How to save MotoGP

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Dion @ Jan 6 2009, 09:40 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>So stick that in your pipe and smoke it... 2 stokes sound .....

.... the whales

SAVE TWO-STROKES

Small market riders in 250s:

Cheseaux & Luthi - Swiss
Abraham & Pesek - Czech
Talmacsi - Hungary
Wilairot - Thailand

Its a start...

Face facts, 2 strokes in grand prix racing are going to be extinct shortly. The deal is done, the writings on the wall, they're not coming back. Why the .... anyone even thinks they "might" come back is beyond me.
Yearning for "the good old days" is fine, but the reality of the matter is something else.

here's my idea... 450 singles to replace 125s... 600s to replace 250s... and 1000's for GP

All manufacturers have these bikes and engines... They run factory specs (to save money)
BUT can do whatever they please...for example... the 1000 CC engine has to be in spec as far as size...but can be fully built...all the guts, even a totally different material for engine block...but it all has to stay similar to factory spec...

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (povol @ Jan 5 2009, 07:25 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I agree with everything you say but its a choice that people are allowed to make.Once you make that decision,it should be all on you.It wouldnt matter if they made cigarette companies include a electronics device installed on every pack that screams [You stupid ....,these things will kill you}.People will do harmful things to themselves for self satisfaction.I would have no problem with laws that would say the government doesnt have to supply anyone with health care who have smoke related illness.No insurance,to bad dude,your the one who pulled the trigger.

Too true - sad but true. It's an addiction plain and simple. I quit years ago - but still
every now and then when I'm stressed I'll go to the deli and buy tobacco and roll one up and
smoke it - and then wonder why the .... I did. But I'm not kidding myself that it's harmless.
Mostly I'm too old to care anymore. I'd like to see tobacco money back in racing but I gotta say
I hate seeing 14 year-old kids smoking and they do it because it's all around them. Well . . .
at least Rossi isn't plugging smokes on the tube.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Keshav @ Jan 6 2009, 05:08 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'> Too true - sad but true. It's an addiction plain and simple. I quit years ago - but still
every now and then when I'm stressed I'll go to the deli and buy tobacco and roll one up and
smoke it - and then wonder why the .... I did. But I'm not kidding myself that it's harmless.
Mostly I'm too old to care anymore. I'd like to see tobacco money back in racing but I gotta say
I hate seeing 14 year-old kids smoking and they do it because it's all around them. Well . . .
at least Rossi isn't plugging smokes on the tube.
Well if the world and especially this country would take it's skirt off and put on their leathers then the parents should do their job. I never felt like becoming a smoker because of the really cool paint job on the old lucky strike suzuki. Or craving a cig because of the red Marlboro logos. I mean really who ever started this whole campaign against tobacco sponsorship should look into Nascar and get rid of the alcohol sponsors then, or how about the armed forces cause if they have to fight they could die. And my favorite is the fast food sponsors cause we all know how awesomely healthy Mcdonalds is. So if you can do for one you must for the other. THe only sponsors left with large cash will be bristol myers, pfizer and the rest of the drug companies who put out more drugs that people can never get hooked on. THey love us.

MotoGP is broken and yet almost every post is about some intangible, tertiary subject---i.e. global participation or return of the 2-smokes

Here are the 3 things that need to be done to fix the sport:

1. Control tire
2. Top speed limit
3. Electronic limits

MotoGP isn't dying because it can't attract new audiences, it's dying because it can't keep the audiences it used to have. Anyone who understands the sport knows there is no coherent conspiracy to promote any one nationality. DORNA simply hands out favors to riders who look like they will bring in viewership. It's pragmatism at it's most despicable. Brad Pitt, Michael Jordan, Tom Cruise, and Michael Schumacher all probably receive DORNA money in the off chance they turn out to be decent riders.

The real problems with the sport are cost and lack of close racing.

In reality, all problems can be attributed to a few ill-fated decisions made in the wake of Kato's death. Sadly, each one of the major changes is responsible for the cumulative total of motogp's problems. MotoGP is like a hospital patient with multiple diseases. Even if they treat TB, the patient will still need to overcome lymphoma, and MS. The control tire eliminated TB, imo, now only MS and lymphoma remain.

The 1 thing DORNA has actually done right is the control tire. I doubt the newest tire is helpful to the sport b/c it was certainly designed to help GP maintain lap time advantages over WSBK. Secondly, the new control tire appears to have an extremely spongy front and a rock hard rear tire. We all know of a certain someone who has used that setup throughout a majority of his career. In that someone's defense, his tire spec didn't show up until mid season so it more likely that Bridgestone adapted the tire to suit Rossi. After it was proven to be fastest, Bridgestone adopted it for everyone in accordance with the control tire rules.

But forget the minor problems, the control tire allows DORNA to control performance without significantly injuring the spectacle. Almost all of a motorcycle's performance is controlled via the tires, the obvious exception is top speed. I suppose they could create a tire that delaminated at 215mph but I'm not sure that would be safe.

If DORNA have control of the tires, only 2 other things need to be defined in order to allow more relaxed rules----top speed and the use of electronic devices. I know everyone hates the idea of a top speed limit, but it's obvious the classical solution to excessive top speed (displacement reduction) is an abysmal failure in the electronic age.

A top speed limit would relieve safety concerns but it wouldn't reduce the prevalence of TC. Personally, I'd like to see a return to mechanical fuel injection, but I'm sure the MSMA would probably veto the hell out of mechanical injection. I guess KR's suggestions might be more palatable for the MSMA---ban throttle by wire and limit the number of cylinders that can be controlled with TC.

The real tragedy is that the MSMA are not solely responsible for most of the problems with the sport. Too many of the sports fans are stuck in the 20th century ESPECIALLY the fans who are obsessed with the proliferation of electronic gadgetry. Classical means of controlling performance (displacement reduction) do not work in the electronic age which means either electronics or unlimited performance have to go.

The real problem with MotoGP is that it is ceasing to produce relevant technologies. If DORNA would stop blowing a majority of it's budget subsidizing riders and teams who labor under stupid rules packages, perhaps they could use some of that money to invest in safety equipment that will help me avoid death in the event I'm cut off by a truck again.

I think even the most bone-headed manufacturers can realize that rider safety is the biggest stumbling block prohibiting the expansion of high displacement sports bikes. In many ways MotoGP is like the AMA---it's a bunch of foolish bandits fighting over an increasingly dwindling stream of revenues. None of them have any vision outside of defeating the other bandits. The vision needed to expand the motorcycling market needs to come from the FIM or DORNA. In this case Ezy is most closely related to MotoGP, if he is incapable of selling his vision to the sport's participants and the fans, they need to find someone who can.

Focusing on new safety equipment should be the primary use of DORNA's funds in the 21st century. Eliminating expensive restrictions on racing equipment (displacement, fuel, electronics) should be on the top of the priorities list as well.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ROCKGOD01 @ Jan 6 2009, 01:37 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Well if the world and especially this country would take it's skirt off and put on their leathers then <u>the parents should do their job</u>. I never felt like becoming a smoker because of the really cool paint job on the old lucky strike suzuki. Or craving a cig because of the red Marlboro logos. I mean really who ever started this whole campaign against tobacco sponsorship should look into Nascar and get rid of the alcohol sponsors then, or how about the armed forces cause if they have to fight they could die. <u>And my favorite is the fast food sponsors cause we all know how awesomely healthy Mcdonalds is</u>. So if you can do for one you must for the other. THe only sponsors left with large cash will be bristol myers, pfizer and the rest of the drug companies who put out more drugs that people can never get hooked on. THey love us.

Can't argue with either point. Well said. And to tell the truth - there ain't a whole lot of 14 yr. olds watching Moto GP.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mylexicon @ Jan 6 2009, 03:32 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>MotoGP is broken and yet almost every post is about some intangible, tertiary subject---i.e. global participation or return of the 2-smokes

Here are the 3 things that need to be done to fix the sport:

1. Control tire
2. Top speed limit
3. Electronic limits

MotoGP isn't dying because it can't attract new audiences, it's dying because it can't keep the audiences it used to have. Anyone who understands the sport knows there is no coherent conspiracy to promote any one nationality. DORNA simply hands out favors to riders who look like they will bring in viewership. It's pragmatism at it's most despicable. Brad Pitt, Michael Jordan, Tom Cruise, and Michael Schumacher all probably receive DORNA money in the off chance they turn out to be decent riders.

The real problems with the sport are cost and lack of close racing.

In reality, all problems can be attributed to a few ill-fated decisions made in the wake of Kato's death. Sadly, each one of the major changes is responsible for the cumulative total of motogp's problems. MotoGP is like a hospital patient with multiple diseases. Even if they treat TB, the patient will still need to overcome lymphoma, and MS. The control tire eliminated TB, imo, now only MS and lymphoma remain.

The 1 thing DORNA has actually done right is the control tire. I doubt the newest tire is helpful to the sport b/c it was certainly designed to help GP maintain lap time advantages over WSBK. Secondly, the new control tire appears to have an extremely spongy front and a rock hard rear tire. We all know of a certain someone who has used that setup throughout a majority of his career. In that someone's defense, his tire spec didn't show up until mid season so it more likely that Bridgestone adapted the tire to suit Rossi. After it was proven to be fastest, Bridgestone adopted it for everyone in accordance with the control tire rules.

But forget the minor problems, the control tire allows DORNA to control performance without significantly injuring the spectacle. Almost all of a motorcycle's performance is controlled via the tires, the obvious exception is top speed. I suppose they could create a tire that delaminated at 215mph but I'm not sure that would be safe.

If DORNA have control of the tires, only 2 other things need to be defined in order to allow more relaxed rules----top speed and the use of electronic devices. <u>I know everyone hates the idea of a top speed limit, but it's obvious the classical solution to excessive top speed (displacement reduction) is an abysmal failure in the electronic age.

</u>
A top speed limit would relieve safety concerns but it wouldn't reduce the prevalence of TC. Personally, I'd like to see a return to mechanical fuel injection, but I'm sure the MSMA would probably veto the hell out of mechanical injection. I guess KR's suggestions might be more palatable for the MSMA---ban throttle by wire and limit the number of cylinders that can be controlled with TC.

.

I think that this is inevitable. Problem is, that laws of physics being what they are - it can't be too long before tire technology and engine management reach their zenith. Gradually - WSBK is catching up and eventually one series is going to end up redundant. Yes I know that two-strokes aren't going to make a come-back, but seems to me that minus that distinction, Moto GP is little more than a gold-plated superbike series.

The California Kid,

1. True. Places like China and Qatar have money, but the overall interest in the sport is low. In Qatar, nearly 100% of the fanbase supports Valentino Rossi. Places like China have a growing racing following, but the 4 wheel action of Formula One still dominates. Many young drivers in Europe and throughout Asia in the junior levels are Chinese drivers. Yes, there are kids in Spain and Italy and Britain who are using the lower levels to reach stardom, but that also goes back to the support system set in place for these young riders to reach the top. You have thousands of young riders in the US, but they struggle to make anything of their career because of the support system in place (made even more difficult by the DMG-AMA system).

2. Man you need to go back to school. Learn some English grammar man. You say your a Cali kid, and that could make you from any country in the world, but sheesh, even if English is a second or third or fourth language for you, ever language starts sentences with capital letters.

3. Walk into a Wal-Mart parking lot. You will notice a BMW, a Mercedes, a Cadillac (not a tinted window 1980's El Dorado used by a drug dealer either). Every one shops at Wal-Mart. Everyone wants to save money. Thinking with that mentality is just ignorant to how the world works.

4. Like said by povol, "If you dont know by now that smoking can kill you,your to ....... stupid to live anyway." You'd have to be a very stupid ignorant child to want to pick up a cig if you saw your favorite rider sponsored by a tobacco company. So what who advertises on the side of a motor bike or race car. As long as it is legal, I say, "If you have the cash and want to spend it that way, go ahead." The public is much smarter than the government thinks it is.

While MotoGP might have names in their ranks right now, that cannot save a series or sport. You need on-track action.
[/quote]



Wow im Sorry! I didnt know i was being graded on my post, my english teacher never told me that i would be judged on my gramar when i posted on internet forums. maybe its his fault. From now on ill write my post as if i was writing an essay to get into princeton or harvard. im going to make a rough draft have some one proof read it thean go over it with a dictionary and thesarus and fix all my mistakes just to make you happy, god forbid i was to to get an "F" in powerslide.net 101. Your comment really made me laugh because my wife always busts my balls for the same reason when i text her, if your a woman then i forgive you. So quit acting like a little .....!! or change your handle to "Pedrosa fan" which would be more apropriate with your behavior.

I am from southern california where we have more options to shop at than wal mart unlike the most of the country where they wiped out all the other stores and its the only place to shop. In the last 5 years ive probably walked into a wal mart 2 times and both times were acompanying a friend but those stores are a ....... joke the services is horrible and theres .... all over the place. It might be different where you live but out here there are really no bmws in the wal mart parking lot. wal mart is an example of why this country is where its at. people are so fucken greedy or as you put it "like to save money" that they rather save 75 cents at walmart than pay the regular price at the local mom and pop store where they know your name and if there is a problem you can talk directly to the owner instead of just getting the number to the corprate office. So keep shopping at your beloved wal mart and keep making the ritch ritcher and the poor poorer by saving your self a couple of bucks

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (The California Kid @ Jan 6 2009, 01:33 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I am from southern california where we have more options to shop at than wal mart unlike the most of the country where they wiped out all the other stores and its the only place to shop. In the last 5 years ive probably walked into a wal mart 2 times and both times were acompanying a friend but those stores are a ....... joke the services is horrible and theres .... all over the place. It might be different where you live but out here there are really no bmws in the wal mart parking lot. wal mart is an example of why this country is where its at. people are so fucken greedy or as you put it "like to save money" that they rather save 75 cents at walmart than pay the regular price at the local mom and pop store where they know your name and if there is a problem you can talk directly to the owner instead of just getting the number to the corprate office. So keep shopping at your beloved wal mart and keep making the ritch ritcher and the poor poorer by saving your self a couple of bucks
Have you been to 'most of the country'? Just because the rest of the country isn't SoCal doesn't mean there's nothing but Wal-Mart. Get real, man.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Austin @ Jan 6 2009, 02:52 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Have you been to 'most of the country'? Just because the rest of the country isn't SoCal doesn't mean there's nothing but Wal-Mart. Get real, man.


SoCal sucks ....

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (The California Kid @ Jan 6 2009, 11:33 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>I am from southern california where we have more options to shop at than wal mart unlike the most of the country where they wiped out all the other stores and its the only place to shop.

I go to Walmart several times a week.

Everytime I'm there I see Mercedes parked next to Toyotas parked next to old beat up Chevy trucks and the parking lot is full of blacks, whites, indians, mexicans, arabs, asians of various income levels all headed into the same building.

You are a racist.

Furthermore, Walmart isn't about low price. Low price is just the guarantee. Walmart is successful because it is a one stop shopping destination. Where else can you buy vicodin, a handgun, diapers, weed killer, a half rack of ribs, a flat screen, and a new belt?

Walmart has tons of weaknesses and no one is exploiting them. That's not Walmart's fault.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mylexicon @ Jan 6 2009, 04:18 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>You are a racist.
Topic locked in three... two... one...

Any takers?

Only kidding, mods. Nothing but love.

....! i think i would have been better off bad mouthing Rossi. Just because i dont like wal mart does not make me a racist. So I will apploud wal mart for creating diversity. you made a really good point with your vicodin and hand gun i think you might have changed my mind with that wal mart here i come!!!!!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (The California Kid @ Jan 6 2009, 02:46 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>....! i think i would have been better off bad mouthing Rossi. Just because i dont like wal mart does not make me a racist. So I will apploud wal mart for creating diversity. you made a really good point with your vicodin and hand gun i think you might have changed my mind with that wal mart here i come!!!!!

Juxtaposition is great.

So is calling someone racist because they don't like Walmart. I can't help it if you only like to shop with your homogenized neighborhood cronies.

Can Walmart save motogp?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (alex29 @ Jan 7 2009, 09:01 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Can Walmart save motogp?
Maybe they can race bikes around Walmart parking lots. There's a huge new audience to tap into.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Keshav @ Jan 6 2009, 11:04 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Can't argue with either point. there ain't a whole lot of 14 yr. olds watching Moto GP.
We got two here: Tom and Phleg. (Migs if you throw in IQ score).

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (alex29 @ Jan 6 2009, 03:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><div class='quotemain'>Can Walmart save motogp?

Yes. If they sponsor a team or two.

Can you imagine someone riding a GP bike in Walmart livery?



Wow, that really makes a bike look fast, doesn't it?