Cue up your vids, August it will be. Btw, when you read my reply here, read it in a tone of pure admiration for your racing knowledge and opinion. I still read your posts as they were the Word of God. (Assuming he existed...).
Thanks for the kudos however short lived. My dear friend, I think you may take too much stock in what these so called experts say, who generally have to adjust their ........ once the contrary happens turning to 'they knew it all along'. That's why I asked you to view the vids on mute, so as to relieve yourself of the echo these "experts" reverberate from the song the paddock hums. So Casey, just how bad is that chatter, well, its unbearable! Oh, well you just won the race MF. So Lorenzo, you said you need more power, is it that bad? Yeah, its unbearable! Well, you just won the race MF. Commentators, that Honda chatter is horrible, and the power on the Yamaha is ..... Listening public, Yamaha wins--the Honda chatter is horrible, Honda wins, the Yamaha power is horrible. It reminds me of the political pundits on the networks, all it takes is for the political operatives to send out the message for the day and the talking heads on the screen follow suit. In the event Stoner starts taking wins, expect the 'I told you so' expert brigade to rear its head. The tone of these experts after Portugal were ready to scribe Stoner on the 2012 trophy as I mentioned. Now suddenly the RCV is unridable?
For my part I tend to take little notice of prevailing 'chatter'.
He does exist, and he is still worshipped, he's just having a bad time of it right now what with so many losing their faith and deserting his cause. The creationists are still lurking around though..insisting that World Championship motorcycle racing actually began, not in 1949, but 1996 with the coming of our Lord. The fundamentalists are still among us staunchly, stoically and nobly defending the cause, waiting for the second coming while others have fallen to the folly of false idols.
You are very kind, but there are those on this forum who far exceed the the technical and historical racing knowledge of my own - including yourself - and right now we are sorely missing my good friend Austin. I think Keshav has a better turn of phrase than myself, while Michael demonstrates greater powers of reasoning and a more balanced view. Regarding myself, I am not tainted or biased by rider of brand affiliation and enjoy the sport without allegiance - (although I wear my number 69 shirt with pride and have followed Crutchlow and Stoner since very early in their careers. I regard Moto Matters as a very informative site though lacking the prolificy of posts and perhaps the fecundity of Powerslide. Certainly the character and the individual characters. And as for the Word of God - look no further than Krop himself, while asking, how does he derive his supernatural insight?
Where I marvel at the knowledge of Ryder and Moody I try to formulate my own view based upon a variety of sources tempered by my own - I hope - objective observations. I'm not interested in speculation and conjecture but occasionally succumb like the best/rest of us. I think paddock talk amongst plaudits and pundits alike is generally hearsay and Chinese whispers can certainly permeate into the commentary box. I admire the Eurosport team because they offer a balanced, measured view which tends to be derived mainly from known established fact. If they peddle paddock gossip - they acknowledge that it is precisely that. You have expressed your amazement at the bike racing coverage that we our blessed with here in Blighty - but it wasn't always that way.
For many years I couldn't afford sky or cable - throughout the nineties in fact. The BBC ran World Superbike coverage towards the end of the decade while Grand Prix racing, which at the time was quite beleaguered and suffering poor attendances, was extremely marginalised. I attended GP's, pored over the racing press, and devoured whatever subject matter I could find at the time. In many ways it had always been that way. There was no internet, scant coverage on the T.V. so I was very much accustomed to being in the dark from when I first became interested in bike racing as a child. This is why when I first joined the forum I started a thread asking how people originally got into bike racing. For some it was a particular race - others a more gradual exposure whilst there are members with direct involvement in the sport. I was genuinely interested in the process from both a national and an international perspective. As many Brits on here will confirm, The Sheene phenomena, propelled the sport towards more recognition in very much the same way that Valentino has done. You could argue for the wrong reasons following the documentary that featured the infamous Daytona crash. (The British public are weird in that respect. Take Top Gear. During the nineties this programme had become an embarrassment - to me it still is - relegated to the preserve of staid satellite channel interest and on the brink of being dropped by BBC schedulers and planners. Following Richard Hammond's accident it became a sensation - reinventing itself as a global brand with a dry comic twist.) As a result, Sheene became a household name but subsequently you were more likely to see Barry on your screens in a Faberge commercial or in the press spilling out of tramps at three a.m. with a model on each arm than you were to see him lining up on a grid.
I'm aware I am preaching to the converted. Like you, in the absence of exposure you find ways of learning - find out how to inform yourself. Again like you I have learned to follow racing through
being there, absorbing the sights the sounds the smells, (and on some occasions any available and forthcoming alcohol along the way). I implored my Dad to take me to the annual Easter Trans Atlantic challenges at Mallory, Oulton and Donington, who as a staunch F1 aficionado begrudgingly obliged and was later loath to admit he enjoyed it as much as me. The British GP at Silverstone became my annual Mecca - even better when it moved half an hour up the road to Donington. (I couldn't wait for it to go back to Silverstone though). I was in the stands during the Golden era and even attended the odd GP in the later nineties when there was Doohan, an ice cream van and one man and his dog. When you guys came up with Superbikes I was there as soon as it went global and had the opportunity, having been fascinated by articles on seemingly mythical god like figures like Cooley, Rainey, and Lawson many of whom staked their claim to GP having followed in the (dirt) tracks blazed by the King. I used to watch racing wherever I could find someone with a cable or satellite willing to let me in and it didn't become a regular fixture in my home until the 2000 season. What you don't have or don't know about you don't really miss. Where I freely confess I'm not the ardent racegoer that I once was, and at the risk of being branded BM or handed the annual Sackwack award was unable to take up the offer of free passes to Donington WSBk last month and didn't attend Silverstone on raceday, I do still maintain that you can divine a huge amount from being trackside. Not to suppose that we can all be imbued with Babelfish levels of sagacity, but I do believe being there is everything.
Today, I am spoilt by the coverage I get, but I don't take it for granted nor have my opinions about racing originated in a British Eurosport commentary box. I listen, and I listen intently, and weigh it up myself but don't rely on it. Your inference that I lap up and devour soundbites akin to some brainwashed electorate glued to Fox deep in redneck republican county (hi Pov!) is as you know misleading as it is untrue. I guess much like you Jum, as with many things, I have learned to assimilate information both consciously and sub consciously via a process of osmosis and living and breathing the sport for so many years. The absorption of information is then subject to our own conditioning perhaps governed by experience and external influence - how we elect to process and synthesise this stimuli affects the formulation of our opinions. Yeah I can watch with the sound down, but speak for yourself, I'd rather listen and learn from the technical opinion of Neil Spalding - someone who knows infinitely more than you or I and has very little affiliation or bias. I don't get the same insightful feeling from - who do you get on the subscribed feed? - messrs Harris, Emmett and Wheeler, in respect of who I would gladly stab at the services of the mute button on my remote. Burnicle is a clown, and regarding 'echo's and reverberation' the white noise of Parish and Cox lingers like tinnitus.
This is a developmental sport and as such is subject to the ebb and flow transition and mutability of prototype racing (for now). The riders and their machines are in a constant state of flux governed by a myriad of prevailing variables and circumstances at anyone time. The works Yamaha M1 and Honda RCV213v are so close as racing machines as to blur the distinctions in their relative performance without even building in the rider/machinery equation. There is no simple dichotomy to be drawn between the two other than their design conventions which appear to me to be bearing out. I have heard no 'expert' say that the Honda is unrideable - that was Dani Pedrosa. No one is saying this, I certainly am not. There are no easy rides at this level both metaphorically and literally. This is thus a highly complex debate albeit one which I am happy to continue irrespective of the legal costs. Read on...
Would Stoner want to jump on the M1 to finish off the season then? Would that make the difference? I laugh at the idea of Stoner looking "smooth and stable" on the M1 to indicate that the Yamaha is the better bike. You base your assumption here that the M1 is the better option because Lorenzo chose to stay, hardly a smoking gun. Its one of two only competitive machines, fairly evenly matched, staying with Yamaha was hardly a revelation. Lorenzo is happy where he is at precisely at the moment, the negotiation to Yamaha's credit executed in savvy timing on the heels of wins when riders are most happy. Why leave a happy situation, especially when you got a guy like Zeelenberg telling him the strength of the machine? Certainly he wasn't pointing out the acceleration disadvantages was he?Let Lorenzo start losing a bit (if it happens) and watch for the usual cries of "we need more power Scotty", a recurring theme last year from the mouth of Jorge (when he wasn't winning of course). Regarding the money, we don't know home much HRC may have offered, but I'm sure it was fairly comparable to what Yamaha offered, Yamaha isn't exactly poor less you forget they did employ Valentino for a number of years.
Actually, laughably we were both once threatened with legal action on here - remember?
Jorge 'looking smooth and stable' does not indicate that the Yamaha is the better bike - I 'm not saying that. Smooth and stable is indeed the hallmark of Jorge's riding style which is met very well by the yamaha whilst I don't believe that
currently the Honda would be quite so accommodating. 'Smooth and stable' is also the signature riding style of Dani Pedrosa, and as I have said
currently I believe that the Yamaha would cater for and compliment this more than the Honda
currently does which I think is slightly inhibiting Dani - but before you start citing circumstances to the contrary - I emphasise only
slightly. That is my opinion as
I perceive it and not as you would maintain subject to the Gospel of Toby and Julian. The fact that most reliable sources are also singing from the same hymn sheet over this is neither related to popular TV terminology, PR proselytisation or HRC indoctrination just observed fact. Stoner on the M1? My belief would be that he would adapt his style to suit the bike as he did when he stepped off the Ducati and onto last years Honda which when he first rode gave him the air of a completely different rider - simply because he wasn't on the limit any more. Jorge is very much on the limit and to his credit and to our utter awe and admiration he still retains this smooth high speed fluid style which is as you say metronomic. We have seen Stoner ride the same way when he races the circuit and I believe that he would handed the M1.
Regarding contract time the timing is good, but also prematurely necessitated by Stoners announcement of retirement followed by aggressive approaches by HRC. Jorge was very, very close to a move, instead he chose to stay...Smoking gun no, but very much drawing his loaded weapon of choice which is already cocked and primed, and very much on target; as opposed to drawing a contract with HRC . Like you say - a riders decision is governed by push and pull factors and currently he and Yamaha are a winning formula and Honda and their two highly talented riders are demonstrably (for whatever reasons you infer) are not. Only Jorge knows if he truly believes that he would be capable of the same on the RCV213. It is an unknown - but I do believe that much can be attributed to his confidence in Yamaha who this year have constructed a very, very good all round racing motorcycle. Honda could have continued to up the financial stakes at the behest of Jorge and unquestionably have more in reserve than Yamaha. You know as well as I do that although Vale sat on the payroll of Yamaha - any comparisons are pointless where the subject of securing Valentino's signature historically tends to hinge upon the production of blank cheques.
Regarding Zeelenberg's quote, no he didn't refer to any acceleration disadvantage - why would he? You are fully aware of how the Yamaha makes it's power and the relative advantages/disadvantages of this. The Honda may pack a punch out of a corner but time and time again we see the the Yamaha come into it's own through various sectors of the circuits we've visited. What the Yamaha lacks in acceleration it more than compensates for in corner entry and on the brakes. Regarding top end, I didn't see Jorge getting murdered by Pedrosa down the home straight at Catalunya. I would venture in the power stakes, Yamaha have plenty in hand this year.
Remember - 'it is a fundamental of racing that top speed and power blah blah ..' - sorry couldn't resist that.
Wait I either "conveniently" glossed over it or I felt it wasn't independently relevant enough considering his "vested interests", covering our bases are we? As if that were not enough cake eating, you say any race can show instances of both sides of our debate, uhm, yeah, that is my point. The point being that the M1 and the RCV can both appear a certain way and have the capability to do either as most often its tied to the hands of the man behind the controls. Generally speaking, that is Stoner's point and shoot, hanging off, shoulder down, rear tire lose bias to Lorenzo's planted, wheels in-line, shoulder in, metronomic lap style. If you say that the RCV is inferior to the M1 because its "smooth and stable" then explain the video evidence to the contrary not say, well of course we can see this on the footage and then dismiss it as cherrypicking. We can't just discount the reality and say, well of course sometimes the video shows the RCV in stable and in control.
Dani is very similar in style to Jorge. I think you would agree there is far more motion observable this year underneath the Honda of Pedrosa than there is the Yamaha of Lorenzo. Casey does indeed like to make shapes on the Honda, and will be more inclined to slide the rear as we all know. But the gung-ho style you describe is quite far from the truth these days. Like Nicky, Casey can deal with a bike moving underneath him and chatter aside, actively likes it to do so. It doesn't always translate into the fastest lap time but is also capable of peeling off lap after lap of remorseless race precision. We know Jorge doesn't favour this. Like Vale Casey has that unique ability to respond to changes in the motorcycle during the course of a race and adapt his style if necessary mid race. The contrast in style between CS and Jolo is noteworthy - but as I keep stressing, CS has repeatedly demonstrated the ability to modify this. As I said the M1 has allowed to Lorenzo export his 250 pedigree quite successfully - and his body language does outwardly look very different to Casey's renowned dirt track pedigree or Spies 'elbowz' out stance who unlike Jorge is not exploiting the strengths of the M1 as effectively. I don't however see the style of CS and JL as poles apart as say Schwantz and Lawson and where Schwantz was undoubtably hampered by the handling of the Suzuki of course, there are no such comparable inequities present in the Honda. I do believe that the introduction of the softer carcass and the introduction of the new front mid season has compromised the potential of the bike along with confidence in the bike - and particularly in the case of Pedrosa, exacted a psychological toll. I repeat the point I made earlier in the thread. I believe if Lorenzo was riding the Honda he wouldn't be leading the championship. Which leads nicely to this…..
I disagree, considering we are only speculating and offering personal opinion, here is mine to contrast yours. I positively believe Lorenzo could ride the RVC in decidedly his own style. The RCV has the potential for either Stoner or Lorenzo to win. Since you watched from Woodcote, you should have then been able to see the difference between Spies and Lorenzo, watching from my screen, admittedly an inferior vantage point (maybe), I was able to pick up some differences. I saw Spies a bit out of shape precisely into Woodcote. The M1s they both ride are still relatively the same, right? So what's the difference? Well, set up for one. As you have said often, which I agree, Houseworthless may be in over his head. And Spies pedigree may be the other, though they are on 1000s as oppose to 800s, where conventional wisdom would seem to favor superbike style born of that discipline (Crutchlow). I think you may underestimate what Lorenzo and crew could do on the current RCV. And assuming he could, I think his style would also have the same result on the new spec tire, that is, less durability problems to the current HRC riders as a consequence of his particular style of riding.
I watched morning warm up at Luffield, but also at various other points around the circuit. We watched most of qualifying from Becketts/Maggots which you know well.
I don’t underestimate the prowess of Lorenzo and crew in the slightest. I do think that the 1000cc formula is far more forgiving to riders than the ‘class of 800cc’ – particularly the sophomores (soon to be unhampered by the rookie rule). I think this is probably true both in terms of set up and actual riding difficulty. I think the 1000cc bike will also allow a greater range of styles and right now the one that is suiting the M1 the best appears to be that of Lorenzo. The problems encountered with the new tyre are not simply concerning their duration Jum although I would concur with you that Jorge does have a very favourable approach when it comes to tyre management and preservation. Where I am certain that they are being exaggerated, particularly form Pedrosa’s corner of the garage, they are compromising the set up, poise and development of the motorcycle not to mention the confidence of the riders. The less stiff customer versions of the frame do not seem to exacerbate the problems so the difficulties reside purely in the works Repsol garage. This is my belief, I stress again neither conditioned by any regurgitated processed diatribe from any one commentary booth, nor skewed by any affiliation to rider or brand bias of which we see so much on here. I said earlier that I try to avoid conjecture, and I admit that much of this is my own supposition, but it is derived from my personal observations and perceptions. If I turn the sound down next race I will draw my own conclusions irrespective of the commentary – although in the absence of Neil Spalding, I will learn less and perhaps be less informed. As race goers in the UK will testify, the in house opinion of Fred Clarke relayed by archaic and antiquated trackside PA systems is seldom to be discerned above the roar of 135 decibels of race machinery.
I would also make quick reference to the way that either motorcycle makes and translates it's power and the associated characteristics of this - it's not simply about a conservative riding technique. The other aspect that we can also explore further is the engineering itself behind this years M1. You talk of the Honda being the superior bike in 2011 and we touched on the relative merits of both the Honda and the Yam in a thread last year. You were right. Yamaha halted development in the final year of the 800's and although there was a new chassis design available to Spies Jorge elected to retain the 2010 frame because he like it so much. Resources were directed into the development of the new 1000cc machine and I think it is showing. During the Siverstone commentary (am I allowed to say this?) Neil Spalding was detailing the care and quality which has been lavished on the new bike and so far when you look at the engine allocation I would admittedly suggest that the Yamaha may even prove be the more reliable less stressed motor by design in comparison to the Honda - we'll see.
I say again, I don’t believe that Lorenzo would be having any more success than either Dani or Casey on that Honda. If past form is to go by and as you intimated yourself if anything he is more susceptible to the vagaries of set up woes. I would also venture that an optimum setting on the Honda is currently significantly more elusive than the Yamaha.
Interesting, the commentating "experts" often mentioned Max's "smooth" style on the Alstare Suzuki, in fact, the very first superpole lap he took on the Japanese manufacture was describe as "smooth" and credited for getting him runner-up to pole (Qatar). Not sure how you can say it doesn't support my argument, as your own very words make mention of their (Jorge & Max) similar approach and riding style. That style is still very evident in the RSV4. Smoking gun time, are you ready for it; guess who said the following:
(Insert name of highly qualified opinion here)...'referred to Biaggi as a “phenomenon” and said he was “another manteguilla (butter) rider,” which is a way of praising his smooth riding style.' I'll give you a hint, his initials are:
Jorge Lorenzo. So above you are speculating Lorenzo could not replicate his style on the RCV, to support this you claim the RSV4 Aprillia disallows Max to ride in his particular style, but I just showed you a quote from the horse's mouth, none other than Jorge Lorenzo, who said in no uncertain terms, Biaggi exhibits the same "manteguilla (butter) "smooth" style he himself is know for employing. With all do respect, would you like to retract?
Neither in the absence of any contradiction on my part.
Perhaps the ‘experts’ did but I don’t think that the GSXR thou’ was amenable to Max’s style as the current RSV4 is. I think you misunderstood what I said my friend. I am saying that far from
disallowing Biaggi to ride the way that is natural to him the Aprilia
compliments Max’s 250 style in much the same way as the M1 does for Jorge. Nothing to retract, I’d sooner assert this point again in support of my argument – please re-read and reconsider.
My mention of Max in WSBk does not support your argument, far from it. I think the Aprilia plays to Biaggi's strengths and I couldn't see him emulating his 250 style to the same extent on an in line four in spite of the fact that he secured his title on the zook he looked decidedly un-max when he rode for Alstare. This don't mean that Biaggi isn't riding well - but it does mean that the Aprilia is maximising the advantages intrinsic to his riding style and I believe that the same can be said of Jorge - and so does Zeelenberg.
Clear now?
Jumkie' timestamp='1340518182' post='320356 said:
Again, you seem to be making my argument for me my dear and respected friend. You keep asserting the M1 is the superior machine but supporting the claim with caveat after caveat: Which of these in the following list of your points (which I highlighted above) supports the assertion that the M1 is stronger than the RCV? Lorenzo's "superior riding", "mentally stronger", "more focused", "mental preparedness", "infallible race brain"? This all sounded like the case for Lorenzo not the M1. In addition, even here you say Jorge had a chance to move over to Honda implying he chose the better machine; but another caveat, the reasons you say "can't simply be reduced to the fact that the M1 is the seemingly better bike." Ok, but you are still implying it despite saying the reasons can't be reduced to support the M1 is a better machine? How about the M1 is good enough to beat Stoner right now? Lorenzo is on a roll, and getting caught up in a contract dispute for a few more bucks and a an uncertain situation at HRC may have been too much of a distraction. He may have wisely chosen the situation and bike he can win on now.
I think the best point you made above is that Jorge is on the limit to stave off the Hondas. Something I don't think Stoner is doing to stay ahead of the Yamaha rider. And perhaps with good reason, as a DNF would spell doom, something Lorenzo perhaps was more willing to do as he came into the season who's mind set twas prepared to take more risk knowing that's what it would take to stay within a country mile of Stoner. He has stepped it up and now has enough of a lead in points to ride a bit safer. Its my contention, Stoner on the other hand has not put it all on the line for something he finds increasing distasteful. And in fine racer fashion, its my .... RCV that isn't getting the job done...the public so inclined: that RCV is .....
My praise of Lorenzo is to acknowledge his strengths and in recognition of the fact that his stellar performance cannot be attributed to the bike alone. I believe that his riding has been superior but that
currently he would struggle to transfer this level of success to the same degree on the Honda. Which acknowledges the fact that the machinery is to some degree playing its part. He is mentally stronger but conjecture again, who is to say that he wouldn’t unravel to some extent on the Honda. Right now Jorge’s mind is a fortress he may be under siege but riding that bike I don’t see many chinks in his armour.
Yeah, Casey is demob happy. Yet you assert that Casey ‘isn’t putting it on the line for something he finds increasingly distasteful’ which love him or hate him isn’t his style yet hilariously compliment an ailing Valentino who is doing precisely that. We all know what Rossi has in reserve, he simply and perhaps sensibly isn’t prepared to risk pushing that motorcycle lap in lap out every race and session in the same way that Hayden currently is because his bargaining power is greater. Why should he? Regarding the tyre choice, far from being respected over the decision they made in horrific conditions (far worse than Silverstone) both Stoner and Hayden were keel hauled on this forum after Donington 2009 – some even suggested that CS was not only washed up at Ducati but his career in general had been hung out to dry.
Casey’s recent slump in form if you see it like that has coincided with his public decision to retire – but the misgivings that he had were very much present over the winter break during which time rightly or wrongly he actually questioned whether he wanted to come back in 2012. Like Vale I think Casey may well be reading the riot act to his factory employers – because both are in a position to do so. I’m sure his motivation may have suffered but I return to the machinery. Sound down commentary off – from where I’m sitting Jorge appears to be able to place that Yamaha precisely where he likes – particularly in the latter stages of a race. Very simply and based upon my own qualitative reckoning – quantitative facts aside - I don’t see the same responsive handling with the Honda.
You speak of echo’s – the cadence left resonating since the checkered flag at Siverstone beats out the sound of Lorenzo’s rhythmic pattern very much in harmony and tune with the three forks. Currently all I see and hear at Honda is discord.
Jumkie' timestamp='1340518182' post='320356 said:
How is that cake tasting my friend? If Valentino is capable of pushing harder, but is not for whatever reason, then why not the same applying to Stoner? I'm aware the bump is mainly blamed for the crash, Valentino didn't have to tell us, every expert commentator did the same. They also said he was pushing the front to the limit at Vale. A mistake to hit the bump, yes. That bump would not have caused a rider to crash if they were not pushing it to the limit. I don't think Valentino rode a "gutsy" race as much as I don't think Lorenzo or Casey rode a "gutsy" race, perhaps the only "gutsy" racer at the British GP was Crutchlow riding with a broken ankle. The question is was Rossi pushing or cruising. He was the only rider to choose the hard tires, my guess, in hopes of the conditions turning favorable for that choice. Again, if it would have happened and he would have charged up the field, how many "experts" would have been telling us there is still 'fight in that dog' and 'he pulled a rabbit out on race day' etc. If Rossi runs the soft tires, he would have predicted its good for 7-10, if he runs the hards he would have predicted 7-10 or better, why then not take the gamble and run the hard option nobody has taken and hope that it will be a top five finish given the predictable unpredictable conditions?
Doubtless about the same as the humble pie I'm serving you now which admittedly lacks the same synthetic colouring or the bitter taste of your own concoction
Back to Vale again. As Rog said, to explore the limits of that motorcycle he has to push it. I watched him tentatively come out in Saturday morning warm up when track temperature was excessively low – perhaps dangerously so whereupon he systematically and methodically began to wind it up as Valentino always has, progressively pushing harder and harder – and this was more pronounced than any other rider until he had the moment under braking at Vale which caused him to run on. I haven’t seen the laptime but in qualifying he was similarly pushing again and went down at exactly the same point. From then I believe his race was run. The hard tyre choice was an opportunistic one – very much like the decision made by Casey and Nicky at the British GP in ’09. Indeed, why not opt for hard tyres as you say. It doesn’t make for a gutsy ride though Jum, in much the same way as no one applauded Casey or Nicky at Donington 2009.
Jumkie' timestamp='1340518182' post='320356 said:
I just checked the mail box, but no Cease and Desist order yet. It might be that Willski mail to blame. You may want to consider a new legal team, one that at very least can employ carrier pigeons.
I’ve decided to conduct my own defence – I take it back, In hindsight Wilski is too expensive and he’ll insist on bringing Hector into the equation. Besides, we'd have to swear on his own version of the Bible.
