 riders are really easy to check, who would risk losing face on such a thing.

This said, in case some riders are in doubt or indifferent, there are also manufacturers and teams in this game who do influence such a vote. I heard Cecchinello on Italian TV saying clearly that the current Honda works better with the 070, period. The only Honda rider who could prefer the softer one is Pedrosa, if only because he would have more chances of beating his teammate with that one!

I think it is reasonable to doubt the sincerity of many riders (notably Rossi and Marquez) when they say they don't really have a preference for one tire or the other, that tehy are very similar, etc etc... Marquez began saying something like that in the Press Conference, only to contradict himself in the next sentence when he stated that he didn't find any problems with the 070, while he reckoned he had some problems with the softer carcass.

These riders simply do not want to express a clear preference to avoid being accused of looking for an advantage for themselves, that's clear enough. The most honest so far has been Lorenzo, who stated his preference for the softer carcass without any ambivalence.

danski · May 20, 2017

J4rn0 said:
The votes of 23 riders are really easy to check, who would risk losing face on such a thing.

This said, in case some riders are in doubt or indifferent, there are also manufacturers and teams in this game who do influence such a vote. I heard Cecchinello on Italian TV saying clearly that the current Honda works better with the 070, period. The only Honda rider who could prefer the softer one is Pedrosa, if only because he would have more chances of beating his teammate with that one!

I think it is reasonable to doubt the sincerity of many riders (notably Rossi and Marquez) when they say they don't really have a preference for one tire or the other, that tehy are very similar, etc etc... Marquez began saying something like that in the Press Conference, only to contradict himself in the next sentence when he stated that he didn't find any problems with the 070, while he reckoned he had some problems with the softer carcass.

These riders simply do not want to express a clear preference to avoid being accused of looking for an advantage for themselves, that's clear enough. The most honest so far has been Lorenzo, who stated his preference for the softer carcass without any ambivalence.

Gaz said:
The shame of a lot of this is that the vote is secret .............. make the vote public and often the results are different .

That said, all BS anyway, bring back multiple choice selections and competition

The sizable majority should put to bed the theory that the change is only for one rider.
I totally agree that multiple choice is the way forward in fairness.

Gaz · May 20, 2017

danski said:
The sizable majority should put to bed the theory that the change is only for one rider.
I totally agree that multiple choice is the way forward in fairness.

Maybe, but as was reported in previous years, the real shame is where a rider may choose a tyre to disadvantage another rather than to advantage themselves but yes, if the reported number is correct that could be seen as many wanting the change.

Alternately though, and for mine this is pure conspiracy but I suspect that a lot of riders are somewhat sheeple and do not want to upset a majority or their factory

danski · May 20, 2017

Gaz said:
Maybe, but as was reported in previous years, the real shame is where a rider may choose a tyre to disadvantage another rather than to advantage themselves but yes, if the reported number is correct that could be seen as many wanting the change.

Alternately though, and for mine this is pure conspiracy but I suspect that a lot of riders are somewhat sheeple and do not want to upset a majority or their factory

In this case I do believe the 20 just plain preferred #70, not to disadvantage anyone like in 2012.

Arrabbiata1 · May 20, 2017

J4rn0 said:
These riders simply do not want to express a clear preference to avoid being accused of looking for an advantage for themselves, that's clear enough. The most honest so far has been Lorenzo, who stated his preference for the softer carcass without any ambivalence.

But then in Lorenzo's case, there is nothing to gain from such equivocation.

I do think that Redding and Dovi were being truthful in saying that they have no preference.

Over the years, disingenuity and insincerity is something that I've come to associate with Valentino.

J4rn0 · May 20, 2017

Arrabbiata1 said:
But then in Lorenzo's case, there is nothing to gain from such equivocation.

I do think that Redding and Dovi were being truthful in saying that they have no preference.

Over the years, disingenuity and insincerity is something that I've come to associate with Valentino.

True for Lorenzo, and yes, Dovi is always honest as well. Valentino and Marquez are actually very similar in their ways, whatever you want to associate them with. Actually the young champ (whom I also admire wholeheartedly as a rider) has probably surpassed the old master in more ways than one.

JPSLotus · May 20, 2017

J4rn0 said:
True for Lorenzo, and yes, Dovi is always honest as well. Valentino and Marquez are actually very similar in their ways, whatever you want to associate them with. Actually the young champ (whom I also admire wholeheartedly as a rider) has probably surpassed the old master in more ways than one.

Rossi and Marquez similar in what ways?

p4p1 · May 20, 2017

Can we start penciling in M. Marquez on the trophy yet?

michaelm · May 20, 2017

danski said:
In this case I do believe the 20 just plain preferred #70, not to disadvantage anyone like in 2012.

So you remember a riders' vote in 2012, as I do and as it would appear David Emmett does?

I was reliably informed by JKant that it didn't happen because he couldn't google it, his implication presumably being that I had invented it.

J4rn0 · May 20, 2017

JPSLotus said:
Rossi and Marquez similar in what ways?

Don't you see? Pleasing the crowds and promoting the myth of themselves as the youngest/fastest riders (each in his own generation). They are very similar in that. That's also why, despite the initial friendship, they were bound to clash. Had Rossi retired in time, say end of 2014, they would have gone down to history as father and son, so to say.
Lorenzo also tried Rossi's crowd-pleasing tricks, but that's not really his cup of tea. He always came across as contrived.
This kind of considerations is not aimed at invalidating in any way the sheer talent of these riders, which is huge and has to be evaluated in its own merit.

danski · May 20, 2017

p4p1 said:
Can we start penciling in M. Marquez on the trophy yet?

What, the Cal Crutchlow trophy for most crashes in the weekend?
:fishing1:

Theo · May 20, 2017

danski said:
I totally agree that multiple choice is the way forward in fairness.

Don't agree, they pointed out a few years ago and almost every year since that the bikes are costing too much to produce, so a natural progression of this is that there should be just one control tyre in its various disguises, ie hard, medium and soft. If everyone had the tyre they liked then they would have to turn up with over a thousand tyres and then they have to change it for every circuit throughout the year. Clearly, this is a stupid idea.

Keshav · May 20, 2017

J4rn0 said:
Don't you see? Pleasing the crowds and promoting the myth of themselves as the youngest/fastest riders (each in his own generation). They are very similar in that. That's also why, despite the initial friendship, they were bound to clash. Had Rossi retired in time, say end of 2014, they would have gone down to history as father and son, so to say.
Lorenzo also tried Rossi's crowd-pleasing tricks, but that's not really his cup of tea. He always came across as contrived.
This kind of considerations is not aimed at invalidating in any way the sheer talent of these riders, which is huge and has to be evaluated in its own merit.

Hmmm... I don't see any parallels in terms of how these two play to the press. I've not seen Marquez engage in all the mugging for the cameras, and waiving and winking to his on-board video, or having a new bizarre helmet design at every race. One doesn't really get the sense of Marquez really going out of his way to market himself. He certainly doesn't go in for the silly costumes and stage shows to celebrate each win. He seems quite content to let the race results speak for themselves, which I think has won over many serious fans of the sport. I'm not saying he is without ego; no rider at this level could be.

danski · May 20, 2017

Theo said:
Don't agree, they pointed out a few years ago and almost every year since that the bikes are costing too much to produce, so a natural progression of this is that there should be just one control tyre in its various disguises, ie hard, medium and soft. If everyone had the tyre they liked then they would have to turn up with over a thousand tyres and then they have to change it for every circuit throughout the year. Clearly, this is a stupid idea.

I think the one size fits all idea is well past it's sell by date. The only way that works fairly is in a one make series. In GP the vast difference in bikes even from the same manufacturer can make what works for team X worse than useless for team Y(as seen in Jerez)
If Dorna sort out the Friday free practice so that it's not treated as a pre qualifier with teams chucking tyres on to make sure of making q2, there could be a saving made there so that Michelin could manage to bring more different profiles carcasses etc , end result would be more competitive bikes and more different winners imo.

Theo · May 20, 2017

danski said:
I think the one size fits all idea is well past it's sell by date. The only way that works fairly is in a one make series. In GP the vast difference in bikes even from the same manufacturer can make what works for team X worse than useless for team Y(as seen in Jerez)
If Dorna sort out the Friday free practice so that it's not treated as a pre qualifier with teams chucking tyres on to make sure of making q2, there could be a saving made there so that Michelin could manage to bring more different profiles carcasses etc , end result would be more competitive bikes and more different winners imo.

Lets look at slightly different then, I presume you ride a motorbike, or maybe more than one, on your bike/s you fit tyres made by a manufacturer that makes you feel confident, chances are they are all from the same manufacturer. Now they don't just make that tyre for you, they make it for lots of other motorbike riders and they ride all manner of bikes. If they started making tyres for different bikes, that work well on one but not on another can you even start to imagine how much that would cost?
I imagine we wouldn't ride bikes it'd be to expensive.

danski · May 20, 2017

Theo said:
Lets look at slightly different then, I presume you ride a motorbike, or maybe more than one, on your bike/s you fit tyres made by a manufacturer that makes you feel confident, chances are they are all from the same manufacturer. Now they don't just make that tyre for you, they make it for lots of other motorbike riders and they ride all manner of bikes. If they started making tyres for different bikes, that work well on one but not on another can you even start to imagine how much that would cost?
I imagine we wouldn't ride bikes it'd be to expensive.

I don't have a bike now, haven't since my zx10r ten years ago. However I do remember the standard Bridgestone's were too hard and changing to Michelin pilot powers made it much easier to ride. I've no doubt those Bridgestone's would maybe have suited another brand better.

Michelin 070 chosen by riders

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